NSG Senate Chamber [NSG Senate]

[Byzantium Imperial]

Regardless of if there is a god or not, your were born the way you were. Life is about living with that.

No, Senator, but sadly I do not subscribe to your ridiculous and impossible philosophy about life. Did you know that our bodies are constantly changing, and that our bodies are fully replaced around every seven years? Since when was life about living with how we were born as babies?

As i dont see it as a medical need (prosthetic legs and cancer treatment are different from changing sex's because you want a penis), i dont see it as a necessary government expense. We dont pay for plastic surgery, why pay for this? (yes there is a huge difference between the two, but they both fit in the NOT MEDICALLY NECCESARRY category)

Does it have to be like a prosthetic leg or cancer treatment to be a medical need? Actually, considering we don't have a healthcare bill passed yet, I'm pretty sure that we have to pay for it as of the current moment. However, we should definitely cover plastic surgery for those, for example, who have seen their faces or other parts of their bodies disfigured, torn, or destroyed. Did you know that plastic surgery is used for burns; traumatic injuries, such as facial bone fractures and breaks; congenital abnormalities, such as cleft palates or cleft lips; developmental abnormalities; infection and disease; and cancer or tumors?

Il just conceed on the first point. I was being overt for giggles.

for the second part.... this is going in circles and i have to get up in 4 hours. Good night!

[Mishmahig]

No, Senator, but sadly I do not subscribe to your ridiculous and impossible philosophy about life. Did you know that our bodies are constantly changing, and that our bodies are fully replaced around every seven years? Since when was life about living with how we were born as babies?


Does it have to be like a prosthetic leg or cancer treatment to be a medical need? Actually, considering we don't have a healthcare bill passed yet, I'm pretty sure that we have to pay for it as of the current moment. However, we should definitely cover plastic surgery for those, for example, who have seen their faces or other parts of their bodies disfigured, torn, or destroyed. Did you know that plastic surgery is used for burns; traumatic injuries, such as facial bone fractures and breaks; congenital abnormalities, such as cleft palates or cleft lips; developmental abnormalities; infection and disease; and cancer or tumors?

Il just conceed on the first point. I was being overt for giggles.

for the second part.... this is going in circles and i have to get up in 4 hours. Good night!

Query: if we did actually modify the health care act to account for all these additions and whatnot, would our healthcare actually be, well, doable?

[Wolfmanne]

As the current author of the Universal Health Care Act, seeing as Chestaan is absent, I won't accept any amendments to the Universal Health Care Act edited by me inside the act. They will have to be submitted as separate legislation.

[Yanalia]

As the current author of the Universal Health Care Act, seeing as Chestaan is absent, I won't accept any amendments to the Universal Health Care Act edited by me inside the act. They will have to be submitted as separate legislation.

Will you not even consider these amendments despite their widespread support among the body of the Senate?

[Resora]

If you're not willing to negotiate, Wolfmanne, don't expect a lot of support from the left.

[Fulflood]

If you're not willing to negotiate, Wolfmanne, don't expect a lot of support from the left.

It won't get a lot of support from the right if he amends it though.

[The Grand Republic of Hannover]

If you're not willing to negotiate, Wolfmanne, don't expect a lot of support from the left.

It won't get a lot of support from the right if he amends it though.

Wait what?
How does the right support that meanwhile the left doesn't?

[Resora]

If you're not willing to negotiate, Wolfmanne, don't expect a lot of support from the left.

It won't get a lot of support from the right if he amends it though.

The mental wellbeing and health of transgender people is not something we're willing to compromise on. If the centrists balk at providing surgeries for people that need them simply because they're transgender, they're not only demonstrating a disturbing amount of bigotry, they don't really support universal healthcare. We're not about to back down; a decade ago the people that oppose this amendment would have opposed same-sex marriage.

[Fulflood]

It won't get a lot of support from the right if he amends it though.

The mental wellbeing and health of transgender people is not something we're willing to compromise on. If the centrists balk at providing surgeries for people that need them simply because they're transgender, they're not only demonstrating a disturbing amount of bigotry, they don't really support universal healthcare. We're not about to back down; a decade ago the people that oppose this amendment would have opposed same-sex marriage.

Honestly, this only debatably falls under the remit of healthcare. To suggest that 'they don't really support universal healthcare' only really serves to isolate those opposing you by using unnecessary hyperbole, and equating their arguments to outright hatred towards transgender people is false.

And trust me, people won't support this in a decade's time.

[Resora]

The mental wellbeing and health of transgender people is not something we're willing to compromise on. If the centrists balk at providing surgeries for people that need them simply because they're transgender, they're not only demonstrating a disturbing amount of bigotry, they don't really support universal healthcare. We're not about to back down; a decade ago the people that oppose this amendment would have opposed same-sex marriage.

Honestly, this only debatably falls under the remit of healthcare. To suggest that 'they don't really support universal healthcare' only really serves to isolate those opposing you by using unnecessary hyperbole, and equating their arguments to outright hatred towards transgender people is false.

And trust me, people won't support this in a decade's time.

The line between ignorance and malevolence is thin. Whether or not they have "outright hatred" for transgender people is irrelevant, their actions are far from benign despite their particular brand of reasoning. Saying something like "it fits in the NOT MEDICALLY NECCESARRY category" betrays ignorance of the host of mental and psychological health reasons for why intersex surgery is important to intersex individuals, ignorance that has very real consequences for those individuals.

There's no such thing as benign ignorance.

[Finium]

Medically necessary in my mind that a life depends on a procedure, not that wellbeing depends on a procedure. I would advocate the utmost stringency in the definition of necessary.

[Unicario]

Medically necessary in my mind that a life depends on a procedure, not that wellbeing depends on a procedure. I would advocate the utmost stringency in the definition of necessary.

But that intersexed person, with no hope to raise money to /get/ the surgery they need without breaking bank, would likely commit suicide in agony.

[Fulflood]

Medically necessary in my mind that a life depends on a procedure, not that wellbeing depends on a procedure. I would advocate the utmost stringency in the definition of necessary.

But that intersexed person, with no hope to raise money to /get/ the surgery they need without breaking bank, would likely commit suicide in agony.

Not 'most likely' really. Most likely, they would continue to lead their lives, just less fulfilled than before and perhaps with lower self-esteem and depression problems. It's similar to a lot of therapies, including cosmetic surgery or, on a smaller scale, various forms of alternative medicine, massages etc.

Although well done for attempting to tackle that above post.

[Finium]

Medically necessary in my mind that a life depends on a procedure, not that wellbeing depends on a procedure. I would advocate the utmost stringency in the definition of necessary.

But that intersexed person, with no hope to raise money to /get/ the surgery they need without breaking bank, would likely commit suicide in agony.

I'll need to compare likeliness to commit suicide post- and pre-op, if it poses a minor threat to life of a person, then we can discuss counseling, if it is a major threat, then we can discuss free surgeries. Do you have these statistics?

[Unicario]

But that intersexed person, with no hope to raise money to /get/ the surgery they need without breaking bank, would likely commit suicide in agony.

Not 'most likely' really. Most likely, they would continue to lead their lives, just less fulfilled than before and perhaps with lower self-esteem and depression problems. It's similar to a lot of therapies, including cosmetic surgery or, on a smaller scale, various forms of alternative medicine, massages etc.

Although well done for attempting to tackle that above post.

You'd be surprised at how high the suicide rate is for transgenders.

[New Waterford]

Ok:

Alright then il revise my vote. I dont like being overridden by a sitting president, but i admit its a necessary power for any decently powerful executive branch.

I vote AYE on all bills except:

Senate Supremacy act, and the Senate grammer and spelling bill, which i vote NAY

*snigger snigger*
If you're a Yank and think I just used a racist slur, the word 'snigger' is the British English spelling of 'snicker'. It has nothing to do with the N-word.

[New Zepuha]

Not 'most likely' really. Most likely, they would continue to lead their lives, just less fulfilled than before and perhaps with lower self-esteem and depression problems. It's similar to a lot of therapies, including cosmetic surgery or, on a smaller scale, various forms of alternative medicine, massages etc.

Although well done for attempting to tackle that above post.

You'd be surprised at how high the suicide rate is for transgenders.

I believe the 2011 estimates were 49% of Transgenders ages 14-25, committed suicide.

[Byzantium Imperial]

Il just conceed on the first point. I was being overt for giggles.

for the second part.... this is going in circles and i have to get up in 4 hours. Good night!

Query: if we did actually modify the health care act to account for all these additions and whatnot, would our healthcare actually be, well, doable?

Thats part of a point i made earliar about how we simply cant afford to do transgender care, or several other things already covered in the law. As Wolf is unwilling to add amendment though, that is a moot point for now.

But i have a question for wolf: since this is a massive system and we may wish to install amendments into it before it is implemented, can the actuall implementation of universal healthcare be pushed back to like august?

Id be willing to pay for transgender care if some of my other demands for making this fiscally sustainable are added. I still think its not worth it, but hey if the country feels strongly about it then we can make a deal.

[New Waterford]

Also, seeing as the SGSPEA was passed, has anyone been appointed as proof-reader yet?

[Byzantium Imperial]

Also, seeing as the SGSPEA was passed, has anyone been appointed as proof-reader yet?

Uh..... Is that a posistion we should elect or have the government appoint?
Right now, i would nominate Nepal and Free califas for that posistion. They are both good proofreaders, and I trust both of them in their ability to set aside political things when editing for spelling and grammar.

[Rumostan]

Also, seeing as the SGSPEA was passed, has anyone been appointed as proof-reader yet?

No but I volunteer myself.

[New Zepuha]

Commonwealth Fire Services

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Authors: New Zepuha [IND]
Sponsors: Byzantium Imperial [NIFP], Torsiedelle [NIFP], Haelunor [RG], Kouralia [USLP], Rumostan [CMP], Eliasonia [NIFP]

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REALIZES the need to formally establish a Fire Service for the Commonwealth of Aurentina, being essential to the protection of the people from Fire/Accident/Explosion etc.

AFFIRMS the necessity of having such an organization as a benefit to public safety.

MANDATES the following points:

• The Fire Service will be controlled by each municipality, as well as a national Special Fire Service for the case of special disaster.
• Chiefs of each Fire Department must be elected by the people.
• Firemen/Women must pass physical evaluations, and be re-evaluated every FIVE [5] years.
• Fire gear such as, air bottles, masks, gloves, jackets, and associated material; should be replaced every FOUR [4] years.
• Fire vehicles must be replaced or retro-fitted every TEN [10] years.
• Firemen/Women will serve a 24 hour shift in their assigned firehouse.
• One firehouse minimum must be in an area per ONE HUNDRED THOUSAND [100,000] people or below.

ESTABLISHES the following Departments/Divisions within the Fire Service:

General Fire Department: Serves as the first line of defense against fire mishaps and general accidents. Fire Engines will be assigned to each general station, alongside a Rescue Truck. These will be the standard block of the Fire Service.

Volunteer Fire Department: For small rural communities, affording a large fire service may not be applicable. Volunteers would be an unpaid force of trained fire fighters that are on call, but not required to be at the station 24 hours. Though TWO [2] Firefighters must be at the station during the night time hours.

Hazardous Material Unit: HMUs would be the specially trained units tasked with detoxing people and areas of hazardous material such as: Radiation, Toxic Gas, Acid, and various explosives. These units will be assigned to areas that are deemed high traffic for hazardous material, or in most danger.

Air Rescue Unit: Trained pilots and paramedics that fly into either express situations or people trapped in areas that regular ambulances cannot get to immediately. The pilots should receive extended training for emergency landings and take offs.

Tactical Support Unit: TSUs also known as Rehab units, are deployed on scene to large fires and operations to do the following: Refill air tanks, hand out bottled water, keep snack foods to keep firefighters from exhausting their bodies, and repair or replace hose lines when needed.

Brush Fire Unit: BFUs would be only assigned to municipalities that are deemed prone to brush fires and the like. These will be special units requiring the certs to be deemed by the future fire code.

This bill should also form an education program and fire experience, to educate the public on how to prevent fires in their own homes. This would create the following:

A. Creates a Fire Education program,
a. Creates the ability for Fire Departments to create an education program in their local area.
b. Allows for Municipalities to also create curriculum for what is to be instructed.
c. Creates the position of Fire Safety Instructor
I. Instructors are to receive 6 weeks of training at the Fire Academy
II. Instructors will have overtime opportunities to instruct school students and members of the public.
B. Mandates that a Fire Code to be drafted amongst selected members from the Fire Services Chief upon passing of this bill.

ESTABLISHES the National Fire Academy

A. The NFA will be established on a sector of land no less than 60 acres of land owned by the government.
B. Training should consist of three phases and curriculum to be determined by the Fire Service's future fire code.
a. First, a Physical training portion should focus on the aspects of physical duties of a firefighter.
b. Second, a class room setting should educate them on first aid, medical, and fire code related materials.
c. Third, fire related training should focus on the fighting of fires, and tactics used to fight certain fires.
C. Establishes the Special Training Course.
a. Allows for Firefighters wishing to receive special training to do certain specialty roles, to come back for additional training in said fields.
b. Requires for separate training dates from the regular academy courses.



HEREBY establishes the Commonwealth Fire Service.

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Definitions
Volunteer Firefighter: An unpaid on call firefighter.
Fire Department: Municipal level fire units consisting of multiple firehouses and firefighters, usually has a Chief and two Assistant Cheifs.
Special Fire Service: Response units tasked with responding to certain situations that regular Firefighters are not equipped/trained for.
Fire Service: The entirety of each Department/Division/Battalion and Special Units tasked with combating fires and threats by nature or accident to the public.
NFA: The training academy used for Firefighters.

This now has enough sponsors to be added to the queue.

[New Waterford]

Also, seeing as the SGSPEA was passed, has anyone been appointed as proof-reader yet?

Uh..... Is that a posistion we should elect or have the government appoint?
Right now, i would nominate Nepal and Free califas for that posistion. They are both good proofreaders, and I trust both of them in their ability to set aside political things when editing for spelling and grammar.

I think the government should appoint them.

Also, seeing as the SGSPEA was passed, has anyone been appointed as proof-reader yet?

No, but I volunteer myself.

Fixed.
Punctuation is just as important. However, if you're willing to take that aboard, I think you'd make a great proof-reader.

[Byzantium Imperial]

Senate Legislative Queue

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Next in Queue: Governmental Services Act
2. Ministry of Research and Astronomy Reform Act
3. National Culture Act
4. National Financing and Accounting Act
5. Legality and Restrictions Act
6. Anti Corruption Omnibus
7. International Treaties Ratification Act
8. Economic Oversight Act
9. Civil Liberties Omnibus
10. Internet Omnibus Act
11. Voting out business management without holding shares is stupid idea and illegal
12. Standards of Daily Measurement Act
13. Condemnation of United States National Security Agency project: US-984XN
14. Environment Act
15. Transportation Amendments and Standards Omnibus
16. Armed Forces Reform Act
17. Revenue Collection Act of 2013
18. State of Emergency Act
19. National Fingerprint Registry
20. Social Welfare Act
21, Commonwealth Fire Services Act

added. Im pretty sure other bills have been added into the queue in the meantime, anyone want to check




Side note: We have mainly been arguing the universal healthcare act, but there are other bils in there. While free school meals is pretty non controversial and doesnt require debate, the Education framework act (it sets out curriculum for levels, and other general guidelines), the public school act (establishes a state run public school system through age 18), and universal credit (welfare) are also important.

[The Grand Republic of Hannover]

Senate Legislative Queue

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Next in Queue: Governmental Services Act
2. Ministry of Research and Astronomy Reform Act
3. National Culture Act
4. National Financing and Accounting Act
5. Legality and Restrictions Act
6. Anti Corruption Omnibus
7. International Treaties Ratification Act
8. Economic Oversight Act
9. Civil Liberties Omnibus
10. Internet Omnibus Act
11. Voting out business management without holding shares is stupid idea and illegal
12. Standards of Daily Measurement Act
13. Condemnation of United States National Security Agency project: US-984XN
14. Environment Act
15. Transportation Amendments and Standards Omnibus
16. Armed Forces Reform Act
17. Revenue Collection Act of 2013
18. State of Emergency Act
19. National Fingerprint Registry
20. Social Welfare Act
21, Commonwealth Fire Services Act

added. Im pretty sure other bills have been added into the queue in the meantime, anyone want to check




Side note: We have mainly been arguing the universal healthcare act, but there are other bils in there. While free school meals is pretty non controversial and doesnt require debate, the Education framework act (it sets out curriculum for levels, and other general guidelines), the public school act (establishes a state run public school system through age 18), and universal credit (welfare) are also important.

I think the Senate should add another 12 (or even 24) hours to the debating time. I don't see any compromise coming up soon