[SUBMITTED]Hasty Hooligan Hullabaloo

[Paris Saint-Germain]

I'm posting from my PSG puppet, but I thought of an idea that would encompass the sporting culture of hooligans. While we have issues dealing with sports violence, none of them address the underlying sports culture of hooliganism. We hear of articles on England fans being rowdy or ultras from Balkan clubs causing trouble.

Description: In a qualifying game for the IFF World Cup, @@NAME@@ has lifted spirits after a crucial win against Bigtopia. However, a darker side of your country's fanbase has emerged: hooligan fans, especially those from the group @@DEMONYMADJECTIVE@@ Extreme Boyz, stir up trouble and seek fights with rivals. In this instance, @@DEMONYMADJECTIVE@@ hooligans have chanted racist slurs against Bigtopian players and fans alike.

Validity: must have professional sports

[option]"These so-called 'fans' are an absolute disgrace!" shouts @@RANDOMNAME@@, a fair-weather fan who has cuts and bruises trying to escape from a fight. "I know that national pride is important and that we must do anything to win, but this goes too far. Racist chants, dehumanizing our rivals, rioting and causing a fuss, these actions are simply unsportsmanlike. What's worse is that the minority of hooligans only tarnishes the image of us and @@DEMONYMADJECTIVE@@ football as a whole! @@LEADER@@, I implore you to ban all hooligan firms from attending any game. Also, why not ban alcohol and the use of flares? That'll show those thugs not to mess around and trash our sport!"
[effect]attending a sports game is more family-friendly than watching a kids movie

[option]"I agree, but this doesn't go far enough," says @@RANDOMFEMALENAME@@, a psychologist who also is a controversial feminist. "Hooliganism is rampant amongst angsty young men who want to show off their toxic masculinity. It's clear they are suffering from a mental disorder brought on by unchecked hormones, rage, and oh yes, masculinity! We need a national mental health program to evaluate the behavior of these people and stamp out this disgrace once and for all."
[effect]men who raise their voice are shipped off to asylums

[option]"No one likes us, no one likes us! No one likes us, we don't care!" shouts a crowd of @@DEMONYMADJECTIVE@@ Extreme Boyz while engaged in a typical street riot for their standards. The hooligan firm leader @@RANDOMMALENAME@@ comes up to talk holding a megaphone. "If you ban us and other ultra groups from attending, then you will destroy the atmosphere of every single sporting event! We provide our national team the extra edge to get the win with banners, chants, and flares, and you want to make our home ground a library? That's a great way to sabotage our sports culture!"
[effect]matchdays resemble all-out civil war

Description: In a qualifying game for the International Football Federation (IFF) Global Cup, @@NAME@@ has lifted spirits after a crucial win against Bigtopia. However, a darker side of your country's fanbase has emerged: hooligan fans, especially those from the group @@NAME@@ Battalion who stir up trouble and seek fights with rivals. In this instance, @@DEMONYMADJECTIVE@@ hooligans have chanted racist slurs against Bigtopian players and fans alike.

Validity: must have professional sports

[option]"These so-called 'fans' are an absolute disgrace!" shouts @@RANDOMNAME@@, a fair-weather fan who has cuts and bruises trying to escape from a fight. "I know that national pride is important and that we must do anything to win, but this goes too far. Racist chants, dehumanizing our rivals, rioting and causing a fuss, these actions are simply unsportsmanlike. What's worse is that the minority of hooligans only tarnishes the image of us and @@DEMONYMADJECTIVE@@ football as a whole! @@LEADER@@, I implore you to ban alcohol, flares, and any hooligan activity from our games."
[effect]attending a sports game is more family-friendly than watching a kids movie

[option]"I agree, but this doesn't go far enough," says @@RANDOMFEMALENAME@@, a psychologist who has redder hair than the kits of amateur club Communism FC. "Hooliganism is rampant amongst angsty young men who want to show off their toxic masculinity. It's clear they are suffering from a mental disorder brought on by unchecked hormones, rage, and oh yes, masculinity! We need a national mental health program to evaluate the behavior of these people and stamp out this disgrace once and for all."
[effect]men who scream are shipped off to asylums

[option]"No one likes us, no one likes us! No one likes us, we don't care!" shouts a crowd of @@NAME@@ Battalion members engaged in a typical street riot for their standards. The hooligan leader @@RANDOMMALENAME@@ comes up to talk holding a megaphone. "If you ban us and other ultras from attending, then you will destroy the atmosphere of every single sporting event! We provide our national team the extra edge to get the win with banners, chants, and flares, and you want to make our home ground a library? That's a great way to sabotage our sports culture! @@LEADER@@, if you are a true patriot, why don't you publicly support and back our activities?"
[effect]government employees make strange bedfellows with masked men brandishing crowbars

[Paris Saint-Germain]

Reserved for other drafts if needed

[Baggieland]

Great to see another sport issue in the pipeline.

I edited the issue about who pays for the policing of hooligans, so there's no overlap to worry about.

none of them address the underlying sports culture of hooliganism.

Nice angle, but I don't think you've quite nailed it yet.

Option 1 is a knee jerk reaction, but it won't solve the underlying (societal) causes of why people choose to behave like a hooligan on Saturday afternoons. Rugby and cricket fans drink booze at matches, but they behave themselves.

Option 2 is better, but my main problem is how will this national mental health program work? Will it rely on hooligans volunteering to be analysed? Because I can't see too many volunteers stepping up.

Option 3 is fine as that choice needs to be available.

Finally, you seem to be insistant on making racism the central point. Hooliganism causes many problems: racism, rioting, criminal damage, GBH, boozing and anti social behaviour, as well as families not wishing to take their children to matches. I'd say that rioting, criminal damage and GBH are more serious matters.

[Paris Saint-Germain]

Reworked the premise of the issue to focus on rioting and property damage as central to the problem of hooliganism, and the root cause with societal problems that seemingly cause people to participate in these activities.

I could work in an option to ban hooligan firms but figured to rework option 1 to deal with societal concerns that tend to bring about hooliganism. My insights and research have shown a tendency of those who participate in such activities (especially in England but also apply to other places like the Balkans) are those who are working class, have lower incomes, and tend to be marginalized from society, so focusing on dealing with those issues might solve the problem and take aim at hooligan culture.

Option 2 is reworked so that the mental health program forcibly detains members of hooligan firms to be psychologically analyzed. Seems like something to come out of 1984, but as already mentioned, people aren't willing to volunteer themselves. Or if they were, then the government could provide incentives, but I went with the heavy-handed authoritarian approach.

[Baggieland]

you get something similar to Mean Street

What is Mean Street?

expand social services to address the root problem

How and in what way?

[Paris Saint-Germain]

you get something similar to Mean Street

What is Mean Street?

expand social services to address the root problem

How and in what way?

Mean Street is in reference to the famous movie Green Street that is about West Ham hooligans in their war against Millwall. I could have gone with a different color like violet but wanted it to rhyme.

I was going for the generic "expand welfare to marginalized working class communities" but that might be too boring.

[Baggieland]

Mean Street is in reference to the famous movie Green Street that is about West Ham hooligans in their war against Millwall. I could have gone with a different color like violet but wanted it to rhyme.

I thought it was that. As much as I enjoyed Green Street, I think English hooligan films are a bit of a niche genre. I'm not too sure that enough people would get that reference.

Maybe take it out and replace it with a nod to what Green Street was about.

[Paris Saint-Germain]

Mean Street is in reference to the famous movie Green Street that is about West Ham hooligans in their war against Millwall. I could have gone with a different color like violet but wanted it to rhyme.

I thought it was that. As much as I enjoyed Green Street, I think English hooligan films are a bit of a niche genre. I'm not too sure that enough people would get that reference.

Maybe take it out and replace it with a nod to what Green Street was about.

Fair enough. I'll incorporate the changes once I have the time to do so.

Edit: minor changes incorporated, including taking out the Green Street reference by name.

[Paris Saint-Germain]

Decided to also resume drafting this issue, made a few minor changes.

[Electrum]

Good writing, some comments:

I think I have the most issues with Option 1, namely that any effect of the social services is likely to be on the timescale of months, and not an immediate policy response. Which is fine, but you need to caveat that. It's also not clear what is the link between social services and reducing hooliganism? Is it giving working-class men more money? Or is it sending them to diversionary programs? Effect line 1 also doesn't immediately follow from what's stated in the option.

"controversial feminist" --> I think here's a ripe place for a joke. Show, don't tell.

Otherwise it looks really good!

edit: Also I believe it's Hullabaloo

[Paris Saint-Germain]

Decided to get this draft back up and running.

In response to Electrum's feedback, I was thinking of having one option be the one where you increase police and security funding during gameday, and then the other option would be to tackle the root problems of hooliganism. I feel having both in one option wouldn't really fit.

[Australian rePublic]

What's IFF?

[Verdant Haven]

- For folks who might not recognize the naming convention or know that they tend to roll in gangs, when the name of the hooligan group is introduced in the description, it might be helpful to specify that that is the name of a specific organized group.

- We could probably make this validity pro sports specifically, rather than just all sports, and that will add a few more nations to the list that can receive it.

- To ride on Electrum's suggestion (and your comments on responding to it), we definitely need to clarification on how social services are going to help the situation, and which services are being suggested.

- I think your idea of splitting between social services and increased enforcement would be a good call – they are very different approaches to the problem. I honestly would use the increased enforcement option to replace your current second option, which feels very close to the first (both functionally being "these people are troubled men who need to be fixed")

- In the final option, the term "hooligan firm" is perhaps uncommon enough to warrant defining (potentially able to be combined with an adjustment related to what I mentioned for the description).

- More importantly, for the final option, that doesn't look like it's currently an active choice – it doesn't change anything, just asks to let the current situation continue. That's what the Dismiss button is for, so this should have some kind of choice added. It could easily be something along the lines of having the government officially sponsor an Ultra group for the national team, or provide preferential seating and perks at national team games, or other things like that.

[Paris Saint-Germain]

- For folks who might not recognize the naming convention or know that they tend to roll in gangs, when the name of the hooligan group is introduced in the description, it might be helpful to specify that that is the name of a specific organized group.

- We could probably make this validity pro sports specifically, rather than just all sports, and that will add a few more nations to the list that can receive it.

- To ride on Electrum's suggestion (and your comments on responding to it), we definitely need to clarification on how social services are going to help the situation, and which services are being suggested.

- I think your idea of splitting between social services and increased enforcement would be a good call – they are very different approaches to the problem. I honestly would use the increased enforcement option to replace your current second option, which feels very close to the first (both functionally being "these people are troubled men who need to be fixed")

- In the final option, the term "hooligan firm" is perhaps uncommon enough to warrant defining (potentially able to be combined with an adjustment related to what I mentioned for the description).

- More importantly, for the final option, that doesn't look like it's currently an active choice – it doesn't change anything, just asks to let the current situation continue. That's what the Dismiss button is for, so this should have some kind of choice added. It could easily be something along the lines of having the government officially sponsor an Ultra group for the national team, or provide preferential seating and perks at national team games, or other things like that.

I don't see how the first and second option are functionally being "these people are troubled men who need to be fixed." Option 1 wants to get rid of them completely and option 2 tries to go after the root of the problem (aka marginalization of working class men).

Edited option 3 to include the government sponsor ultra groups.

[Paris Saint-Germain]

In lieu of feedback, bumping it and putting it on last call.

[Australian rePublic]

What's IFF?

[Paris Saint-Germain]

What's IFF?

International Football Federation. Basically like FIFA.

[Newland City]

Description: In a qualifying game for the IFF World Cup, @@NAME@@ has lifted spirits after a crucial win against Bigtopia. However, a darker side of your country's fanbase has emerged: hooligan fans, particularly those of the @@DEMONYMADJECTIVE@@ Extreme Boyz that cause trouble on the streets and seek fights against rival fans. People are demanding you take a stand.

Validity: must have sports

Description: In a qualifying game for the IFF World Cup, @@NAME@@ has lifted spirits after a crucial win against Bigtopia. However, a darker side of your country's fanbase has emerged: hooligan fans, especially those from the group @@DEMONYMADJECTIVE@@ Extreme Boyz, stir up trouble and seek fights with rivals. In this instance, @@DEMONYMADJECTIVE@@ hooligans have chanted racist slurs against Bigtopian players and fans alike.

Validity: must have professional sports

I think you put the description twice on accident. Anyways, the second, more descriptive one is better.

[option]"These so-called 'fans' are an absolute disgrace!" shouts @@RANDOMNAME@@, a fair-weather fan who has cuts and bruises trying to escape from a fight. "I know that national pride is important and that we must do anything to win, but this goes too far. Racist chants, dehumanizing our rivals, rioting and causing a fuss, these actions are simply unsportsmanlike. What's worse is that the minority of hooligans only tarnishes the image of us and @@DEMONYMADJECTIVE@@ football as a whole! @@LEADER@@, I implore you to ban all hooligan firms from attending any game. Also, why not ban alcohol and the use of flares? That'll show those thugs not to mess around and trash our sport!"
[effect]attending a sports game is more family-friendly than watching a kids movie

Speaking as an American, I read through this issue and thought 'hooligan firm' was a weird typo of 'hooligans from,' and had to read through this thread to have even the remotest idea of what that is, and even know I still don't feel like I get it. Definitely 100% 1take that suggestion to actually explain what you're referring to.

Even aside from that, this option feels rather weak, especially because the banning alcohol thing is locked behind an "also." My suggestion would be to reword it along the lines of "I implore you to ban alcohol, flairs, and any of the other activities that give rise to hooliganism from sports games!"

[option]"I agree, but this doesn't go far enough," says @@RANDOMFEMALENAME@@, a psychologist who also is a controversial feminist. "Hooliganism is rampant amongst angsty young men who want to show off their toxic masculinity. It's clear they are suffering from a mental disorder brought on by unchecked hormones, rage, and oh yes, masculinity! We need a national mental health program to evaluate the behavior of these people and stamp out this disgrace once and for all."
[effect]men who scream are shipped off to asylums

Replace 'controversial feminist' with something less direct and more funny, like have her hair be "redder than the @@ANIMAL@@ball team jerseys." Other than this is a solidly written option.

[option]"No one likes us, no one likes us! No one likes us, we don't care!" shouts a crowd of @@DEMONYMADJECTIVE@@ Extreme Boyz while engaged in a typical street riot for their standards. The hooligan firm leader @@RANDOMMALENAME@@ comes up to talk holding a megaphone. "If you ban us and other ultra groups from attending, then you will destroy the atmosphere of every single sporting event! We provide our national team the extra edge to get the win with banners, chants, and flares, and you want to make our home ground a library? That's a great way to sabotage our sports culture! @@LEADER@@, if you are a true patriot, why don't you publicly support and back our activities?"
[effect]government employees proudly brandish flares in their daily lives[/box]

Solid the first sentence is throwing me off: "@@DENONYMADJECTIVE@@ Extreme Boyz?" As in, every nation has its own "Extreme Boyz?" I'd reword that whole thing to "chants a crowd of members of hooliganistic sports club 'Extreme Boyz in unison while crowding out the street."

---

Quite a bit away from ready for 'Last Call' IMO. Could use some more work but I get the feeling you have a good chance of getting this accepted if you put that work in

[Australian rePublic]

What's IFF?

International Football Federation. Basically like FIFA.

Specify

[Paris Saint-Germain]

Description: In a qualifying game for the IFF World Cup, @@NAME@@ has lifted spirits after a crucial win against Bigtopia. However, a darker side of your country's fanbase has emerged: hooligan fans, particularly those of the @@DEMONYMADJECTIVE@@ Extreme Boyz that cause trouble on the streets and seek fights against rival fans. People are demanding you take a stand.

Validity: must have sports

Description: In a qualifying game for the IFF World Cup, @@NAME@@ has lifted spirits after a crucial win against Bigtopia. However, a darker side of your country's fanbase has emerged: hooligan fans, especially those from the group @@DEMONYMADJECTIVE@@ Extreme Boyz, stir up trouble and seek fights with rivals. In this instance, @@DEMONYMADJECTIVE@@ hooligans have chanted racist slurs against Bigtopian players and fans alike.

Validity: must have professional sports

I think you put the description twice on accident. Anyways, the second, more descriptive one is better.

Used the latter description and fixed that formatting problem.

[option]"These so-called 'fans' are an absolute disgrace!" shouts @@RANDOMNAME@@, a fair-weather fan who has cuts and bruises trying to escape from a fight. "I know that national pride is important and that we must do anything to win, but this goes too far. Racist chants, dehumanizing our rivals, rioting and causing a fuss, these actions are simply unsportsmanlike. What's worse is that the minority of hooligans only tarnishes the image of us and @@DEMONYMADJECTIVE@@ football as a whole! @@LEADER@@, I implore you to ban all hooligan firms from attending any game. Also, why not ban alcohol and the use of flares? That'll show those thugs not to mess around and trash our sport!"
[effect]attending a sports game is more family-friendly than watching a kids movie

Speaking as an American, I read through this issue and thought 'hooligan firm' was a weird typo of 'hooligans from,' and had to read through this thread to have even the remotest idea of what that is, and even know I still don't feel like I get it. Definitely 100% 1take that suggestion to actually explain what you're referring to.

Even aside from that, this option feels rather weak, especially because the banning alcohol thing is locked behind an "also." My suggestion would be to reword it along the lines of "I implore you to ban alcohol, flairs, and any of the other activities that give rise to hooliganism from sports games!"

Hooligan firms simply mean hooligan groups and I feel it is self-explanatory. However, I will reword it to "hooligan groups" if it's too confusing for other audiences.

[option]"I agree, but this doesn't go far enough," says @@RANDOMFEMALENAME@@, a psychologist who also is a controversial feminist. "Hooliganism is rampant amongst angsty young men who want to show off their toxic masculinity. It's clear they are suffering from a mental disorder brought on by unchecked hormones, rage, and oh yes, masculinity! We need a national mental health program to evaluate the behavior of these people and stamp out this disgrace once and for all."
[effect]men who scream are shipped off to asylums
Replace 'controversial feminist' with something less direct and more funny, like have her hair be "redder than the @@ANIMAL@@ball team jerseys." Other than this is a solidly written option.

Alright, will do something along those lines.

[option]"No one likes us, no one likes us! No one likes us, we don't care!" shouts a crowd of @@DEMONYMADJECTIVE@@ Extreme Boyz while engaged in a typical street riot for their standards. The hooligan firm leader @@RANDOMMALENAME@@ comes up to talk holding a megaphone. "If you ban us and other ultra groups from attending, then you will destroy the atmosphere of every single sporting event! We provide our national team the extra edge to get the win with banners, chants, and flares, and you want to make our home ground a library? That's a great way to sabotage our sports culture! @@LEADER@@, if you are a true patriot, why don't you publicly support and back our activities?"
[effect]government employees proudly brandish flares in their daily lives[/box]
Solid the first sentence is throwing me off: "@@DENONYMADJECTIVE@@ Extreme Boyz?" As in, every nation has its own "Extreme Boyz?" I'd reword that whole thing to "chants a crowd of members of hooliganistic sports club 'Extreme Boyz in unison while crowding out the street."

I meant it to be the nation's Extreme Boyz (ex. something like the English Extreme Boyz), but I can see where you are coming from. I might also change it entirely to the @@ANIMAL@@ Batallion or the @@NAME@@ Front (something that evokes more fear and even a tinge of fascism/far-right elements).

---

Quite a bit away from ready for 'Last Call' IMO. Could use some more work but I get the feeling you have a good chance of getting this accepted if you put that work in

I moved it to last call since there wasn't much feedback and feedback for it was pretty slow. Thanks for your feedback, will implement them now.

[Paris Saint-Germain]

Edits already in place and bumping for more feedback. Still on last call.

[Paris Saint-Germain]

And submitted. Thanks for the feedback!

[Australian rePublic]

Good Luck!!!