[Abortion][REVISED POLL] If you had the power...

[LimaUniformNovemberAlpha]

Same perspective. And I am both.

No you aren't, because they are mutually exclusive.

The definition of conservative is "traditional."

So, there is no such thing as a "conservative" unless the traditions you're conserving are specified alongside it. In this case, libertarian traditions.

[LimaUniformNovemberAlpha]

The question of men having a responsibility to care for a child they didn't want is a red herring, not really related to the abortion debate at all.

The vast majority of those who support abortion rights have characterized male objections to abortion as "you're just jealous you didn't get laid yourself."

The same could be said of those who support mandatory child support, yet we don't hear it near as often.

This issue, apart from causing the risk-averse to be outbred by those less so, is also the ultimate social experiment. It tells us who, among those who support abortion rights, are fundamentally disingenuous people, and who are not.

[Donut section]

No you aren't, because they are mutually exclusive.

The definition of conservative is "traditional."

So, there is no such thing as a "conservative" unless the traditions you're conserving are specified alongside it. In this case, libertarian traditions.

Hardly, the difference between trad cons and cons is the "everything was better then" and "what did we used to do better or what can we use from yesterday that can help today."

[Ifreann]

The question of men having a responsibility to care for a child they didn't want is a red herring, not really related to the abortion debate at all.

The vast majority of those who support abortion rights have characterized male objections to abortion as "you're just jealous you didn't get laid yourself."

The same could be said of those who support mandatory child support, yet we don't hear it near as often.

This issue, apart from causing the risk-averse to be outbred by those less so, is also the ultimate social experiment. It tells us who, among those who support abortion rights, are fundamentally disingenuous people, and who are not.

If you want to examine people's political positions on matters not related to abortion I would suggest sending them a telegram rather than posting in the abortion thread about things unrelated to abortion.

[The Alma Mater]

The question of men having a responsibility to care for a child they didn't want is a red herring, not really related to the abortion debate at all.

The vast majority of those who support abortion rights have characterized male objections to abortion as "you're just jealous you didn't get laid yourself."

They have ? Can you show some statistics ?

[Katganistan]

I think that being informed should be somewhat like ensuring a person knows they need to show up in court (ie informing them of the court date and all that). Basically there needs to be evidence the man actually knew the woman was pregnant. That being said, I also do not support this in a place like the US, which has a shit system for ensuring the well-being of kids who live in poverty.

All the more reason to force the issue. We can't put off doing so just because of the initial consequences.

The vast majority of men claim to have had sex in their teen years; the vast majority of them couldn't have afforded children at the same time. Maybe they should all be expected to chip in for the child support bills of the few whose condoms broke.

No.

[Katganistan]

The question of men having a responsibility to care for a child they didn't want is a red herring, not really related to the abortion debate at all.

The vast majority of those who support abortion rights have characterized male objections to abortion as "you're just jealous you didn't get laid yourself."

The same could be said of those who support mandatory child support, yet we don't hear it near as often.

This issue, apart from causing the risk-averse to be outbred by those less so, is also the ultimate social experiment. It tells us who, among those who support abortion rights, are fundamentally disingenuous people, and who are not.

I would like to see some evidence of these statements you're pulling out of A-space.

The ones related to abortion. The other ones belong in other threads.

[The Parkus Empire]

No you aren't, because they are mutually exclusive.

The definition of conservative is "traditional."

So, there is no such thing as a "conservative" unless the traditions you're conserving are specified alongside it. In this case, libertarian traditions.

Conservativism is a specific school of Western political thought including philosophy and jurisprudence.

[The Parkus Empire]

And no, in the U.S., Roe vs. Wade is completely contingent on revising the very reason for a law, thus it is very wrong. Whatever arguments can be made on state level are a different story, but that ruling is pure legislation

[Zyr and Pony]

Mississippi's governor has just signed into law the tightest abortion restrictions in the US.

The bill bans most abortions after 15 weeks, with no exceptions for rape or incest.

The only exemptions are in cases where there is a foetal abnormality that is "incompatible with life", or the mother's life is in danger.

Mississippi previously banned abortions from 20 weeks. Critics say the new law is unconstitutional.

The measure was enacted on Monday by Republican Governor Phil Bryant, who says he wants the southern state to be "the safest place in America for an unborn child".

The Center for Reproductive Rights said it had filed a lawsuit to block the new law on behalf of the only abortion clinic in Mississippi, the Jackson Women's Health Organization.

Diane Derzis, who runs that clinic, said earlier this month that anti-abortion activists were seeking to undermine Roe v Wade, the landmark 1973 US Supreme Court case which legalised abortion.

She told the Clarion-Ledger newspaper: "These groups are tossing anything and everything out there, anything that could start winding its way through the legal system because we're in a very fragile place right now."

In 2014 federal judges ruled that attempts for six- and 12-week bans in North Dakota and Arkansas were unconstitutional, and struck them down.

President Trump has supported a proposed federal ban on abortions after 20 weeks after fertilisation, but the bill was blocked in the Senate in January.

So Missisippi continues to try to overturn abortion, and isn't even smart/nice enough to allow for exceptions for rape and abortion. This isn't surprising but it is frustrating to me, having the south continue to try to overturn Planned Parenthood v. Casey (the current supreme court ruling governing abortions, superseding Roe v. Wade) and not even giving any exemptions for rape babies.

So, what say ye, NSG? Too far, not far enough, completely in the wrong direction? What?

[Kramanica]

I'm okay with this except for the incest part.

[Godular]

A wretched law penned by wretched men.

[Aillyria]

I support this law, Mississippi does something good for once......except they should have made an exception for incest, tbh.

[Copperward]

The measure was enacted on Monday by Republican Governor Phil Bryant, who says he wants the southern state to be "the safest place in America for an unborn child".

Mississippi has to do a lot more to be anywhere close to being "the safest place in America for an unborn child."
*Cough* a population heavily afflicted by weight problems and obesity *cough* poverty as a consequence of a terrible state bureaucracy *cough* lowest life expectancy *cough* worst highschool graduation rates in the nation *cough*

I'm not going to argue over whether or not there should be laws against abortions, but I would like to point out how outrageous it is that politicians are so concerned with abortion and "protecting unborn children" and all that jargon but won't give a damn when it comes to protecting the child after he or she is born. What about their quality of life? Health? Education? Future?

[The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp]

"no exceptions for rape or incest."

Yeah, this law is 100% bullshit.

[Albrenia]

The measure was enacted on Monday by Republican Governor Phil Bryant, who says he wants the southern state to be "the safest place in America for an unborn child".

Mississippi has to do a lot more to be anywhere close to being "the safest place in America for an unborn child."
*Cough* a population heavily afflicted by weight problems and obesity *cough* poverty as a consequence of a terrible state bureaucracy *cough* lowest life expectancy *cough* worst highschool graduation rates in the nation *cough*

I'm not going to argue over whether or not there should be laws against abortions, but I would like to point out how outrageous it is that politicians are so concerned with abortion and "protecting unborn children" and all that jargon but won't give a damn when it comes to protecting the child after he or she is born. What about their quality of life? Health? Education? Future?

Caring about people after they are born is Socialism, duh.

[Zurkerx]

No surprises here.

[Neanderthaland]

I'm okay with this except for the incest part.

So a fetus with a severe developmental disorder should never be aborted unless it is "incompatible with life," but an equally innocent fetus is a sin against God and man, deserving only of scorn and death, provided it's parents are cousins. Even if it is completely healthy?

Can you even see the moral high ground from down there?

[Ostroeuropa]

I support on demand abortion and legal parental surrender.
The law is a step backward.

[Copperward]

Mississippi has to do a lot more to be anywhere close to being "the safest place in America for an unborn child."
*Cough* a population heavily afflicted by weight problems and obesity *cough* poverty as a consequence of a terrible state bureaucracy *cough* lowest life expectancy *cough* worst highschool graduation rates in the nation *cough*

I'm not going to argue over whether or not there should be laws against abortions, but I would like to point out how outrageous it is that politicians are so concerned with abortion and "protecting unborn children" and all that jargon but won't give a damn when it comes to protecting the child after he or she is born. What about their quality of life? Health? Education? Future?

Caring about people after they are born is Socialism, duh.

A communist America is a good America

[Saiwania]

What about their quality of life? Health? Education? Future?

Red state politicians are loathe to support or focus on anything that might raise taxes. All that stuff probably costs too much money.

[Kramanica]

I'm okay with this except for the incest part.

So a fetus with a severe developmental disorder should never be aborted unless it is "incompatible with life," but an equally innocent fetus is a sin against God and man, deserving only of scorn and death, provided it's parents are cousins. Even if it is completely healthy?

Can you even see the moral high ground from down there?

I don't believe in God so yeah.

Also I have no idea what you're talking about.

[Aillyria]

What about their quality of life? Health? Education? Future?

Red state politicians are loathe to support or focus on anything that might raise taxes. All that stuff probably costs too much money.

It'd take too much money from their own top notch government healthcare and services.

[Neanderthaland]

So a fetus with a severe developmental disorder should never be aborted unless it is "incompatible with life," but an equally innocent fetus is a sin against God and man, deserving only of scorn and death, provided it's parents are cousins. Even if it is completely healthy?

Can you even see the moral high ground from down there?

I don't believe in God so yeah.

Also I have no idea what you're talking about.

How do you justify an exception for incest, but nothing else?

[Copperward]

I don't believe in God so yeah.

Also I have no idea what you're talking about.

How do you justify an exception for incest, but nothing else?

Fulfilling campaign promises, re-election