Is there a God?

[The New California Republic]

The dragon in your garage doesn't give you things like the prayer of the Angel of God.
You may not appreaciate things like that prayer, said differently, see its worth, but many people do.

You may not appreciate things like having an invisible, intangible, undetectable dragon in your garage, but many people do.

It's my best friend. I talk to it every day. I ask it for things but it isn't too chatty.

[Punished UMN]

Metaphysically speaking, Christianity would say that the universe is within God, that it is a manifestation of god projecting his will, emanating from him in the neoplatonic process of creation.

[State of Turelisa]

Metaphysically speaking, Christianity would say that the universe is within God, that it is a manifestation of god projecting his will, emanating from him in the neoplatonic process of creation.

Dark matter provides evidence on which this metaphysical argument may be based.

http://eng.lmr.cc/m_A_Natural_Disaster_04.html

[Punished UMN]

Metaphysically speaking, Christianity would say that the universe is within God, that it is a manifestation of god projecting his will, emanating from him in the neoplatonic process of creation.

Dark matter provides evidence on which this metaphysical argument may be based.

I don't know anything about that, but do elaborate.

[Alvecia]

My question about worth was more directed in the sense of "what makes a religious belief any different from any other strong held belief", beyond perhaps popularity. The dragon in my garage as an example.

I was born and raised a Catholic, spending my entire primary and secondary education in faith schools, so I like to think I have some basic understanding of what christians believe in.

The dragon in your garage doesn't give you things like the prayer of the Angel of God.
You may not appreaciate things like that prayer, said differently, see its worth, but many people do.

No, it gives me chants like the Word of the Dragon.
You may not appreciate things like that chant, said differently, see its worth, but I do.

[Allenstadt]

And FYI, this is the real Pascal's wager:
http://wp.production.patheos.com/blogs/ ... /aVSVQ.png
(it was too large to be included here)

[Fuzzbuckets]

'God' exists.

But it's not exactly what one generally thinks of when they hear the word 'God'

[The Alma Mater]

And FYI, this is the real Pascal's wager:
http://wp.production.patheos.com/blogs/ ... /aVSVQ.png
(it was too large to be included here)

Still lacks many religions and still assumes a deity appreciates it if you worship him/her/it solely for the benefits

But still a nice image to post for whenever some silly person brings it up. Thanks

[Lost Memories]

The dragon in your garage doesn't give you things like the prayer of the Angel of God.

This is the prayer of the Angel of God.
Observed in: catholic church (1,3 billion people, 50% of all christianity)

Latin version

Ángele Dei,
qui custos es mei,

me, tibi commissum
pietáte supérna,

illúmina, custódi,
rege et gubérna.

Amen

Translation of the latin version.

Angel of God,
that you are my guardian,

that I was entrusted to you
by the Heavenly Piety.

illuminate, safeguard,
rule and guide me

Amen.

Official english version

Angel of God,
my guardian dear,
to whom God’s love commits me here,
ever this day be at my side,
to light and guard, to rule and guide.
Amen.

---
What belief points are expressed in this prayer? (on which belief this prayer is based on?)
-Angels: spiritual beings at the service of god, they are pure and immune to humans weaknesses
-Human weaknesses: to be vulnerable to temptation, to have weak wills
-Every person since birth received an angel as guardian, regardless of personal actions, deeds and misdeeds
-Guardian angels help in hardships, and lead to God
-Christian prayer: "the raising of one's mind and heart to God, or the requesting of good things from God." Prayer may be expressed vocally or mentally.
-Prayers of Intercession: prayers of intercession don't aim directly at god, but at some other being, spiritual or human, to ask them to put in a good word for us in front of god, to ask them to pray god for us
-Heavenly Piety: one of the names of God, used in the latin version to highlight why god acts

---
What are the takeaways from this prayer according to Tradition?
-Every person is precious and important to God, so much to instruct an angel as guardian for everyone
-The aid and blessings offered by god to everyone in the form of a personal guardian angel are:
to light, or illuminate: to don't walk in the dark but in the light, but also to find light in oneself, to light up the intellect and the soul
to guard: to keep safe, to be protected from evil, to be kept safe from temptations and the deception of evil
to rule: this one can mean to support, to hold firm, to hold up, when faced with difficulty or while falling
to guide: to be inspired to make the right choice, and to avoid falling in mistake, to be purposeful and to not be led astray, to be led to god
-the role of the guardian angel is that of a divinely inspired conscience
-like with conscience, the guardian angel always talks and gives good suggestions, but to listen or not, is up to the person
-the presence of a guardian angel reinforces the concept that no one is ever alone
-the prayer of the Angel of God exists not only to call more support, but also to give due respect to their presence, for the work they do, to don't take them for granted


Some pictures the Angel of God

.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Cort ... gel_01.jpg
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Guar ... l_1900.jpg
https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File ... Kindes.jpg
https://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plik:Schutzengelbild_(florentinisch_17Jh).jpg
https://pl.wiktionary.org/wiki/Plik:Ber ... zengel.jpg

And neither does God, since - as you claim - God is not in any way in our universe.

I didn't.
viewtopic.php?p=37604406#p37604406
Read the latter part of that post.

[The Alma Mater]

And neither does God, since - as you claim - God is not in any way in our universe.

I didn't.
viewtopic.php?p=37604406#p37604406
Read the latter part of that post.

Ah, I missed your edit.
Still, if God is present in our universe and does interact with it - that means material evidence must exist.

[Lost Memories]

The dragon in your garage doesn't give you things like the prayer of the Angel of God.
You may not appreaciate things like that prayer, said differently, see its worth, but many people do.

No, it gives me chants like the Word of the Dragon.
You may not appreciate things like that chant, said differently, see its worth, but I do.

Tell me, how is the chant called Word of the Dragon?
Post it.


Besides, since you claimed to have been a catholic, did you ever heard of the prayer of the Angel of God before?
How many of the points expressed in that prayer you do recognize as "basic understanding of what christians believe in" ?

so I like to think I have some basic understanding of what christians believe in.

[Sicilian Imperial-Capitalist Empire]

Metaphysically speaking, Christianity would say that the universe is within God, that it is a manifestation of god projecting his will, emanating from him in the neoplatonic process of creation.

Dark matter provides evidence on which this metaphysical argument may be based.

http://eng.lmr.cc/m_A_Natural_Disaster_04.html

I would like to see your reasoning for this statement, given how dark matter definitely does not act like god, although scientifically we don't know very much about it.

[Ifreann]

The dragon in your garage doesn't give you things like the prayer of the Angel of God.
You may not appreaciate things like that prayer, said differently, see its worth, but many people do.

No, it gives me chants like the Word of the Dragon.
You may not appreciate things like that chant, said differently, see its worth, but I do.

Nuz aan sul, fent alok,
fod fin vul dovah nok,
fen kos nahlot mahfaeraak ahrk ruz!
Paaz Keizaal fen kos stin nol bein Alduin jot!

[Alvecia]

No, it gives me chants like the Word of the Dragon.
You may not appreciate things like that chant, said differently, see its worth, but I do.

Tell me, how is the chant called Word of the Dragon?
Post it.

I couldn't possibly share such things with a non-believer. It would be heresy of the highest order

Besides, since you claimed to have been a catholic, did you ever heard of the prayer of the Angel of God before?
How many of the points expressed in that prayer you do recognize as "basic understanding of what christians believe in" ?

so I like to think I have some basic understanding of what christians believe in.

No actually, which I think says a lot about the variety of denominations we were discussing earlier. If it came up in R.E I can't recall it. Mostly it was just the hail marys, our fathers and the 4 or 5 hymns of the week.

[The Alma Mater]

No, it gives me chants like the Word of the Dragon.
You may not appreciate things like that chant, said differently, see its worth, but I do.

Nuz aan sul, fent alok,
fod fin vul dovah nok,
fen kos nahlot mahfaeraak ahrk ruz!
Paaz Keizaal fen kos stin nol bein Alduin jot!

Dovahkiin, fah hin kogaan mu draal!

Amen.

[Godular]

You know, I’ve kinda come a bit of a full circle since that readjustment in my position.

With the whole ‘no reason to include it in the theory’ bit, I’m pretty much at the same conclusions I had before, but from a lightly different angle. For instance, all this talk of things outside the universe or beyond the material... it has barely any actual observation, and functionally no empirical observation whatsoever, so any argument about it is functionally the same as getting particularly heated about the literary analysis of the Harry Potter series.

And maybe getting really heated about who the ‘best’ character is.

It’s all so speculative, but also ... personal.

[Lost Memories]

I didn't.
viewtopic.php?p=37604406#p37604406
Read the latter part of that post.

Ah, I missed your edit.
Still, if God is present in our universe and does interact with it - that means material evidence must exist.

If God inspires someone to paint a picture, that is the result of an interaction between God and reality, by using an human as intermediary.
That painted picture is very real and material, that's "material evidence", something did change from the interaction of God.

That's how usually the interaction of God with reality is understood. God interacts mainly by using humans as intermediary.
Then yes, there are also miracles. But those are very rare, so much as to don't count as evidence for christians themselves(most of, again), and generally miracles are a can of worms(many are fake). I'm not going to defend them.


Actually, if you did care to read the previous posted prayer of the Angel of God, with its explaination, you should have been able to see for yourself what christians generally think about God interacting with the universe.

I'm not asking you to believe that, just read it and make yourself more informed.
Which is going to save a lot of questions, and actually make the discussion progress.
(progress? what is that? in a forum discussion? preposterous)

[Lost Memories]

so I like to think I have some basic understanding of what christians believe in.

Besides, since you claimed to have been a catholic, did you ever heard of the prayer of the Angel of God before?
How many of the points expressed in that prayer you do recognize as "basic understanding of what christians believe in" ?

No actually, which I think says a lot about the variety of denominations we were discussing earlier. If it came up in R.E I can't recall it. Mostly it was just the hail marys, our fathers and the 4 or 5 hymns of the week.

And now that you have read it, how many of the points expressed in that prayer do you recognize as part of christian belief?

That's the part i was most interested in.
Since you claim to know christianity, as many do, how much of your understanding actually matches the one of an active christian? And how much of it is in clear conflict?
(not just some random christians, but from the same group, which has internal unity, so "variety of denominations" doesn't hold, when talking about catholicism)

[Jedi Council]

Metaphysically speaking, Christianity would say that the universe is within God, that it is a manifestation of god projecting his will, emanating from him in the neoplatonic process of creation.

As though metaphysics still needs to be taken seriously in the 21st century

[Godular]

Ah, I missed your edit.
Still, if God is present in our universe and does interact with it - that means material evidence must exist.

If God inspires someone to paint a picture, that is the result of an interaction between God and reality, by using an human as intermediary.
That painted picture is very real and material, that's "material evidence", something did change from the interaction of God.

That's how usually the interaction of God with reality is understood. God interacts mainly by using humans as intermediary.
Then yes, there are also miracles. But those are very rare, so much as to don't count as evidence for christians themselves(most of, again), and generally miracles are a can of worms(many are fake). I'm not going to defend them.

But that’s no different than feeling inspired by one’s idea of God. There is plenty of art ‘inspired’ by other concepts... though there is a part of me that is amused at how my argument is drifting towards rule 34 as a statement on religious iconography.

[Ifreann]

Ah, I missed your edit.
Still, if God is present in our universe and does interact with it - that means material evidence must exist.

If God inspires someone to paint a picture, that is the result of an interaction between God and reality, by using an human as intermediary.
That painted picture is very real and material, that's "material evidence", something did change from the interaction of God.

That's how usually the interaction of God with reality is understood. God interacts mainly by using humans as intermediary.
Then yes, there are also miracles. But those are very rare, so much as to don't count as evidence for christians themselves(most of, again), and generally miracles are a can of worms(many are fake). I'm not going to defend them.

How do we differentiate between a real and extant God interacting with reality by inspiring the creation of some work of art, and an artist being inspired by the idea of God in the same way that people are inspired to create works of art based on Batman?

[Alvecia]

No actually, which I think says a lot about the variety of denominations we were discussing earlier. If it came up in R.E I can't recall it. Mostly it was just the hail marys, our fathers and the 4 or 5 hymns of the week.

And now that you have read it, how many of the points expressed in that prayer do you recognize as part of christian belief?

That's the part i was most interested in.
Since you claim to know christianity, as many do, how much of your understanding actually matches the one of an active christian? And how much of it is in clear conflict?
(not just some random christians, but from the same group, which has internal unity, so "variety of denominations" doesn't hold, when talking about catholicism)

Seems like a pretty general prayer? I don't really understand what you're asking.

[Lost Memories]

And now that you have read it, how many of the points expressed in that prayer do you recognize as part of christian belief?

That's the part i was most interested in.
Since you claim to know christianity, as many do, how much of your understanding actually matches the one of an active christian? And how much of it is in clear conflict?
(not just some random christians, but from the same group, which has internal unity, so "variety of denominations" doesn't hold, when talking about catholicism)

Seems like a pretty general prayer? I don't really understand what you're asking.

I listed some points under the prayer text, did you find anything odd in those points?

[Alvecia]

Seems like a pretty general prayer? I don't really understand what you're asking.

I listed some points under the prayer text, did you find anything odd in those points?

They are certainly points. Bulleted an all, but I'm not sure how this homework assignment has any relevance to my initial question.

[Asle Leopolka]

There is no god.
There is no allah.
There is no devil.
You're just afraid of the unknown and made up a superstition to ease your fears.
This superstition has been warped and manipulated to become a means of control through promises of salvation from your miserable lives or as a mechanism of fear to force obedience, shame, and a desire to beg for forgiveness.