The Rejected Times

[Drop Your Pants]

Nope. It's just how you could fix an inactive region with a rotten base and terrible system.

But it's like I said, activity isn't for everyone.

Balder isn't the most active of the 4 sinkers I'd say its a joint first between Osiris and TRR and Laz and Balder fighting for last. No middle ground

[Tano]

Nope. It's just how you could fix an inactive region with a rotten base and terrible system.

But it's like I said, activity isn't for everyone.

Balder isn't the most active of the 4 sinkers I'd say its a joint first between Osiris and TRR and Laz and Balder fighting for last. No middle ground

From what I've seen, Osi doesn't seem very active.

[Cormac A Stark]

From what I've seen, Osi doesn't seem very active.

We go back and forth. We've had 1,377 posts so far this month, with some days having relatively high post count by our standards (100+) and other days significantly lower.

For what it's worth, I don't think this pissing contest over who's the most active is either relevant or productive. Different regions have different forms of activity. For example, Osiris has a very active IRC channel and that's a big part of our regional culture -- that's something we would rather be doing than spamming. For Balder, on days when their post count is low their RMB activity might be knocking all the other Sinkers out of the park. For TRR, obviously its newspaper is the most prolific in NationStates, while also being remarkably inaccurate and at times outright libelous. I'm sure Lazarus has some kind of activity as well. They're probably busy helping the proletariat or something.

Anyway, there isn't any point in this. All regions have highs and lows in activity, booms and busts in regard to active governments, etc. Rachel is right though that a region that has had its own very serious activity problems shouldn't be throwing stones, particularly when much of its criticism isn't even accurate, as usual.

[Tano]

From what I've seen, Osi doesn't seem very active.

For what it's worth, I don't think this pissing contest over who's the most active is either relevant or productive.

Yet you still managed to find the time to make a cheap shot at Laz? Classy.

I do agree with you on the fact that different regions have different forms of activity. TEP's skype room is one of the most active in all of NS (even Albion's is rivaled by it). And Osi's IRC channel is indeed active.

[V I Lenin]

Activity levels in Lazarus are excellent at present, you should perhaps be a little more informed before you throw away comments like that.

[Funkadelia]

Inane ramblings.

Man, you sure do a great job of making yourself look worse with every post you make, huh?

Apparently it doesn't matter who is more active, but for the record Lazarus is inactive? Genius.

[Aperi]

I'm sure Lazarus has some kind of activity as well. They're probably busy helping the proletariat or something.

That's all you've got? Some piss poor jab about how we chose to RP our government? I could have easily poked fun at the Egyptian theme or how you totally tried to black-list Zaolat over nonsense but I'm too stoned to care. Go endotart man, I'm starting to get ideas.


edit: Not trying to get banned, so I used better words so the dutch mafia won't come after me.

[Benevolent Thomas]

All of this squabbling over GCRs is so pointless when we all know that UCRs are far better places to be

[Aperi]

All of this squabbling over GCRs is so pointless when we all know that UCRs are far better places to be

Now Thomas....playing in a UCR is like playing with unlimited health on Turok.

[North East Somerset]

All of this squabbling over GCRs is so pointless when we all know that UCRs are far better places to be

Now Thomas....playing in a UCR is like playing with unlimited health on Turok.

Playing in 10KI is pretty risky actually, as Thomas found out.

[Unibot III]

Now Thomas....playing in a UCR is like playing with unlimited health on Turok.

Playing in 10KI is pretty risky actually, as Thomas found out.

Playing outside of 10KI is pretty risky in 10KI.

[North East Somerset]

Playing in 10KI is pretty risky actually, as Thomas found out.

Playing outside of 10KI is pretty risky in 10KI.

But, Grub is 10 times the Leader you will ever be!

Hail Grub!

[Bears Armed]

I haven't a clue what everyone is arguing about. I think it's just a contest to see who can post the largest wall of text.

My question: how the heck does one RP a sport? I'm serious.

Scorinaters. Basically they decide the outcome, and then RP the game based on the stats.

That's basically it, although depending on the event and its organisers the RP might not have to relate directly to the actual game and could be about [for example] current events back in their homeland or events back in the athletes' pasts instead. In most cases the competition's organisers then insert bonuses into the scorinator programme based on their opinion of the RPs, and in some cases (with 'World Cup'- level football being the main one about which I know anything) a points-based rating derived from the team's previous performance is also a factor.

[The Grim Reaper]

Scorinaters. Basically they decide the outcome, and then RP the game based on the stats.

That's basically it, although depending on the event and its organisers the RP might not have to relate directly to the actual game and could be about [for example] current events back in their homeland or events back in the athletes' pasts instead. In most cases the competition's organisers then insert bonuses into the scorinator programme based on their opinion of the RPs, and in some cases (with 'World Cup'- level football being the main one about which I know anything) a points-based rating derived from the team's previous performance is also a factor.

Alternatively, P2TM sometimes simply had them RP out the games according to the scores they got, and then added the RP bonuses to the NEXT game.

[Bears Armed]

That's basically it, although depending on the event and its organisers the RP might not have to relate directly to the actual game and could be about [for example] current events back in their homeland or events back in the athletes' pasts instead. In most cases the competition's organisers then insert bonuses into the scorinator programme based on their opinion of the RPs, and in some cases (with 'World Cup'- level football being the main one about which I know anything) a points-based rating derived from the team's previous performance is also a factor.

Alternatively, P2TM sometimes simply had them RP out the games according to the scores they got, and then added the RP bonuses to the NEXT game.

Well, yes, I meant that the bonus would be applied for the game[s] that hadn't yet been scorinated. Apologies for not making that clear enough.

[Darkesia]

So, it's not interactive? Two people just sort of make up the back story for however many people are on a team?

Sorry to be such a dolt, I am trying to expand my understanding of the RP side of the game.

[Bears Armed]

So, it's not interactive? Two people just sort of make up the back story for however many people are on a team?

It can be interactive. For example in World Cup-related Football, and I'm fairly sure in some other contests too, you're generally encouraged to fill in a 'RP Permissions Box' which tells your opponents what they can (and can't) do with your players in their RPs about the matches;, there are IC disputes about how accurate other nations' news media have been in their reporting; and people quite often collaborate on shared storylines...
Here’s a link to the current World Cup’s RP thread, viewtopic.php?f=7&t=303819 , in case you feel like taking a look.

[Hobbesistan]

I'm not sure rambling about how 'my gcr is more active then your GCR' solves anything.

[Venico]

I'm not sure rambling about how 'my gcr is more active then your GCR' solves anything.

Same thing as having a bigger penis. More satisfaction and ego.

[Tano]

I'm not sure rambling about how 'my gcr is more active then your GCR' solves anything.

Same thing as having a bigger penis. More satisfaction and ego.

But quality of performance is the most important thing.

[Darkesia]

World Cup’s RP thread, viewtopic.php?f=7&t=303819 , in case you feel like taking a look.

Wow! That's an impressive time investment on the part of all participants. To create, compose, edit and publish multiple posts must take hours. You all have my admiration.

I understand much more about why RPers don't participate in gameplay. You don't have time!

Thank you!

[Todd McCloud]

So, it's not interactive? Two people just sort of make up the back story for however many people are on a team?

Sorry to be such a dolt, I am trying to expand my understanding of the RP side of the game.

It's NSsports, which is a bit different, in that an external program (scorinators) determine the outcome, and it's sort of an RP as you go thing. A bunch of us participate in the NS olympics. How that works is the host nation "scores" the day's events, posts them, and you RP about whatever you like, typically how good / bad your nation does, but some get more creative than that. In most cases, the host judges how good or bad the RP was and awards the good ones a "bonus" which benefits your nation in events.

Some nations do, however, work together to make some good storylines. They can be rather fun to read.

[The Rejected Times]

This week, Joe Bobs speaks with Warzone Africa's District XIV and Wysteria's The Bruce.

Class of 2002 #3: The Bruce
FEATURE | JOE BOBS

For the third installment of this series, The Rejected Times sat down with The Bruce. The Bruce is certainly one of the longest serving members of the NationStates community, having begun playing shortly after the game launched in 2002. He is the founder of Wysteria, one of a handful of user-created regions to have lasted almost twelve years. In founding the Triumvirate between The Heartland, Texas and Wysteria, he was one of the pioneers of Defending, before the concepts of invading and defending had even been established. His History of NationStates is widely considered as one of the most authoritative accounts of the story of our game.

JB: Who was your biggest influence in the early days?

TB: In the early days there really wasn’t anyone to influence you, because everyone was just doing their own thing and most of those things hadn’t been done yet. Equus and I had our hands on the tiller to guide our regional community the most, so she had a lot to do with the success of our region. Even then, it wasn’t so much influencing each other as it was dividing up duties, hashing things out, and getting things done.

JB: How did you find the process of region building back then? As there are of course many tried and tested methods today, was it more difficult back then?

TB: I think that because of how wide open everything was, it was both easier and harder to build a region back then. With so many regions now buying recruitment stamps or using 3rd party recruiting scripts, you now longer have to plod your way through the feeders and sinkers, sending individual recruiting telegrams. The downside to this means new nations are drowning in recruitment telegrams at the click of a button, so less work is put into it, which can translate into less caring about the nations that come to your region. It was not at all difficult to recruit in the first four years of the game and you could afford to be choosy. As long as you treated region building as community building it wasn’t a difficult process at all. Recruiting is only a small part of the process of region building, because even more than a reason to come to your region, they have to have a reason to stay and be active.

JB: What changes to the game do you believe have had the most impact?

TB: There have been a lot of big changes to the game that have had a lot of impact. Restrictions on submitting UN proposals were both a blessing and a curse. There were only a few other delegates with the patience to slog through 120 pages of UN proposals, so a lot of delegates didn’t bother and a lot of business didn’t get done. The restrictions (2 endorsements required) disenfranchised a lot of UN member states, but helped decrease the tendency of dead beat delegates.

Regional Powers and Founders had a huge change on the system. There were unfortunate instances of invaders claiming founder status in conquered regions to make them permanent prize regions, but otherwise these changes made regions with active founders less of a slave to the whims of invaders, spammers, and griefers.
The introduction of moderators stemmed from the same reason regional powers and founders were created: players being extremely crappy to one another. While there were numerous instances of baiting that occurred, to get other nations mod bombed after antagonizing them, on the whole moderators helped make NationStates less of a 4Chan experience.

The Griefer Rules regarding invading (with percentages of bad things invaders were allowed to do before they crossed punishable boundaries) was a bucket of cold water on invading. Invading and defending declined, moderators got migraines intervening over every little invasion, and everyone else got to enjoy a bit more peace and quiet. Reversing that in 2006, to a more hands off “gameplay” system caused an immediate rise in invading, without the same resurgence of defenders to balance it, because so many prominent defenders had retired or become less active.

JB: This is interesting, do you think the general tone or attitude of players in NationStates has changed a lot over the years?

TB: Thing biggest change in attitude is that there is an expectation of some measure of fair play, in terms of being treated poorly by your fellow player. A large part of that was the introduction of Moderators, but a lot of that also has to do with the emergence of good role-models and people feeling that their regional communities are worth defending.

JB: What changes to the game would you most like to see put into action?

TB: I like a lot of the changes to the game that have been introduced. The only one that hasn’t been beneficial to everyone were the more hands off “gameplay” rules that clearly favour invaders. The powers that be have made it perfectly clear that they have no wish to go back to the mod work intensive Griefer Rules and any changes need to be carefully thought out, because invaders will find a way to pervert their intent. Likely, a wider window of opportunity for updaters to affect quick changes in delegate would help.

JB: What has been the most unexpected event you have witnessed?

TB: When players I didn’t know in real life began moving to Wysteria in 2002. To begin with, the nations in our region were all played by people I knew offline; so when strangers started showing up out of the blue it was a bit of a shock. You have to understand that things were all very new back then. It completely changed how I viewed our regional community. It went from a region for friends to have nations in to a region for nations to come and become friends in.

JB: What has given you the most satisfaction?

TB: I’d have to say that helping to build a regional community that has led to long term, friendships outside of the game.

JB: Would you say that the community aspect is the most important part of NationStates?

TB: Nothing else has the same draw in the game as feeling that you’re part of a community. A well planned and successful liberation of a region is less rewarding, without fellow players to share in the moment.

JB: Wysteria has a very strong community, what do you think makes a region a real community, rather than just a group of players?

TB: Regions live and die by the activity and dedication of their core players. What makes a strong regional community is that players identify strongly with the region, support their fellow players, feel protective of it when it is threatened, and want to participate in regional activities.

JB: What was your biggest disappointment?

TB: The Server 1 Invisionfree crash of 2006. It affected the oldest regions in NationStates, as it was one of the most popular offsite forum options when players needed an option to the clunky, early NS forums that were too slow to use. We were having a really good level of roleplaying activity on our offsite forum and then in a flash we lost six months’ worth of posts. That stopped everything in its tracks and the focus went from role-playing to thread recovery (Google caches, Wayback Machine, etc.).

JB: I remember this too, there was a lot of outrage across the game. How long did it take Wysteria to recover?

TB: The first couple of weeks were spent wading through the panic and sometimes conflicting statements by Invisionfree, while they sorted the mess out. We were by no means the only victims of the server crash. A lot of the older regions used it and some of the non-NationStates forums they supported were online memorials to people no longer among the living. Once we knew that Server 1 information wasn’t going to be restored, there was another two months of people using various means to recover lost threads and repost them. It probably took another six months or more to recover the lost level of role-playing activity and having their major threads derailed cost us at least one of our most active role-players at the time.

JB: What is your opinion on the current state of affairs? How does it compare?

TB: For a lot of players it’s a contentious question. The best of both worlds would be the sophistication of the current game system and the overwhelming enthusiasm in the early years of NationStates. The invader-defender rules are in serious need of an overhaul to put some balance back into the nightly struggle. Probably the biggest problem right now is when you have players that have been around a long time taking the piss out of new players for the crime of wanting to try to do something on their own, but making the mistake of posting their ideas on the NS Forum. Veteran players need to be more supportive of new players and not pounce on anyone for having an idea. The future of the game will always be tied to the enthusiasm and creativity of new players.

JB: What advice would you give to others who want to last as long?

TB: You need to explore the facets of this game that interest you and work at it. If you’re not creative, don’t engage other players, don’t want to be part of something bigger than your nation, and just hammer away at your daily issues you’re probably not going to be around for a long time (unless you’re competing in the world census standings). You have to make time for NationStates, to get the most out of it, and remember that for every nation there’s someone on the other side of the keyboard doing their own thing. Even for players who are active, the biggest challenge is not to get jaded or in a rut. A lot of people whine about there not being enough activity, but when it comes right down to it, the best way to generate activity is to be active. It starts with you.

JB: Truer words have never been spoken!

In the recent Great Influence Survey, Wysteria was voted as the 10th most influential region of all time. What do you think the key is to Wysteria's staying power?

TB: The development planning of our region always used long term thinking. Recruitment in the early years was done in waves, sometimes six months apart, to allow generations of players to grow within the region before the next recruiting drive. While a lot of regions wanted to get as big as they could as fast as they could, to be the next boom-bust region, Wysteria has always been concerned about sustainable numbers and not getting so big that we lost our character.

Wysteria has also been very fortunate over the years. We’ve had a strong core of players grow with the region, who have been willing to invest their time and imaginations to making it a better place than when they arrived. Without the arrival of active players over the years that really wanted to do something with their NationStates’ experience, we wouldn’t be the region we are today. When new players arrive in the region with their energy, if they are supported, that energy becomes infectious. Even when I've had less time to participate in my own region, due to the demands of offline life, I've always done my best to ensure that the region was secure to ensure it was a safe place for its active, core players.

JB: Who do you believe has made the biggest contribution to NationStates?

TB: No Max, no NationStates. So logically, Max has made the biggest contribution. After that it’s a few hundred players pulling at the same ball of yarn over the years. Outside of the sham popularity contests, each high profile player exists differently in the minds of every other player. Despite what players in certain cliques might feel, because there are so many different regional and cosmopolitan experiences available in the game, even an exceptional player won’t transcend that boundary for everyone.

JB: One final question. Some of those who have been here since the first days of NationStates have joined the Mod Team. If asked, would you consider joining?

TB: While I’d be honoured if they asked, to be honest I’m really not their guy. Moderators are typically chosen among those who are extremely active on the NationStates Forums, where the lion’s share of their work is. While I tend to check out forums of interest daily on the NS Forums, I don’t have the kind of post count or activity level that gets you considered for the role of moderator. The only time I was a really prolific poster there was when I was laid up with a sports injury for a few weeks.

---

Rising Stars #3: District XIV
FEATURE | JOE BOBS

Rising Stars looks for the future leaders of NationStates and we want to thank all of those who have recommended people to be featured in this piece, please keep your suggestions coming!

In this issue, we speak to District XIV. A regular feature in the NSGP forum, District XIV is currently Vice President of Warzone Africa, Steward of Courage (equivalent to a military general) of the United Provinces of Hyrule, Deputy Tsar of Hummusland (a region he co-founded), Minister of Foreign Affairs for Sanctuary, and a Citizen of the Global Right Alliance. He is also a former Overseer of Foreign Affairs for the Coalition of Freedom. He began playing back in December 2012 but left the game only to return a few months ago, and has received recognition in particular for his work in Warzone Africa. He is also the author of the proposal Liberate Panem.

JB: What has been the biggest learning curve for you in NationStates?

DXIV: Just plain experience and active participation. Doing things over and over, even when I failed, helped me learn about how to do it better the next time.

JB: Who would you describe as your mentor?

DXIV: The guys back in Panem, who really took me on when I was a total n00b. We learned and experienced together; and both of them, United Soviet Jason Republic and Star United States, were amazing people to be with. They were nice and accepting.

JB: Some of our readers may not know Panem, could you briefly describe it? You recently submitted a proposal to the Security Council for the Liberation of Panem. Could you describe the situation that led to this?

DXIV: Panem was originally a small region, having not more than little over twenty members. I moved there a few months after founding the nation of District XIV, and quickly got involved with the small community that was developing there. My nation, if it wasn't obvious, is based off The Hunger Games series of books, so a region based off the same thing seemed appropriate to me. Over time, my interest in NationStates dipped, so I CTE'd in April of 2013.

Unfortunately, Panem is a founderless region, so it met the same fate most founderless regions meet. It was invaded numerous times by both TBR and other groups; essentially becoming a battlefield. Star United States and United Soviet Jason Republic were the players who I regarded as like "founding fathers" of the Panemian community, but they left the region after I had departed (temporarily) from the game. Then, who I and some others assume to be defender sleepers, entered the region and placed in a password. The region is now locked down and the current residents have not responded nor complied with any requests of mine or SUS's for the password as so we may attempt to refound the region; this eventually leading to my seeking of an SC liberation of Panem.

JB: What has been your biggest challenge so far?

DXIV: Attempting to construct a community in Warzone Africa even with the help of good people like Arekrya. It's hard to build a government and community in a place that was not built for what we did, and the raids don't help. But, hey, we can't really complain

JB: The Warzones are certainly an interesting and unique aspect of NationStates. How do you think the Warzone community differs from others in the game?

DXIV: The constant threat of invasion, as the Warzones were intended to be, well, 'war zones', not communities. We get used to invasions because they happen so often, and we continue on with our lives when they're over.

JB: Where do you see yourself in a year’s time?

DXIV: Hopefully, by that time, I will have built Panem up from the ground. I want to invest my resources into rebuilding that region once it's refounded; hopefully it works.

JB: You're fairly well traveled in NS and active on the main forum. Any lessons learnt from the communities you've participated in which you will be applying to building Panem?

DXIV: Keep things original, and offer fun but easy-to-participate-in activities for the residents. Nations tend to stay if they can easily become involved in the regional community.

JB: What area of the game would you most like to expand into that you are not currently involved with?

DXIV: Roleplay, most likely. I've hung out in II a lil' bit, but not that much. My RP skills are fine, although I'm willing to expand them and continue actively participating in the roleplay forums. I created an IC organization once (which actually still exists), but It didn't really take off.

JB: As a Gameplayer who is interested in RP, what are your views on the recent Liberate Haven / Ixnay / etc controversy? Should RPers be able to opt out of being raided?

DXIV: Mall was acting independently in the World Assembly, as any player has the right to do. The whole "Mallorea and Riva should resign" was a hilariously immature reaction to situation, for two reasons:

1. We all know "Liberate Haven" wasn't going to pass, much less go to vote.
2. As I stated before, Mall has the full right to act independently as any player, moderator or not, may do.

Although, I do think roleplaying regions should have an easy "opt out of R/D" ability; similar to the "Intergovernmental Organizations" feature Esternial suggested.

JB: What advice would you give to newcomers?

DXIV: Find people who you trust, and stay clear of assholes. Don't do things for those who disregard you and what you want to do. People like those interfere with your progression and experience in this world.

JB: Thank you very much for taking part!

DXIV: My pleasure. Thank you for the interview.

[Ananke II]

Nice interview with The Bruce.

[Unibot III]

Nice interview with The Bruce.

Yeah, I thought it was quite a good interview.