by Neu Engollon » Sun Jun 19, 2022 7:14 am
by Neu Engollon » Sun Jun 19, 2022 7:14 am
by Neu Engollon » Sun Jun 19, 2022 7:15 am
by Trad Bosnia » Sun Jun 19, 2022 7:23 am
by Neu Engollon » Sun Jun 19, 2022 7:27 am
Trad Bosnia wrote:I think it's important for these conventions to distinguish between honest and criminal combatants.
I think uniformed soldiers of apolitical units should be one example of legitimate combatants along with nat lib militias provided that they:
- Carry arms openly and do not impersonate civilians,
- Conduct themselves in accordance with the laws and customs of war recognised amongst civilised nations and
- are commanded by a person responsible for their subordinates.
by Trad Bosnia » Sun Jun 19, 2022 8:37 am
Neu Engollon wrote:Trad Bosnia wrote:I think it's important for these conventions to distinguish between honest and criminal combatants.
I think uniformed soldiers of apolitical units should be one example of legitimate combatants along with nat lib militias provided that they:
- Carry arms openly and do not impersonate civilians,
- Conduct themselves in accordance with the laws and customs of war recognised amongst civilised nations and
- are commanded by a person responsible for their subordinates.
So, basically non-nation state actor combatants? Political, religious, or separatist groups, but also maybe encompassing mercenaries/private contractors?
by Neu Engollon » Sun Jun 19, 2022 8:43 am
Trad Bosnia wrote:Neu Engollon wrote:
So, basically non-nation state actor combatants? Political, religious, or separatist groups, but also maybe encompassing mercenaries/private contractors?
I don't think that's what I mean because mercenaries and partisan who
- Carry arms openly and do not impersonate civilians,
- Conduct themselves in accordance with the laws and customs of war recognised amongst civilised nations and
and
- are commanded by a person responsible for their subordinates
would be able to be protected.
I think the ANC and certain Irish resistance groups during the Easter Rising would meet this criteria as would, I think, certain private military contractors.
by Trad Bosnia » Sun Jun 19, 2022 9:09 am
Neu Engollon wrote:Trad Bosnia wrote:I don't think that's what I mean because mercenaries and partisan who
- Carry arms openly and do not impersonate civilians,
- Conduct themselves in accordance with the laws and customs of war recognised amongst civilised nations and
and
- are commanded by a person responsible for their subordinates
would be able to be protected.
I think the ANC and certain Irish resistance groups during the Easter Rising would meet this criteria as would, I think, certain private military contractors.
I think we're saying the same thing. The ANC was political and the Irish resistance was separatist. They wanted Ireland separate from the United Kingdom.
by Saksoni » Sun Jun 19, 2022 9:14 am
by Diarcesia » Sun Jun 19, 2022 9:22 am
From the rest of the RP community, we need ideas on what points should be covered - should it just be a line for line copy of the Geneva Conventions with some minor changes, or should we strive to create something completely organic and different
IC wise, I don't mind hosting, but ironically, my capital is called Geneva. I might move the hosting site of such an IC convention to another city in my nation, just to avoid confusion with the RL Geneva Conventions. This is if we even bother to do a whole thread, or just need an IC placeholder location for the signing of the convention documents.
by Hurtful Thoughts » Sun Jun 19, 2022 9:25 am
Mokostana wrote:See, Hurty cared not if the mission succeeded or not, as long as it was spectacular trainwreck. Sometimes that was the host Nation firing a SCUD into a hospital to destroy a foreign infection and accidentally sparking a rebellion... or accidentally starting the Mokan Drug War
Blackhelm Confederacy wrote:If there was only a "like" button for NS posts....
by Diarcesia » Sun Jun 19, 2022 9:28 am
Hurtful Thoughts wrote:there must be an executive arm to enforce this
by Neu Engollon » Sun Jun 19, 2022 9:55 am
Hurtful Thoughts wrote:
But on another subject, threatening the use of world-ending weapons of mass destruction willy-nilly is often a diplomatic faux-pas. But if there are to be laws regarding this, then surely there must be an executive arm to enforce this upon a non-compliant state. Which means someone will need to go in there and disable their hand, or enact further punitive measures.
Because, y'know... toothless laws are kinda useless.
by Neu Engollon » Sun Jun 19, 2022 10:00 am
Diarcesia wrote:Edit: Perhaps using the currently-enforced WA resolutions is a good basis for the declaration?
Diarcesia wrote:I don't mind hosting my capital city of Arcesius as well, but if I nominate a place to hold a convention, it would be some "lore-only" (i.e. controlled by no player) place that contains a "portal to the multiverse" so all tech levels are accommodated. Placeholder name: Island in the Sea of Time
by Hurtful Thoughts » Sun Jun 19, 2022 10:42 am
Diarcesia wrote:How can this enforcement arm differentiate itself from the usual four-letter alliances that claims to profess the virtues of the alt-Geneva Conventions?
Edit: Just answered my own question, but I still want to know your thoughts.
Neu Engollon wrote:Hurtful Thoughts wrote:
But on another subject, threatening the use of world-ending weapons of mass destruction willy-nilly is often a diplomatic faux-pas. But if there are to be laws regarding this, then surely there must be an executive arm to enforce this upon a non-compliant state. Which means someone will need to go in there and disable their hand, or enact further punitive measures.
Because, y'know... toothless laws are kinda useless.
There would never be any one body that could enforce this, and having any 'superpower' kind of force in any tech level that would automatically bring the hammer down is just kind of silly and brings its own set of problems.
Really, the best sanctions would be just like in RL, economic sanctions collectively brought by the signatories of any Convention articles. Even then, you would probably have some signatories skirting around such sanctions for their own best economic interests. Ultimately, consequences would be done in the name of human decency and morality, and any opposed would be deemed to be uncivilized and out of step with the world community.
This is a RP instrument, in the end. No edgy RPing player is going to abide by them, obviously, so it's not really meant to try to bring any justice to them, as they wouldn't give a fuck, anyway.
Mokostana wrote:See, Hurty cared not if the mission succeeded or not, as long as it was spectacular trainwreck. Sometimes that was the host Nation firing a SCUD into a hospital to destroy a foreign infection and accidentally sparking a rebellion... or accidentally starting the Mokan Drug War
Blackhelm Confederacy wrote:If there was only a "like" button for NS posts....
by Trad Bosnia » Sun Jun 19, 2022 11:01 am
by Neu Engollon » Sun Jun 19, 2022 11:41 am
Hurtful Thoughts wrote:-snip-
Trad Bosnia wrote:Are these conventions intended to cover enlistment and deployment ages?
I think it should be at least15 to enlist in any military service at all and at least16.5 to deployed as an infantryman,
by Laka Strolistandiler » Tue Jun 21, 2022 6:29 am
I reserve the right to /stillme any one-liners if my post is at least two lines long
by New Visayan Islands » Tue Jun 21, 2022 7:03 am
Laka Strolistandiler wrote:Are those non-signatory are going to be still bound by the treaty? I am asking because when this will be eventually signed we will automatically become violators because IC-wise do not believe in stuff like “reducing civilian casualties”
by Estado Novo Portugues » Tue Jun 21, 2022 9:44 pm
Laka Strolistandiler wrote:Are those non-signatory are going to be still bound by the treaty? I am asking because when this will be eventually signed we will automatically become violators because IC-wise do not believe in stuff like “reducing civilian casualties”
by Neu Engollon » Wed Jun 22, 2022 9:01 am
by Neu Engollon » Fri Jun 24, 2022 5:47 am
by Trad Bosnia » Fri Jun 24, 2022 5:58 am
by New Visayan Islands » Fri Jun 24, 2022 6:44 am
by Trad Bosnia » Fri Jun 24, 2022 7:24 am
New Visayan Islands wrote:2. How old must a proper combatant be for an armed group or national force in order to not be in violation of international law? What is the youngest age allowed for conscription or volunteers.
- Hard floor of 15 for volunteer service, 18 for conscription; 15-18 limited to non-combat service.
7. Protection of unarmed clergy, and religious figures from any harm from any side. This includes chaplains in military uniform.
- IIRC, chaplains and medics are afforded similar, if not identical, protections.
8. Special protected humanitarian status for hospitals (including field hospitals and aid stations), ambulances and wounded transport, hospital vessels at sea, hospital aircraft.
This is assuming that they are not used for war purposes and remain unarmed. When a nation arms any facility or transport, they invalidate the protection. Agreed upon symbol for protective status - Red Cross, Red Crescent, Red Crystal. Similar symbols like the Red Magen David could also be included.
11. Exemption from criminal or civil trials for captured combatants who have only been captured in the process of taking up arms against an enemy. This status would be revoked for combatants who have been in violation of international law or committed horrific or unwarranted crimes against civilians or other captured enemy personnel under their care. Better definition and wording is needed here, obviously. What constitutes a proper court and trial proceedings for civilians and military personnel suspected of crimes?
- Using Visayan examples: The VICC (Visayan International Criminal Code) provides for the establishment of special courts to judge violators of established international law. This court is empowered to prosecute such violations up to and including violations that are considered capital offenses. In a civil context, the Federal Government has jurisdiction over such cases, in the armed forces, that’s a court-martial.
12. How to treat spies and saboteurs, and how to define them?
- Kinda iffy, because IIRC, spies and saboteurs could be summarily executed.
15. The protection of religious sites and historic landmarks from desecration and destruction, provided they were not being used for military purposes by another combatant side.
- So, Blue Shield?
16. Agreed upon sanctions and measures to be taken upon combatant parties in clear violation of the Accords. Enforcement, in other words. What is possible and practical?
- Going back to my example: minimum sentence of 20-40 years, egregious cases are capital offenses.
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