I can’t believe Greta Thunberg won the person of the year

[Munkcestrian Republic]

You’re awfully hung up on the semantics of this made up award

i make good posts

or rather i POST good posts

[Solanos]

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Time_Person_of_the_Year

Just Google it. It doesn’t have to go to a single person. US scientistJust Google it. It doesn’t have to go to a single person. US scientist, plural, one one times, plural, won one time.

love how it went The Silence Breakers to The Guardians

they should've gone with the protesters just to have three years of groups tbh

Didn't they throw Taylor Swift in there just because?

Maybe for shut-in NEETs who want their Hearthstone treats.

Comrade Xi isn't paying you enough for this comrade.

Neither is Nick Griffin apparently.

[Salandriagado]

Where do you think regulations come from? The people who go to listen to speeches at the UN write them. Thunberg yelling at world leaders to get their shit together is far more likely to make a difference than what mode of transport she uses.

Oh lol do you really think screaming at the UN would change the politicians? Oh genius so politicians now do that?

No! They put out these policies so they could appeal to voters. Remember politicians work for votes, not for actual ‘kind-hearted-ness’. Politics isn’t this fancy place where you could ‘change the world’, they only put these policies out cuz the GENERAL populace pushes them to. It’s sad, but it’s true. Screaming in UN does nothing other than adding fake to Greta herself.

Yes, they do. The fact that you've failed to pay attention to anything outside of the US does not change that fact.

[Salandriagado]

And what exactly do you suppose the criteria for the title to be?

To award person that actually made something important, not just whined about how bad US is

Nope. I'll give you a hint: Hitler won it previously.

[Salandriagado]

I am fine with HKers not being selected as person of the year but I don't think Greta Thunberg deserves that title.

Exactly. I could understand why Hong Kongers don’t win. We got other great people, Pete Buttigueg, the Ethiopian prime minister. BUT NOT GRETA FREAKING THUNBERG

What global-scale effect has either of those had?

[Asle Leopolka]

Anyone who "can't believe" this needs to accept that the media has their own agenda and it's to generate revenue via sales and clicks - even the outrage ones.

[Solanos]

Exactly. I could understand why Hong Kongers don’t win. We got other great people, Pete Buttigueg, the Ethiopian prime minister. BUT NOT GRETA FREAKING THUNBERG

What global-scale effect has either of those had?

I JUST realized they thought Buttigieg is in fact the Ethiopian prime minister. Holy fucking shit. This website is so diseased.

[Munkcestrian Republic]

Exactly. I could understand why Hong Kongers don’t win. We got other great people, Pete Buttigueg, the Ethiopian prime minister. BUT NOT GRETA FREAKING THUNBERG

What global-scale effect has either of those had?

Pete did, like, a really good High Hopes dance

[Alvecia]

i make good posts

or rather i POST good posts

Well that's as debatable as it is irrelevant

[Solanos]

What global-scale effect has either of those had?

Pete did, like, a really good High Hopes dance

He also speaks like 7 bajillion languages, is gay, reads James Joyce, is gay, SERVED IN THE GOD DAMN MILITARY YOU PUSSIES and is gay, he worked for McKinsey and quite possibly the CIA to the detriment of gay people outside the United States, and oh yeah he's gay?

[Costa Hermosa]

So first off, you've entirely and completely missed the point of the Person of the Year award. It's for people who've had a large impact, which she undeniably has.

Don’t get me wrong, I’m an environmentalist. You really need to care about the environment, but definitely not by being a drama queen.

Greta Thunburg is a drama queen. Her parents are actors, and she planned everything out.

Lie.

She condemned Sweden, the greenest countries in the world that aims to reach carbon neutral soon, for not doing enough

An aim which they committed to after she called them out.

but is somehow completely fine with China polluting.

No, she isn't. She's not suing them for precisely the same reason that she isn't suing the US: they're not a party to the treaty that allows such lawsuits.

Why don’t you go cry at Tiananmen? You scared?

What a hypocritical drama queen. Pretends to be a brace hero against governments, but a coward inside. Sure let’s see what she could make up to explain that. ‘How dare you’

I'm not going to dignify that disgusting shit with a response.

She did nothing, I repeat, nothing, to help the environment. She is trying to draw attention and build a hero style thing for herself, how pathetic is that.

You are absolutely wrong. Literally no government was considering getting to net zero emissions at all before her campaign started. Now, major world governments are committing to actual timelines for it.

Remember how she went hyper-cool mode by going to New York on a boat, heck look at all the people who served her on the trip. Of course they called themselves fellow environmentalists even though they’re just servants. Somehow having servants to serve her is fine but taking a plane isn’t, cool now we got publicity stunts from her.

What the fuck is this bullshit?

She deserves no awards, and definitely no congratulations. To save the environment we don’t need publicity queens like her, we need genuine people trying to take small steps to save the world.

Yeah, no. Individuals making small steps will never be sufficient. Being quiet has failed already and rather thoroughly fucked us over. Other than violent revolution, what else is left?

Oh and look, an article from online:
Are you fecking kidding me

Look, I'm not mad that we (Hong Kongers) aren't the Person of the Year. I'm mad that Greta Thunberg is the winner.

She's a god damn hypocrite. She did a "zero carbon trip" across the Atlantic with small boat that generates energy for the voyage. But each time it goes to US and UK, two crewmembers will have to fly to the respective locations to retrieve it.

This is probably a lie, incidentally: delivery runs are generally done by teams of professionals who just pick up delivery runs in the other direction to get home.

Which means four men will have to use the airplane, while if she just took the plane herself with his dad only two will have to ride the plane. Four people using the plane (and only the plane) produces 2,134,800 grams of C02. Look who's producing emissions?

And the reason that all of that is incidental is that you've entirely missed the fucking point. It's about publicity, and about putting pressure on governments.

Oh, and the manufacturing of her Tesla Model 3 and her Europe train trip produces quite an amount of carbon, don't forget that 63.5% electricity is produced by fossil fuel.

You're using US generation figures for a trip in the EU.

She probably has less carbon emissions than most people, that's undeniable, but she doesn't deserve so much attention for screaming at politicians.

That's an inevitable feature of having been born in the West. You're also ignoring secondary effects, with which she's massively in the negative.

Indeed, she's bringing attention to climate issues, but not everything is solvable.

Either we solve it, or billions of people die.

Imagine the socioeconomic consequences.

"It's expensive to avoid" is not a reason to let billions of people die.

When she called on all countries to stop carbon emissions, did she realise how many developing countries have no way to feed their people except carbon emissions?

Another lie: between developed countries running carbon-negative and the fact that we produce far more food than we need, this is a thoroughly solvable problem.

All I see her do is
a) Scream at lawmakers to guilt them

You mean "put pressure on the people who can actually do something about it".

b) Skip planes, which is unavailable for people who have a job

What a fucking absurd statement.

c)Strike from school, unavailable to kids who actually need to learn

You appear to have entirely missed the point of a strike.

Is she a scientist who contributed to reducing emissions? No.
Is she some community leader? No.

Yes.

She's too young and inexperienced she's born with a famous mother (opera singer) and is privileged, yet she screams "yOu rUINeD mY chILdHoOD"? HoW dArE sHE say that? hOW dArE sHE say that while millions of people are starving around the globe?

Not what she said at all.

I'll credit her for her genuine beliefs on saving this planet, but instead of throwing speeches everywhere, how about actually do something? She does not deserve it.

What, exactly, could anybody possibly do that's more impactful than successfully pressuring governments into taking action?

But, if the public wishes, she shall be the person of the year. Now that's true democracy.

Nope: the Time Person of the Year is not a democracy, and they're very clear about this.

Oh

btw, you know how she rode the train. I like trains too, it’s environmentally friendly. Oh but look at Greta Thunberg ruining it, first class, packaged plastic meals,

You're lying again.

and plenty more carbon producing stuff. Oh and you see her jeans? Those waste plenty water, why don’t you condemn yourself then Ms. Attention Seeker?

Where the fuck did you get that from? What kind of clothing is available to people living in the developed world that's less impactful. Additionally, the water used in making jeans doesn't have to be drinking water quality, which means it's not in shortage in any way.

Thank you for this post, mate.

[Outer Sparta]

What global-scale effect has either of those had?

I JUST realized they thought Buttigieg is in fact the Ethiopian prime minister. Holy fucking shit. This website is so diseased.

Also why would Pete Buttigieg even warrant anything close to a person of the year? He hasn't done anything important.

[Munkcestrian Republic]

or rather i POST good posts

Well that's as debatable as it is irrelevant

of course they're posts

[Alvecia]

Well that's as debatable as it is irrelevant

of course they're posts

Hmm

[Munkcestrian Republic]

I JUST realized they thought Buttigieg is in fact the Ethiopian prime minister. Holy fucking shit. This website is so diseased.

Also why would Pete Buttigieg even warrant anything close to a person of the year? He hasn't done anything important.

HIGH HIGH HOPES FOR A LIVIN'

[Oyste]

I do agree, some of her actions seem quite dramatic, but let's consider the actual impacts of her actions. She is part of the reason why we're actually paying some attention to the climate crisis now. Sure, you could go and plant trees, but the reality is that the media won't make that a headline. Planting trees and all the other efforts that environmental activitists do have been done to death. News articles about the climate crisis pop up every few weeks and at this point they're losing their impact. The slow, bureaucratic nature of our political systems have led us to become accustomed to the concept of a climate emergency. We're losing the sense of emergency.

In politics, what matters isn't whether someone's actions matches our ideals, what matters is the impact they are making. Sure, environmentalists can plant trees but that will never match the rate of deforestation of the Amazon if we do not leverage our political systems to organise a collective effort to deal with the climate crisis. Discussions about the climate crisis amongst ourselves is great, but in the end they remain discussions. We need our political systems, our communities to come together and deal with this. The fact is that Thunberg has bought the climate crisis some broadcasting time, and that limited amount of broadcasting time will have a far greater impact on raising awareness of the climate emergency amongst the majority of the population than whatever we discuss here in this chat or any other online forum.

If we are truly concerned about the environment, what we should be doing now is not to squabble amongst ourselves and point fingers at each other saying that the other party isn't a true environmentalist. What we need to do now is to unite together, to utilise the attention Thunberg has brought to the climate issue to create even bigger waves. Go out and show the world that you care about the climate crisis. Protest, go on a march, call your politicians, however you bring attention to issues in your country. What matters now is that we show the politicians that there are more people who care about this issue than they think.

[Nakena]

It's not really surprising that she became person of the year given the extreme hype pushed ad-infinitum by mainstream media of whom she is the most dearest darling.

[Munkcestrian Republic]

of course they're posts

Hmm

I mean, someone disputing that they're posts seems more likely than someone disputing that they're good

[Solanos]

Also why would Pete Buttigieg even warrant anything close to a person of the year? He hasn't done anything important.

HIGH HIGH HOPES FOR A LIVIN'

CUTTING THE WELFARE CAUSE I WANT TO MAKE A KILLIN'

[Outer Sparta]

It's not really surprising that she became person of the year given the extreme hype pushed ad-infinitum by mainstream media of whom she is the most dearest darling.

Also not surprising that any thread about Greta Thunberg will turn into a mess that covers a gazillion other topics leading to no useful debate whatsoever.

[Aureumterra]

Wait she won and not the HK protestors?

[Salandriagado]

I mean the US is pretty bad at human rights...

Hey at least you don’t ‘disappear’ out of thin air

Unless the government decides that you're a terrorism suspect, you mean.

I mean the US is pretty bad at human rights...

We know but their carbon emission are one of the lowest as I know

You are wrong. The US has the 15th highest CO2 emissions per capita in the world.

Not the UN itself, the world leaders who attend speeches there.

---

Yelling at China probably wouldn't make any difference. China is a dictatorship, they're largely immune to public outrage. Democratic nations, not so much. Democratically elected leaders can, to varying degrees, be shamed and pressured into taking action on the environment.

Very true. Democratic countries, let’s use Switzerland as an example since they’re the most direct already, got their seven chancellors. When they want to push a regulation, you need public support. So Greta going to UN screaming while doing publicity stunts won’t do much really. She could’ve used that time and effort on going around putting up poster (preferably made from recycled paper) or going to the local council to attend a small meeting. Doing that at a few local councils would already do better than screaming

Oh, are we pretending that publicity doesn't have an impact on public opinion now? None of your suggestions would be adequate. Her approach might be.

The award doesn't necessarily mean what she did is good (they gave it to Putin and Mark Zuckerberg ffs), just that, in Wikipedia's words, "for better or for worse... [she] has done the most to influence the events of the year".

Which, again, is disputable, but at least does not endorse her actions.

But she's quite frankly insignificant. Another rich leftist teen whining for the world to hear isn't news.

No, she isn't. She's had more impact on the political discussion in more countries than anybody else in decades. We've gone from nobody considering zero emissions at all to actual legal commitments to hitting it on specific timescales.

I can definately agree with Chokoku on this issue - they have made a good point.

Greta Thunberg is just not the right person to lead this crusade against climate change exactly due to her incompetence and complete irrelevance.

She's neither incompetent nor irrelevant: you can tell by how we're having this conversation.

Not the UN itself, the world leaders who attend speeches there.

---

Yelling at China probably wouldn't make any difference. China is a dictatorship, they're largely immune to public outrage. Democratic nations, not so much. Democratically elected leaders can, to varying degrees, be shamed and pressured into taking action on the environment.

But Democratic countries are ALREADY REDUCING their carbon emissions.On the other hand, it's totalitarian or developing countries like China that are increasing their emissions.So you are completely fine that democratic countries bear a greater responsibility than China when it comes to reducing carbon emission?If we don't tackle the problem of China , there is no way that climate change can be resolved. And I don't see how the current approach adopted by Greta helps solve the problem anyway.

The democratic countries aren't doing nearly enough (they're mostly outsourcing their emissions). The solution to China is to go via sane countries: if the EU and US start applying punitive carbon taxes on imports, China will clean their act up right quick.

[Munkcestrian Republic]

Wait she won and not the HK protestors?

as I have said several times in this thread, it is PERSON of the year.

[Munkcestrian Republic]

Wait she won and not the HK protestors?

as I have said several times in this thread, it is PERSON of the year.

also i'm surprised you're not happy a fellow Scandinavian won

[Solanos]

Wait she won and not the HK protestors?

lol imagine HK protestors being anything relevant, and this is coming from someone who dislikes the PRC