[PASSED] Don't Kill the Poor Act

[Wallenburg]

No. I imagine killing the poor, in this sense, not to be a matter of any perceived characteristic of the poor, but rather, a perceived economic burden that maintaining their standard of living, in compliance with extant resolutions, entails. A more sinister regime certainly could assert that "leeching off the welfare system" without maintaining employment is a criminal activity, and thus could kill the unemployed. The reasons for killing wealthy individuals would be even easier to justify for these sinister regimes--by maintaining excessive stockpiles of wealth, the rich engage in "theft" of their own society and of the poor.

Either way, I imagine, the reasons for engaging in socioeconomic genocide are not on the basis of a characteristic. Nations have thousands of ways to justify it within the confines of CoCR.

Now consider the combination of:
GA Resolution #79 'Ban on Ex Post Facto Laws' (which says that you can't punish people for actions carried out before the laws making those actions illegal were actually passed),

GA Resolution #323 'No Penalty Without Law' (which says that you can't punish people for their actions without having passed a law that criminalises those actions).

If acts of genocide are not characterized as legal punishments, that's quite irrelevant.

GA Resolution #344 'Minimum Standard of Living Act' (which requires member nations to guarantee a minimum standard of living to their peoples: trying to criminalise dependence on the nation by people who really can't support themselves seems a pretty clear violation of this)

First, acts of genocide are not always prosecuted under the guise of enforcing laws that prohibit things such as being poor or unemployed.

Second, MSLA guarantees a minimum standard of living. It does not prohibit member states from requiring, say, all adult inhabitants to be employed or find employment within a certain time frame.

Third, clause 4.c reads "Exempts each member state from guaranteeing a minimum standard of living to individuals who refuse to make a good faith attempt to support themselves without government assistance, or to engage in government-mandated job training, temporary employment or community service, without a legitimate reason, such as a disability that would prevent them from doing so;"

This is one of MSLAs weak points, as it does not guarantee a minimum standard of living to the chronically unemployed, or those not seeking employment.

GA Resolution #375 'Crime and Punishment' (particularly clause 4, which forbids the use of execution as a penalty for nonviolent crimes).

Irrelevant if the victims of genocide are not considered convicted criminals.

[Bears Armed]

Irrelevant if the victims of genocide are not considered convicted criminals.

OOC; But then the WA has already banned genocide, too, hasn't it? And isn't any government that's willing to try defining such killings as neither execution nor genocide, and thus not barred under existing WA law, likely to find an argument why their policies don't contravene this proposed resolution either? For what it's worth, I've already thought of one approach that they could use...

[Wallenburg]

Irrelevant if the victims of genocide are not considered convicted criminals.

OOC; But then the WA has already banned genocide, too, hasn't it? And isn't any government that's willing to try defining such killings as neither execution nor genocide, and thus not barred under existing WA law, likely to find an argument why their policies don't contravene this proposed resolution either? For what it's worth, I've already thought of one approach that they could use...

...

Did you even read the OP?

[Emilys land]

on the subject of the title, should it not focus in on one economic group? IRL, most genocide-esque action have been aimed at the rich, so to focus it on the poor seems a little odd?

[Wallenburg]

on the subject of the title, should it not focus in on one economic group? IRL, most genocide-esque action have been aimed at the rich, so to focus it on the poor seems a little odd?

It's a reference to this, mostly.

[Sierra Lyricalia]

on the subject of the title, should it not focus in on one economic group? IRL, most genocide-esque action have been aimed at the rich, so to focus it on the poor seems a little odd?

It's a reference to this, mostly.

OOC: No love for the other source of the phrase, I see.

---

IC: "We would like something like '...or statistically disproportionate...' added to Clause 1 bewteen the words 'systematic' and 'violence.' Often a downtrodden class is kept down by police overzealousness that isn't coordinated in the formal sense, but nevertheless is clearly targeted at a particular group. Not all genocides are centrally controlled."

[Wallenburg]

It's a reference to this, mostly.

OOC: No love for the other source of the phrase, I see.

---

IC: "We would like something like '...or statistically disproportionate...' added to Clause 1 bewteen the words 'systematic' and 'violence.' Often a downtrodden class is kept down by police overzealousness that isn't coordinated in the formal sense, but nevertheless is clearly targeted at a particular group. Not all genocides are centrally controlled."

"I see what you are getting at. I will try to find a way to cover decentralized genocide without painting too broad a brushstroke."

[Wallenburg]

Edits made. Thread bumped.

[Pan-Asiatic States]

(Don't) Kill the Poor Act

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Category: Human Rights || Area of Strength: Significant || Proposed by: Wallenburg

---

Celebrating a history of protecting essential sapient rights,

Recognizing historical efforts to prohibit genocide and guarantee equal rights for the citizens of member states,

Concerned that ill-intentioned governments might engage in violence on the weakest of those under its jurisdiction,

The World Assembly hereby:

1. Recognizes systematic violence perpetrated against a group, forceful isolation of a group in designated areas, removal of a group from designated areas, or the forceful institution of population controls on a group as acts of genocide,
   
   
2. Highlights that case-by-case imprisonment of, displacement of, or use of force against individuals does not target a general group, and so does not constitute genocide,
   
   
3. Prohibits acts of genocide against any group on the basis of economic status or employment,
   
   
4. Requires member states to render aid to those escaping genocide on the basis of their economic status or employment, and to consider such persons refugees.

(Don't) Kill the Poor Act

---

Category: Human Rights || Area of Strength: Significant || Proposed by: Wallenburg

---

Celebrating a history of protecting essential sapient rights,

Recognizing historical efforts to prohibit genocide and guarantee equal rights for the citizens of member states,

Concerned that ill-intentioned governments might engage in violence on the weakest of those under its jurisdiction,

The World Assembly hereby:

1. Recognizes systematic violence perpetrated against a group, forceful isolation of a group in designated areas, removal of a group from designated areas, or the forceful institution of population controls on a group as acts of genocide,
   
   
2. Prohibits acts of genocide against any group on the basis of economic status or employment,
   
   
3. Requires member states to render aid to those escaping genocide on the basis of their economic status or employment, and to consider such persons refugees.

As a footnote, I am fully aware that this also prohibits member states from exterminating the filthy bourgeoisie parasites in the workers' Revolution. As unfortunate as it might be to let them live, we all have to make compromises sometimes.

Delegate Yahui-Molotov sat back to lit a cigar. A puff in bright grey spelled out the words "No."

He then proceeds to burn a dollar, with Washington's face, using the embers of his cig.

"The most important reforms in Socialist history could only be accomplished through the en masse extermination of the ruling-class. How else are we to intimidate others not to reinstate Capitalism under the nose of the government? Are our Cadremen going to tickle them 'til they drop?

Political power grows from the barrel of a gun. Say otherwise, and you're obviously not a Marxist, much less a Maoist. You're revisionist scum."

[Kenmoria]

“In clause 1, ‘group’ is extremely vague, and could constitute numerous groups of people for which the conditions you describe as genocide could be applicable. For example, criminals count as a group, and it is generally allowed to isolate them. Defining the term is probably needed, or else restricting its applicability.”

[Wallenburg]

“In clause 1, ‘group’ is extremely vague, and could constitute numerous groups of people for which the conditions you describe as genocide could be applicable. For example, criminals count as a group, and it is generally allowed to isolate them. Defining the term is probably needed, or else restricting its applicability.”

Clause 2:

Highlights that case-by-case imprisonment of, displacement of, or use of force against individuals does not target a general group, and so does not constitute genocide,

[United Massachusetts]

We support in full still.

[Wallenburg]

Any further comments? Title suggestions?

[Lord Dominator]

Any further comments? Title suggestions?

'Prevention of Proletariat Slaughter'

[Aclion]

Any further comments? Title suggestions?

Preventing Class Warfare

[Imperium Anglorum]

Comments? Be prepared! For the Orcs to tell you they want to kill the poor because of their national sovereignty.

[East Gondwana]

Any further comments? Title suggestions?

Keep the title. Killjoys will say it's "unprofessional" but I think it's great.

[Imperium Anglorum]

Oh wait, I forgot. You can't put brackets in titles.

[Bears Armed]

OOC
I see that this has been submitted.

Wouldn't this clause

1. Recognizes systematic or otherwise intentional and statistically disproportionate violence perpetrated against a group, forceful isolation of a group in designated areas, removal of a group from designated areas, or the forceful institution of population controls on a group as acts of genocide

mean that define military action against enemy forces -- which generally doesn't happen on a "case-by-case" basis, and therefore wouldn't be covered by the following exemptory clause -- have to be defined as acts of genocide? And then, under clause 3, as a ‘crime against humanity’ as well?

3. Renders crimes against humanity any acts of genocide against any group on the basis of economic status or employment,

[Wallenburg]

OOC
I see that this has been submitted.

Wouldn't this clause

1. Recognizes systematic or otherwise intentional and statistically disproportionate violence perpetrated against a group, forceful isolation of a group in designated areas, removal of a group from designated areas, or the forceful institution of population controls on a group as acts of genocide

mean that define military action against enemy forces -- which generally doesn't happen on a "case-by-case" basis, and therefore wouldn't be covered by the following exemptory clause -- have to be defined as acts of genocide? And then, under clause 3, as a ‘crime against humanity’ as well?

3. Renders crimes against humanity any acts of genocide against any group on the basis of economic status or employment,

I'm honored that you would try to withhold something about this proposal until after its submission. Even so, clause 3 quite clearly would not impose any limitations on military engagements, as enemy military forces are not a group defined by their economic status or employment status.

[Jutsa]

OOC: Gl

[Separatist Peoples]

"We oppose this. Our species needs to systematically exterminate those less wealthy than ourselves to reproduce and metabolize," says Bell, trying hard to keep a straight face.

[Kowani]

"We oppose this. Our species needs to systematically exterminate those less wealthy than ourselves to reproduce and metabolize," says Bell, trying hard to keep a straight face.

Nego sighs. "Ambassador, you have no idea what those who do not understand basic economics will say."
"

[LiberNovusAmericae]

Deleted.

[Bears Armed]

OOC
I see that this has been submitted.

Wouldn't this clause

1. Recognizes systematic or otherwise intentional and statistically disproportionate violence perpetrated against a group, forceful isolation of a group in designated areas, removal of a group from designated areas, or the forceful institution of population controls on a group as acts of genocide

mean that define military action against enemy forces -- which generally doesn't happen on a "case-by-case" basis, and therefore wouldn't be covered by the following exemptory clause -- have to be defined as acts of genocide? And then, under clause 3, as a ‘crime against humanity’ as well?

3. Renders crimes against humanity any acts of genocide against any group on the basis of economic status or employment,

I'm honored that you would try to withhold something about this proposal until after its submission. Even so, clause 3 quite clearly would not impose any limitations on military engagements, as enemy military forces are not a group defined by their economic status or employment status.

OOC
Re me "withholding" my comment: I didn't notice that detail earlier, and you submitting this after a gap of about six weeks since the most recent previous comment didn't help... If you'd given us a couple of days warning that submission was imminent then I'd have given it another look-over during that period.
Re clause 3; the members of those forces are being targeted because they're employed in those forces. That is an "employment status", isn't it? If you intend the cause to say that governments can't specifically target the unemployed then maybe this could have been worded more clearly... and in any case that still seems to leave clause 1 as applicable.