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Trump-Inspired Hate Crime In Boston

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The Archregimancy
Game Moderator
 
Posts: 30594
Founded: Aug 01, 2005
Democratic Socialists

Postby The Archregimancy » Fri Aug 21, 2015 5:43 am

Big Jim P wrote:
The Archregimancy wrote:
Not according to the legal precedent set by the 1898 Supreme Court ruling in U.S. v. Wong Kim Ark.

The Supreme Court found that Wong Kim Ark, who was born in San Francisco to non-citizen Chinese immigrants, was a US citizen on the basis of his birth in the United States; this despite Congress a series of 'Chinese Exclusion Acts' that heavily restricted the ability of Chinese labourers to enter the United States, and denied them both the right of permanent residency and the right to become naturalised citizens.

Wong was detained when he re-entered his native United States following a visit to family in China on the basis that he was incapable of being a US citizen given that the Exclusion Acts denied citizenship and residency to both Wong and his parents; the Supreme Court ruled 6-2 that the Exclusion Acts couldn't overrule Wong's 14th Amendment right to citizenship on the basis of his birth in the United States.

I note that the above link sharing the opinions of 'nationally syndicated radio show host Mark Levin' makes no reference to U.S. v. Wong Kim Ark. The 19th-century opinion from 'Senator Lyman Trumbull, Chairman of the Judiciary Committee and a powerful supporter of the Fourteenth Amendment' used as an attempt to bolster the argument indeed predates U.S. v. Wong Kim Ark by some 32 years.


Then I stand corrected.


For reference, the key part of U.S. v. Wong Kim Ark, as it relates to the present debate, is as follows:

Section VI:

No one doubts that the [14th] amendment, as soon as it was promulgated, applied to persons of African descent born in the United States, wherever the birthplace of their parents might have been; and yet, for two years afterwards, there was no statute authorizing persons of that race to be naturalized. If the omission or the refusal of congress to permit certain [169 U.S. 649, 704] classes of persons to be made citizens by naturalization could be allowed the effect of correspondingly restricting the classes of persons who should become citizens by birth, it would be in the power of congress, at any time, by striking negroes out of the naturalization laws, and limiting those laws, as they were formerly limited, to white persons only, to defeat the main purpose of the constitutional amendment.

The fact, therefore, that acts of congress or treaties have not permitted Chinese persons born out of this country to become citizens by naturalization, cannot exclude Chinese persons born in this country from the operation of the broad and clear words of the constitution: 'All persons born in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States.'
Last edited by The Archregimancy on Fri Aug 21, 2015 5:45 am, edited 2 times in total.

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Dyakovo
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Posts: 83162
Founded: Nov 13, 2007
Ex-Nation

Postby Dyakovo » Fri Aug 21, 2015 6:08 am

Alien Space Bats wrote:
Eol Sha wrote:Not the Rubio part. I understand that. I meant about the relocation of his residency to Maine.

Oh.

Well, the Constitution forbids Electors from casting their votes for both a Presidential and a Vice Presidential candidate from the same State. So if Jeb Bush were to remain a Floridian, he couldn't on the same ticket as Marco Rubio, because then only one of the two of them could be elected.

Moving to Maine resolves the problem.

Sorry, ASB, but that's not actually true
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Alien Space Bats
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Founded: Sep 28, 2009
Ex-Nation

Re: Trump-Inspired Hate Crime In Boston

Postby Alien Space Bats » Fri Aug 21, 2015 7:40 am

Dyakovo wrote:Sorry, ASB, but that's not actually true

Damn, it's been a while since this last came up in Presidential politics. Apparently my aging brain neglected to recall that particular detail.

Yes, the rule applies only to Electors from the same State as the Presidential and Vice Presidential candidates in question. In the case of Jeb Bush and Marco Rubio, that would mean that it would only apply to Florida's 29 Electors.

But since 29 Electoral Votes is still one Hell of a lot of votes to give up (enough in many possible scenarios to keep either candidate from reaching magical number of 270 Electoral Votes required to get that candidate elected), the move still makes sense.
Last edited by Alien Space Bats on Fri Aug 21, 2015 7:41 am, edited 1 time in total.
"These states are just saying 'Yes, I used to beat my girlfriend, but I haven't since the restraining order, so we don't need it anymore.'" — Stephen Colbert, Comedian, on Shelby County v. Holder

"Do you see how policing blacks by the presumption of guilt and policing whites by the presumption of innocence is a self-reinforcing mechanism?" — Touré Neblett, MSNBC Commentator and Social Critic

"You knew damn well I was a snake before you took me in."Songwriter Oscar Brown in 1963, foretelling the election of Donald J. Trump

President Donald J. Trump: Working Tirelessly to Make Russia Great Again

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Neo-Vinnland
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Posts: 41
Founded: May 12, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby Neo-Vinnland » Fri Aug 21, 2015 8:10 am

Mallorea and Riva wrote:
Neo-Vinnland wrote:
Yeah. That isn't trolling. If you're going to be a moderator, learn your definitions before you try to moderate. Voicing my actual opinion is not trolling.

I'll let you think about that one.

Trolling/Baiting/Gloating: Trolling is defined as posts that are made with the aim of angering people. (like 'ALL JEWS ARE [insert vile comment here]' for example). Someone disagreeing with you does not equate to trolling. Intent is incredibly important and will be judged by the moderators to the best of their abilities. Honest belief does not excuse trolling. Disagreements are expected and conducting yourself in a civil manner is ideal. Trollbaiting is the action of making posts that attract trolls. A prime example of trollbaiting would be gloating over the results of an election.
It's a fine line but you clearly crossed it. Second opinion: I concur with the punishment handed out by Tsar.


Big surprise.

So when will the one who advocated putting 'rayciss' people be out in electric fences be warned for the same?

Or will they not because they agree with you?

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Farnhamia
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Posts: 112550
Founded: Jun 20, 2006
Left-Leaning College State

Postby Farnhamia » Fri Aug 21, 2015 8:13 am

Neo-Vinnland wrote:
Mallorea and Riva wrote: It's a fine line but you clearly crossed it. Second opinion: I concur with the punishment handed out by Tsar.


Big surprise.

So when will the one who advocated putting 'rayciss' people be out in electric fences be warned for the same?

Or will they not because they agree with you?

When someone reports the post in the Moderation forum.
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The Archregimancy
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Posts: 30594
Founded: Aug 01, 2005
Democratic Socialists

Postby The Archregimancy » Fri Aug 21, 2015 8:15 am

Neo-Vinnland wrote:
Big surprise.

So when will the one who advocated putting 'rayciss' people be out in electric fences be warned for the same?

Or will they not because they agree with you?


This thread is not the place to appeal your warning.

If you want to appeal your warning - or to make reports on other potential examples of trolling in the present thread - then please do so here: viewtopic.php?f=16&t=351487

Thank you.

Edit: When mods collide....
Last edited by The Archregimancy on Fri Aug 21, 2015 8:16 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Alien Space Bats
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Posts: 10073
Founded: Sep 28, 2009
Ex-Nation

Re: Trump-Inspired Hate Crime In Boston

Postby Alien Space Bats » Fri Aug 21, 2015 8:20 am

The Archregimancy wrote:Edit: When mods collide....

Where's George Pal when you need him?
"These states are just saying 'Yes, I used to beat my girlfriend, but I haven't since the restraining order, so we don't need it anymore.'" — Stephen Colbert, Comedian, on Shelby County v. Holder

"Do you see how policing blacks by the presumption of guilt and policing whites by the presumption of innocence is a self-reinforcing mechanism?" — Touré Neblett, MSNBC Commentator and Social Critic

"You knew damn well I was a snake before you took me in."Songwriter Oscar Brown in 1963, foretelling the election of Donald J. Trump

President Donald J. Trump: Working Tirelessly to Make Russia Great Again

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The Princes of the Universe
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Posts: 14506
Founded: Jan 12, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby The Princes of the Universe » Fri Aug 21, 2015 8:21 am

Alien Space Bats wrote:
The Archregimancy wrote:Edit: When mods collide....

Where's George Pal when you need him?

Palling around? :unsure:
Pro dolorosa Eius passione, miserere nobis et totius mundi.

In nomine Patris et Filii et Spiritus Sancti.
Domine Iesu Christe, Fili Dei, miserere mei, peccatoris.


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Farnhamia
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Posts: 112550
Founded: Jun 20, 2006
Left-Leaning College State

Postby Farnhamia » Fri Aug 21, 2015 8:23 am

Alien Space Bats wrote:
The Archregimancy wrote:Edit: When mods collide....

Where's George Pal when you need him?

I just reread both books and I have the movie in iTunes.
Make Earth Great Again: Stop Continental Drift!
And Jesus was a sailor when he walked upon the water ...
"Make yourself at home, Frank. Hit somebody." RIP Don Rickles
My country, right or wrong; if right, to be kept right; and if wrong, to be set right. ~ Carl Schurz
<Sigh> NSG...where even the atheists are Augustinians. ~ The Archregimancy
Now the foot is on the other hand ~ Kannap
RIP Dyakovo ... Ashmoria (Freedom ... or cake)
This is the eighth line. If your signature is longer, it's too long.

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Ethel mermania
Post Overlord
 
Posts: 129570
Founded: Aug 20, 2010
Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Ethel mermania » Fri Aug 21, 2015 8:45 am

The Archregimancy wrote:
Neo-Vinnland wrote:
Big surprise.

So when will the one who advocated putting 'rayciss' people be out in electric fences be warned for the same?

Or will they not because they agree with you?


This thread is not the place to appeal your warning.

If you want to appeal your warning - or to make reports on other potential examples of trolling in the present thread - then please do so here: viewtopic.php?f=16&t=351487

Thank you.

Edit: When mods collide....


Is that

when the doves cry?
https://www.hvst.com/posts/the-clash-of ... s-wl2TQBpY

The West won the world not by the superiority of its ideas or values or religion … but rather by its superiority in applying organized violence. Westerners often forget this fact; non-Westerners never do.
--S. Huntington

The most fundamental problem of politics is not the control of wickedness but the limitation of righteousness. 

--H. Kissenger

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The Archregimancy
Game Moderator
 
Posts: 30594
Founded: Aug 01, 2005
Democratic Socialists

Postby The Archregimancy » Fri Aug 21, 2015 8:53 am

Ethel mermania wrote:
The Archregimancy wrote:
This thread is not the place to appeal your warning.

If you want to appeal your warning - or to make reports on other potential examples of trolling in the present thread - then please do so here: viewtopic.php?f=16&t=351487

Thank you.

Edit: When mods collide....


Is that

when the doves cry?


Dig if you will the picture
Of Farn and I both hitting submit
We decide if to hand out a warning
Can you my Ethel,
Can you picture this?

Dream if you can a forum
An ocean of posting in bloom
Trump fan boys strike curious poses
They feel the heat
The heat of a warning sent through

Now we will just leave you standing
Alone in a thread that's so cold. (So cold)
Maybe I'm just too demanding
Maybe I'm just like my father, too bold
Maybe Farn's just like her mother
She's never satisfied (She's never satisfied)
Why do we mod like each other?

This is what it sounds like
When mods collide

User avatar
Ethel mermania
Post Overlord
 
Posts: 129570
Founded: Aug 20, 2010
Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Ethel mermania » Fri Aug 21, 2015 9:34 am

The Archregimancy wrote:
Ethel mermania wrote:
Is that

when the doves cry?


Dig if you will the picture
Of Farn and I both hitting submit
We decide if to hand out a warning
Can you my Ethel,
Can you picture this?

Dream if you can a forum
An ocean of posting in bloom
Trump fan boys strike curious poses
They feel the heat
The heat of a warning sent through

Now we will just leave you standing
Alone in a thread that's so cold. (So cold)
Maybe I'm just too demanding
Maybe I'm just like my father, too bold
Maybe Farn's just like her mother
She's never satisfied (She's never satisfied)
Why do we mod like each other?

This is what it sounds like
When mods collide




Ladies and gentlemen let me present to you. The Archregimancy, aka the artist formerly know as, and once again know as.....Prince

:clap: :bow: :clap:
Last edited by Ethel mermania on Fri Aug 21, 2015 9:44 am, edited 1 time in total.
https://www.hvst.com/posts/the-clash-of ... s-wl2TQBpY

The West won the world not by the superiority of its ideas or values or religion … but rather by its superiority in applying organized violence. Westerners often forget this fact; non-Westerners never do.
--S. Huntington

The most fundamental problem of politics is not the control of wickedness but the limitation of righteousness. 

--H. Kissenger

User avatar
The Archregimancy
Game Moderator
 
Posts: 30594
Founded: Aug 01, 2005
Democratic Socialists

Postby The Archregimancy » Fri Aug 21, 2015 9:36 am

Alien Space Bats wrote:
The Archregimancy wrote:Edit: When mods collide....

Where's George Pal when you need him?


Just a note that I did get that reference.

In fact, I'm likely one of the few people to have bothered to read the sequel novel 'After Worlds Collide' (originally published in 1934), which I remember for having a bizarrely anti-intellectual tone; the leader of the American colonists on their new planet, for example, ordered the scientists to stop using Latin names for species classification.

Hmmm.... must make this relevant to the thread.

Realistically, that's the sort of thing I can imagine Donald J. Trump doing if he were the leader of a post-disaster 1930s or 1950s space colony.
Last edited by The Archregimancy on Fri Aug 21, 2015 9:38 am, edited 2 times in total.

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Myrensis
Negotiator
 
Posts: 5898
Founded: Oct 05, 2010
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Myrensis » Fri Aug 21, 2015 10:46 am

I'm really trying to imagine the reaction from the right if, after the killing of those police in New York, Obama had gone on television and said, "Yeah well, it's a shame and all, but what can i say? My supporters are passionate about putting an end to police brutality."

The words 'apoplectic meltdown' come to mind.

Ah well, will be interesting times for the GOP when hispanics join blacks in 5-10% of the vote being normal for Republicans.

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Aurum Reich
Spokesperson
 
Posts: 200
Founded: Aug 14, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby Aurum Reich » Fri Aug 21, 2015 10:51 am

Alien Space Bats wrote:
The Cobalt Sky wrote:That Walker-Rubio prediction of yours is looking less and less likely, no?

No, I think that Trump's support has a ceiling and that ceiling's not high enough to win him the nomination. But I think he'll be in the GOP race to the end, and the Party will have to find some way to fellate... re, PLACATE him in order to keep him from going Independent.

That said, if I'm wrong about Walker, it will be because he gets beaten in his head-to-head battle with Bush. Should that happen, the likely GOP ticket will either be Bush-Kasich or Bush-Rubio (Bush has quietly changed his residency to Kennebunkport, ME [where his father lives], which would allow him to claim Maine as his home State and thus put his old political ally Marco Rubio on the ticket as VP, should he desire it).

How good are your predictions? Did you for instance predict McCain + Palin in '08?

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Wallenburg
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 22872
Founded: Jan 30, 2015
Democratic Socialists

Postby Wallenburg » Fri Aug 21, 2015 11:00 am

The Archregimancy wrote:Edit: When mods collide....

After extensive research, I have developed a hypothesis as to the events immediately following the collision of two Moderaton atoms.

Moderaton (Mod) is a heavy element easily distinguished from common NationStates substances, particularly due to its bright red hue and tendency to emit high-energy particles capable of damaging or even destroying lighter atoms. Moderaton is not to be conflated with Adminium (Ad), a very heavy element capable of annihilating even stronger elements.

Due to its rare nature, Moderaton naturally appears as one lone atom, diligently observing other atoms and properly ejecting exotic subatomic particles known as Wharn and Bann particles, respectively named after Peter Wharn and Elizabeth Bann, who have spent the last several decades confirming the nature of rare NationStates elements. However, Moderaton atoms occasionally pass nearby one another, forming weak bonds and then flinging away from each other on their paths to observe the universe. Were two Moderaton atoms to collide, these bonds could last longer or even become permanent, creating a new molecule unheard of in the NationStates universe.

The nature of this molecule is unclear. Perhaps it would serve as a stabilizing force in our universe, allowing for homeostasis to become a more realistic possibility. Perhaps it would be dangerous and decay, releasing unprecedented quantities of Wharn and Bann particles, plunging NationStates into a new dark age. We can only hope that such a collision is unlikely and that our imperfect existence may be maintained by the forces of solitary Moderaton atoms.
Last edited by Wallenburg on Fri Aug 21, 2015 11:00 am, edited 1 time in total.
While she had no regrets about throwing the lever to douse her husband's mistress in molten gold, Blanche did feel a pang of conscience for the innocent bystanders whose proximity had caused them to suffer gilt by association.

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Toolsbergia
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Posts: 117
Founded: May 26, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby Toolsbergia » Fri Aug 21, 2015 11:03 am

The kind of rhetoric displayed by trump and sometimes other republicans should be labled as hatespeach and a danger to society and rightfully banned otherwise the USA will never become civilized.

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MERIZoC
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 23694
Founded: Dec 05, 2013
Left-wing Utopia

Postby MERIZoC » Fri Aug 21, 2015 11:25 am

Prussia-Steinbach wrote:
Washington Resistance Army wrote:MAKE AMERICA GREAT AGAIN PRUSS!

America will be great when we treat our homeless, downtrodden, impoverished, and discriminated against, as well as we do our celebrities.

Send cameras after them and print stories on who they sleep with?

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Wallenburg
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 22872
Founded: Jan 30, 2015
Democratic Socialists

Postby Wallenburg » Fri Aug 21, 2015 11:30 am

Merizoc wrote:
Prussia-Steinbach wrote:America will be great when we treat our homeless, downtrodden, impoverished, and discriminated against, as well as we do our celebrities.

Send cameras after them and print stories on who they sleep with?

Exactly.
While she had no regrets about throwing the lever to douse her husband's mistress in molten gold, Blanche did feel a pang of conscience for the innocent bystanders whose proximity had caused them to suffer gilt by association.

King of Snark, Real Piece of Work, Metabolizer of Oxygen, Old Man from The East Pacific, by the Malevolence of Her Infinite Terribleness Catherine Gratwick the Sole and True Claimant to the Bears Armed Vacancy, Protector of the Realm

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USS Monitor
Retired Moderator
 
Posts: 30747
Founded: Jul 01, 2015
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby USS Monitor » Fri Aug 21, 2015 11:46 am

Toolsbergia wrote:The kind of rhetoric displayed by trump and sometimes other republicans should be labled as hatespeach and a danger to society and rightfully banned otherwise the USA will never become civilized.


Hate speech isn't illegal in the US, and can't be banned without a Constitutional amendment.

If people suggest violent "solutions" for all the crap they're ranting about, THEN you can come after them for making threats. Trump does seem to have a similar attitude to some of the people who have gotten in legal trouble for running their mouths about killing Obama, but AFAIK, he hasn't actually called for violence.
Don't take life so serious... it isn't permanent... RIP Dyakovo and Ashmoria
19th century steamships may be harmful or fatal if swallowed. In case of accidental ingestion, please seek immediate medical assistance.
༄༅། །འགྲོ་བ་མི་རིགས་ག་ར་དབང་ཆ་འདྲ་མཉམ་འབད་སྒྱེཝ་ལས་ག་ར་གིས་གཅིག་གིས་གཅིག་ལུ་སྤུན་ཆའི་དམ་ཚིག་བསྟན་དགོས།

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USS Monitor
Retired Moderator
 
Posts: 30747
Founded: Jul 01, 2015
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby USS Monitor » Fri Aug 21, 2015 11:48 am

Merizoc wrote:
Prussia-Steinbach wrote:America will be great when we treat our homeless, downtrodden, impoverished, and discriminated against, as well as we do our celebrities.

Send cameras after them and print stories on who they sleep with?


That might actually be helpful in some cases.
Don't take life so serious... it isn't permanent... RIP Dyakovo and Ashmoria
19th century steamships may be harmful or fatal if swallowed. In case of accidental ingestion, please seek immediate medical assistance.
༄༅། །འགྲོ་བ་མི་རིགས་ག་ར་དབང་ཆ་འདྲ་མཉམ་འབད་སྒྱེཝ་ལས་ག་ར་གིས་གཅིག་གིས་གཅིག་ལུ་སྤུན་ཆའི་དམ་ཚིག་བསྟན་དགོས།

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Multiversal Domanaeii
Envoy
 
Posts: 211
Founded: Dec 02, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby Multiversal Domanaeii » Fri Aug 21, 2015 11:58 am

Can't ever stump the Trump.
Multiversal Domanaeḯ̶̬ȉ̶̺

e̷̼͊n̵͇͑d̸̩͐ ̵̩͊m̴̔ͅy̴͖͗ ̵̠̀s̸̺̆û̴͕f̶̑ͅf̶̱̍e̸̖̒r̶̃ͅi̸͚͒n̸̺̐g̷̜̽

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The Princes of the Universe
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 14506
Founded: Jan 12, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby The Princes of the Universe » Fri Aug 21, 2015 12:00 pm

Multiversal Domanaeii wrote:Can't ever stump the Trump.

Don't need to stump the Trump. He does that just fine all by himself. :roll:
Pro dolorosa Eius passione, miserere nobis et totius mundi.

In nomine Patris et Filii et Spiritus Sancti.
Domine Iesu Christe, Fili Dei, miserere mei, peccatoris.


User avatar
Multiversal Domanaeii
Envoy
 
Posts: 211
Founded: Dec 02, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby Multiversal Domanaeii » Fri Aug 21, 2015 12:00 pm

The Princes of the Universe wrote:
Multiversal Domanaeii wrote:Can't ever stump the Trump.

Don't need to stump the Trump. He does that just fine all by himself. :roll:


...What?
Multiversal Domanaeḯ̶̬ȉ̶̺

e̷̼͊n̵͇͑d̸̩͐ ̵̩͊m̴̔ͅy̴͖͗ ̵̠̀s̸̺̆û̴͕f̶̑ͅf̶̱̍e̸̖̒r̶̃ͅi̸͚͒n̸̺̐g̷̜̽

User avatar
Ethel mermania
Post Overlord
 
Posts: 129570
Founded: Aug 20, 2010
Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Ethel mermania » Fri Aug 21, 2015 12:03 pm

Toolsbergia wrote:The kind of rhetoric displayed by trump and sometimes other republicans should be labled as hatespeach and a danger to society and rightfully banned otherwise the USA will never become civilized.

Enforcing the law by advocating Throwing the illegals out is hate speech?
https://www.hvst.com/posts/the-clash-of ... s-wl2TQBpY

The West won the world not by the superiority of its ideas or values or religion … but rather by its superiority in applying organized violence. Westerners often forget this fact; non-Westerners never do.
--S. Huntington

The most fundamental problem of politics is not the control of wickedness but the limitation of righteousness. 

--H. Kissenger

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