Ukrainian Crisis

[Inyourfaceistan]

Or the Ukrainians could control their own damn resources, and remain independent from the EU...

Except they couldn't. If you'd know even the remotest thing about Eastern Europe's political situation, you'd know that not integrating yourself further with the EU is basically drawing ever closer to a day when Putin gains economic control over your nation.

Why do the only two choices seem to be join the E.U. or be a Russian puppet. Why is there no third option?

[The yoshin empire]

Or the Ukrainians could control their own damn resources, and remain independent from the EU...

Except they couldn't. If you'd know even the remotest thing about Eastern Europe's political situation, you'd know that not integrating yourself further with the EU is basically drawing ever closer to a day when Putin gains economic control over your nation.

So the choice is between a rupublic and a dictator?

[DrakoLand]

Except they couldn't. If you'd know even the remotest thing about Eastern Europe's political situation, you'd know that not integrating yourself further with the EU is basically drawing ever closer to a day when Putin gains economic control over your nation.

Why do the only two choices seem to be join the E.U. or be a Russian puppet. Why is there no third option?

Yeah, look at Yugosla- oh wait.

[DrakoLand]

Except they couldn't. If you'd know even the remotest thing about Eastern Europe's political situation, you'd know that not integrating yourself further with the EU is basically drawing ever closer to a day when Putin gains economic control over your nation.

So the choice is between a rupublic and a dictator?

EU is a *republic now?

[Divair]

Except they couldn't. If you'd know even the remotest thing about Eastern Europe's political situation, you'd know that not integrating yourself further with the EU is basically drawing ever closer to a day when Putin gains economic control over your nation.

And how is that worse than ending up like Greece?

They're not hosting the Olympics, not inflating welfare systems faster than is necessary, not lying about their economic statistics, and not experiencing widespread tax evasion. Why would they end up like Greece?

[Liriena]

I fail to see how this is worthy of celebration. Most of the time, when a nation flips the bird at an international organization with a strong stance for human rights, it's because said nation doesn't want to be held accountable for whatever insidious antics they are trying to pull back home.

Ah, Ukraine. You have no clue how bad the human rights situation is until you go there. I may have told this story before on NS, I cannot recall. I work a lot with orphanages in Ukraine (hence the dozen visits), and one story stands out every time Ukraine is mentioned. One kid "graduated" from an orphanage. Now you see, you need to understand that Ukraine's police have a quota system. So.. they decide to blame a murder on him despite a lack of evidence. He's taken to a jail full of incredibly sick, incredibly tough criminals. There, he is beaten and tortured (the most horrifying tactic was to put a gas mask on his head, and then drain the air) to attempt to get a confession out of him. The wife of the deceased told the courts that he wasn't the murderer. She "disappeared". Eventually, a group of people who supported this bloke (me included, which is why I know all this) hired a very experienced lawyer from the States to come and deal with the case. It took a long time, and the lawyer was heavily injured after an assassination attempt, but we managed to get him on an EU torture watch-list. In the middle of the night a few years ago, he was randomly released from jail after the state had gotten sick of his supporters.


Ukraine. Not even once.

Damn... and I complain about money laundering in my country.

[Arglorand]

Except they couldn't. If you'd know even the remotest thing about Eastern Europe's political situation, you'd know that not integrating yourself further with the EU is basically drawing ever closer to a day when Putin gains economic control over your nation.

So the choice is between a rupublic and a dictator?

As usual, yes.

[Dyakovo]

Except they couldn't. If you'd know even the remotest thing about Eastern Europe's political situation, you'd know that not integrating yourself further with the EU is basically drawing ever closer to a day when Putin gains economic control over your nation.

And how is that worse than ending up like Greece?

Greece is the one responsible for Greece's economic woes, not the EU.

[Arglorand]

And how is that worse than ending up like Greece?

They're not hosting the Olympics, not inflating welfare systems faster than is necessary, not lying about their economic statistics, and not experiencing widespread tax evasion. Why would they end up like Greece?

Because, obviously, it happens every time a country joins the EU. I mean, just look at the Greekesque economic collapse the Swedes are suffering.

[The yoshin empire]

So the choice is between a rupublic and a dictator?

EU is a *republic now?

Yes.

[Divair]

They're not hosting the Olympics, not inflating welfare systems faster than is necessary, not lying about their economic statistics, and not experiencing widespread tax evasion. Why would they end up like Greece?

Because, obviously, it happens every time a country joins the EU. I mean, just look at the Greekesque economic collapse the Swedes are suffering.

The Baltic states are doing incredibly bad, too!

[Arglorand]

Except they couldn't. If you'd know even the remotest thing about Eastern Europe's political situation, you'd know that not integrating yourself further with the EU is basically drawing ever closer to a day when Putin gains economic control over your nation.

Why do the only two choices seem to be join the E.U. or be a Russian puppet. Why is there no third option?

Because Putin can't get this idea of spheres of influence out of his head.

[Arglorand]

Because, obviously, it happens every time a country joins the EU. I mean, just look at the Greekesque economic collapse the Swedes are suffering.

The Baltic states are doing incredibly bad, too!

Not to mention Poland, which is doing so bad it had no recession at all.

[Shove Piggy Shove]

The EU does nothing but sucks out money from poor nations. I'm sure it'll break-up, sooner or later.

Care to back that up?

http://www.euromove.org.uk/index.php?id=15296

http://www.economicshelp.org/europe/benefits-eu/

[Hurdegaryp]

Except they couldn't. If you'd know even the remotest thing about Eastern Europe's political situation, you'd know that not integrating yourself further with the EU is basically drawing ever closer to a day when Putin gains economic control over your nation.

So the choice is between a rupublic and a dictator?

It's more a choice between the technocratic European Union and the always adorable Russian Federation.

[Liriena]

So the choice is between a rupublic and a dictator?

It's more a choice between the technocratic European Union and the always adorable Russian Federation.

And in the European Union you get to vote. Sure, Germany outvotes everyone, but it could be worse.

[Divair]

The EU does nothing but sucks out money from poor nations. I'm sure it'll break-up, sooner or later.

Care to back that up?

http://www.euromove.org.uk/index.php?id=15296

http://www.economicshelp.org/europe/benefits-eu/

BUT LOOK AT HOW BAD IT IS!
http://business.financialpost.com/2013/ ... facturing/
http://www.spiegel.de/international/bus ... 16642.html
http://www.businessinsider.com/french-flash-pmi-2013-7
http://www.theguardian.com/business/201 ... dp-figures
http://www.businessinsider.com/german-flash-pmi-2013-7
http://www.businessinsider.com/spain-is-surging-2013-7
http://www.businessinsider.com/french-i ... tor-2013-7
http://www.fundweb.co.uk/fund-news/euro ... 95.article
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-08-1 ... ludes.html
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-23944091
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-23956192
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-24382249
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-24430135
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-24740721
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-24668687


Oh. Wait.

[Hurdegaryp]

Because, obviously, it happens every time a country joins the EU. I mean, just look at the Greekesque economic collapse the Swedes are suffering.

The Baltic states are doing incredibly bad, too!

And here in the Netherlands we have to remove the mortal remains of those who died of hunger from the streets every single day!

[Liriena]

The Baltic states are doing incredibly bad, too!

And here in the Netherlands we have to remove the mortal remains of those who died of hunger from the streets every single day!

Santorum told me that elderly people in the Netherlands have to carry bracelets that say "don't euthanize me"! D:

[Arglorand]

It's more a choice between the technocratic European Union and the always adorable Russian Federation.

And in the European Union you get to vote. Sure, Germany outvotes everyone, but it could be worse.

It doesn't really outvote everyone. It only has 99 (12.9%) of the seats in the EP.

[The yoshin empire]

So the choice is between a rupublic and a dictator?

It's more a choice between the technocratic European Union and the always adorable Russian Federation.

Putin hates Yaoi , Yuri , and anything Gay , Bi , lesbian , and transexual thus making it unadorable

[Liriena]

And in the European Union you get to vote. Sure, Germany outvotes everyone, but it could be worse.

It doesn't really outvote everyone. It only has 99 (12.9%) of the seats in the EP.

Totally a dictatorship.

[Hurdegaryp]

It's more a choice between the technocratic European Union and the always adorable Russian Federation.

And in the European Union you get to vote. Sure, Germany outvotes everyone, but it could be worse.

These days Germany tends to save everybody's bacon, while getting not many thanks in return. I think it's time to start a Good Guy Germany meme.

[Liriena]

It's more a choice between the technocratic European Union and the always adorable Russian Federation.

Putin hates Yaoi , Yuri , and anything Gay , Bi , lesbian , and transexual thus making it unadorable

Nobody messes with my Yaoi! >:3

[Divair]

It doesn't really outvote everyone. It only has 99 (12.9%) of the seats in the EP.

Totally a dictatorship.

Merkelreich!