Transgender woman correctly buried as man?

[Ermarian]

On one hand, how you are buried is by definition irrelevant to you personally.

On the other, I wonder how any of her now-living relatives would react to the thought they might get buried in a Muslim or Jewish funeral, or eulogized with the wrong pronouns.

Whether or not we respect people's identities after their death might not matter to them specifically, but it does matter vicariously to anyone who expects to get buried some day.

[Dyakovo]

Do people really need to specifically ask in their will to be buried as they are?

If they're trans*, apparently the answer to that is "yes".

[The New World Oceania]

You have to feel sorry for people who just don't get that sex and gender are arbitrary constructs, that don't exist in a binary.

Gender is arbitrary; sex is not. Sex is binary; gender is not.

Humans are mammals. Mammals are sexually dimorphic. It is true that there are some individuals (in the human species as well as other mammalian species) that have disorders of sexual development, but this doesn't change the fact that we are sexually dimorphic as a species. Kind of like how the fact that some people are born without legs doesn't change the fact that homo sapiens is a bipedal species.

The gender binary was conceived in Western society before the sex binary was understood; that is, the binary perception of gender imposes itself on binary biological sex, not the other way around. Sexual dimorphism, while relevant, is only a description of characteristics which, while helpful without end in medicine, fail irrevocably when paired against social constructivism and antipositivism.

[Degenerate Heart of HetRio]

Gender is arbitrary; sex is not. Sex is binary; gender is not.

Humans are mammals. Mammals are sexually dimorphic. It is true that there are some individuals (in the human species as well as other mammalian species) that have disorders of sexual development, but this doesn't change the fact that we are sexually dimorphic as a species. Kind of like how the fact that some people are born without legs doesn't change the fact that homo sapiens is a bipedal species.

In what way intersex conditions are objectively a disorder comparable to lack of limbs?

Why normal human development would ask for an idealized unambiguous linear following of a pole in a vast spectrum of options that spans chromosomes, gonads, genitalia shape, endocrine gearing and function and neurological wiring?

All humans are ambiguous in these degrees in a minor or major manner because they're shaped by a shot in the dark that defines the interaction between genetics and intra-uterine hormone-based development. The consequences of such interactions between humans that are generally genetically unique and even more singular hormonal influence over the course of several months are not in any shape or form part of a very well-defined dance. It is nowhere near like a disease caused by genetic conditions, because intersex conditions are just a form of human uniqueness, and every single person was exposed to a development that could have made them intersex.

Sometimes they're more "lucky" and our functioning suffered adaptive pressure over generations to guarantee the fostering of such possibility because humans are supposed from an evolutionary viewpoint to be minimally dimorphic, thus there is indeed a pressure selecting for dyadic people, but intersex conditions aren't in themselves harmful. 2% is the same of redheads among the overall human population, all intersex conditions arise in every human population, and there is no exact anti-intersex pressure in evolution that would classify them as particularly flawed. (Fertility being obviously relevant is the sole pro-dyadic pressure, but it's not at all like dyadic = fertile and intersex = sterile.)

Even because, if humans are all ambiguous and the truly dimorphic poles are just idealized states impossible for us to obtain, who is to define what characteristics represent pathological ambiguity (when many of them aren't at all deprived of some vital function by that) and what characteristics define normal ambiguity? Isn't it a pretty arbitrary line to just call people "abnormal" and place them in a blurry non-classification?

Intersex conditions might be variously related to autosomal genome, sex dimorphism chromosomes, and events related to various different stages of intra-uterine hormonal development. It wouldn't make sense to put them in a single umbrella of one-size-fits-all even if you were correct that we can reliably tell which levels of intersexuality should be a diagnosis of a disorder and which are irrelevant. Why aren't all of us in some minor way also disordered, if we all share some ambiguity derived from the womb hormone bath's imprecision?

You might argue that nature doesn't want us to be anything, we just are at pressure for selection of relevant traits, but why wouldn't that apply to intersex people? Ultimately, people are our consciousnesses, our cognition, and our bodies are just flesh vessels much less relevant to our reason to be here than what they carry. We aren't slaves of a necessity to select the fittest bodies anymore. People are free to have bodies that please them, rather than just needing the "superior" ones to survive and guarantee the dispersal of advantaged genes. (And there's nothing particularly disadvantaged about the genomes of a significant majority of intersex folks.) EUGENICS IS DEAD.

To call people inferior because they aren't useful to this line of thought of humans as continually exposed to a contemporary Darwinian selection where we are all each other's rivals rather than siblings is flirting with racialism and other misanthropic ideological scum.

So please stop with the intersexphobic coprolalia, even if you are just trying to justify an agenda that is a mere laughable ripoff of what trans people have to say about themselves. (Dumb Ideologies' point about gender being just arbitrary also stands.)

[Degenerate Heart of HetRio]

This is a problem of terminology.

I use "gender" in the second-wave sense; gender is a hierarchy, a binary imposed to maintain a power structure that is based on sex.

You still should listen to intersex people, non-binary people and those of non-Western genders before using language that is directly related to our struggle and how we conceive ourselves, though.

Before arguing about how much dyadic cis females are oppressed - and I don't doubt they are -, please remember that the dyadic superstructure - i.e. the sex-gender hierarchy system - also grants people cissexist, binarist, colonial and dyadist privileges. We are supposed to be each other's allies or else this won't mean nothing.

[Ethel mermania]

Do people really need to specifically ask in their will to be buried as they are?

Needs to be in the liVing will, and prepay the funeral. You have a particular way of wanting to be buried. Prepay it. Otherwise whoever is paying for the funeral is the one the funeral director is going to listen to.

[Ethel mermania]

Do people really need to specifically ask in their will to be buried as they are?

If they're trans*, apparently the answer to that is "yes".

Not just trans. My kid converts to Christianity and wants to be buried as such, he can pay for it himself. If I have to bury him, it's going to be as a jew.

[Dyakovo]

If they're trans*, apparently the answer to that is "yes".

Not just trans. My kid converts to Christianity and wants to be buried as such, he can pay for it himself. If I have to bury him, it's going to be as a jew.

"Fuck their wishes. What do they think they are? People?"

[Degenerate Heart of HetRio]

If they're trans*, apparently the answer to that is "yes".

Not just trans. My kid converts to Christianity and wants to be buried as such, he can pay for it himself. If I have to bury him, it's going to be as a jew.

Where/how can I formalize my will to be respected as an atheist in death?

[Ethel mermania]

Not just trans. My kid converts to Christianity and wants to be buried as such, he can pay for it himself. If I have to bury him, it's going to be as a jew.

"Fuck their wishes. What do they think they are? People?"

Funerals are for the living not the dead. It matters that much to him, he can make the arrangements.

[The Alma Mater]

"Fuck their wishes. What do they think they are? People?"

Funerals are for the living not the dead. It matters that much to him, he can make the arrangements.

What exactly do the living get out of distorting the memory of the deceased ?

[Herskerstad]

Funerals are for the living not the dead. It matters that much to him, he can make the arrangements.

What exactly do the living get out of distorting the memory of the deceased ?

In this case, it strictly speaking won't matter too much. God'll know those he resurrects be it from ashes or dirt.

I mean I am not a fan of not honoring his own wishes of course in such a situation because it is true that those should over-write the preference of the parents in my opinion, but there is nothing illegal in what Ethel is saying unless, of course, it becomes law given testimony.

[Ethel mermania]

Not just trans. My kid converts to Christianity and wants to be buried as such, he can pay for it himself. If I have to bury him, it's going to be as a jew.

Where/how can I formalize my will to be respected as an atheist in death?

Your in Brazil I think, I have no idea how they do it there.

In the states you would have to prearrange it, and have it in your liVing will. Or trust whoever is paying to bury you respects your wishes.

[CTALNH]

What exactly do the living get out of distorting the memory of the deceased ?

In this case, it strictly speaking won't matter too much. God'll know those he resurrects be it from ashes or dirt.

I mean I am not a fan of not honoring his own wishes of course in such a situation because it is true that those should over-write the preference of the parents in my opinion, but there is nothing illegal in what Ethel is saying unless, of course, it becomes law given testimony.

This sentence doesn't need to be in your post.

[Ethel mermania]

Funerals are for the living not the dead. It matters that much to him, he can make the arrangements.

What exactly do the living get out of distorting the memory of the deceased ?

I think that changes from person to person.

[CTALNH]

What exactly do the living get out of distorting the memory of the deceased ?

I think that changes from person to person.

Closure nincompoop.

We bury,burn and etc our dead for closure.

[Alyakia]

If they're trans*, apparently the answer to that is "yes".

Not just trans. My kid converts to Christianity and wants to be buried as such, he can pay for it himself. If I have to bury him, it's going to be as a jew.

lol just imagine someone burying a jew as a christian against their wishes and see how it turns out in your mind

[The Alma Mater]

I think that changes from person to person.

Closure nincompoop.

We bury,burn and etc our dead for closure.

I get that. But why burn a fantasy image of the dead they themselves would abhor ? How can that give closure - if you cannot even acknowledge who is gone ?

[CTALNH]

Closure nincompoop.

We bury,burn and etc our dead for closure.

I get that. But why burn a fantasy image of the dead they themselves would abhor ? How can that give closure - if you cannot even acknowledge who is gone ?

Wait what I can't understand what your saying.

[The Alma Mater]

I get that. But why burn a fantasy image of the dead they themselves would abhor ? How can that give closure - if you cannot even acknowledge who is gone ?

Wait what I can't understand what your saying.

Burying a Christian as a Jew. Burying someone who selfidentified as female as male. Burying a Republican as a Democrat. Burying a chimneysweep as a medical doctor.

What is the point of such fantasyfunerals ? You are not remembering the person who died. How can such a fantasimage ever give closure for the loss of the real person ?

[Nazi Flower Power]

Well from my perspective its simple really. The corpse does not care. Not any more. Corpses don't have feelings. So the ceremony of burial is something that obviously exists solely for the benefit of the people still alive. Thus what ever they want to do that makes them feel better about their loss is perfectly fine by me.

The problem is it was upsetting to her surviving friends who knew her as a woman.

[Ethel mermania]

Closure nincompoop.

We bury,burn and etc our dead for closure.

I get that. But why burn a fantasy image of the dead they themselves would abhor ? How can that give closure - if you cannot even acknowledge who is gone ?

People are not monolithic creatures, we change as we age. Who we are when we die is not who we are as we grow. We choose the memories we hold on to. If your kid dies at 26 from drug overdose, is that the memory your going to keep of him/her? No, your going to remember and grieve overy the smiling high school graduate, with a bright future ahead of them.

[Alyakia]

I get that. But why burn a fantasy image of the dead they themselves would abhor ? How can that give closure - if you cannot even acknowledge who is gone ?

People are not monolithic creatures, we change as we age. Who we are when we die is not who we are as we grow. We choose the memories we hold on to. If your kid dies at 26 from drug overdose, is that the memory your going to keep of him/her? No, your going to remember and grieve overy the smiling high school graduate, with a bright future ahead of them.

religion and gender are much like hardcore drugs

[The Alma Mater]

I get that. But why burn a fantasy image of the dead they themselves would abhor ? How can that give closure - if you cannot even acknowledge who is gone ?

People are not monolithic creatures, we change as we age. Who we are when we die is not who we are as we grow. We choose the memories we hold on to. If your kid dies at 26 from drug overdose, is that the memory your going to keep of him/her? No, your going to remember and grieve overy the smiling high school graduate, with a bright future ahead of them.

Actually, I would remember both. Because that simply is who the person was.

[Ethel mermania]

People are not monolithic creatures, we change as we age. Who we are when we die is not who we are as we grow. We choose the memories we hold on to. If your kid dies at 26 from drug overdose, is that the memory your going to keep of him/her? No, your going to remember and grieve overy the smiling high school graduate, with a bright future ahead of them.

religion and gender are much like hardcore drugs

I don't like Christianity. I understand drug abuse.