Self-interest.
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by Freefall11111 » Sat Aug 27, 2016 11:38 pm
by Allanea » Sat Aug 27, 2016 11:59 pm
Nochov wrote:My classification of degeneracy isn't really on-topic for this thread. Decadence and drug use qualifies, of course. Degeneracy hurts society by debilitating costs, causes splintering, leads to crime, and worse, is effectively contagious. Allowing it to exist is only going to cause it to spread and become a more deeply ingrained part of society, which is where the firing squad comes in. Public executions are a good way to demonstrate to the people what degeneracy leads to. A society unified in purpose and fear is a society that isn't going to waste time and effort on non-conformist behaviour.
by Communist Xomaniax » Sun Aug 28, 2016 12:27 am
by Pandeeria » Sun Aug 28, 2016 12:58 am
Jumhuriyah Hindustan wrote:What do you think, NSG? I believe in socialism, and ideally, communism, so it may just be my bias, but I want to hear from you guys.
Lavochkin wrote:Never got why educated people support communism.
In capitalism, you pretty much have a 50/50 chance of being rich or poor. In communism, it's 1/99. What makes people think they have the luck/skill to become the 1% if they can't even succeed in a 50/50 society???
by Mattopilos » Sun Aug 28, 2016 2:12 am
Cuprum wrote:To those who want a communist nation, why they don't live in North Korea, China, Vietnam or Cuba which are communist? What's the problem of being rich and being surrounded by pomposity? I think social darwinism is one of the main factors that defines the current the way of capitalism.
by Jumhuriyah Hindustan » Sun Aug 28, 2016 4:22 am
by Socialist Tera » Sun Aug 28, 2016 7:06 am
by Wolfmanne2 » Sun Aug 28, 2016 9:37 am
Jumhuriyah Hindustan wrote:What do you think, NSG? I believe in socialism, and ideally, communism, so it may just be my bias, but I want to hear from you guys.
Mad hatters in jeans wrote:Yeah precipitating on everyone doesn't go down well usually. You seem patient enough to chat to us, i'm willing to count that as nice.
by United Marxist Nations » Sun Aug 28, 2016 10:01 am
The Kievan People wrote: United Marxist Nations: A prayer for every soul, a plan for every economy and a waifu for every man. Solid.
St. John Chrysostom wrote:A comprehended God is no God.
by Socialist Tera » Sun Aug 28, 2016 10:02 am
by Wolfmanne2 » Sun Aug 28, 2016 10:03 am
Mad hatters in jeans wrote:Yeah precipitating on everyone doesn't go down well usually. You seem patient enough to chat to us, i'm willing to count that as nice.
by United Marxist Nations » Sun Aug 28, 2016 10:04 am
The Kievan People wrote: United Marxist Nations: A prayer for every soul, a plan for every economy and a waifu for every man. Solid.
St. John Chrysostom wrote:A comprehended God is no God.
by Conserative Morality » Sun Aug 28, 2016 10:06 am
United Marxist Nations wrote:If not religious morals, why any morals?
by Nochov » Sun Aug 28, 2016 11:10 am
I think the problem we're having here is that you see the death penalty as a more severe punishment than I do. Why shouldn't we be purging the undesirable parts of the population? I also think we have different opinions on how much of a cost is debilitating. In my opinion, if drug use costs society x currency units, then that's x currency units too many. If it doesn't directly benefit society, it shouldn't exist. And when we make a distinction between medication and drug use, then it's pretty easy to say that drug use is never beneficial.Allanea wrote:Nochov wrote:My classification of degeneracy isn't really on-topic for this thread. Decadence and drug use qualifies, of course. Degeneracy hurts society by debilitating costs, causes splintering, leads to crime, and worse, is effectively contagious. Allowing it to exist is only going to cause it to spread and become a more deeply ingrained part of society, which is where the firing squad comes in. Public executions are a good way to demonstrate to the people what degeneracy leads to. A society unified in purpose and fear is a society that isn't going to waste time and effort on non-conformist behaviour.
No, your classification of degeneracy is perfectly on-topic for this thread.
You can't just expect to make a hugely controversial claim - that people who drink alcohol or use drugs or have promiscuous sex are degenerate, and in fact so degenerate they deserve to get killed for it.
This is clearly not something most of society believes - evidently we are not living in a society that executes people for drinking alcohol or being promiscous. So if you are basing your entire argument on the claim that everyone who drinks vodka or does drugs or has lots of sex is a degenerate - something which is clearly deeply controversial - you need to defend this claim.
It is simply not true that society is afflicted with some manner of 'debilitating' costs from people fucking too much or doing too much drugs. To be sure there are costs to this but they're not debilitating. The oppressive majority of drug users - even the oppressive majority of hard drug users - are not in fact stereotypical criminal junkies.
According to the US government there are nearly 25 million people in the US who have used drugs in the past month, and 1.5 million people who have used cocaine in the past months. Do you, looking around yourself, feel that you're surrounded by vast legions of horrible junkies?
by The New Sea Territory » Sun Aug 28, 2016 12:17 pm
Jumhuriyah Hindustan wrote:What do you think, NSG? I believe in socialism, and ideally, communism, so it may just be my bias, but I want to hear from you guys.
| Ⓐ ☭ | Anarchist Communist | Heideggerian Marxist | Vegetarian | Bisexual | Stirnerite | Slavic/Germanic Pagan | ᚨ ᛟ |
Solntsa Roshcha --- Postmodern Poyltheist
"Christianity had brutally planted the poisoned blade in the healthy, quivering flesh of all humanity; it had goaded a cold wave
of darkness with mystically brutal fury to dim the serene and festive exultation of the dionysian spirit of our pagan ancestors."
-Renzo Novatore, Verso il Nulla Creatore
by The New Sea Territory » Sun Aug 28, 2016 12:19 pm
| Ⓐ ☭ | Anarchist Communist | Heideggerian Marxist | Vegetarian | Bisexual | Stirnerite | Slavic/Germanic Pagan | ᚨ ᛟ |
Solntsa Roshcha --- Postmodern Poyltheist
"Christianity had brutally planted the poisoned blade in the healthy, quivering flesh of all humanity; it had goaded a cold wave
of darkness with mystically brutal fury to dim the serene and festive exultation of the dionysian spirit of our pagan ancestors."
-Renzo Novatore, Verso il Nulla Creatore
by Arkolon » Sun Aug 28, 2016 12:32 pm
by The New Sea Territory » Sun Aug 28, 2016 12:40 pm
Arkolon wrote:The New Sea Territory wrote:
I don't know about your selfishness, but I don't see how self-interest could be a basis for morality....my self-interest comes into direct conflict with any moral system.
Your self-interest is a moral system, since it - your self-interest - determines which of your actions is right (presumably those in your self-interest) and wrong (presumably those that are not in your self-interest).
| Ⓐ ☭ | Anarchist Communist | Heideggerian Marxist | Vegetarian | Bisexual | Stirnerite | Slavic/Germanic Pagan | ᚨ ᛟ |
Solntsa Roshcha --- Postmodern Poyltheist
"Christianity had brutally planted the poisoned blade in the healthy, quivering flesh of all humanity; it had goaded a cold wave
of darkness with mystically brutal fury to dim the serene and festive exultation of the dionysian spirit of our pagan ancestors."
-Renzo Novatore, Verso il Nulla Creatore
by Arkolon » Sun Aug 28, 2016 12:43 pm
The New Sea Territory wrote:Arkolon wrote:Your self-interest is a moral system, since it - your self-interest - determines which of your actions is right (presumably those in your self-interest) and wrong (presumably those that are not in your self-interest).
Your definition of "moral system" is meaninglessly vague, because it encompasses even the most basic and individual tastes. My desire, and following my desire, does not equate to a claim that my desire "ought" to be followed.
by Greed and Death » Sun Aug 28, 2016 12:49 pm
Risottia wrote:Wolfmanne2 wrote::roll:
Aside from the all the people who died as a result of the failure of planned economics, whom he had no morality for.
More like aside from his secret police, torture, and the execution of thousands after drumhead court trials.
Basically, he was the average immoral dictator dude.
by Conserative Morality » Sun Aug 28, 2016 12:52 pm
The New Sea Territory wrote:Then your moral judgments aren't a stable basis for political argument.
by Salus Maior » Sun Aug 28, 2016 12:52 pm
Minzerland wrote:Except enjoyment perhaps; not all rich people live happy lives.
by The New Sea Territory » Sun Aug 28, 2016 12:54 pm
Arkolon wrote:The New Sea Territory wrote:
Your definition of "moral system" is meaninglessly vague, because it encompasses even the most basic and individual tastes. My desire, and following my desire, does not equate to a claim that my desire "ought" to be followed.
Well, let me rephrase: in your opinion, should you, personally, do what is in your self-interest?
| Ⓐ ☭ | Anarchist Communist | Heideggerian Marxist | Vegetarian | Bisexual | Stirnerite | Slavic/Germanic Pagan | ᚨ ᛟ |
Solntsa Roshcha --- Postmodern Poyltheist
"Christianity had brutally planted the poisoned blade in the healthy, quivering flesh of all humanity; it had goaded a cold wave
of darkness with mystically brutal fury to dim the serene and festive exultation of the dionysian spirit of our pagan ancestors."
-Renzo Novatore, Verso il Nulla Creatore
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