[Accepted]Only @@LEADER@@ Could Go To Dàguó

[Drasnia]

Name: Only @@LEADER@@ Could Go To Dàguó

Description: The Holy Emperor of the highly isolationist and xenophobic nation Dàguó has invited you to his palace for a state dinner in an attempt to warm decades of frosty relations between your two nations. Your closest advisors remain concerned about this meeting – half of them believe it poses a security risk while others believe that you should make the effort to improve relations.

Validity: All

The Debate

[option]"IT’S A TRAP!" shouts your military advisor, Admiral @@RANDOMNAME@@. "Isn’t it obvious? They’re only inviting you over there so they can KILL you! They’ll either poison you or kill you in your sleep. Trust me, you can’t trust these Dàguóite animals. They will kill you the moment you let your guard down. You are better off ignoring their request and staying right here."
[effect]@@NAME@@’s government refuses to meet with foreign dignitaries
[stats]intentionally left blank


[option]"I agree that we shouldn’t go over there," replies @@RANDOMNAME@@, a random diplomat who seemingly appeared out of nowhere. "However, that doesn’t mean we become an isolationist state that refuses to meet with world leaders. Why not invite this 'Holy Emperor' of theirs over here and treat him to a state dinner? There’s much to discuss like that missile crisis in Blackacre or the increasing amount of refugees from the Maxtopian civil war."
[effect]foreign leaders are invited to lavish state dinners in @@CAPITAL@@
[stats]intentionally left blank

[option]"Dàguó's leaders have historically denounced our great nation for grievances that never, err, officially, happened." political science professor @@RANDOMNAME@@ says between college lectures. "Meeting with the Dàguóite Emperor is a perfect way to counter all of those baseless accusations of racism and assassination. Accept the invite, respect their customs regardless of how strange they might seem, and act like a real national leader for once! Go out there and start advocating for world peace. Diplomacy will do more good than isolationism or imperialist policy ever will."
[effect]@@LEADER@@ has embarked on a diplomatic tour of @@REGION@@ in an effort to boost foreign relations
[stats]intentionally left blank

[effect]"What if we worked visiting Dàguó to our advantage?" suggests incredibly suave secret agent James Bont while shooting a Tasmanian sniper down the hall. As your security rushes to seal your office, he continues. "Go over there and do what you would normally do on this kind of diplomatic event. Meanwhile, posing as a Marche Noiran master chef so I can poison the Emperor’s meal. Once he drops dead, his security is going to suspect foul play, but I'll be there to extract you back to @@NAME@@. It’ll all be hush-hush and there’s a chance it might end up causing a war, but it if means destabilizing things in an enemy country to get them off our backs, that’s a risk we should be prepared to take."
[effect]Dàguó has descended into anarchy following the suspicious death of its beloved Emperor
[stats]intentionally left blank

Name: Only @@LEADER@@ Could Go To Marche Noir

Description: In an effort to warm frosty relations, the Holy Emperor of Marche Noir – Maximus Barrius – has personally invited you to a state dinner in his grand palace. Your closest advisors remain concerned about this meeting – half of them believe it poses a security risk while others believe that you should make the effort to improve relations with Marche Noir.

Validity: All

The Debate

[option]"IT’S A TRAP!" shouts your military advisor, Admiral @@RANDOMNAME@@. "Isn’t it obvious? They’re only inviting you over there so they can KILL you! They’ll either poison you or kill you in your sleep. Trust me, you can’t trust these Marche Norian @@ANIMAL@@s. They will kill you the moment you let your guard down. You are better off ignoring their request and staying right here."
[effect]@@NAME@@’s government refuses to meet with foreign dignitaries
[stats]intentionally left blank


[option]"I agree that we shouldn’t go over there," replies @@RANDOMNAME@@, a random diplomat who seemingly appeared out of nowhere. "However, that doesn’t mean we become an isolationist state that refuses to meet with world leaders. Why not invite this Maximus Barrius over to here and treat him to a state dinner? There’s much to discuss like that missile crisis in that island in Southern @@REGION@@ or the increasing amount of refugees from the Maxtopian civil war."
[effect]foreign leaders are invited to lavish state dinners in @@CAPITAL@@
[stats]intentionally left blank

[option]"Marche Noir's leaders have historically denounced our great nation for grievances that never, err, officially, happened." political science professor @@RANDOMNAME@@ says between college lectures. "Meeting with the Marche Norian Emperor is a perfect way to counter all of those baseless accusations of racism and assassination. Accept the invite, respect their customs regardless of how strange they might seem, and act like a real national leader for once! Go out there and start advocating for world peace. Diplomacy will do more good than isolationism or imperialist policy ever will."
[effect]@@LEADER@@ has embarked on a diplomatic tour of @@REGION@@ in an effort to boost foreign relations
[stats]intentionally left blank

[effect]"What if we worked visiting Marche Noir to our advantage?" suggests incredibly suave secret agent James Bont as he is able to shoot a Maxtopian sniper down the hall. As your security rushes to seal your office, he continues. "Go over there with a full security detachment. I will also go, posing as a Marche Noiran chef so I can poison the Emperor’s meal. Once he drops dead, his security is going to suspect foul play, but I'll be there to extract you back to @@NAME@@. It’ll all be hush-hush and there’s a chance you might get shot in the chaos, but it if means destabilizing things in an enemy country to get them off our backs, that’s a risk we should be prepared to take."
[effect]Marche Noir has descended into anarchy following the suspicious death of its beloved Emperor
[stats]intentionally left blank

[Trotterdam]

The problem is metagaming - players know that @@LEADER@@ can't really die, so there's no real danger in accepting the invitation. There should be some other complication in just making peace and living happily ever after.

Description: In an effort to warm frosty relations, the Holy Emperor of Marche Noir – Maximus Barrius – has personally invited you to a state dinner in his grand palace.

Marche Noir might be a democracy, and if it's not, their leader is probably King Zog.

Max Barry references should probably be confined to the player nation and Maxtopia.

Not sure which nation is best to use instead. Lilliput(ia?) and Tasmania are more known for terrorism than a stable and proud (if megalomaniacal) government, East Lebatuck and Blackacre are more Soviet-ish than imperialist. Maxtopia may in fact be a viable candidate (having a highly corrupt government but also exports that make it worth befriending them), though it's highly unstable.

"Trust me, you can’t trust these Marche Norian @@ANIMAL@@s."

What? But my national animal is the pride of my nation! Comparison to them is a compliment!

[option]"I agree that we shouldn’t go over there," replies @@RANDOMNAME@@, a random diplomat who seemingly appeared out of nowhere. "However, that doesn’t mean we become an isolationist state that refuses to meet with world leaders. Why not invite this Maximus Barrius over to here and treat him to a state dinner? There’s much to discuss like that missile crisis in that island in Southern @@REGION@@ or the increasing amount of refugees from the Maxtopian civil war."
[effect]foreign leaders are invited to lavish state dinners in @@CAPITAL@@

Oh, you mentioned Maxtopia already.

Blackacre is the nation most likely to get involved in a missile crisis.

More importantly, though, this option needs a clearer downside. "No, we won't accept your invitation, you should come to US!" is kind of rude, and would make them fairly justified suspecting you of assassination, reversing the original premise. This option needs to create clear diplomatic tensions.

[effect]"What if we worked visiting Marche Noir to our advantage?" suggests incredibly suave secret agent James Bont as he is able to shoot a Maxtopian sniper down the hall.

Grammar first: "as he is able to shoot" -> "while shooting".

Make the sniper Tasmanian. They're blamed for assassinating your predecessor, so they have real teeth, and they don't get used much. Blackacre is also an option, they're the main Cold War Enemy nation, but they're more serious nemeses scheming for the long haul, not sending crude and easily-stopped assassins like a random encounter in a video game.

"Go over there with a full security detachment. I will also go, posing as a Marche Noiran chef so I can poison the Emperor’s meal. Once he drops dead, his security is going to suspect foul play, but I'll be there to extract you back to @@NAME@@.

Why the security detachment if the real plan hinges on a secret agent?

Though there should be an option for going in with enough bodyguards to constitute a small army.

[Australian rePublic]

I like it

[Annihilators of Chan Island]

Love the issue.

Trotterdam's covered most of what I was going to say, but I would add that there should be an option where you send a body double over instead. Historically several leaders have done that for the high-risk or the low-interest meetings (Looking into it, there appears to be a pretty history of them around Joseph Stalin- at least 2 doubles confirmed).

[Drasnia]

Thanks for the feedback, Trott. Marche Noir isn't the best country for this. I just love the name, though

Love the issue.

Trotterdam's covered most of what I was going to say, but I would add that there should be an option where you send a body double over instead. Historically several leaders have done that for the high-risk or the low-interest meetings (Looking into it, there appears to be a pretty history of them around Joseph Stalin- at least 2 doubles confirmed).

The problem with that is that it would become too large of an issue, IMO. It's not a bad idea, however.

[Candlewhisper Archive]

Nice issue, you should definitely address all of Trott's points though. Love the Star Wars reference.

As to which nation, if there's no good fit you could always come up with something new.

I agree that you should keep it at 4 options.

Can you explain the title to me? I'm not getting the reference.

[Bears Armed]

Can you explain the title to me? I'm not getting the reference.

"Only Nixon could go to China."

[Candlewhisper Archive]

Cool, learn something every day. Never heard that phrase till now, though I don't know if that's me or the transatlantic gap.

No problem with it, now I know where it's from.

[Almonaster Nuevo]

How about varying option 3 depending on civil rights...
- Restrict the one you have to low CR (30-?).
- For high CR nations (70+?) have a concern that visiting would condone the Emperor's atrocities.
In-between, neither would apply.

[Nation of Quebec]

Perhaps instead of Marche Noir (which I've always seen as a modern day Roman Empire), East Lebatuk or Blackacre could work? East Lebatuk has been referred to as a communist country, though I don't think we've covered what form of government Blackacre has.

Can you explain the title to me? I'm not getting the reference.

"Only Nixon could go to China."

Interestingly enough, I first heard of the phrase in Star Trek VI where Spock called it a "Vulcan proverb".

[Trotterdam]

Perhaps instead of Marche Noir (which I've always seen as a modern day Roman Empire),

Maybe more like the old Roman Kingdom, which did get overthrown and replaced by the Roman Republic

East Lebatuk or Blackacre could work? East Lebatuk has been referred to as a communist country, though I don't think we've covered what form of government Blackacre has.

Probably deliberate, because Blackacre is supposed to be the "enemy nation", regardless of what your own politics are like. Blackacre evokes the Soviet Union (and related spy drama), but is not explicitly communist (because the player nation may well be communist too) - it resembles the Soviet Union more in methods than goals. It's just some nation you've always had tensions with for some reason or another.

East Lebatuck strikes me as more like one of those smaller "backwater communists" countries that isn't very active on the international scene.

NationStates has many "bad nations", but I always saw them as more like faux-democratic corrupt dictatorships, not proud empires.

[Drasnia]

Edited. I tried addressing most of the concerns. I decided to make a new NPC nation based off of China/Japan called Fengjing. Should I continue with the new nation or should I attribute it to an already established one? And if the former, do you like the name or can you think of a better one?

[Candlewhisper Archive]

A China-analogue sounds fun, though Fengjing is a real place in China.

Also, lets never ever do the lumping together of China and Japan. Its an oft repeated sin in western media to lump them together, much as the west often views "Africa" as a single entity. China and Japan are far more distinct from each other than say, the UK and America, so the two should never be dumped into a single category.

Zhongxia could work, as a smushed together fictional version of Zhonggui, Zhonghua and Huaxia, all of which are names for China. However, proper history buffs might not like that as Zhongxia was also the name of a significant early Chinese communist.

Likewise, we need to be wary of making a clear China analogue into somewhere "isolationist and xenophobic", and even associating it with Imperialism.

So maybe not so good anyway.

Hmm.

How about Dàguó.

That sounds vaguely oriental, and would basically mean "Big Kingdom", which would be a nice mirror to Maxtopia.

[Australian rePublic]

Can I make a suggestion? Feyongyang
Pyongyang, North Korea

[Drasnia]

A China-analogue sounds fun, though Fengjing is a real place in China.

Also, lets never ever do the lumping together of China and Japan. Its an oft repeated sin in western media to lump them together, much as the west often views "Africa" as a single entity. China and Japan are far more distinct from each other than say, the UK and America, so the two should never be dumped into a single category.

Zhongxia could work, as a smushed together fictional version of Zhonggui, Zhonghua and Huaxia, all of which are names for China. However, proper history buffs might not like that as Zhongxia was also the name of a significant early Chinese communist.

Likewise, we need to be wary of making a clear China analogue into somewhere "isolationist and xenophobic", and even associating it with Imperialism.

So maybe not so good anyway.

Hmm.

How about Dàguó.

That sounds vaguely oriental, and would basically mean "Big Kingdom", which would be a nice mirror to Maxtopia.

Huh, I searched it on Google and it tried to correct it to Fingjing. (searching again on a different device shows that you are indeed correct.) I had several other possibilities, but Daguo sound quite good.

[Drasnia]

I replaced all instances of Fengjing with Dàguó. Aside from the potential problems the accents may cause on certain browsers (perhaps it should be changed to Daguo), any other comments or is this ready for submission?

[Annihilators of Chan Island]

I replaced all instances of Fengjing with Dàguó. Aside from the potential problems the accents may cause on certain browsers (perhaps it should be changed to Daguo), any other comments or is this ready for submission?

It's looking pretty good. I still think it ought to have the option of sending over a body double or just a trusted representative instead, but other than that its pretty much good to go.

[Drasnia]

Final bump before submission.

[Katalaysia]

Quick pointer, in the last option the wording of "posing as a Marche Noiran master chef so I can poison the Emperor’s meal" is clunky. I think it'd be better to put "posing as a Marche Noiran master chef, I can use my wiles to slip into the kitchen so I can poison the Emperor's meal".

[Drasnia]

Quick pointer, in the last option the wording of "posing as a Marche Noiran master chef so I can poison the Emperor’s meal" is clunky. I think it'd be better to put "posing as a Marche Noiran master chef, I can use my wiles to slip into the kitchen so I can poison the Emperor's meal".

Except that doesn't sound grammatical to me. *Shrugs* Bump for submitted.

[Australian rePublic]

Good luck!

[Drasnia]

Seconds ago: Following new legislation in Drasnia, recent events in Dàguó have been classified 'for King Rhodar's eyes only'.

[Zwangzug]

Congrats! I got this today but didn't realize it was new; I think the fourth option is included (hidden validity)? I'll post it to the spoilers thread if I see it again.

[Australian rePublic]

Congragulations!