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by Ardoki » Sat Apr 18, 2015 4:23 pm
by Vedria » Sat Apr 18, 2015 4:38 pm
by The High Lords » Sat Apr 18, 2015 4:57 pm
by Alosteq Diin Nastja » Sat Apr 18, 2015 4:59 pm
The High Lords wrote:I'm reconsidering my membership if the United Left is not willing to accept nations that are trying to join the struggle for the proletariat.
by Ardoki » Sat Apr 18, 2015 4:59 pm
Ardoki wrote:Alosteq Diin Nastja wrote:I am one of the most senior members in the alliance, having been a member much longer than you (Only saying this because seniority is clearly important to you). And since the UL is reforming to phase out dictatorial members and the like, I am violating none.
Does that mean Marxist-Lenninist states would be prohibited from being in this alliance? They are leftist economically and socially, however they are single-party states and sometimes autocracies.
by Vedria » Sat Apr 18, 2015 4:59 pm
by The High Lords » Sat Apr 18, 2015 5:03 pm
by Alosteq Diin Nastja » Sat Apr 18, 2015 5:04 pm
by The High Lords » Sat Apr 18, 2015 5:05 pm
Alosteq Diin Nastja wrote:The High Lords wrote:
Yes.
As far as I know this is an ECONOMICALLY-ALIGNED alliance, not anything else. Refer to previous iterations of the UL thread for more evidence of economic alignment.
Emphasis with CAPS - not yelling
We're reforming as to make this a freer alliance. There is no need for dictatorship in the modern world.
by The UL Administrator » Sat Apr 18, 2015 5:08 pm
Ran by:
New Jordslag, United Remnants of America, and Vedria. Glory to the workers, the soldiers, and to Democracy.
by Ardoki » Sat Apr 18, 2015 5:11 pm
Alosteq Diin Nastja wrote:The High Lords wrote:
Yes.
As far as I know this is an ECONOMICALLY-ALIGNED alliance, not anything else. Refer to previous iterations of the UL thread for more evidence of economic alignment.
Emphasis with CAPS - not yelling
We're reforming as to make this a freer alliance. There is no need for dictatorship in the modern world.
by Alosteq Diin Nastja » Sat Apr 18, 2015 5:13 pm
Ardoki wrote:Alosteq Diin Nastja wrote:We're reforming as to make this a freer alliance. There is no need for dictatorship in the modern world.
There kind of is.
I live in a democracy, and the crimes against humanity which occur just because a large proportion of the population is racist is absolutely horrible (we lock up refugees in concentration camps). In Australia for example, the majority of people who vote for the Liberal Party would be better off voting for the Labour Party, they literally vote against their own interests. The same thing occurs with the Republican Party in America.
The people need to be guided, they majority can't be trusted to vote correctly.
by The High Lords » Sat Apr 18, 2015 5:15 pm
Alosteq Diin Nastja wrote:Ardoki wrote:There kind of is.
I live in a democracy, and the crimes against humanity which occur just because a large proportion of the population is racist is absolutely horrible (we lock up refugees in concentration camps). In Australia for example, the majority of people who vote for the Liberal Party would be better off voting for the Labour Party, they literally vote against their own interests. The same thing occurs with the Republican Party in America.
The people need to be guided, they majority can't be trusted to vote correctly.
But when the people are informed, democracy can be wonderous.
by Alosteq Diin Nastja » Sat Apr 18, 2015 5:17 pm
by Ardoki » Sat Apr 18, 2015 5:21 pm
Alosteq Diin Nastja wrote:Ardoki wrote:There kind of is.
I live in a democracy, and the crimes against humanity which occur just because a large proportion of the population is racist is absolutely horrible (we lock up refugees in concentration camps). In Australia for example, the majority of people who vote for the Liberal Party would be better off voting for the Labour Party, they literally vote against their own interests. The same thing occurs with the Republican Party in America.
The people need to be guided, they majority can't be trusted to vote correctly.
But when the people are informed, democracy can be wonderous.
by Alosteq Diin Nastja » Sat Apr 18, 2015 5:23 pm
Ardoki wrote:Alosteq Diin Nastja wrote:But when the people are informed, democracy can be wonderous.
The thing is, humans are not perfect. They can be manipulated, with fear, hatred, etc. It isn't just politicians, but the media which manipulate the voters.
Look at the rise of the far-right in Europe today. They are becoming ever more powerful while the left is weakening, racism and xenophobia are on the rise. It's like 1933 all over again.
Democracy may be a good idea, but it is corruptible and requires each voter to vote rationally in order to work, something which never happens due to the complexities of the human brain.
Obviously don't support the people having no influence over the government. However there are people who would be more suited to rule a country than the masses. Democracy implies that an ordinary citizen knows more about economics than an economist, an ordinary citizen knows more about healthcare than someone in the industry.
Democracy allows the ordinary citizens to decide the policy of the government, why would we let those who are unqualified decide government policy. Not only do they butcher the government, the majority often supports the oppression of minorities (ethnic minorities, religious minorities, the poor, etc).
by The High Lords » Sat Apr 18, 2015 5:24 pm
by Ardoki » Sat Apr 18, 2015 5:25 pm
Alosteq Diin Nastja wrote:Ardoki wrote:The thing is, humans are not perfect. They can be manipulated, with fear, hatred, etc. It isn't just politicians, but the media which manipulate the voters.
Look at the rise of the far-right in Europe today. They are becoming ever more powerful while the left is weakening, racism and xenophobia are on the rise. It's like 1933 all over again.
Democracy may be a good idea, but it is corruptible and requires each voter to vote rationally in order to work, something which never happens due to the complexities of the human brain.
Obviously don't support the people having no influence over the government. However there are people who would be more suited to rule a country than the masses. Democracy implies that an ordinary citizen knows more about economics than an economist, an ordinary citizen knows more about healthcare than someone in the industry.
Democracy allows the ordinary citizens to decide the policy of the government, why would we let those who are unqualified decide government policy. Not only do they butcher the government, the majority often supports the oppression of minorities (ethnic minorities, religious minorities, the poor, etc).
And 1933 gave way to fascist dictatorships that led to inevitable collapse. The USSR was already failing to provide for the people and it was a dictatorship. Dictatorships don't exactly have the best track record for success.
by Ardoki » Sat Apr 18, 2015 5:27 pm
by Jenrak » Sat Apr 18, 2015 8:26 pm
Cyllea wrote:Redacted. Not gonna stay in a dying alliance governed by self-righteous 10 year olds anyway. Goodbye.
by Victoriala » Sat Apr 18, 2015 8:36 pm
Jenrak wrote:Cyllea wrote:Redacted. Not gonna stay in a dying alliance governed by self-righteous 10 year olds anyway. Goodbye.
I understand your frustration, but it is always best to leave politely, professionally, and kindly, even if you feel slighted. Regardless, I must give you a *** warning for flaming ***. Please cool down, make some tea, and I hope you find something more suited to your tastes!
FACTBOOK | LA SOCIÉTÉ | NATIONS | ILLUMINATOR | +
Fucking little island person. 陰 and 陽 but mostly 陰. I draw and do designs.
My NS activity is 90% shitposts. Singy and I fuck each other occasionally.
Equity is True Equality. Pro-Aufklärung, Anti-Gegenaufklärung. [economic: -4.0 social: -4.21]
by Ardoki » Sat Apr 18, 2015 10:06 pm
Ardoki wrote:Alosteq Diin Nastja wrote:I am one of the most senior members in the alliance, having been a member much longer than you (Only saying this because seniority is clearly important to you). And since the UL is reforming to phase out dictatorial members and the like, I am violating none.
Does that mean Marxist-Lenninist states would be prohibited from being in this alliance? They are leftist economically and socially, however they are single-party states and sometimes autocracies.
by Democratic Chuguria » Sat Apr 18, 2015 10:54 pm
Victoriala wrote:Jenrak wrote:
I understand your frustration, but it is always best to leave politely, professionally, and kindly, even if you feel slighted. Regardless, I must give you a *** warning for flaming ***. Please cool down, make some tea, and I hope you find something more suited to your tastes!
You can feel the polite and niceness from this guy
Jenrak is like my spirit animal
by New Chilokver » Sun Apr 19, 2015 12:04 am
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