Flamebaiting?

[Lithosano]

Solarys seems rather intent of flamebaiting trans* people.

It is the same. Both are highly offensive terms with a historical usage as slurs.

It's not even close to accurate. A transwoman is female. Refer to her as such.

1) No, both are different.
2) Depends on the context.
3) A transwoman is not a female, but a male to female and hence the he-she.

How exactly are they different?

A transwoman is a female. "He-she" is a highly inappropriate and offensive term.

a transwoman is a male turned female. He-she is a highly appropriate and accurate term.

1. You weren't being accurate.

2. I know the definition of vague. The article itself is not vague. It's merely asserting how dubious current hypothesis regarding the origins of transgender people are.

1) A he to she, he-she. Accuracy. see ?

2) http://bit.ly/zpm6Bh

It is vague allright. Feel free to try and argue though.

He seems intent on using "he-she," a highly offensive slur (as has been pointed out to him.) Spoiler'd for brevity.

Sousei is a trans woman, so it's rather arrogant of you to assume you know more about her than she does.

When did i ever say i know anything about her ? If you are not a female by birth, don't expect me to consider you on the same level as those who are. The same for fem-males too.

He-she is also a derogatory slur.

Depends on who you ask.

He-she is for someone who's transgender like nigger or darky is for someone who's black. You just don't go there, and that's that.

Female, male or he, she etc are for those who are actually that, not those who think they are that. I am not going to degrade them with including transgenders in the same category.

Apparently trans women are lesser than "real" women, and I'm fairly sure "fem-males" is also a slur.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Causes_of_ ... _structure

*shrug*

And the conclusion is ? (the article was a bit confusing and vague at best)

I'm almost afraid to ask. What is technically true?

They are both in a sense.

if most/all of the people you actually use it to refer to consider it a slur and tell you not to use it, is it a slur?

(yes)

If they are suffering from somekind of mental disorder, then i would hardly take it seriously.

(I know i am getting a bit offensive here, tell me when i cross the line and if i have already, don't bother)

How about you call her "she?"

That is for actual females

Trans* people are not "both." Trans* women are actual females. It should be considered a slur, because it is.

Did you seriously just call a transwoman "he-she?" That is a very big no-no.

but he-she, she-he, sound like a great asian name.

And some good old fashioned racism.

I just realized I misspelled "flamebaiting" in the title. Huh.

[Lithosano]

Now Christian Democrats wants in on the action.

Because not every biological male is alike?
Because not every biological male is always stronger than a woman?

An MTF is a biological male in every sense. If he-she wants to play sports, play sports with other physical males. Sports are physical.

This is the post that started the entire "he-she" tangent, but I'm including it because it's germane.

Not regarding this. "he/she" denotes that either could be the case, and is used when the writer honestly doesn't know and doesn't wish to offend the party in question. "he-she" denotes that the party in question is both or otherwise a combination of the two.

That is the case. A person who is a physical male (he) with a female gender identity (she).

Do you want me to use "xe" and "xem" (or "xer")?

Included for the offensive insistence that a trans* person is both genders.

[Christian Democrats]

I used "he-she" in an impersonal context to refer to a hypothetical male-to-female (he-to-she) trying to play girls' sports.

I did not think he or she would be appropriate, especially since many transgender people are genderqueer.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-binary_gender

Someone who is neither he nor she = he-she. I did not mean to offend anyone and said that I would try to use alternative terms.

[Solarys]

So if someone addresses me by a masculine term and i say that even though i am man i am offended by it, it is an offense now ?

Also racism ? Hishi when you say it out loud sounds like an asian name like something out of an old kung fu movie.

So what anyone is allowed to accuse anyone else of anything that they find offensive even it is not ?

[Liriena]

http://forum.nationstates.net/viewtopic.php?f=20&t=257036&p=16078441#p16078441

There's another user on the same thread that I wish to report.

How would you feel if you had a daughter who dealt with harassment, bullying, and threats every day, indeed, who would very likely be subjected to the possibility of great physical harm, if she were forced to be in the boy's locker room because she was trans* and the sex she was assigned at birth did not match her identity?

Actually, I suppose since you are a transphobe (all people who misgender trans* people intentionally are transphobes, so the label is valid and not flamebaiting), if you had a trans* kid, you would probably misgender them too and neglect them and by your callousness contribute to the fact that transwomen are substantially at risk to be homeless, raped, or murdered more so than almost any minority group. So on the off chance that your hypothetical children are not cisgender, please don't ever have any. Indeed, please don't even have cisgender children because you will only raise them to continue in your bigotry.

The hate speech you circulate, just like the hate speech promoted by the OP, has tangible consequences - you contribute to bloodshed as your words continue to foster a society where violence against trans* people and complete disregard for their well being is the norm. Shame on you and shame on anyone who would dare to gripe at this most meager and basic step forward for human decency.

Big words from a small mind. I'll be blunt and skip any fancy arguments. Gender is determined by what genitalia a person is born with. As a male who is not endowed with the powers of shape-shifting, the simple truth of the matter is that I will always be male, regardless of any past, present or future beliefs I ever have about my gender. Gender is determined by biology, not psychology, something which I hope your children will learn in school so that they don't spew this nonsense about one's inner gender. Also, if common sense is now labeled as bigotry, then I would never let go of it and I shall delight in teaching it to any future children I have.

[The Blaatschapen]

I've handled the Solarys and Greater Ilanar reports.

I'm flagging the Christian Democrats report for review by another mod, since I'm off to bed.

[Kryozerkia]

Now Christian Democrats wants in on the action.

An MTF is a biological male in every sense. If he-she wants to play sports, play sports with other physical males. Sports are physical.

This is the post that started the entire "he-she" tangent, but I'm including it because it's germane.

That is the case. A person who is a physical male (he) with a female gender identity (she).

Do you want me to use "xe" and "xem" (or "xer")?

Included for the offensive insistence that a trans* person is both genders.

Neither are in violation of the rules. The latter appears to be a genuine question. It's a sensitive topic, however, this is a political correctness issue. Christian Democrats did not intend to offend.

[Solarys]

Umm.. i did not call being transgender perverted, more like using it as a justification for perverted activities in that post. Sorry if it came across as that.

Also while this might be a bit off topic, is using the F* word, b*t*h etc ok here. Just wanted to make sure since there have been posts containing those. I tend to self censor any major slur or something if i even find myself using it for whatever reason, but yeah, just asking.

[Lithosano]

Now Christian Democrats wants in on the action.



This is the post that started the entire "he-she" tangent, but I'm including it because it's germane.



Included for the offensive insistence that a trans* person is both genders.

Neither are in violation of the rules. The latter appears to be a genuine question. It's a sensitive topic, however, this is a political correctness issue. Christian Democrats did not intend to offend.

Fair enough. My thanks.

[Reploid Productions]

Also while this might be a bit off topic, is using the F* word, b*t*h etc ok here. Just wanted to make sure since there have been posts containing those. I tend to self censor any major slur or something if i even find myself using it for whatever reason, but yeah, just asking.

Fucking hell, bitch ass cunts get to say shit all the time around here!

More seriously, we do permit use of 'bad language' in discussion, though with the caveat that doing so in excess can land a person in hot water. We don't ban words, even slurs- what counts is how words are used. (Granted, a lot of slurs are very difficult to use in a way that ISN'T rulebreaking.) Bad language is usually an intensifier- compare calling something stupid to calling it 'fucking stupid.' Using bad language to intensify something that's already rulebreaking is going to be frowned on- compare the hypothetical "X is an idiot" (a fairly mild flame) to "X is a fucking idiot" (much less mild flame.)

In short, bad language is okay, but use it sparingly for best results. And not in customizable nation fields like motto, flag, currency, etc.

[Solarys]

Also while this might be a bit off topic, is using the F* word, b*t*h etc ok here. Just wanted to make sure since there have been posts containing those. I tend to self censor any major slur or something if i even find myself using it for whatever reason, but yeah, just asking.

Fucking hell, bitch ass cunts get to say shit all the time around here!

More seriously, we do permit use of 'bad language' in discussion, though with the caveat that doing so in excess can land a person in hot water. We don't ban words, even slurs- what counts is how words are used. (Granted, a lot of slurs are very difficult to use in a way that ISN'T rulebreaking.) Bad language is usually an intensifier- compare calling something stupid to calling it 'fucking stupid.' Using bad language to intensify something that's already rulebreaking is going to be frowned on- compare the hypothetical "X is an idiot" (a fairly mild flame) to "X is a fucking idiot" (much less mild flame.)

In short, bad language is okay, but use it sparingly for best results. And not in customizable nation fields like motto, flag, currency, etc.

KK, understood