Do women have the right to expose their chests?

[Deuxtete]

Most Americans? You know this how? Your age is showing.
Oh shit "science things" like electricity, that kind of "science thing", or you know the tens of millions of people who use ..."science things" in their jobs.
Like concrete workers, brick masons, electricians, plumbers, everyone in medical professions, argriculture, culinary professionals, fucking hell the world must be such a bizarre fucking mystery through your eyes.

Or maybe bro you just focus on your pecks bro...do you even lift?
But stop, I already know you don't, body builders are really good with that science thing called "anatomy".

Fucking priceless.


What passage did I memorize?
Scientifically organized...are you picking words randomly?

Sorry, my passions are focused towards economics and business. And if you want to presume your superior intellect and belittle me by assuming I can't form sentences because I'm typing on a phone an auto correct is a thing then that's on you. Being a fucking pick and assuming that I should treat writing on a forum akin to typing up a 15 page research paper is equally ridiculous. I don't pay attention much to the science behind things and I imagine most people not in scientificly related fields do either. That seems like a reasonable assumption to me.

Sounds like you're making up for your insecurities though with that intellectual superiority complex you got there. I bet you can't speak a word of it though on a stage with more than 2 people looking at you.

Only trophy I ever received was for a political speech written on the need for higher education standards. I gave that speech before 1000 people(Voice of America competition), none of them students. I was 15.

Your passions are business and economics...you can't pass a highschool anatomy class you aren't passionate about anything involving learning. So please, don't try to suggest otherwise.

[Arcturus Novus]

If feminists have the right to go to topless, then they should stop complaining about man-spreading and all of the other usually irrelevant "issues" women face, such as their views on men holding the door, which is apparently now sexist.

I fail to see this person's reasoning honestly.

[Lordieth]

Everyday life? Well, obviously not. I don't take my shirt off at work, or when I go shopping. Why should Women be able to behave any differently? In the same manner, however, where it is acceptable for men to take off their shirts, women should also be able to go topless.

I can agree with this. It is hypocritical to do otherwise, the law should apply to everyone equally even if it hurts.

Where I come from though it is considered inappropriate for men to go shirtless practically anywhere outside ones home, so this doesn't really apply in my area atleast. Male Toplessness is considered tasteless at best and completely inappropriate and lewd at worst, especially when children are present.

This is what happens when the human body becomes taboo and over-sexualised. It's just flesh.

[New Ogunquit]

Can we please all keep our damn clothes on? I mean, we've invented those for a reason, you know.

I agree with this. I don't particularly want to see anyone naked when I want to go out in public. Also, if women were given this right, whose to say a ton of them would suddenly begin to exercise it? I feel like legalizing it wouldn't do much, you'd actually have to encourage women to go topless for anything to actually change. But idk.

[Doperland]

I can agree with this. It is hypocritical to do otherwise, the law should apply to everyone equally even if it hurts.

Where I come from though it is considered inappropriate for men to go shirtless practically anywhere outside ones home, so this doesn't really apply in my area atleast. Male Toplessness is considered tasteless at best and completely inappropriate and lewd at worst, especially when children are present.

This is what happens when the human body becomes taboo and over-sexualised. It's just flesh.

"It's just skin, Steven"

[The Serbian Empire]

If feminists have the right to go to topless, then they should stop complaining about man-spreading and all of the other usually irrelevant "issues" women face, such as their views on men holding the door, which is apparently now sexist.

The man spreading is nothing when compared to purses... Yet MRAs aren't going around complaining of purses.

[Nilla Wayfarers]

I don't pay attention much to the science behind things

Then how the hell do you support any of your arguments?

[Lordieth]

Can we please all keep our damn clothes on? I mean, we've invented those for a reason, you know.

I agree with this. I don't particularly want to see anyone naked when I want to go out in public. Also, if women were given this right, whose to say a ton of them would suddenly begin to exercise it? I feel like legalizing it wouldn't do much, you'd actually have to encourage women to go topless for anything to actually change. But idk.

Nobody said anything about encouragement. Just giving women the same right to be topless where it is acceptable for men to be topless. Nothing more, nothing less. Infact, Women should actually have more of a right, out of the necessity to breast-feed.

[The Black Forrest]

Sorry, my passions are focused towards economics and business. And if you want to presume your superior intellect and belittle me by assuming I can't form sentences because I'm typing on a phone an auto correct is a thing then that's on you. Being a fucking pick and assuming that I should treat writing on a forum akin to typing up a 15 page research paper is equally ridiculous. I don't pay attention much to the science behind things and I imagine most people not in scientificly related fields do either. That seems like a reasonable assumption to me.

Sounds like you're making up for your insecurities though with that intellectual superiority complex you got there. I bet you can't speak a word of it though on a stage with more than 2 people looking at you.

Only trophy I ever received was for a political speech written on the need for higher education standards. I gave that speech before 1000 people(Voice of America competition), none of them students. I was 15.

Your passions are business and economics...you can't pass a highschool anatomy class you aren't passionate about anything involving learning. So please, don't try to suggest otherwise.

You are funny.

[Alyakia]

i'm going to manspread all over this thread
when i mansplain i bring the pain

[Yorkvale]

Sorry, my passions are focused towards economics and business. And if you want to presume your superior intellect and belittle me by assuming I can't form sentences because I'm typing on a phone an auto correct is a thing then that's on you. Being a fucking pick and assuming that I should treat writing on a forum akin to typing up a 15 page research paper is equally ridiculous. I don't pay attention much to the science behind things and I imagine most people not in scientificly related fields do either. That seems like a reasonable assumption to me.

Sounds like you're making up for your insecurities though with that intellectual superiority complex you got there. I bet you can't speak a word of it though on a stage with more than 2 people looking at you.

Only trophy I ever received was for a political speech written on the need for higher education standards. I gave that speech before 1000 people(Voice of America competition), none of them students. I was 15.

Your passions are business and economics...you can't pass a highschool anatomy class you aren't passionate about anything involving learning. So please, don't try to suggest otherwise.

Congrats,especially if you manged to keep them awake.

However it is incredibly childish and arrogant to assume that if someone lacks basic knowledge in something incredibly dull and useless like anatomy, that they must have no passion or interest in learning anything. Some kids would rather dream about starting businesses than becoming professors or paying attention in science class.

[New Ogunquit]

I agree with this. I don't particularly want to see anyone naked when I want to go out in public. Also, if women were given this right, whose to say a ton of them would suddenly begin to exercise it? I feel like legalizing it wouldn't do much, you'd actually have to encourage women to go topless for anything to actually change. But idk.

Nobody said anything about encouragement.

I didn't say anyone did.

Just giving women the same right to be topless where it is acceptable for men to be topless. Nothing more, nothing less. Infact, Women should actually have more of a right, out of the necessity to breast-feed.

This I agree with.

[Yorkvale]

I don't pay attention much to the science behind things

Then how the hell do you support any of your arguments?

Through a social lens.

[Nilla Wayfarers]

Then how the hell do you support any of your arguments?

Through a social lens.

Elaborate.

[Deuxtete]

No I don't stand the same for public nudity. I have at least a remedial education, there is a difference between the breast(that's on both men and women, the word is unisex) and the anal and perianal areas and penis and vaginal opens ...these differences are increased issues with human hygiene and pathogen transfer. The breast being exposed doesn't create health issues, nudity does.


Read a fucking book.

I've read several, sorry if they're not associated with science textbooks.

The point made is that hygiene is very much reinforced as a social norm and that doesn't make it innately bad I'm the same way covering up your boobs which are very much a sexual object and used in sexual activities frequently is also a social norm but that does not make the expectation to do so innately bad.

Hygiene is a social norm that was imposed, because of disease.
Not societal pressure, but science, specifically medical science ...biology.
We don't wash our hands because its "polite" we do it not to spread disease.
Nudity, would promote the spread of pathogens we normally reduce the spread of because we cover specific parts of our anatomy.

The breast has no such concern. It's an issue based entirely in puritanical sexism.

I'm rather certain you havnt opened many textbooks at all, on any subject.

[Katyuscha]

There's no reason they shouldn't be allowed to

[New Ogunquit]

Being a fucking pick and assuming that I should treat writing on a forum akin to typing up a 15 page research paper is equally ridiculous.

LOL autocorrect. I see what you were trying to say there.

[Ostroeuropa]

I've read several, sorry if they're not associated with science textbooks.

The point made is that hygiene is very much reinforced as a social norm and that doesn't make it innately bad I'm the same way covering up your boobs which are very much a sexual object and used in sexual activities frequently is also a social norm but that does not make the expectation to do so innately bad.

Hygiene is a social norm that was imposed, because of disease.
Not societal pressure, but science, specifically medical science ...biology.
We don't wash our hands because its "polite" we do it not to spread disease.
Nudity, would promote the spread of pathogens we normally reduce the spread of because we cover specific parts of our anatomy.

The breast has no such concern. It's an issue based entirely in puritanical sexism.

I'm rather certain you havnt opened many textbooks at all, on any subject.

Dude, you're aware we used to believe that diseases were curses, or miasma or some shit, right? And we had clothing then too?

You can't claim clothing is a social norm because of protection from disease. That's a lie. It's a norm because we're prudes.

[Deuxtete]

Only trophy I ever received was for a political speech written on the need for higher education standards. I gave that speech before 1000 people(Voice of America competition)I none of them students. I was 15.

Your passions are business and economics...you can't pass a highschool anatomy class you aren't passionate about anything involving learning. So please, don't try to suggest otherwise.

You are funny.

VFW sponsored it.
State winner got a scholarship.
So for the sake of transperency I lost the state competition. So instead of college money I got a stupid fucking trophy, and dinner.

[Dyakovo]

GoTopLess and associated feminists seem to think so

http://gotopless.org/

GoTopLess is essentially a movement for "gender equality" that claims women should have the right to go topless just as men are.

What do you guys think about this movement?

The problem behind this imho are the boobies! And while they are not really genitalia they are however protected under the law as genitalia. If you forcefully grav a woman's arm it is assault, but if you grab their boobs it is sexual assault.

So If I were the one man supreme court, I'd probably strike it down. I however, Love BOOBIES So I don't mind the movement much hehe and maybe joining some topless protesters would be..interesting!

What say you NSG?

Radical feminist nonsense, reasonable demands based on gender equality, freedom of expression or sinful and disgusting?

Women should be allowed to go topless any where that men are.

[Deuxtete]

Hygiene is a social norm that was imposed, because of disease.
Not societal pressure, but science, specifically medical science ...biology.
We don't wash our hands because its "polite" we do it not to spread disease.
Nudity, would promote the spread of pathogens we normally reduce the spread of because we cover specific parts of our anatomy.

The breast has no such concern. It's an issue based entirely in puritanical sexism.

I'm rather certain you havnt opened many textbooks at all, on any subject.

Dude, you're aware we used to believe that diseases were curses, or miasma or some shit, right? And we had clothing then too?

You can't claim clothing is a social norm because of protection from disease. That's a lie. It's a norm because we're prudes.

Reread what I wrote.
I didn't claim clothing was a norm because of disease.
Fucking derderddrduhduuuh.
Also are you asking me what we used to believe diseased was caused by? It looks like it.
A better question is when we thought that.
We also used to believe bathing regularly was unhealthy...oh! Reread my fucking post to learn how the societal taboo of regular hygienic practices was beaten by scientific understanding.

Then after that....derderdumduuuh. I explained why I was anti full nudity, which boils down to I don't trust you to wipe your ass correctly if you can't fucking read.

[The Huskar Social Union]

Im sorry but getting a license to show the top part of your body is fucking stupid and so backward it hurts, sometimes social norms need to shredded like cabbage and changed, and the over-sexualisation of women's breasts (largely caused by Religion and conservative attitudes) and being all "hush hush not allowed to show because indecency" is one of them.

Just because its a social norm does not mean it has to stay that way for ever, social norms change constantly and they need to.

Er, it's more than the top part of their bodies and using your logic public nudity should be legal too no?

After all clothing is just another societal norm.

Society is all we know, and the vast majority of the law is suited to the demographic of the population. Boobs have sexual connotations according to the VAST majority of men AND women. It would make people uncomfortable and overly sexually charged in a public environment and so I'm against it. You don't have to be a ultra conservative wait till marriage christian to understand this.

Boobs were overly sexualized before christianity, so that's also a BS move to put on religion.

There is a major difference between exposing your breasts, and exposing your actual Genitalia such as Vagina or Penis. As the latter two can carry actual health risks that can be transmitted to other people and are actually sexual in origin and nature, a man or woman not wearing their shirt and exposing their breasts does not unless they have some kind of skin disease and breasts are not sexual in origin or nature, the primary basis of female breasts is for feeding and is an every day part of common human life, both publicly and privately. So no im not in favour of open public full on nudity for the most part because of actual genuine health concerns where as a topless woman does not, just as a topless man does not.

And as society is pushing forward, more and more people are more open minded about things, including women not wearing a top and showing their breasts as in demonstrated by tons of beaches and areas that allow it in many countries. Also the reason they carry sexual connotations is again because of religion/puritanical based reasoning and conservative attitudes of them being indecent which is quite frankly stupid.

Also i said Religion, not Christianity, as Religion existed long before the Christian faith did, And i said nothing about Marriage, read my post properly next time please.

I am pro-nudism being legal.
I think it is a matter of free expression.

Clothing is a form of expression, and I am a proponent of free expression, as such, I cannot justify forced expression of any kind. Nudism is similar to the right to be silent. (Except broader and not strictly a legal thing.) Nobody should be able to compel expression.

BUT!!!!

There is another issue at stake here.
Unless those feminists and such arguing that breasts should be allowed are also, in general, pro-nudism, then what they are arguing is that breasts are not of a sexual nature.

This is fine.

But are they then prepared to say that someone who gropes breasts without permission has not committed sexual assault?

Because that's the conclusion you have to reach if you accept their reasoning.

I very much fucking doubt they are fine with this. They are trying to have their cake and eat it too.

As far as i am concerned no it would not be, but if you lay your hands on someone with out their consent anywhere on their body in a hostile or semi hostile fashion or purposefully go out of your way to make someone uncomfortable by groping them then it is just full on assault if they want to bring it to the police or other authorities, which they have every right to do so.

[Yorkvale]

Through a social lens.

Elaborate.

I see boobs, I think sex time. Most men see boobs, they think sex time. If I see boobs not in the bedroom, I think wtf? As do most people. We have clothes for a reason, and men don't wear shirts at the beach because the male upper body does not imply sex time to women as the female upper body implies sex time for men. It's sexualy enticing and outlandish.

Since civilization began this for the most part has held true. While it isn't to be held true simply because it is a social norm isn't my argument. Rather, this norm is practical and harmless.

[Deuxtete]

Only trophy I ever received was for a political speech written on the need for higher education standards. I gave that speech before 1000 people(Voice of America competition), none of them students. I was 15.

Your passions are business and economics...you can't pass a highschool anatomy class you aren't passionate about anything involving learning. So please, don't try to suggest otherwise.

Congrats,especially if you manged to keep them awake.

However it is incredibly childish and arrogant to assume that if someone lacks basic knowledge in something incredibly dull and useless like anatomy, that they must have no passion or interest in learning anything. Some kids would rather dream about starting businesses than becoming professors or paying attention in science class.

It's fair.
You don't manage even a basic understanding of human anatomy, that for instance my 12 year old has. So its safe to say dreaming is your version of learning.

[The Huskar Social Union]

Elaborate.

I see boobs, I think sex time. Most men see boobs, they think sex time. If I see boobs not in the bedroom, I think wtf? As do most people. We have clothes for a reason, and men don't wear shirts at the beach because the male upper body does not imply sex time to women as the female upper body implies sex time for men. It's sexualy enticing and outlandish.

Since civilization began this for the most part has held true. While it isn't to be held true simply because it is a social norm isn't my argument. Rather, this norm is practical and harmless.

No its a combination of partial failure at education and immaturity, the primary purpose of human female breasts is for feeding the young, most people know this because its a very very very basic biological and scientific fact you learn in school.

If you are enticed by a womans breasts out on public display or feel its outlandish the issue is with you and not the breasts.

And also for the most of human civilization the primary connotation of breasts has again been FEEDING, as its how human babies are fed before bottles and other instruments found common use which is largely only over the last two centuries.