NATION

PASSWORD

57% Of Republicans Want Christianity As National Religion

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)

Advertisement

Remove ads

User avatar
Atlanticatia
Negotiator
 
Posts: 5970
Founded: Mar 01, 2014
Ex-Nation

Postby Atlanticatia » Wed Feb 25, 2015 4:27 pm

It's all about "muh constitutional rights" when one talks about gun control but not about the first amendment, I guess. We shouldn't tolerate the suggestion of a non-secular government, and we really need to do something to quash the religious right. They've had too much time on the soapbox and it's really getting old now.
Economic Left/Right: -5.75
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -5.95

Pros: social democracy, LGBT+ rights, pro-choice, free education and health care, environmentalism, Nordic model, secularism, welfare state, multiculturalism
Cons: social conservatism, neoliberalism, hate speech, racism, sexism, 'right-to-work' laws, religious fundamentalism
i'm a dual american-new zealander previously lived in the northeast US, now living in new zealand. university student.
Social Democrat and Progressive.
Hanna Nilsen, Leader of the SDP. Equality, Prosperity, and Opportunity: The Social Democratic Party

User avatar
Greed and Death
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 53383
Founded: Mar 20, 2008
Ex-Nation

Postby Greed and Death » Wed Feb 25, 2015 5:24 pm

The Black Forrest wrote:
greed and death wrote:With current politics as they are you are more likely to get a constitutionally amendment to make Xtianity a national religion than an amendment repealing the 2nd amendment.


It would make for an interesting time as that would go to the SCOTUS.

Not really much they could do an amendment changes the Constitution.
"Trying to solve the healthcare problem by mandating people buy insurance is like trying to solve the homeless problem by mandating people buy a house."(paraphrase from debate with Hilary Clinton)
Barack Obama

User avatar
SaintB
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 21792
Founded: Apr 18, 2007
Ex-Nation

Postby SaintB » Wed Feb 25, 2015 5:25 pm

My opinion on the matter of anyone wanting a national religion is as follows:

Too fucking bad.
Hi my name is SaintB and I am prone to sarcasm and hyperbole. Because of this I make no warranties, express or implied, concerning the accuracy, completeness, reliability or suitability of the above statement, of its constituent parts, or of any supporting data. These terms are subject to change without notice from myself.

Every day NationStates tells me I have one issue. I am pretty sure I've got more than that.

User avatar
Greater Nevadian Empire
Chargé d'Affaires
 
Posts: 391
Founded: Feb 02, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby Greater Nevadian Empire » Wed Feb 25, 2015 5:29 pm

Currently, 79% of Americans are Christian, 16% Atheist, about 2% Jewish, about 1% Buddhist, and 2% other. I don't think Christianity should be established as the national religion of America, even though I am a Christian.
Apply for an embassy
Please click here
"Without war, there would be no military, and without military, there would be no Greater Nevadian Empire."
Recent News:
Former dictator Robert Huang has taken South Province, Far West Province, and parts of five other southern provinces. Huang has declared a "People's Republic of Socialist Nevadia". A full on civil war is expected to happen within the next few days.

User avatar
Othelos
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 12729
Founded: Feb 05, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby Othelos » Wed Feb 25, 2015 5:32 pm

Burleson 2 wrote:I'm part of that 57%, and proud of it.

So are you guys going to give up the pretense of caring about the founding fathers and what they thought?

User avatar
Prezelly
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1101
Founded: Jul 07, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby Prezelly » Wed Feb 25, 2015 5:33 pm

Othelos wrote:
Burleson 2 wrote:I'm part of that 57%, and proud of it.

So are you guys going to give up the pretense of caring about the founding fathers and what they thought?

Having a national religion does not infringe on the freedom of others to have their own religion
All opinions are accepted as long as they are the right one
Political Compass
Economic Right: 2.0
Social Authoritarian: 0.7

ISTP personality type

User avatar
Othelos
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 12729
Founded: Feb 05, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby Othelos » Wed Feb 25, 2015 5:33 pm

Greater Nevadian Empire wrote:Currently, 79% of Americans are Christian, 16% Atheist, about 2% Jewish, about 1% Buddhist, and 2% other. I don't think Christianity should be established as the national religion of America, even though I am a Christian.

"irreligious" =/= atheist. Only 2% of americans consider themselves atheist.

User avatar
Yumyumsuppertime
Retired Moderator
 
Posts: 28799
Founded: Jun 21, 2012
Ex-Nation

Postby Yumyumsuppertime » Wed Feb 25, 2015 5:34 pm

Prezelly wrote:
Othelos wrote:So are you guys going to give up the pretense of caring about the founding fathers and what they thought?

Having a national religion does not infringe on the freedom of others to have their own religion


No, but it makes it easier to enforce one's personal religious views on others.

User avatar
Tekania
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 21671
Founded: May 26, 2004
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Tekania » Wed Feb 25, 2015 5:35 pm

Conserative Morality wrote:I know some of them.

I'm family with some of them.

Fuckin' dominionists.


This.... can't stand dominionism. Dominionism makes me glad we have a wall of separation between church and start. That wall was erected for primary purpose of not repeating the error of state churches as Europe had. Ironically enough at the time, it was the evangelicals, the ideological ancestors of these present day dominionists influenced churches who were thankful of that wall of separation.... because it was mostly them who has suffered under the oppression of state churches and know the import of having such a wall.

If only these churches knew their own history.
Such heroic nonsense!

User avatar
Othelos
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 12729
Founded: Feb 05, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby Othelos » Wed Feb 25, 2015 5:35 pm

Prezelly wrote:
Othelos wrote:So are you guys going to give up the pretense of caring about the founding fathers and what they thought?

Having a national religion does not infringe on the freedom of others to have their own religion

not inherently. Most theocratic societies are hellholes for anyone who doesn't fit in perfectly. ex, Saudi Arabia, Iran.

User avatar
Steamtopia
Negotiator
 
Posts: 5097
Founded: Jan 13, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby Steamtopia » Wed Feb 25, 2015 5:35 pm

Prezelly wrote:
Othelos wrote:So are you guys going to give up the pretense of caring about the founding fathers and what they thought?

Having a national religion does not infringe on the freedom of others to have their own religion

Yes, it does.
TG me. Just do it.

User avatar
Prezelly
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1101
Founded: Jul 07, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby Prezelly » Wed Feb 25, 2015 5:36 pm

Yumyumsuppertime wrote:
Prezelly wrote:Having a national religion does not infringe on the freedom of others to have their own religion


No, but it makes it easier to enforce one's personal religious views on others.

What do you mean by enforce their views?
All opinions are accepted as long as they are the right one
Political Compass
Economic Right: 2.0
Social Authoritarian: 0.7

ISTP personality type

User avatar
Prezelly
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1101
Founded: Jul 07, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby Prezelly » Wed Feb 25, 2015 5:37 pm

Othelos wrote:
Prezelly wrote:Having a national religion does not infringe on the freedom of others to have their own religion

not inherently. Most theocratic societies are hellholes for anyone who doesn't fit in perfectly. ex, Saudi Arabia, Iran.

In the US, there are clauses set up in the constitution to prevent things like that. However it is possible. Unlikely I'd say
All opinions are accepted as long as they are the right one
Political Compass
Economic Right: 2.0
Social Authoritarian: 0.7

ISTP personality type

User avatar
Yumyumsuppertime
Retired Moderator
 
Posts: 28799
Founded: Jun 21, 2012
Ex-Nation

Postby Yumyumsuppertime » Wed Feb 25, 2015 5:38 pm

Prezelly wrote:
Yumyumsuppertime wrote:
No, but it makes it easier to enforce one's personal religious views on others.

What do you mean by enforce their views?


To ban same-sex marriages, for instance, and to invalidate already existing same-sex marriages.

User avatar
Dyakovo
Post Kaiser
 
Posts: 83162
Founded: Nov 13, 2007
Ex-Nation

Postby Dyakovo » Wed Feb 25, 2015 5:39 pm

Steamtopia wrote:
Prezelly wrote:Having a national religion does not infringe on the freedom of others to have their own religion

Yes, it does.

No, not necessarily. It's possible to have a national religion and be a secular nation. This wouldn't be the case in the US, since those Who want a national religion do not want the nation to be secular.
Don't take life so serious... It isn't permanent...
Freedom from religion is an integral part of Freedom of religion
Married to Koshka
USMC veteran MOS 0331/8152
Grave_n_Idle: Maybe that's why the bible is so anti-other-gods, the other gods do exist, but they diss on Jehovah all the time for his shitty work.
Ifreann: Odds are you're secretly a zebra with a very special keyboard.
Ostro: I think women need to be trained
Margno, Llamalandia, Tarsonis Survivors, Bachmann's America, Internationalist Bastard B'awwwww! You're mean!

User avatar
Othelos
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 12729
Founded: Feb 05, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby Othelos » Wed Feb 25, 2015 5:39 pm

Prezelly wrote:
Othelos wrote:not inherently. Most theocratic societies are hellholes for anyone who doesn't fit in perfectly. ex, Saudi Arabia, Iran.

In the US, there are clauses set up in the constitution to prevent things like that. However it is possible. Unlikely I'd say

The first amendment doesn't allow for the establishment of a national religion.

User avatar
Prezelly
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1101
Founded: Jul 07, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby Prezelly » Wed Feb 25, 2015 5:40 pm

Yumyumsuppertime wrote:
Prezelly wrote:What do you mean by enforce their views?


To ban same-sex marriages, for instance, and to invalidate already existing same-sex marriages.

They can try to, but even with 70% of America being Christian. Most people are in favor of same sex marriage. At least so far as I have seen. I cold look up some statistics
All opinions are accepted as long as they are the right one
Political Compass
Economic Right: 2.0
Social Authoritarian: 0.7

ISTP personality type

User avatar
Prezelly
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1101
Founded: Jul 07, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby Prezelly » Wed Feb 25, 2015 5:41 pm

Othelos wrote:
Prezelly wrote:In the US, there are clauses set up in the constitution to prevent things like that. However it is possible. Unlikely I'd say

The first amendment doesn't allow for the establishment of a national religion.

It doesn't prohibit it either. The first amendment protects the people's right to believe what they want. The nation can still have a national religion
All opinions are accepted as long as they are the right one
Political Compass
Economic Right: 2.0
Social Authoritarian: 0.7

ISTP personality type

User avatar
Yumyumsuppertime
Retired Moderator
 
Posts: 28799
Founded: Jun 21, 2012
Ex-Nation

Postby Yumyumsuppertime » Wed Feb 25, 2015 5:41 pm

Prezelly wrote:
Yumyumsuppertime wrote:
To ban same-sex marriages, for instance, and to invalidate already existing same-sex marriages.

They can try to, but even with 70% of America being Christian. Most people are in favor of same sex marriage. At least so far as I have seen. I cold look up some statistics


But once you have a national religion, it gives further impetus to pass laws based upon that religion.

Let me ask you this: What would be the purpose of having a national religion?

User avatar
Othelos
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 12729
Founded: Feb 05, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby Othelos » Wed Feb 25, 2015 5:42 pm

Prezelly wrote:
Yumyumsuppertime wrote:
No, but it makes it easier to enforce one's personal religious views on others.

What do you mean by enforce their views?

-outlawing abortion
-outlawing same-sex marriage and/or eliminating protections based on sexual orientation
-forcing schools to teach abstinence only sex education

User avatar
Othelos
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 12729
Founded: Feb 05, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby Othelos » Wed Feb 25, 2015 5:43 pm

Prezelly wrote:
Othelos wrote:The first amendment doesn't allow for the establishment of a national religion.

It doesn't prohibit it either. The first amendment protects the people's right to believe what they want. The nation can still have a national religion

Read again:

"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion,"

User avatar
Prezelly
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1101
Founded: Jul 07, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby Prezelly » Wed Feb 25, 2015 5:43 pm

Yumyumsuppertime wrote:
Prezelly wrote:They can try to, but even with 70% of America being Christian. Most people are in favor of same sex marriage. At least so far as I have seen. I cold look up some statistics


But once you have a national religion, it gives further impetus to pass laws based upon that religion.

Let me ask you this: What would be the purpose of having a national religion?

In my viewpoint (which is probably not that popular), it is to recognize that a majority of people follow this religion. However people can twist it into what they want
All opinions are accepted as long as they are the right one
Political Compass
Economic Right: 2.0
Social Authoritarian: 0.7

ISTP personality type

User avatar
SaintB
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 21792
Founded: Apr 18, 2007
Ex-Nation

Postby SaintB » Wed Feb 25, 2015 5:43 pm

Prezelly wrote:
Othelos wrote:So are you guys going to give up the pretense of caring about the founding fathers and what they thought?

Having a national religion does not infringe on the freedom of others to have their own religion

It does infringe on the first amendment guarantee that Congress will pass no law establishing a national religion...
Hi my name is SaintB and I am prone to sarcasm and hyperbole. Because of this I make no warranties, express or implied, concerning the accuracy, completeness, reliability or suitability of the above statement, of its constituent parts, or of any supporting data. These terms are subject to change without notice from myself.

Every day NationStates tells me I have one issue. I am pretty sure I've got more than that.

User avatar
Yumyumsuppertime
Retired Moderator
 
Posts: 28799
Founded: Jun 21, 2012
Ex-Nation

Postby Yumyumsuppertime » Wed Feb 25, 2015 5:44 pm

Prezelly wrote:
Yumyumsuppertime wrote:
But once you have a national religion, it gives further impetus to pass laws based upon that religion.

Let me ask you this: What would be the purpose of having a national religion?

In my viewpoint (which is probably not that popular), it is to recognize that a majority of people follow this religion. However people can twist it into what they want


Why is it important to acknowledge this?

User avatar
Prezelly
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1101
Founded: Jul 07, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby Prezelly » Wed Feb 25, 2015 5:45 pm

Yumyumsuppertime wrote:
Prezelly wrote:In my viewpoint (which is probably not that popular), it is to recognize that a majority of people follow this religion. However people can twist it into what they want


Why is it important to acknowledge this?

I don't know, maybe just as important to recognize that there is a national tree or national animal.
All opinions are accepted as long as they are the right one
Political Compass
Economic Right: 2.0
Social Authoritarian: 0.7

ISTP personality type

PreviousNext

Advertisement

Remove ads

Return to General

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Duvniask, Fartsniffage, Inner Albania, Nioya, Repreteop, Tarsonis, The Archregimancy, Turenia

Advertisement

Remove ads