Ukraine Megathread: Crimea River Build a Bridge, Get Over It

[West Aurelia]

Ukraine accuses Russia of deploying more forces.

[Jinwoy]

Ukraine accuses Russia of deploying more forces.

Don't we usually hear these things from NATO? I'm more inclined to believe them over, what I consider, dodgy Ukrainian reports... which can be used to justify breaking the ceasefire and continuing glorious ATO.

[Bears Armed]

It's like you people have a mental block on remembering that Stalin's greatest contribution to the Baltic States was not building factories, but deporting people en masse to Siberia for bullshit reasons.

Also - since when deporting (and not shooting on the spot, which according to the law Stalin could order) Nazi collaborators is "bullshit reason"?

Even leaving aside the fact that the law you’re talking about was Soviet law rather than the existing laws of the Baltic Republics themselves, so that Stalin had no right (other than “right of conquest”, if you consider that to be a right…) to apply it there, and the question of how many of the deportees were given fair trials to establish their “guilt” in that respect, you’re ignoring the important point that those deportations began before the Nazis invaded Russia and some people in the Baltic Republics decided then that cooperating with them was the only way to get Stalin off of their backs: The deportations actually began [and began on quite a large scale, at that] almost immediately after the Soviets seized control of the Republics, which they did while still at peace with Germany as a part of their own share of the spoils under the German-Soviet Nonaggression Pact…
Oh, and of course you’re also ignoring the fact that the very existence of that Pact means that if the term “Nazi collaborators” can accurately be applied to anybody who was involved in the deportations at that time then that would be to the Soviet authorities themselves — up to and including Stalin himself — rather than to anybody in the Republics.

Don't raise your ALL BALTIC INHABITANTS ARE FASCISTS flag, because Lithuania sabotaged recruitment to an SS legion, while Russia has the second largest amount of collaborators with the Nazis per capita in the whole bloody WW2, right after France.

Yeah, going to need a source for that one. Sounds like good old Baltic government brainwashing to me.

Maybe Arglorand was referring to this?

[Jinwoy]

My Russian is terrible, but it sounds like Russian Opposition are planning a "spring", similar to what happened with the Arab Spring and European colour revolutions. Could a fluent Russian speaker please confirm?
https://twitter.com/SvobodaRadio/status ... 0987239424

[Jinwoy]

Anti-Communism is on the rise in Russia, specifically stemming from Russian opposition to Putin.
https://twitter.com/tvrain/status/568100958846263296

[Herargon]

Don;t project your own thoughts on others. Russia has no desire to "dominate Europe". These fine things - spheres of influence - whether you believe in them or not, preclude Russia from doing that. Yep, I understand - this totally contraditcts your Cold War era propaganda.

Yep, Ukraine =/= neutral, government leaning to the west now.
Belarus =/= government is officially neutral, but leaning towards Russia, and almost all Belarussians speak Russian, but many people in Belarus understand Belarussian. Most stable country of the countries in Europe that are leaning towards Russia.
Sphere of Russia = the rest of the former USSR.
The Baltic countries = sphere of the European Union (more specifically; Poland, Germany, Sweden and Finland have a considerable cultural influence there).

[Baltenstein]

So what gave Abkhazia the right to separate from Georgia when prior to 1992's war, it was almost half Georgian ethnically speaking and Abkhazia had to resort to ethnic cleansing? It seems to me that South Ossetia has a stronger basis for independence because even before, Ossetians made up a clear majority there.

I imagine Abkhasians pursued autonomy, probably tired of living under Soviet, and then Georgian, rulers who did not appreciate Abkhasian interests.

Luckily they are now free to live under Russian rulers and exist under exclusively Russian-dictated conditions.

Yay?

[Estruia]

Russian bomber crew films NATO escorts.

I love that the British Typhoon did a little belly dance and showed the Russians that it's fully-armed. Seriously, though... Who on Earth is afraid of TU-95s, anymore? They're antiquated pieces of trash, just like the B-52 (only a little more shitty.)

[Germanic Templars]

Russian bomber crew films NATO escorts.

I love that the British Typhoon did a little belly dance and showed the Russians that it's fully-armed. Seriously, though... Who on Earth is afraid of TU-95s, anymore? They're antiquated pieces of trash, just like the B-52 (only a little more shitty.)

Poorly developed 3rd world countries?

[Dr Freud]

Are you saying these things wouldn't have been built if the territories hadn't been occupied by the Soviet Union? Because they certainly would have in the case of the Baltic states, which means no, that wasn't an advantage of Soviet rule. You're asking them to be thankful for 50 years of political and economic repression because they got some stuff they would have got as independent states.

No, he's NOT saying that.

Actually, that's exactly what he said.

He's saying that Soviets did bad and good things in the Baltics, which is common sense.

Please explain what these good things are. Because I see investment in infrastructure and industry (paid for out of funds raised from those same SSRs) which left these countries with gaps in their living standards greater than comparable countries which didn't benefit from this supposed Soviet benevolence. If I took your money and misspent it on you, that's not me helping you out.

You're engaging in "what ifs" and "whataboutisms".

Asking "what if" is an important thought exercise. There's no whataboutism in my post but feel free to try and find one, let me know where it is if you do.

During the "horrible" Soviet rule, the population of Balts in the Baltics increased. During the "super-duper-nice-&-shiny" democratic rule, the population of Balts in the Baltics decreased, and the trio are in a demographic death spiral. Those are the facts.

To break that fact down a little bit, the population of Lithuanians in Lithuania increased. The population of Estonians in Estonia and Latvians in Latvia both declined. Nevertheless, the population of these groups has decreased since independence. And why wouldn't they? For almost fifty years they fell behind nearby countries in terms of living standards while the vast majority were denied the basic right to emigrate. When that right was restored its hardly surprising than many chose to seek better living standards elsewhere, particularly after they were granted the right to live and work visa free in the EU. If these countries are to fight their demographic problems they will need to focus on closing the gap with the rest of Europe, which for the most part they have done since independence.

As a mod has requested a return to topic, feel free to address my post in a new thread.

[Roski]

Russian bomber crew films NATO escorts.

I love that the British Typhoon did a little belly dance and showed the Russians that it's fully-armed. Seriously, though... Who on Earth is afraid of TU-95s, anymore? They're antiquated pieces of trash, just like the B-52 (only a little more shitty.)

The same countries afraid of being hit by nuclear weapons.

[OMGeverynameistaken]

Russian bomber crew films NATO escorts.

I love that the British Typhoon did a little belly dance and showed the Russians that it's fully-armed. Seriously, though... Who on Earth is afraid of TU-95s, anymore? They're antiquated pieces of trash, just like the B-52 (only a little more shitty.)

Anybody who's intelligent?

Strategic bombers don't carry bombs these days. They're armed with nuclear cruise missiles. They might not have the same punch as an ICBM's warhead, but you can fit a pretty decent warhead on a long range cruise missile. The KH-55 will still carry a 200kt warhead 3,000 kilometers. And it's very difficult to shoot down a cruise missile once it's got going.

[Baltenstein]

Did you know that famous porn actress Sasha Grey was a heroic nurse in Eastern Ukraine, murdered by Ukrainian Fascists?

http://uatoday.tv/society/porn-star-den ... 10191.html

Pro-militant site describes Sasha Grey as a nurse who was treating wounded militants in Ukraine

Former porn star Sasha Grey has denied reports of her death which appeared on social media.

The posts appeared on a group which supports Russian-backed militants in east Ukraine. They said that Grey was volunteering as a nurse and died whilst treating militants injured in fighting with the Ukrainian government.

After the posts appeared the musician and now mainstream actress issued a tweet saying that "the propaganda war has gone too far."

The posting on the pro-militant social media group also said that Grey "was able to bring to life even to the most hopeless of cases." It ends saying that the former porn star was captured by Ukrainian troops and eventually killed.

Sasha Grey tweeted Wednesday that the emergence of the latest meme had flung her to the opposite end of the propaganda spectrum. She had once been blasted for her alleged support of the protest movement in Kyiv, and was now being glorified for her death at the hands of Ukrainian forces.

Truly, she has been an inspiration to us all. In more ways than one.

[The balkens]

My Russian is terrible, but it sounds like Russian Opposition are planning a "spring", similar to what happened with the Arab Spring and European colour revolutions. Could a fluent Russian speaker please confirm?
https://twitter.com/SvobodaRadio/status ... 0987239424

What?

" French self defense forces appear in paris with Russian Military gear bought at the corner store. including T-90 tanks, BMP-2's, MI-24's and more russian shit. A council of French-Russians have announced a referendum to have France become territory of the Russian Federation, Putin and the Duma pleased. Oddly enough, none of them speak a word of French
About half as likely as Kim Jong Il raising from the grave to tell his son that he has a eating problem.

[Malgrave]

An interesting NYT article on the state of Russian television.

[Zimnaya Zemlya]

Anti-Communism is on the rise in Russia, specifically stemming from Russian opposition to Putin.
https://twitter.com/tvrain/status/568100958846263296

lol, opposition? Man, you make me laugh. Putin has approval ratings at an all time high right now, because he's the only one in this world helping Novorossiyans fight the Putschist-fascist government in Kiev.

[Washington Resistance Army]

Anti-Communism is on the rise in Russia, specifically stemming from Russian opposition to Putin.
https://twitter.com/tvrain/status/568100958846263296

lol, opposition? Man, you make me laugh. Putin has approval ratings at an all time high right now, because he's the only one in this world helping Novorossiyans fight the Putschist-fascist government in Kiev.

I love it when people don't know what certain words mean, it just brings a certain joy to my heart.

[Herargon]

lol, opposition? Man, you make me laugh. Putin has approval ratings at an all time high right now, because he's the only one in this world helping Novorossiyans fight the Putschist-fascist government in Kiev.

I love it when people don't know what certain words mean, it just brings a certain joy to my heart.

Zimnaya Zemlya is being sarcastic, for your information, Was.

[Kelinfort]

Anti-Communism is on the rise in Russia, specifically stemming from Russian opposition to Putin.
https://twitter.com/tvrain/status/568100958846263296

lol, opposition? Man, you make me laugh. Putin has approval ratings at an all time high right now, because he's the only one in this world helping Novorossiyans fight the Putschist-fascist government in Kiev.

He's much closer to Fascism politically than Ukraine is.

[Busen]

My Russian is terrible, but it sounds like Russian Opposition are planning a "spring", similar to what happened with the Arab Spring and European colour revolutions. Could a fluent Russian speaker please confirm?
https://twitter.com/SvobodaRadio/status ... 0987239424

That is wonderfull news but it is unlikely to happen because of the police state that Putin has established during his reign. We cannot even start a color revolution in Belarus and how do you excpet to start a Russian Maidan?

[Busen]

Truly, she has been an inspiration to us all. In more ways than one.

Why does she have symapthise for the Rebels? She is not of Russian descendant.

[Slobozhanshchyna]

Anti-Communism is on the rise in Russia, specifically stemming from Russian opposition to Putin.
https://twitter.com/tvrain/status/568100958846263296

;_; But muh РСД...

[Herargon]

Did you know that famous porn actress Sasha Grey was a heroic nurse in Eastern Ukraine, murdered by Ukrainian Fascists?

http://uatoday.tv/society/porn-star-den ... 10191.html

Pro-militant site describes Sasha Grey as a nurse who was treating wounded militants in Ukraine

Former porn star Sasha Grey has denied reports of her death which appeared on social media.

The posts appeared on a group which supports Russian-backed militants in east Ukraine. They said that Grey was volunteering as a nurse and died whilst treating militants injured in fighting with the Ukrainian government.

After the posts appeared the musician and now mainstream actress issued a tweet saying that "the propaganda war has gone too far."

The posting on the pro-militant social media group also said that Grey "was able to bring to life even to the most hopeless of cases." It ends saying that the former porn star was captured by Ukrainian troops and eventually killed.

Sasha Grey tweeted Wednesday that the emergence of the latest meme had flung her to the opposite end of the propaganda spectrum. She had once been blasted for her alleged support of the protest movement in Kyiv, and was now being glorified for her death at the hands of Ukrainian forces.

Truly, she has been an inspiration to us all. In more ways than one.

She is not murdered. She recently has denied the claim that she was killed on Twitter. What you are reading was an source that was incorrect.

[The balkens]

Truly, she has been an inspiration to us all. In more ways than one.

Why does she have symapthise for the Rebels? She is not of Russian descendant.

Personally, i only cared for around 3 min's worth of her opinion. *nods*

[Myrensis]

lol, opposition? Man, you make me laugh. Putin has approval ratings at an all time high right now, because he's the only one in this world helping Novorossiyans fight the Putschist-fascist government in Kiev.

He's much closer to Fascism politically than Ukraine is.

He's still correct, thought not because of fascism or any such thing. Putin is wildly popular because his actions stoke nationalist pride. Yes, in the long term he's screwing Russia politically and economically, but for now at least they get to feel like the world still fears them.