Do you consider the Confederate flag to be racist

[Gaelic Celtia]

The confederate flag was not a misused traditional Buddhist symbol. It is very different.

No its not.

The social stigma behind it associates it with slavery.

...because it was the banner of the armies that fought to keep slavery as an institution. I cannot IMAGINE why such an idea might develop.

It was not used for thousands of years as a symbol of peace for Eastern faiths. Therefore, it has little in common with the Swastika misconception

[Conserative Morality]

We only broke away because The North wasn't following the Constitution!
And it's not racist.

He would say that, were the northern states rejecting the constitution, they were justified in doing so because democracy is the idealization of equality and certain ideals transcend law. You and I would agree that certain ideals transcend the law. Our disagreement on the justification of the North would be utterly biased and an end of conversation.

Also, the Confederates were traitors to the Union. They argued that the northern states had become traitors to the constitution which is a very different thing.

Don't try to play that card; the Federal Government had neither the intention nor the political capital to violate the Constitution before Confederate Secession. They seceded because they realized that public opinion was threatening their pseudo-aristocratic way of life.

[Vettrera]

many black people dont consider to be racist, so its probably not.

I didn't know you were the official spokesperson for the African American community, you must be to make such a statement.

S/he is not.
I am.

[Vettrera]

Why is the Confederate Flag racist for representing a slave state that lasted for four years, but the Stars and Stripes not racist for representing a slave state that lasted 189 years?

That.

USA, flag of state founded by rich slavers like George Washington and Thomas Jefferson.

You also have to consider the Native American Genocide, and things like Imperialism. There's a reason why so many oppose Western influence to this day.

[Dyakovo]

Why is the Confederate Flag racist for representing a slave state that lasted for four years, but the Stars and Stripes not racist for representing a slave state that lasted 189 years?

1: Slavery was not legal in the US for 189 years.
2: The CSA was founded for the purpose of maintaining the legality of slavery. The US was not.

[Dyakovo]

It's not only racist, it's also the symbol of anti-democratic traitors who turned against not only the values of this country, but also the values of modernity.

But it is protected under the first amendment.

We only broke away because The North wasn't following the Constitution!
And it's not racist.

Wrong on both counts.

[Divair2]

It's not only racist, it's also the symbol of anti-democratic traitors who turned against not only the values of this country, but also the values of modernity.

But it is protected under the first amendment.

We only broke away because The North wasn't following the Constitution!

Slavery.

[Farnhamia]

But it is protected under the first amendment.

We only broke away because The North wasn't following the Constitution!
And it's not racist.[/quote]

Sauce for "only".[/quote]
You're an idiot, and stop putting links to "sex" stuff you pervert. [/quote]
Don't call people names. It'll get you warned. Really. It will.

[Enfaru]

When even the mods can't quote properly...

Anyway, the flag itself isn't racist, heck the National Socialist flag isn't racist. Unfortunately there are a lot of people who follow said flags that use the flags to represent white supremacy rather than what the flags actually stood for in the first place.

I personally consider the confederate flag to be a sign of oppression and those who fly it I consider to support oppression of those people who they don't agree with. But not racist.

[The Land Fomerly Known as Ligerplace]

When even the mods can't quote properly...

Anyway, the flag itself isn't racist, heck the National Socialist flag isn't racist. Unfortunately there are a lot of people who follow said flags that use the flags to represent white supremacy rather than what the flags actually stood for in the first place.

I personally consider the confederate flag to be a sign of oppression and those who fly it I consider to support oppression of those people who they don't agree with. But not racist.

Actually, that's exactly how the quote was originally posted.

[Maineiacs]

I consider Neo-Confederates to be racist traitors. I consider the Confederate flag to be a piece of cloth.

[Nazi Flower Power]

I consider Neo-Confederates to be racist traitors. I consider the Confederate flag to be a piece of cloth.

I imagine you have a similar attitude toward other flags as well...

[Confederate Flower Power]

He would say that, were the northern states rejecting the constitution, they were justified in doing so because democracy is the idealization of equality and certain ideals transcend law. You and I would agree that certain ideals transcend the law. Our disagreement on the justification of the North would be utterly biased and an end of conversation.

Also, the Confederates were traitors to the Union. They argued that the northern states had become traitors to the constitution which is a very different thing.

Don't try to play that card; the Federal Government had neither the intention nor the political capital to violate the Constitution before Confederate Secession. They seceded because they realized that public opinion was threatening their pseudo-aristocratic way of life.

You say that like there is something wrong with our pseudo-aristocratic way of life...

[The Padelas Empire]

Try to remember what the Banner of Traitors did to the United States. It was this treachery that led to Lincoln's death and the South's usurpal of Reconstruction efforts which would have prevented the Civil Rights movements, since the Radical Republicans would have given equal rights in the first place. Then, the hundreds of beatings, murders, and other horrors of the 19th and 20th centuries would have never occurred. Try to remember the blood spilt by brave Union soldiers, old and young, as they died trying to reclaim their lost bretheren in the South and make our nation whole again. I pity those who have forgotten the stains of blood left of the Confederates' hands. It was their treachery that set back political and social thinking back a full century. God alone can tell me why anyone would show pride in it!

Because while you state the blood spilt by "brave union soldiers" plenty of people in the south had ancestors who also spilt their blood too. Down in the south we remember our dead soldiers very well. And most connotations of the confederate flag down here isn't about racism or slavery it's just a huge part of southern history.

[Scholmeria]

many black people dont consider to be racist, so its probably not.

When did they become the sole arbiters of what is or is not racist?

When did white liberals/left-wingers become the sole arbiters of what is or is not racist?

[Ixzara]

When did they become the sole arbiters of what is or is not racist?

When did white liberals/left-wingers become the sole arbiters of what is or is not racist?

Probably WW2.

[Scholmeria]

many black people dont consider to be racist, so its probably not.

I didn't know you were the official spokesperson for the African American community, you must be to make such a statement.

I am not butI dont understand why do the progressives whant to be?

Why cannot this black college student be the official spokesperson of the black cpmmunity in the US? Also stop calling them African American, the terms is racist as they dont have nothing in common with Africa.

[The Empire Of Dolmite]

no more of a heritage thing really but one could hold it in the same regard as we hold things like the swastika and the communist hammer and sickle really but who cares honestly the fact is all it was was a battle flag for a failed revolution in the united states that just happened to be apart of slavery so what it wasn't the main cause of the war the real main cause was the federal government wanted more control than they had before because they wanted control over certain things the states had control over so the real cause was the federal government over the states government national rights over states rights and really the only thing was it wasn't economical for slaves any more they cost way too much to maintain keep and feed it just was a dieing business how can a dieing business be the cause of the war that almost ripped the united states in two

[Scholmeria]

When did white liberals/left-wingers become the sole arbiters of what is or is not racist?

Probably WW2.

To my knowledge, their ideological counterpartners were people as Chembarlain while the traditionalists, conservatived and parriots wanted to fight Hitler.

[Valica]

Exactly and perfectly true!

CSA = racist government; stars and bars = flag of a racist government, therefore it is a racist flag; Dixie is the anthem of a racist government, so it is a racist song.

Dixie was one of Abraham Lincoln's favorite songs. I'm sure we're all agreed Abraham Lincoln wasn't racist.

"there is a physical difference between the white and black races that will forever
forbid the two from living together on terms of social and political equality."
- Abraham Lincoln

He also wanted to ship black people out of America.
He may not have been an advocate of slavery, but he most certainly did not support complete equality.

[Ixzara]

no more of a heritage thing really but one could hold it in the same regard as we hold things like the swastika and the communist hammer and sickle really but who cares honestly the fact is all it was was a battle flag for a failed revolution in the united states that just happened to be apart of slavery so what it wasn't the main cause of the war the real main cause was the federal government wanted more control than they had before because they wanted control over certain things the states had control over so the real cause was the federal government over the states government national rights over states rights and really the only thing was it wasn't economical for slaves any more they cost way too much to maintain keep and feed it just was a dieing business how can a dieing business be the cause of the war that almost ripped the united states in two

The war was about slavery. 4 fucking states said it right on their Declaration of Secession.

[The Padelas Empire]

no more of a heritage thing really but one could hold it in the same regard as we hold things like the swastika and the communist hammer and sickle really but who cares honestly the fact is all it was was a battle flag for a failed revolution in the united states that just happened to be apart of slavery so what it wasn't the main cause of the war the real main cause was the federal government wanted more control than they had before because they wanted control over certain things the states had control over so the real cause was the federal government over the states government national rights over states rights and really the only thing was it wasn't economical for slaves any more they cost way too much to maintain keep and feed it just was a dieing business how can a dieing business be the cause of the war that almost ripped the united states in two

The war was about slavery. 4 fucking states said it right on their Declaration of Secession.

That's funny I remember there being more than just 4 states in the confederacy....

[Ixzara]

The war was about slavery. 4 fucking states said it right on their Declaration of Secession.

That's funny I remember there being more than just 4 states in the confederacy....

And yet those 4 states that did explicitly secede because of slavery still destroy the argument that the Civil War was not about slavery. Need more? The Vice President of the Confederacy said so himself.
http://www.addictinginfo.org/2013/11/03 ... r-slavery/

[The Padelas Empire]

That's funny I remember there being more than just 4 states in the confederacy....

And yet those 4 states that did explicitly secede because of slavery still destroy the argument that the Civil War was not about slavery. Need more? The Vice President of the Confederacy said so himself.
http://www.addictinginfo.org/2013/11/03 ... r-slavery/

Where are the primary documents from the secession papers? This is a second hand spruce from a guy who is obviously biased. While he does point out things, does he show the whole document? There were the ideas of tariffs involved, political imbalance, etc. and you know that most people in the confederate army didn't fight over slaves right?

[Ixzara]

And yet those 4 states that did explicitly secede because of slavery still destroy the argument that the Civil War was not about slavery. Need more? The Vice President of the Confederacy said so himself.
http://www.addictinginfo.org/2013/11/03 ... r-slavery/

Where are the primary documents from the secession papers? This is a second hand spruce from a guy who is obviously biased. While he does point out things, does he show the whole document? There were the ideas of tariffs involved, political imbalance, etc. and you know that most people in the confederate army didn't fight over slaves right?

South Carolina
http://avalon.law.yale.edu/19th_century/csa_scarsec.asp

Mississippi
http://avalon.law.yale.edu/19th_century/csa_missec.asp

Texas
http://avalon.law.yale.edu/19th_century/csa_texsec.asp

Georgia
http://avalon.law.yale.edu/19th_century/csa_geosec.asp

Alexander H. Stephens' Cornerstone Speech
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cornerstone_Speech