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[DRAFT] Preserve, Restore, Repurpose

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Arichia
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[DRAFT] Preserve, Restore, Repurpose

Postby Arichia » Mon Aug 03, 2020 11:50 am

This is my first draft. Any feedback is greatly appreciated.

[title] Preserve, Restore, Repurpose

[description] A solid, but colorless marble statue of the founder of @@NAME@@ has been found and has been dated to around the time of their rise to power. This is the oldest statue discovered with the founder's countenance, as well with an authentic engraving of the artist that sculpted it. Debates have arisen over what to do with the impressive piece of art.

[validity] None

[option] "That statue is a relic of our glorious past!" declares @@RANDOMNAME@@, an @@DEMONYMADJECTIVE@@ nationalist as @@HE@@ glances disapprovingly at a small Maxtopian clay sculpture on your desk. "It belongs in a museum! Safe, preserved, untouched for future generations to gaze upon the glory of our founder and craftsmanship, behind a few guards and pole rope of course. "
[effect] heated debates occur over which museum gets the statue.

[option] "The world is dying to see the pigments that have faded away from this statue!" exclaims @@RANDOMNAME@@ the Chancellor of @@NAME@@ University. "Let our team of professional duplicators, make a plaster replica, examine the original, then paint every feature accurately according to our findings. Of course, you'll have to divert some funding to our project, but at least we can admire the true color and beauty of it once more!"
[effect] @@DEMONYMADJECTIVE@@ parks have suspiciously similar statues

[option] "That much material to create just ONE replication is ridiculous! Why should we waste time and money to make and color a replica when we could paint the actual piece?" asks your Minister of Finance. "No one wants to see a boring-ole, blank-o canvas. Research and Restore! My kids could even do the painting, for ten @@CURRENCY@@."
[effect] painting priceless statues are a common school project

[option] A construction worker overhears and joins the conversation. "That statue is made of marble! That's stuff's one of the strongest building materials! I mean this thing was preserved for like a kajillion years. We can't just let it rot on a shelf, er, marble rots right? Anyways, let us free that stone from its sad state, and turn it into something much more useful for all of us!"
[effect] marble is now the official building block of @@NAME@@
Last edited by Arichia on Tue Aug 04, 2020 6:58 am, edited 34 times in total.

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Daarwyrth
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Postby Daarwyrth » Mon Aug 03, 2020 12:05 pm

The language of the issue appears to be written nicely, as the sentences strike a good balance between conveying information and being concise.

However, the subject and issue options remind me a lot of #719 Buried Bones Unearth Debate, where essentially the remains of ancient @@DEMONYMPLURAL@@ are found and the debate arises what to do with them. One option seeks to present them in a museum, another to study them, much like in yours. There are a few distinctions between your idea and issue #719, but I have a feeling that there might be a little bit too much overlap in the base subject itself. I could be wrong though, so someone please correct me if I am.
Last edited by Daarwyrth on Mon Aug 03, 2020 12:07 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Minskiev
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Postby Minskiev » Mon Aug 03, 2020 12:08 pm

The effect line for option 1 should be ‘@@DEMONYMADJECTIVE@@ museums’ instead of @@DEMONYM@@ museums.

The effect lines, again, could also use a tad more humor.

[effect] @@DEMONYMADJECTIVE@@ museums are filled with priceless pieces of art -> a civil war has erupted over two museums and a deformed stone

[effect] the wealthy has bought painted replicas of statues -> every household has suspiciously similar statues

[effect] art enthusiasts faint at the sight of the painted statue -> the statue is being taken on by trapeze artists (it’s a pun as well :D. or is it double meaning? eh, maybe both.)

[effect] marble statues have become the latest building material -> former statues make the foundation for statues
Last edited by Minskiev on Mon Aug 03, 2020 12:18 pm, edited 6 times in total.
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Westinor
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Postby Westinor » Mon Aug 03, 2020 12:11 pm

This draft feels a bit.. superfluous? As mentioned before, the writing is fine and the issue feels balanced enough, and I don't actually take up any problems with the premise of the issue, but it just feels so unimportant (yet something that can probably presented as an issue). It reminds me some of the earlier issues written. This isn't taking up arms against your writing, which is fine, but just a thought.

On a separate note, you could probably spice the issue up with humor and flavor. All of the characters just feel like the same voice, advocating for something different. If you could add in humorous character actions, perhaps little quirks in the speech or jokes to make each speaker stand out a bit more and feel like an actual character, then you'll be on your way to a great issue.
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Arichia
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Postby Arichia » Mon Aug 03, 2020 12:12 pm

Minskiev wrote:The effect line for option 1 should be ‘@@DEMONYMADJECTIVE@@ museums’ instead of @@DEMONYM@@ museums.

The effect lines, again, could also use a tad more humor.

I've changed the effect line, and I'll be thinking about some funnier effect lines

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Arichia
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Postby Arichia » Mon Aug 03, 2020 12:20 pm

Westinor wrote:This draft feels a bit.. superfluous? As mentioned before, the writing is fine and the issue feels balanced enough, and I don't actually take up any problems with the premise of the issue, but it just feels so unimportant (yet something that can probably presented as an issue). It reminds me some of the earlier issues written. This isn't taking up arms against your writing, which is fine, but just a thought.

On a separate note, you could probably spice the issue up with humor and flavor. All of the characters just feel like the same voice, advocating for something different. If you could add in humorous character actions, perhaps little quirks in the speech or jokes to make each speaker stand out a bit more and feel like an actual character, then you'll be on your way to a great issue.

I've changed up some things around the issue. Though, I think that I can do better. Any thoughts?
Last edited by Arichia on Mon Aug 03, 2020 12:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Westinor
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Postby Westinor » Mon Aug 03, 2020 12:39 pm

Arichia wrote:
Westinor wrote:This draft feels a bit.. superfluous? As mentioned before, the writing is fine and the issue feels balanced enough, and I don't actually take up any problems with the premise of the issue, but it just feels so unimportant (yet something that can probably presented as an issue). It reminds me some of the earlier issues written. This isn't taking up arms against your writing, which is fine, but just a thought.

On a separate note, you could probably spice the issue up with humor and flavor. All of the characters just feel like the same voice, advocating for something different. If you could add in humorous character actions, perhaps little quirks in the speech or jokes to make each speaker stand out a bit more and feel like an actual character, then you'll be on your way to a great issue.

I've changed up the first two effect lines and added something to the last option. Though, I think that I can do better. Any thoughts?


Again, try to breath life into your characters. This is what separates a regular issue framework from an actual issue.

"That statue is a relic of art and history!" says @@RANDOMNAME@@, an avid collector. "It belongs in a museum! Safe, preserved, untouched for future generations, and the world to admire." @@HE@@ adds. "A glass case and guards would also be a nice touch."


For example, this option has a decent writing and structure, but lacks a certain flavor. You have simple speaker actions like "says" and "adds"(which, by the way, is not needed - unless you were to add another character action), as well as simple, direct dialogue. You should try to add jokes, flair in the character's dialogue, or character actions to make the character seem alive.

Try "This statue is a relic of our nation's glorious past!" exclaims @@RANDOMNAME@@, an avid collector, as @@HE@@ glances disapprovingly at a small Maxtopian clay sculpture on your desk. "It belongs in a museum, where the entire world can gaze upon its glory - from a safe distance, of course."

You could, of course, add back some of what you wrote,

"This statue is a relic of our nation's glorious past!" exclaims avid art critic @@RANDOMNAME@@, as @@HE@@ glances disapprovingly at a small Maxtopian sculpture on your desk. "It belongs in a museum, where the whole world can admire it! From a safe distance, behind some pole rope and security guards, of course."

Now, you have a cut-and-clean option, which you can go ahead and add humor or jokes to. I'll add some justification for my changes, just to walk you through the process.

A statue can not be a relic of art, and history was changed to "glorious past" to add to the "fervent art critic" character. I changed the description of the character to "critic", which feels better suited towards having the statue held in a museum, but you can go with collector, if you'd like. The character action only continues to add to the "art critic who wants to preserve things" character, allowing players to interpret the sculpture as bad or implying that he thinks it should go in a museum. The second portion of the option has been revised to make it more efficient, flow better, and remove repetitive wording. For example, saying something is safe and preserved, then mentioning a glass case and security guards, is redundant. Having a glass case and security guards is already implied by the "museum", and that in turn implies safety and preservation. However, you can add back in the protection measures of security guards and the glass case (which I changed to pole rope for grammatical reasons) for emphasis on the character's point. "@@HE@@ adds" was removed because no further action was needed nor was the speaker adding anything. Finally, though the "behind some pole rope and security guards" obstructs it a bit, "from a safe distance, of course" adds a bit of flavor to the dialogue.

This isn't to restrict on your creative freedom! There are tons of other ways to go about this.

All in all, try to cut down on redundancy, work on flow and characters, and most importantly, keep writing. This is a great start, just focus more on giving your options life and humor.
Last edited by Westinor on Mon Aug 03, 2020 12:56 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Arichia
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Postby Arichia » Mon Aug 03, 2020 1:16 pm

Thanks for the advice, though I changed option one a bit more before seeing your advice. An effect line suggestion gave me a new idea for option one. I decided to have the art/collector enthusiast become a museum owner. I was trying to make him someone who cares about the preservation of the statue, as well as getting recognition and profit for his museum by getting the statue. I would like to see what you and others think about it. If it still doesn't seem that great, I'll go back to your advice and my previous idea.
Last edited by Arichia on Mon Aug 03, 2020 1:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Postby Cretox State » Mon Aug 03, 2020 1:48 pm

Welcome to Got Issues! Have a complementary fruit basket.

I think the premise works well enough. It isn't a sweeping policy decision like many other issues, but that isn't necessarily a bad thing.

You should definitely heed Westinor's advice, but I feel that a very important point is getting lost here: You can't add humor or life into an issue until you have a solid frame to build on. Your objective right now should be to distill the issue to its most basic parts; in other words, make it as lean as you can. Humor and all that jazz can come later. As it stands, you use a lot of words just for the sake of using words. This isn't a criticism of you in particular; a lot of authors struggle with this until they get a bit more experience. Cut the issue down to its essentials, then consider spicing it up.

[Title] Preserve, Restore, Repurpose

[Description] A solid, but colorless marble statue of the founder of @@NAME@@ has been discovered. Debates have arisen over what to do with the massive piece of art.The description is dry, but it works. Humor can be added later on.

[Validity] None

[Option] "That statue is a relic of our glorious past!" declares @@RANDOMNAME@@, a museum owner. "It belongs in my, or um, a museum! Safe, preserved, untouched for future generations, and the world to admire, from a good distance of course." @@HE@@ asserts. "But, you must remember that my museum is the optimal place for that statue to be in."
[effect] heated debates occur over which museum gets the statue.

[Option] "The public is dying to see the color that has faded away from this statue!" exclaims @@RANDOMNAME@@ the Chancellor of @@NAME@@ University. "Let our team of replication experts, make a plaster replica, then paint it accordingly. Of course, we'll need funding for the material and workers' pay, but it'll be worth it!We'll do such a good job that you might just make me the Minister of Ancient Art."
[effect] auctions sell painted replicas for breathtaking amounts

[Option] "That much material to create just ONE replication is ridiculous! I could buy a mansion with that money! How does the Minister of Finance know how much money the project will cost when the previous speaker didn't cite any particular amount?Why should we waste time and money to make and color a replica, when we could paint the actual piece?" asks your Minister of Finance. "No one wants to see a boring-ole, white canvas. Research and Restore! My kids could even do the painting, for ten @@CURRENCY@@"
[effect] painting priceless statues are a common school project

[Option] A construction worker overhears and joins the conversation abruptly. "That statue is made of marble! One of the strongest materials ever! I mean this thing lasted a kajillion years!" he hollers. "We can't just let it rot on a shelf, er, marble rots right? Anyways, let's free that stone from its sad state, and turn it into something much more useful!" he suggests.
[effect] marble is now the official building blocks of @@NAME@@

The feeling I'm getting is that you're trying to inject humor in areas where it isn't needed, which only encumbers the draft. It definitely has potential, but I highly recommend working to streamline the draft first. Ask yourself why each speaker is saying what they are. Why are they phrasing their arguments in that particular way? What purpose does each word serve? Does a certain phrase actually add anything?
Last edited by Cretox State on Mon Aug 03, 2020 1:49 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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Westinor
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Postby Westinor » Mon Aug 03, 2020 2:02 pm

Arichia wrote:Thanks for the advice, though I changed option one a bit more before seeing your advice. An effect line suggestion gave me a new idea for option one. I decided to have the art/collector enthusiast become a museum owner. I was trying to make him someone who cares about the preservation of the statue, as well as getting recognition and profit for his museum by getting the statue. I would like to see what you and others think about it. If it still doesn't seem that great, I'll go back to your advice and my previous idea.


Hm, yeah, I felt your former draft was better and a lot more clean cut. This rendition is a bit stuffed - like I said before, cut back on redundancies and make sure the issue flows well. As Cretox mentioned, each phrase needs to mean something - and while your original draft was simple enough so that it felt fine and just dry, currently it feels a bit wordy. The challenge here is balancing concision with flavor, so definitely make sure that each sentence leads logically into the next.
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Postby Trotterdam » Mon Aug 03, 2020 2:14 pm

If we even recognize the founder of @@NAME@@ on seeing the statue, then there must be enough depictions of him/her that the statue isn't that important or unique. Why bother taking this to the highest echelons of government?

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Postby Australian rePublic » Mon Aug 03, 2020 2:50 pm

Options 2&3- did people actually ever used to paint statues?
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Arichia
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Postby Arichia » Mon Aug 03, 2020 3:04 pm

Australian rePublic wrote:Options 2&3- did people actually ever used to paint statues?

Yeah, people did paint statues I think.

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Arichia
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Postby Arichia » Mon Aug 03, 2020 3:10 pm

Trotterdam wrote:If we even recognize the founder of @@NAME@@ on seeing the statue, then there must be enough depictions of him/her that the statue isn't that important or unique. Why bother taking this to the highest echelons of government?

In the description, I put that the statue was huge. To me, it's more impressive to have a larger statue than a smaller one.

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Postby Australian rePublic » Mon Aug 03, 2020 3:18 pm

Arichia wrote:
Australian rePublic wrote:Options 2&3- did people actually ever used to paint statues?

Yeah, people did paint statues I think.

First I'm hearing of that. Carry on
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Arichia
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Postby Arichia » Mon Aug 03, 2020 3:21 pm

Australian rePublic wrote:
Arichia wrote:Yeah, people did paint statues I think.

First I'm hearing of that. Carry on

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4jmMWohs1XM is where I learned it.

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Postby Australian rePublic » Mon Aug 03, 2020 3:23 pm

Arichia wrote:
Australian rePublic wrote:First I'm hearing of that. Carry on

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4jmMWohs1XM is where I learned it.

Ha. Based on how this issue was written, I fhought that they were multicoloured, like the Columbia logo in movies
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Arichia
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Postby Arichia » Mon Aug 03, 2020 3:25 pm

Cretox State wrote:Welcome to Got Issues! Have a complementary fruit basket.

I think the premise works well enough. It isn't a sweeping policy decision like many other issues, but that isn't necessarily a bad thing.

You should definitely heed Westinor's advice, but I feel that a very important point is getting lost here: You can't add humor or life into an issue until you have a solid frame to build on. Your objective right now should be to distill the issue to its most basic parts; in other words, make it as lean as you can. Humor and all that jazz can come later. As it stands, you use a lot of words just for the sake of using words. This isn't a criticism of you in particular; a lot of authors struggle with this until they get a bit more experience. Cut the issue down to its essentials, then consider spicing it up.

[Title] Preserve, Restore, Repurpose

[Description] A solid, but colorless marble statue of the founder of @@NAME@@ has been discovered. Debates have arisen over what to do with the massive piece of art.The description is dry, but it works. Humor can be added later on.

[Validity] None

[Option] "That statue is a relic of our glorious past!" declares @@RANDOMNAME@@, a museum owner. "It belongs in my, or um, a museum! Safe, preserved, untouched for future generations, and the world to admire, from a good distance of course." @@HE@@ asserts. "But, you must remember that my museum is the optimal place for that statue to be in."
[effect] heated debates occur over which museum gets the statue.

[Option] "The public is dying to see the color that has faded away from this statue!" exclaims @@RANDOMNAME@@ the Chancellor of @@NAME@@ University. "Let our team of replication experts, make a plaster replica, then paint it accordingly. Of course, we'll need funding for the material and workers' pay, but it'll be worth it!We'll do such a good job that you might just make me the Minister of Ancient Art."
[effect] auctions sell painted replicas for breathtaking amounts

[Option] "That much material to create just ONE replication is ridiculous! I could buy a mansion with that money! How does the Minister of Finance know how much money the project will cost when the previous speaker didn't cite any particular amount?Why should we waste time and money to make and color a replica, when we could paint the actual piece?" asks your Minister of Finance. "No one wants to see a boring-ole, white canvas. Research and Restore! My kids could even do the painting, for ten @@CURRENCY@@"
[effect] painting priceless statues are a common school project

[Option] A construction worker overhears and joins the conversation abruptly. "That statue is made of marble! One of the strongest materials ever! I mean this thing lasted a kajillion years!" he hollers. "We can't just let it rot on a shelf, er, marble rots right? Anyways, let's free that stone from its sad state, and turn it into something much more useful!" he suggests.
[effect] marble is now the official building blocks of @@NAME@@

The feeling I'm getting is that you're trying to inject humor in areas where it isn't needed, which only encumbers the draft. It definitely has potential, but I highly recommend working to streamline the draft first. Ask yourself why each speaker is saying what they are. Why are they phrasing their arguments in that particular way? What purpose does each word serve? Does a certain phrase actually add anything?

I've cut down the issue to your marked version. I'm not quite sure yet how I'll add humor, but I'm thinking about it.

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Daarwyrth
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Postby Daarwyrth » Mon Aug 03, 2020 3:29 pm

Arichia wrote:
Trotterdam wrote:If we even recognize the founder of @@NAME@@ on seeing the statue, then there must be enough depictions of him/her that the statue isn't that important or unique. Why bother taking this to the highest echelons of government?

In the description, I put that the statue was huge. To me, it's more impressive to have a larger statue than a smaller one.


Well, size isn't everything I'd argue. While certainly impressive, it doesn't feel special enough (so I am with Trotterdam on this one). Instead of or in addition to being huge, perhaps you could also add that it's believed to be one of the first depictions of the nation's founder and thus, probably the most accurate depiction of them. That would be more special than simply very big, I believe.
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A unified state of constituent duchies, ruled by one absolute monarch, located on the fictional continent of Geldria.

Our Leader: Queen Demi Maria I | Our Capital: Daarport | Government type: Unitary absolute monarchy | Technology level: Post-Modern Tech | Civilization index: 13.71


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Arichia
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Postby Arichia » Mon Aug 03, 2020 3:41 pm

Daarwyrth wrote:
Arichia wrote:In the description, I put that the statue was huge. To me, it's more impressive to have a larger statue than a smaller one.


Well, size isn't everything I'd argue. While certainly impressive, it doesn't feel special enough (so I am with Trotterdam on this one). Instead of or in addition to being huge, perhaps you could also add that it's believed to be one of the first depictions of the nation's founder and thus, probably the most accurate depiction of them. That would be more special than simply very big, I believe.

That is a good point. I've changed the description to show that it was made a very long time ago.
Last edited by Arichia on Mon Aug 03, 2020 3:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Daarwyrth
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Postby Daarwyrth » Mon Aug 03, 2020 3:55 pm

This is the oldest statue found of the founder


Consider changing this to "This is the oldest statue discovered with the founder's countenance", as you have used "found" in the sentence before and the use of "countenance" emphasizes the appearance-aspect of the statue, I'd say.
The United Monarchy of Daarwyrth

A unified state of constituent duchies, ruled by one absolute monarch, located on the fictional continent of Geldria.

Our Leader: Queen Demi Maria I | Our Capital: Daarport | Government type: Unitary absolute monarchy | Technology level: Post-Modern Tech | Civilization index: 13.71


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Arichia
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Postby Arichia » Mon Aug 03, 2020 3:58 pm

Daarwyrth wrote:
This is the oldest statue found of the founder


Consider changing this to "This is the oldest statue discovered with the founder's countenance", as you have used "found" in the sentence before and the use of "countenance" emphasizes the appearance-aspect of the statue, I'd say.

I've changed it, thanks!

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Arichia
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Postby Arichia » Tue Aug 04, 2020 5:41 am

"This statue is a relic of our nation's glorious past!" exclaims avid art critic @@RANDOMNAME@@, as @@HE@@ glances disapprovingly at a small Maxtopian sculpture on your desk.
Wouldn't an art critic/collector be interested in more than one nation's art? I would think that a collector would want all sorts of art, not just one nation's. Or are there collectors that are obsessed with only one kind of art?

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Trotterdam
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Postby Trotterdam » Tue Aug 04, 2020 6:05 am

Arichia wrote:
"This statue is a relic of our nation's glorious past!" exclaims avid art critic @@RANDOMNAME@@, as @@HE@@ glances disapprovingly at a small Maxtopian sculpture on your desk.
Wouldn't an art critic/collector be interested in more than one nation's art? I would think that a collector would want all sorts of art, not just one nation's. Or are there collectors that are obsessed with only one kind of art?
There are people obsessed with all kinds of weird categories, broad or narrow. It's a big world.

Then again, maybe the Maxtopian sculpture is just really bad for reasons completely unrelated to it being from Maxtopia.

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Candlewhisper Archive
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Postby Candlewhisper Archive » Wed Aug 05, 2020 5:31 am

So the core issue here, really, is whether restoration should include reapplying pigments to those classical statues which we know were originally painted, but which we've grown used to seeing as plain marble.

I think it'd make a more interesting issue if a major museum had gone ahead and already restored the colour to a whole exhibition of classical era statues, and if a group of "traditionalists" were complaining about this "cultural vandalism".
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