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[PASSED] Commend Frieden-und Freudenland

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Kuriko
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[PASSED] Commend Frieden-und Freudenland

Postby Kuriko » Thu Jul 16, 2020 9:20 am

So, this is my first time trying to write a commendation for an issued author. It's not nearly as good as I'd like it to be, but I don't really know how to improve it. Advice would be appreciated, and if anyone thinks something should be added please let me know!

The Security Council,

Recognizing that throughout the known universes there are individuals, organizations, and nations that dedicate their precious time to disseminate information to national leaders;

Believing Frieden-und Freudenland to be a shining example of such a nation with a record of invaluable service that, at present, stretches back almost 5 years;

Lauding numerous efforts by Frieden-und Freudenland, which total no fewer than 14, to bring attention to issues of national significance, including but not limited to:

  • Political campaigns of foreign leaders accused of rights abuses, as presented in Is There An Election In Marche Noir Or Are You Just Happy To See Us?;
  • Workers compensation policy relating to overtime wages, as presented in Sit-Down Money;
  • The legality of child actors in advertisements and movies, as presented in Never Work With Children;
  • Public health concerns caused by vitamin D deficiency, as presented in Where The Sun Don’t Shine;
  • Internet privacy as it relates to minors, as presented in Paparazzi Parents; and
  • Birthright citizenship policy, as presented in Baby Shower;

Highlighting the fact that Frieden-und Freudenland has also contributed to the region of Forest and the international community in several ways, including:

  • Creating a regional newspaper known as The Forest News Leaf, the first known regional newspaper of the region since the region was refounded in 2007. Having been created in September 2015, The Forest News Leaf became a very important news outlet that let the national leaders of Forest stay apprised of happenings in neighboring nations;
  • Creating the annual Forest Photo Contest, an inter-regional event which started in 2015 featuring pictures from many nations throughout the Multiverse. The Forest Photo Contest brought many national leaders to Forest to participate, and lended a hand in Forest's diplomatic efforts to spread the word of eco-friendliness;

Concluding that the nation of Frieden-und Freudenland should be recognized by the World Assembly Security Council for these reasons;

Hereby commends Frieden-und Freudenland.

Co-authored by Candensia


The Security Council,

Recognizing that throughout the known universes there are individuals, organizations, and nations that dedicate their precious time to disseminate information to national leaders;

Believing Frieden-und Freudenland to be a shining example of such a nation with a record of invaluable service that, at present, stretches back approximately 5 years;

Lauding numerous efforts by Frieden-und Freudenland, which total no fewer than 12, to bring attention to issues of national significance, including but not limited to:

  • Political campaigns of foreign leaders accused of rights abuses, as presented in Is There An Election In Marche Noir Or Are You Just Happy To See Us?
  • Workers compensation policy relating to overtime wages, as presented in Sit-Down Money
  • The legality of child actors in advertisements and movies, as presented in Never Work With Children
  • Internet privacy as it relates to minors, as presented in Paparazzi Parents, and
  • Birthright citizenship policy, as presented in Baby Shower

Highlighting the fact that Frieden-und Freudenland has also contributed to the region of Forest in multiple ways, including:

  • Creating a regional newspaper known as the Forest News Leaf, the first of its kind in the region which featured news from many of the nations residing therein.
  • Creating the annual Forest Photo Contest in 2015, a contest which has since run annually, featuring pictures from many nations throughout the realms.
  • Holding Government positions within the region, such as Minister of Culture between 2016 and 2017, where in that capacity they ran the annual Forest Photo Contest as well as other regional events.

Concluding that the nation of Frieden-und Freudenland should be recognized by the World Assembly Security Council for these reasons;

Hereby commends Frieden-und Freudenland.

Co-authored by Candensia


The Security Council,

Recognizing that throughout the known universes there are individuals, organizations, and nations that dedicate precious time to disseminate information to national leaders;

Believing Frieden-und Freudenland, also known as FuF, to be a shining example of such a nation with a record of invaluable service that, at present, stretches back approximately 5 years;

Lauding numerous efforts by Frieden-und Freudenland to bring attention to issues of national significance, which include, but are not limited to:

  • Political campaigns of foreign leaders accused of rights abuses, as presented in Is There An Election In Marche Noir Or Are You Just Happy To See Us?
  • Workers compensation policy relating to overtime wages, as presented in Sit Down Money
  • The legality of child actors in advertisements and movies, as presented in Never Work With Children
  • Internet privacy as it relates to minors, as presented in Paparazzi Parents, and
  • Health risks associated with cultural and religious practices, as presented in Gotta Go Fast;

Lamenting the fact that there could be countless issues from Frieden-und Freudenland having been distributed to international leaders, without knowledge of where they truly originated from due to them being intercepted during transit and their origins being lost;

Highlighting the fact that Frieden-und Freudenland has also contributed to the region of Forest in multiple ways, including:

  • Creating a regional newspaper known as the Forest News Leaf, the first of its kind in the region which featured news from many of the nations residing therein.
  • Creating the annual Forest Photo Contest in 2015, a contest which has run annually, featuring pictures from many nations throughout the realms.
  • Holding Government positions within the region, such as Minister of Culture between 2016 and 2017, where in that capacity they ran the annual Forest Photo Contest as well as other regional events.

Concluding that the nation of Frieden-und Freudenland should be recognized by the World Assembly Security Council for these reasons;

Hereby commends Frieden-und Freudenland.

Co-authored by Candensia
Last edited by Ransium on Sun Aug 02, 2020 9:38 pm, edited 16 times in total.
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Postby Kuriko » Thu Jul 16, 2020 9:28 am

Could I also possibly get a legality ruling on the lamenting clause? It's supposed to be referencing the fact that FuF was an issues editor, but I'm not sure of its legality.
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Postby SkyDip » Thu Jul 16, 2020 9:34 am

Kuriko wrote:Could I also possibly get a legality ruling on the lamenting clause? It's supposed to be referencing the fact that FuF was an issues editor, but I'm not sure of its legality.

I mean you’ve sort of talked around it, but R1 pretty explicitly states that you can’t C&C a nation for actions undertaken as an issues moderator, which is the bulk of this proposal.
Last edited by SkyDip on Thu Jul 16, 2020 9:35 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Kuriko » Thu Jul 16, 2020 9:39 am

SkyDip wrote:
Kuriko wrote:Could I also possibly get a legality ruling on the lamenting clause? It's supposed to be referencing the fact that FuF was an issues editor, but I'm not sure of its legality.

I mean you’ve sort of talked around it, but R1 pretty explicitly states that you can’t C&C a nation for actions undertaken as an issues moderator, which is the bulk of this proposal.

The issues listed in the proposal are from before FuF was made an issues editor, and the Forest positions and deeds had nothing to do with issues. I believe it's legal, but I'd like others opinions.
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Postby SkyDip » Thu Jul 16, 2020 9:42 am

Kuriko wrote:
SkyDip wrote:I mean you’ve sort of talked around it, but R1 pretty explicitly states that you can’t C&C a nation for actions undertaken as an issues moderator, which is the bulk of this proposal.

The issues listed in the proposal are from before FuF was made an issues editor, and the Forest positions and deeds had nothing to do with issues. I believe it's legal, but I'd like others opinions.

Strictly interpreting the rules, it looks legal to me, if not...verbose.
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Gordano and Lysandus wrote:SkyDip's actions have, ultimately, destroyed the World Assembly.

Eist wrote:Yea... If you are just going to casually dismiss SkyDip's advice, you are probably not going to get very far at all.

Sedgistan wrote:SkyDip is trying to help, and is giving sound advice. I'd suggestion listening to him, as he has experience of writing (and advising others with) legal proposals.

Frisbeeteria wrote:What Skydip said. This bitchfest is an embarrassment to the Security Council.

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Postby Noahs Second Country » Thu Jul 16, 2020 9:55 am

Kuriko wrote:Could I also possibly get a legality ruling on the lamenting clause? It's supposed to be referencing the fact that FuF was an issues editor, but I'm not sure of its legality.

Reading the clause, I had no idea what it was referencing at all. With that in mind, I'm not sure if it's really necessary for it to be included as I doubt many others will read it and think "oh, issues editor". I don't think any other commendations for editors in the past have included referencing them as an issue editor either.

Additionally, it seems rather repetitive to write "as presented in" as opposed to leading with the title and following with a description of the issue.

Support.

EDIT: You also add "also known as FuF" then never refer to them by FuF so that seems unnecessary.
Last edited by Noahs Second Country on Thu Jul 16, 2020 9:58 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Drasnia » Thu Jul 16, 2020 10:00 am

Gotta Go Fast is #1151, and was added about 120 issues after FuF was made editor. Use any other issue before ~#1030 as that was what was being reported at the time Fuf was made editor.

For the chronology, FuF became an editor on July 24, 2018 and stepped down on January 1, 2020. Gotta Go Fast was first reported January 22, 2019 which would most likely make it a rules violation to mention that issue specifically.
Last edited by Drasnia on Thu Jul 16, 2020 10:00 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Postby Kuriko » Thu Jul 16, 2020 10:08 am

Drasnia wrote:Gotta Go Fast is #1151, and was added about 120 issues after FuF was made editor. Use any other issue before ~#1030 as that was what was being reported at the time Fuf was made editor.

For the chronology, FuF became an editor on July 24, 2018 and stepped down on January 1, 2020. Gotta Go Fast was first reported January 22, 2019 which would most likely make it a rules violation to mention that issue specifically.

*looks at Candensia* we'll find a replacement, thanks!
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Postby Drasnia » Thu Jul 16, 2020 10:12 am

Kuriko wrote:
Drasnia wrote:Gotta Go Fast is #1151, and was added about 120 issues after FuF was made editor. Use any other issue before ~#1030 as that was what was being reported at the time Fuf was made editor.

For the chronology, FuF became an editor on July 24, 2018 and stepped down on January 1, 2020. Gotta Go Fast was first reported January 22, 2019 which would most likely make it a rules violation to mention that issue specifically.

*looks at Candensia* we'll find a replacement, thanks!

*Shakes fist at Candensia* Stop writing incredibly good issues so you can proofread!

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Postby Candensia » Thu Jul 16, 2020 10:15 am

Hey, I prepared a list of issues written before FuF became an editor, precisely to prevent me from making this mistake. I just, uh, forgot to check against the list!
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Postby Kuriko » Thu Jul 16, 2020 10:22 am

Noahs Second Country wrote:
Kuriko wrote:Could I also possibly get a legality ruling on the lamenting clause? It's supposed to be referencing the fact that FuF was an issues editor, but I'm not sure of its legality.

Reading the clause, I had no idea what it was referencing at all. With that in mind, I'm not sure if it's really necessary for it to be included as I doubt many others will read it and think "oh, issues editor". I don't think any other commendations for editors in the past have included referencing them as an issue editor either.

Additionally, it seems rather repetitive to write "as presented in" as opposed to leading with the title and following with a description of the issue.

Support.

EDIT: You also add "also known as FuF" then never refer to them by FuF so that seems unnecessary.

Yeah, I'll take these suggestions into account. Thanks Noah :)
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Postby Dollystana » Thu Jul 16, 2020 10:25 am

This is awesome! Finally, doing what commendations are meant to do.
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Postby Morover » Thu Jul 16, 2020 10:36 am

Why do you include the shorthand of "FuF" and then proceed to never use it again? More feedback incoming, probably.

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Postby Kuriko » Thu Jul 16, 2020 12:24 pm

Morover wrote:Why do you include the shorthand of "FuF" and then proceed to never use it again? More feedback incoming, probably.

I was originally going to use FuF, then Can wrote his portion using the whole name and I said might as well.

Edit: draft updated.
Last edited by Kuriko on Thu Jul 16, 2020 1:15 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Tinhampton » Thu Jul 16, 2020 3:39 pm

I hate to pull a Proposal Vivisection on a draft written by the most prolific author in SC history, but... erm, yeah. Usual take-what-you-want policy applies, but I'd rather not be credited as a co-author:
The Security Council,

Recognising that, across the known multiverse, many nations and their citizens have dedicated precious time to the cause of bringing important decisions to national leaders,

Identifying Frieden-und Freudenland (also known as FuF), which has dedicated half a decade of invaluable service to this cause, as a shining example of such a nation,

Lauding FuF's efforts in bringing at least twelve issues of national significance to the attention of world leaders - although many experts believe that this figure is in fact much higher - among them:
  • political campaigns of foreign leaders accused of rights abuses (as presented in Is There An Election In Marche Noire Or Are You Just Happy To See Us?),
  • paying overtime wages to employees for their commute to work (as presented in Sit-Down Money),
  • the legality of employing child actors (as presented in Never Work With Children),
  • parents sharing pictures of their children on the internet (as presented in Paparazzi Parents), and
  • whether to abolish the policy of birthright citizenship (as presented in Baby Shower),

Further highlighting the multiple and diverse contributions made by FuF to their home region of Forest, among them:
  • publishing its first newspaper, the Forest News Leaf, which featured news stories from many of Forest's resident nations,
  • establishing the Forest Photo Contest in 2015, which is now an annual spectacular that attracts photographers of the natural environment from around the multiverse, and
  • holding many government positions, including the post of Culture Minister from 2016 to 2017, where (among other achievements) they continued to organise the Photo Contest, and

Concluding that FuF's accomplishments, in the service of their home region as well as world leaders, are more than sufficient to merit Security Council recognition:

Hereby commends Frieden-und Freudenland.

Co-authored by Candensia

My only red line is that you change "Sit Down Money" (without a hyphen) in the LAUDING clause to its proper title, "Sit-Down Money" (with a hyphen) :P
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Postby Honeydewistania » Thu Jul 16, 2020 4:25 pm

Pretty good, support.

Although:
nation is credited with raising no fewer than 12 issues of significance with the international community, many estimates put this number much higher;


This reads like you’re mentioning their issues while being an editor, which might be illegal.
Last edited by Honeydewistania on Thu Jul 16, 2020 4:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Electrum » Thu Jul 16, 2020 4:56 pm

I think we'll need a mod's ruling on this one, but isn't it possible we decouple the act of writing an issue with the act of editing an issue? So we could consider all of what FuF wrote, even while an IE, but not the issues they edited (including their own). The job of an IE is to edit and refine issues, provide stats, etc. but not to provide the original idea of the issue itself.
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Postby SherpDaWerp » Thu Jul 16, 2020 5:03 pm

Electrum wrote:I think we'll need a mod's ruling on this one, but isn't it possible we decouple the act of writing an issue with the act of editing an issue? So we could consider all of what FuF wrote, even while an IE, but not the issues they edited (including their own). The job of an IE is to edit and refine issues, provide stats, etc. but not to provide the original idea of the issue itself.

The problem is more complicated than that. As an editor, people have access to backstage conversations about which issues are most needed to fill holes in the issue base (issues that are more likely to be published), as well as direct feedback from other editors.

That significant advantage is why issues written as an editor (even if they were published by someone else) aren't able to be counted in a C/C.

EDIT: Link to original ruling by Wrapper, and link to USS Monitor making the point that I just paraphrased
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Postby Candensia » Thu Jul 16, 2020 7:24 pm

Honeydewistania wrote:Pretty good, support.

Although:
nation is credited with raising no fewer than 12 issues of significance with the international community, many estimates put this number much higher;


This reads like you’re mentioning their issues while being an editor, which might be illegal.
Electrum wrote:I think we'll need a mod's ruling on this one, but isn't it possible we decouple the act of writing an issue with the act of editing an issue? So we could consider all of what FuF wrote, even while an IE, but not the issues they edited (including their own). The job of an IE is to edit and refine issues, provide stats, etc. but not to provide the original idea of the issue itself.


I contend that the clause is legal, not because it decouples the act of writing an issue from the action of editing an issue, but rather because it doesn't credit FuF with anything she did as an editor.

The clause only explicitly credits FuF with 12 issues written as a non-editor, these are legal. The clause does contain language that implies that FuF is responsible for more than these 12, but does so in unspecific terms, only acknowledging that such issues are "debated by experts", and therefore cannot be fully credited.

I think extending credit to FuF for issues written as an IE would be illegal. The question is rather can a C/C legally acknowledge the existence of issues written by IEs, as long as it doesn’t credit the IE with writing them?
Last edited by Candensia on Thu Jul 16, 2020 7:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Drasnia
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Postby Drasnia » Thu Jul 16, 2020 7:47 pm

I'm not really sure why we're having this issue (pardon the pun) now. It's already been established multiple times that editors can be C/C'd for there work prior to joining the editing team.

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Postby Kuriko » Fri Jul 17, 2020 3:34 am

Tinhampton wrote:I hate to pull a Proposal Vivisection on a draft written by the most prolific author in SC history, but... erm, yeah. Usual take-what-you-want policy applies, but I'd rather not be credited as a co-author:
The Security Council,

Recognising that, across the known multiverse, many nations and their citizens have dedicated precious time to the cause of bringing important decisions to national leaders,

Identifying Frieden-und Freudenland (also known as FuF), which has dedicated half a decade of invaluable service to this cause, as a shining example of such a nation,

Lauding FuF's efforts in bringing at least twelve issues of national significance to the attention of world leaders - although many experts believe that this figure is in fact much higher - among them:
  • political campaigns of foreign leaders accused of rights abuses (as presented in Is There An Election In Marche Noire Or Are You Just Happy To See Us?),
  • paying overtime wages to employees for their commute to work (as presented in Sit-Down Money),
  • the legality of employing child actors (as presented in Never Work With Children),
  • parents sharing pictures of their children on the internet (as presented in Paparazzi Parents), and
  • whether to abolish the policy of birthright citizenship (as presented in Baby Shower),

Further highlighting the multiple and diverse contributions made by FuF to their home region of Forest, among them:
  • publishing its first newspaper, the Forest News Leaf, which featured news stories from many of Forest's resident nations,
  • establishing the Forest Photo Contest in 2015, which is now an annual spectacular that attracts photographers of the natural environment from around the multiverse, and
  • holding many government positions, including the post of Culture Minister from 2016 to 2017, where (among other achievements) they continued to organise the Photo Contest, and

Concluding that FuF's accomplishments, in the service of their home region as well as world leaders, are more than sufficient to merit Security Council recognition:

Hereby commends Frieden-und Freudenland.

Co-authored by Candensia

My only red line is that you change "Sit Down Money" (without a hyphen) in the LAUDING clause to its proper title, "Sit-Down Money" (with a hyphen) :P

That's not a vivisection, that's a proposed re-write of the proposal. Thanks, but no thanks I'll stick with my own wording. I'll fix the issue title though, so thanks for pointing that out :).

Honeydewistania wrote:Pretty good, support.

Although:
nation is credited with raising no fewer than 12 issues of significance with the international community, many estimates put this number much higher;


This reads like you’re mentioning their issues while being an editor, which might be illegal.
The clause is legal, not illegal.
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Postby Sedgistan » Fri Jul 17, 2020 3:37 am

The "Acknowledging" clause reads like an attempted Rule 1 dodge, and I don't think it's going to fly. That's not a ruling, but notice that it's being discussed and that's the way things are leaning.

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Postby Honeydewistania » Fri Jul 17, 2020 3:37 am

Sedgistan wrote:The "Acknowledging" clause reads like an attempted Rule 1 dodge, and I don't think it's going to fly. That's not a ruling, but notice that it's being discussed and that's the way things are leaning.


Wait, I was right? :blink:
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Postby Kuriko » Fri Jul 17, 2020 3:52 am

Sedgistan wrote:The "Acknowledging" clause reads like an attempted Rule 1 dodge, and I don't think it's going to fly. That's not a ruling, but notice that it's being discussed and that's the way things are leaning.

How is it illegal to say that someone has authored more issues than we're allowed to put in the proposal? We're not allowed to say that she's authored 24 issues, but it seems a disservice to say that she's only authored 12 issues which is half of what she's actually done.
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Sedgistan
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Postby Sedgistan » Fri Jul 17, 2020 4:18 am

Your question is essentially "how is it illegal to say something that it's not legal to say?". You can't do it legally. Yes, it means FuF can't be credited for the issues added since she was a member of the team. That's a fundamental principle of the rules - Commendations/Condemnations are not the appropriate place to recognise work done by site staff.

You can avoid this to an extent by removing mention of "12" and using an adjective such as "numerous" instead. 12 is numerous. So is 24.

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