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[SUBMITTED] Promoting Biomedical Research

Where WA members debate how to improve the world, one resolution at a time.

how do you rate this proposal? Please leave suggestions if any

Great
1
8%
Good
2
17%
Moderate
2
17%
Bad
3
25%
Worse
4
33%
 
Total votes : 12

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Nelandire
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[SUBMITTED] Promoting Biomedical Research

Postby Nelandire » Mon Mar 12, 2018 10:06 pm

Biomedical Research

Category: Health
Area of effect: Research
Proposed by: Nelandire

Recognizing that health of the citizens being one of the predominant factors that influences the market and thereby is a key driver of a nation's economy, it is of prime importance that this wealth be safeguarded and preserved.

Noting that amidst the global concern on environment regarding global warming, pollution, climate change, improper waste management and rapid industrialization, the highlight on the aforementioned issues overshadows the looming global threat of the decline in health.

Recognizing that a rise in pollution levels, increased global consumption of elements rendered unhealthy, subscription to genetically modified food and detrimental food industry practices have resulted in exponential increase of health issues,
Alarmed at the surge in cancer related cases, in particular Leukemia, although relatively unknown of its causes, scientists speculate that environmental factors might be a reason.

Therefore, noting the above, to prevent potential future economic downturns due to issues of health, to take preventive measures against diseases that risk high rate of fatality as well as transmission such as AIDS, cancer, to uphold the value of health that serves as a premise of the GAR#412 enactment and to incentivize as well as nourish research,

The General Assembly,

Hereby, mandates the following measures to be enacted by the authority vested in the General Assembly:
1. Member nations shall allocate a suitable percentage of their GDP in accordance with the nation's economic capacity towards biomedical
research as defined under GAR#219.

2. All member nations shall establish a dedicated central facility for the research under a health centre of national importance and ensure that
patients have access to the treatments resulting from the research.

3. To motivate research in academic spheres, member nations shall allow academic institutions within their jurisdiction to establish centres of biomedical research upon approval from the respective governmental administration.

4. To ensure talent resources are fully exploited and to promote biomedical field, a portion of the allocated fund mentioned in clause 1 shall be utilized as grants for the research proposals.

5. To ensure that benefits of the research are accessible and to create awareness among the public, a minor portion of the allotted fund as mandated in clause 1, deemed appropriate by the authority shall be utilized in providing limited subsidized biomedical health treatment to low income groups and on a case by case basis to other income groups.

CREATES the Bio-Ethics Council on Research (BECR) within World Health Authority (WHA) whose task shall be the following:
1. To ensure that the research conducted by member nations are within the ethical standards set by the council following the mandates enacted in GAR#425.
2. To ensure that the activities of Biomedical Innovation Organization (BIO), established under GAR#219 comes within the purview of the council regarding the ethical standard.
3. To serve as an advisory to the WHA, General Assembly, WA members and organizations concerning the issues of ethical nature that
pertains to the advancement in research.

CLARIFIES that the above legislation,

1. Seeks to promote biomedical research whereby mandates 1,2,3,4 ensure financial, infrastructural support while enabling talent
acquisition and mandate 5 facilitates in spreading awareness on biomedical treatments.
2. Does not seek to define or modify matters pertaining to the ethical standards of biomedical research.
3. Does not mandate free healthcare.
4. Has not fully defined the functional role of BECR noting that setting a comprehensive standard on ethical practices in biomedicine requires
a consensual agreement on where the standard lies and therefore scope of BECR is subject to further legislation. Hence mandates in
GAR#425 shall provide a framework in congruence with the function vested by this mandate for the functioning of BECR ad interim.

Taking note of the lagging scientific and economic progress of some member nations,

SUGGESTS all the scientifically and technologically advanced member nations to collaborate with their counterparts to help with capacity building programmes and setting up of facilities utilizing the funds allocated as per the first mandate.
Last edited by Nelandire on Tue Mar 13, 2018 8:56 pm, edited 6 times in total.

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The First German Order
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Postby The First German Order » Tue Mar 13, 2018 7:57 am

OOC: Could we get a strength? Also this seems duplicated.
Last edited by The First German Order on Tue Mar 13, 2018 7:58 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Nelandire
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Founded: Mar 03, 2018
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Postby Nelandire » Tue Mar 13, 2018 8:26 am

The First German Order wrote:OOC: Could we get a strength? Also this seems duplicated.

I do not understand what you meant by strength. I am new here so pardon me if it may seem that it is too early to give out a proposal.
Also, I am genuinely disappointed that you have felt it may be duplicated but I can certify 100% to the fact that this is original and not copied.
To my best, I have ensured that there are no other other similar proposals, the closest would be the one I mentioned in the proposal itself and repealed proposal #49.

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Kenmoria
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Postby Kenmoria » Tue Mar 13, 2018 8:45 am

Nelandire wrote:
The First German Order wrote:OOC: Could we get a strength? Also this seems duplicated.

I do not understand what you meant by strength. I am new here so pardon me if it may seem that it is too early to give out a proposal.
Also, I am genuinely disappointed that you have felt it may be duplicated but I can certify 100% to the fact that this is original and not copied.
To my best, I have ensured that there are no other other similar proposals, the closest would be the one I mentioned in the proposal itself and repealed proposal #49.

(OOC: Every proposal has a category (what the proposal does, for example environmental) and either a a strength (mild, significant or strong), or an area of effect (what part of the category the proposal affects).)
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Not in the WA despite coincidentally following all resolutions
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The First German Order
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Postby The First German Order » Tue Mar 13, 2018 8:47 am

Nelandire wrote:
The First German Order wrote:OOC: Could we get a strength? Also this seems duplicated.

I do not understand what you meant by strength. I am new here so pardon me if it may seem that it is too early to give out a proposal.
Also, I am genuinely disappointed that you have felt it may be duplicated but I can certify 100% to the fact that this is original and not copied.
To my best, I have ensured that there are no other other similar proposals, the closest would be the one I mentioned in the proposal itself and repealed proposal #49.

OOC: I never said it was plagiarized, I'm just asking if it's a duplication of "Protection of a Biomedical Research".
”Nuclear strikes do not damage the phone network. The atom respects your right to a final call.” - Dumb Ideologies

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Masurbia
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Postby Masurbia » Tue Mar 13, 2018 8:48 am

Nelandire wrote:
The First German Order wrote:OOC: Could we get a strength? Also this seems duplicated.

I do not understand what you meant by strength. I am new here so pardon me if it may seem that it is too early to give out a proposal.
Also, I am genuinely disappointed that you have felt it may be duplicated but I can certify 100% to the fact that this is original and not copied.
To my best, I have ensured that there are no other other similar proposals, the closest would be the one I mentioned in the proposal itself and repealed proposal #49.

Have you looked at protection of biomedical research which looks very similar to your proposal here (The exact name). And under the “The General Assembly” you say “Hereby RECOMMENDS” which doesn’t do anything. It should be mandates or requires.
I see, therefore I am not blind.

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The New California Republic
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Postby The New California Republic » Tue Mar 13, 2018 8:49 am

Nelandire wrote:CREATES the Bio-Ethics Council on Research (BECR) within World health Authority (WHA) whose task shall be the following:

OOC: As a general rule, it is better to use a pre-existing committee that has already been created by prior WA Resolutions, as adding more committees to the WA committee pile should be avoided at all costs.
Last edited by Friedrich Nietzsche on Thu Jan 03, 1889 13:05 pm, edited 999 times in total.

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Current President of The NCR: Aaron Kimball.
Current NCR Ambassador to The World Assembly: Colonel James Hsu, NCR Army (Ret.)
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Copperward
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Postby Copperward » Tue Mar 13, 2018 8:51 am

Nelandire wrote:
The First German Order wrote:OOC: Could we get a strength? Also this seems duplicated.

I do not understand what you meant by strength. I am new here so pardon me if it may seem that it is too early to give out a proposal.
Also, I am genuinely disappointed that you have felt it may be duplicated but I can certify 100% to the fact that this is original and not copied.
To my best, I have ensured that there are no other other similar proposals, the closest would be the one I mentioned in the proposal itself and repealed proposal #49.


OOC:
Welcome to the World Assembly and GA forums. To get acquainted with proposal writing, I would recommend reading passed proposals to understand more about proposal-writing in the General Assembly. I would also recommend reading the General Assembly Rules for Proposals..
A proposal's "strength" is the measure of how much the proposal's mandates would affect nations. The strength can range from mild to significant.
Also, when First German Order says that this proposal may be "duplication," he is not alleging you of plagiarizing material, but is referring to the WA's "Duplication rule," a rule that states that proposals cannot repeat a specific action or concept featured in another passed resolution.

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Industrial West Virginia
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Postby Industrial West Virginia » Tue Mar 13, 2018 9:03 am

CREATES the Bio-Ethics Council on Research (BECR) within World health Authority (WHA) whose task shall be the following:


World *Health* Authority. Capitalize the H.

Therefore, noting the above, to prevent potential future economic downturns due to issues of health, to take preventive measures against diseases that risk high rate of fatality as well as transmission such as AIDS, Cancer, to uphold the value of health that serves as a premise of the GAR#412 enactment and to incentivize as well as nourish research,


Uncapitalize the C in Cancer.

3. To serve as an advisory to the WHA, General Assembly, its member nations and organizations concerning the issues of
ethical nature that pertains to the advancement in research


*and* its member nations + lack of punctuation?
The absolute madman.

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Nelandire
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Postby Nelandire » Tue Mar 13, 2018 9:19 am

Masurbia wrote:
Nelandire wrote:I do not understand what you meant by strength. I am new here so pardon me if it may seem that it is too early to give out a proposal.
Also, I am genuinely disappointed that you have felt it may be duplicated but I can certify 100% to the fact that this is original and not copied.
To my best, I have ensured that there are no other other similar proposals, the closest would be the one I mentioned in the proposal itself and repealed proposal #49.

Have you looked at protection of biomedical research which looks very similar to your proposal here (The exact name). And under the “The General Assembly” you say “Hereby RECOMMENDS” which doesn’t do anything. It should be mandates or requires.

Thank You for pointing out that resolution, I dont know how I missed it but anyway that resolution mentions, I quote 'clarifies that the research is subject to extant legislation'
Mandates 4 and 5 only skims through the topic of ethics, I feel neither of them are specific but they serve better as guidelines for further legislation. Mandate 3, is about the disclosure of research conducted. Mandates 1 and 2 touch upon ethics of limiting experimentation to species ascertained to be sapient.
So as per my understanding, this resolution serves better as an ethics guideline on conducting research than promoting research.

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Nelandire
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Postby Nelandire » Tue Mar 13, 2018 9:21 am

Industrial West Virginia wrote:
CREATES the Bio-Ethics Council on Research (BECR) within World health Authority (WHA) whose task shall be the following:


World *Health* Authority. Capitalize the H.

Therefore, noting the above, to prevent potential future economic downturns due to issues of health, to take preventive measures against diseases that risk high rate of fatality as well as transmission such as AIDS, Cancer, to uphold the value of health that serves as a premise of the GAR#412 enactment and to incentivize as well as nourish research,


Uncapitalize the C in Cancer.

3. To serve as an advisory to the WHA, General Assembly, its member nations and organizations concerning the issues of
ethical nature that pertains to the advancement in research


*and* its member nations + lack of punctuation?

Duly noted, Thank You!

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Nelandire
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Postby Nelandire » Tue Mar 13, 2018 9:26 am

The New California Republic wrote:
Nelandire wrote:CREATES the Bio-Ethics Council on Research (BECR) within World health Authority (WHA) whose task shall be the following:

OOC: As a general rule, it is better to use a pre-existing committee that has already been created by prior WA Resolutions, as adding more committees to the WA committee pile should be avoided at all costs.

Thank you for the suggestion. I was not aware that there were many committees and I could only find two of them relating to biomedicine so perhaps I thought adding one more would make the organizations function better and stricter as far as ethics is concerned.

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The First German Order
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Postby The First German Order » Tue Mar 13, 2018 9:31 am

"We don't allow any private healthcare nor do we give grants to anyone. We already have a set budget for our healthcare and we do not plan on dedicating anymore of our funds to healthcare. If people cannot afford healthcare we are not giving them the money to be able to afford it, they can fer a job of their own. And finally, what ethics is this "council" going to enforce? You have not defined nor have you set any ethics in your proposal."
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Nelandire
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Postby Nelandire » Tue Mar 13, 2018 9:37 am

The First German Order wrote:
Nelandire wrote:I do not understand what you meant by strength. I am new here so pardon me if it may seem that it is too early to give out a proposal.
Also, I am genuinely disappointed that you have felt it may be duplicated but I can certify 100% to the fact that this is original and not copied.
To my best, I have ensured that there are no other other similar proposals, the closest would be the one I mentioned in the proposal itself and repealed proposal #49.

OOC: I never said it was plagiarized, I'm just asking if it's a duplication of "Protection of a Biomedical Research".

I do not think it is a duplication (Except for the name maybe), both emphasizes different aspects of the same area. kindly see my reply to Masurbia and do let me know your thoughts.

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Nelandire
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Postby Nelandire » Tue Mar 13, 2018 9:48 am

The First German Order wrote:"We don't allow any private healthcare nor do we give grants to anyone. We already have a set budget for our healthcare and we do not plan on dedicating anymore of our funds to healthcare. If people cannot afford healthcare we are not giving them the money to be able to afford it, they can fer a job of their own. And finally, what ethics is this "council" going to enforce? You have not defined nor have you set any ethics in your proposal."

It is not private health care, It explicitly states that nation sets apart a portion. I do not exactly understand what you meant by not giving grants but anyway how exactly does a research takes place if grants are not given to those who conduct research?
The aspect of ethics is already mandated according to the resolution in Protection of Biomed Research, perhaps like you probably meant I can emphasize some points.
healthcare and its research usually does not have clear distinction,both go hand in hand, and the proposal is not to provide free healthcare but to provide a little subsidy since research expenditure could go high and therefore depriving the poor of its benefits.

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The First German Order
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Postby The First German Order » Tue Mar 13, 2018 11:45 am

Nelandire wrote:
The First German Order wrote:"We don't allow any private healthcare nor do we give grants to anyone. We already have a set budget for our healthcare and we do not plan on dedicating anymore of our funds to healthcare. If people cannot afford healthcare we are not giving them the money to be able to afford it, they can fer a job of their own. And finally, what ethics is this "council" going to enforce? You have not defined nor have you set any ethics in your proposal."

It is not private health care, It explicitly states that nation sets apart a portion. I do not exactly understand what you meant by not giving grants but anyway how exactly does a research takes place if grants are not given to those who conduct research?
The aspect of ethics is already mandated according to the resolution in Protection of Biomed Research, perhaps like you probably meant I can emphasize some points.
healthcare and its research usually does not have clear distinction,both go hand in hand, and the proposal is not to provide free healthcare but to provide a little subsidy since research expenditure could go high and therefore depriving the poor of its benefits.

“Our government does the research and we don’t give grants. We have a set budget. Meanwhile you said that the “council” enforces the ethics that it comes up with, not ethics from ‘Protection of Biomedical Research’. Also, what do you mean by “depriving the poor of its benefits”? I don’t see how not subsidizing research that doesn’t need to be subsidized, for us at least, will “deprive the poor of its benefits”.”
OOC: I think that relying on the ethics set by “Protection of Biomedical Research” may be a HoC violation though I may be wrong.
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The First German Order
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Postby The First German Order » Tue Mar 13, 2018 11:45 am

The First German Order wrote:
Nelandire wrote:It is not private health care, It explicitly states that nation sets apart a portion. I do not exactly understand what you meant by not giving grants but anyway how exactly does a research takes place if grants are not given to those who conduct research?
The aspect of ethics is already mandated according to the resolution in Protection of Biomed Research, perhaps like you probably meant I can emphasize some points.
healthcare and its research usually does not have clear distinction,both go hand in hand, and the proposal is not to provide free healthcare but to provide a little subsidy since research expenditure could go high and therefore depriving the poor of its benefits.

“Our government does the research and we don’t give grants. We have a set budget. Meanwhile you said that the “council” enforces the ethics that it comes up with, not ethics from ‘Protection of Biomedical Research’. Also, what do you mean by “depriving the poor of its benefits”? I don’t see how not subsidizing research that doesn’t need to be subsidized, for us at least, will “deprive the poor of its benefits”.”
OOC: I think that relying on the ethics set by “Protection of Biomedical Research” may be an HoC violation though I may be wrong.
”Nuclear strikes do not damage the phone network. The atom respects your right to a final call.” - Dumb Ideologies

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Nelandire
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Postby Nelandire » Tue Mar 13, 2018 12:09 pm

The First German Order wrote:
Nelandire wrote:It is not private health care, It explicitly states that nation sets apart a portion. I do not exactly understand what you meant by not giving grants but anyway how exactly does a research takes place if grants are not given to those who conduct research?
The aspect of ethics is already mandated according to the resolution in Protection of Biomed Research, perhaps like you probably meant I can emphasize some points.
healthcare and its research usually does not have clear distinction,both go hand in hand, and the proposal is not to provide free healthcare but to provide a little subsidy since research expenditure could go high and therefore depriving the poor of its benefits.

“Our government does the research and we don’t give grants. We have a set budget. Meanwhile you said that the “council” enforces the ethics that it comes up with, not ethics from ‘Protection of Biomedical Research’. Also, what do you mean by “depriving the poor of its benefits”? I don’t see how not subsidizing research that doesn’t need to be subsidized, for us at least, will “deprive the poor of its benefits”.”
OOC: I think that relying on the ethics set by “Protection of Biomedical Research” may be a HoC violation though I may be wrong.


Correct me if I am wrong, government does research by giving grants or in otherwords allocating funds to the respective departments, however in this proposal, it seeks to promote research and awarding grants is also a way to do that (to work in govt labs if not private which is upto the government to decide), it would attract talent, lower unemployment, lower crime and through a series of cause and effect it ultimately reflect in the economy as a positive influence.
I am unusure if my new edits would answer your questions on low income groups and I am also unsure of hoC violation too. Take a look at my new edits if you may and let me know.

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The First German Order
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Postby The First German Order » Tue Mar 13, 2018 12:26 pm

Nelandire wrote:
The First German Order wrote:“Our government does the research and we don’t give grants. We have a set budget. Meanwhile you said that the “council” enforces the ethics that it comes up with, not ethics from ‘Protection of Biomedical Research’. Also, what do you mean by “depriving the poor of its benefits”? I don’t see how not subsidizing research that doesn’t need to be subsidized, for us at least, will “deprive the poor of its benefits”.”
OOC: I think that relying on the ethics set by “Protection of Biomedical Research” may be a HoC violation though I may be wrong.


Correct me if I am wrong, government does research by giving grants or in otherwords allocating funds to the respective departments, however in this proposal, it seeks to promote research and awarding grants is also a way to do that (to work in govt labs if not private which is upto the government to decide), it would attract talent, lower unemployment, lower crime and through a series of cause and effect it ultimately reflect in the economy as a positive influence.
I am unusure if my new edits would answer your questions on low income groups and I am also unsure of hoC violation too. Take a look at my new edits if you may and let me know.

IC: "A government provides a budget and if the research requires more funding than they were given then they allocate more funding to that department. It's not just a one-time grant, it's higher funding until the research is complete. Also how would this result in a positive influence? It doesn't seem like this would lower crime or unemployment. If someone is poor and can't get a job, what makes you think that they'll have the required education and experience to be a researcher?"
OOC: Was your response IC or OOC? Mine was IC and OOC so you'd have to split it up as the HoC violation (if there is one) wouldn't be IC.
”Nuclear strikes do not damage the phone network. The atom respects your right to a final call.” - Dumb Ideologies

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Nelandire
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Postby Nelandire » Tue Mar 13, 2018 12:39 pm

The First German Order wrote:
Nelandire wrote:
Correct me if I am wrong, government does research by giving grants or in otherwords allocating funds to the respective departments, however in this proposal, it seeks to promote research and awarding grants is also a way to do that (to work in govt labs if not private which is upto the government to decide), it would attract talent, lower unemployment, lower crime and through a series of cause and effect it ultimately reflect in the economy as a positive influence.
I am unusure if my new edits would answer your questions on low income groups and I am also unsure of hoC violation too. Take a look at my new edits if you may and let me know.

IC: "A government provides a budget and if the research requires more funding than they were given then they allocate more funding to that department. It's not just a one-time grant, it's higher funding until the research is complete. Also how would this result in a positive influence? It doesn't seem like this would lower crime or unemployment. If someone is poor and can't get a job, what makes you think that they'll have the required education and experience to be a researcher?"
OOC: Was your response IC or OOC? Mine was IC and OOC so you'd have to split it up as the HoC violation (if there is one) wouldn't be IC.

The proposal does not mention anything about a specific amount allocated to research, just a suitable amount according to a nation's capability. however, it is completely the prerogative of the government to decide what requires more funding, a militaristic nation puts more emphasis on defence, a science and tech nation puts emphasis on R&D and so on.
If an economy is a primitive one (or less advanced one), surely this amounts to little decrease in crime or unemployment but I am inclined to say that is not the case because the proposal suggest the well off economies to help poorer ones via capacity building and sorts, so definitely there must be some decrease in unemployment and crimes is it not? Also I must say you wrongly assume that there cant be a poor or unemployed person with good education! You have plenty of real life examples that could prove your assumption wrong. As a fact I have seen many unemployed engineers !

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The First German Order
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Postby The First German Order » Tue Mar 13, 2018 12:42 pm

Nelandire wrote:
The First German Order wrote:IC: "A government provides a budget and if the research requires more funding than they were given then they allocate more funding to that department. It's not just a one-time grant, it's higher funding until the research is complete. Also how would this result in a positive influence? It doesn't seem like this would lower crime or unemployment. If someone is poor and can't get a job, what makes you think that they'll have the required education and experience to be a researcher?"
OOC: Was your response IC or OOC? Mine was IC and OOC so you'd have to split it up as the HoC violation (if there is one) wouldn't be IC.

The proposal does not mention anything about a specific amount allocated to research, just a suitable amount according to a nation's capability. however, it is completely the prerogative of the government to decide what requires more funding, a militaristic nation puts more emphasis on defence, a science and tech nation puts emphasis on R&D and so on.
If an economy is a primitive one (or less advanced one), surely this amounts to little decrease in crime or unemployment but I am inclined to say that is not the case because the proposal suggest the well off economies to help poorer ones via capacity building and sorts, so definitely there must be some decrease in unemployment and crimes is it not? Also I must say you wrongly assume that there cant be a poor or unemployed person with good education! You have plenty of real life examples that could prove your assumption wrong. As a fact I have seen many unemployed engineers !

OOC: This is NationStates, not real life.
IC: "I do not have any "real life examples". In our nation if you're poor you most likely don't have a good education and our police force is good enough that we have little to no crime. Our unemployment wouldn't be helped by this because the government invites people who they think are good enough. You can't just get out of collage with a degree and say "Oh, I'm going to be a government scientist!". It just doesn't work. All of what you have said fails to explain how it would help lower crime and unemployment.
”Nuclear strikes do not damage the phone network. The atom respects your right to a final call.” - Dumb Ideologies

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Nelandire
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Postby Nelandire » Tue Mar 13, 2018 1:06 pm

The First German Order wrote:
Nelandire wrote:The proposal does not mention anything about a specific amount allocated to research, just a suitable amount according to a nation's capability. however, it is completely the prerogative of the government to decide what requires more funding, a militaristic nation puts more emphasis on defence, a science and tech nation puts emphasis on R&D and so on.
If an economy is a primitive one (or less advanced one), surely this amounts to little decrease in crime or unemployment but I am inclined to say that is not the case because the proposal suggest the well off economies to help poorer ones via capacity building and sorts, so definitely there must be some decrease in unemployment and crimes is it not? Also I must say you wrongly assume that there cant be a poor or unemployed person with good education! You have plenty of real life examples that could prove your assumption wrong. As a fact I have seen many unemployed engineers !

OOC: This is NationStates, not real life.
IC: "I do not have any "real life examples". In our nation if you're poor you most likely don't have a good education and our police force is good enough that we have little to no crime. Our unemployment wouldn't be helped by this because the government invites people who they think are good enough. You can't just get out of collage with a degree and say "Oh, I'm going to be a government scientist!". It just doesn't work. All of what you have said fails to explain how it would help lower crime and unemployment.

I thought NS had its basis on real life( eg: WA, budgets, terrorism, etc.,) So I believe it is helpful to think of them.
I cannot offer you much towards enabling you see if you totally base your understanding on the game mechanics itself. however as a final attempt to help you with it, let me reiterate, no country that is not advanced enough to do some amount of science can benefit from the resolution however it does offer a sort of help via other scientifically established nations to equip some citizens to do research (even if its 200 scientists in a million , it is a decrease in unemployment) now for research, facilities require maintenance, there are logistical needs, scientists spent money (affects local retailers and etc.,) . I hope now you can get a better picture! Now research itself may not give an economy its boost, its the preserving of good health that gives a major positive influence( research -> better health -> -> better productivity -> economic growth), unemployement and crime too comes in somewhere along the chain of cause and effects as I mentioned beforehand. I take cues from real life to better understand this. I rest my case. :)

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The First German Order
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Postby The First German Order » Tue Mar 13, 2018 1:38 pm

Nelandire wrote:
The First German Order wrote:OOC: This is NationStates, not real life.
IC: "I do not have any "real life examples". In our nation if you're poor you most likely don't have a good education and our police force is good enough that we have little to no crime. Our unemployment wouldn't be helped by this because the government invites people who they think are good enough. You can't just get out of collage with a degree and say "Oh, I'm going to be a government scientist!". It just doesn't work. All of what you have said fails to explain how it would help lower crime and unemployment.

I thought NS had its basis on real life( eg: WA, budgets, terrorism, etc.,) So I believe it is helpful to think of them.
I cannot offer you much towards enabling you see if you totally base your understanding on the game mechanics itself. however as a final attempt to help you with it, let me reiterate, no country that is not advanced enough to do some amount of science can benefit from the resolution however it does offer a sort of help via other scientifically established nations to equip some citizens to do research (even if its 200 scientists in a million , it is a decrease in unemployment) now for research, facilities require maintenance, there are logistical needs, scientists spent money (affects local retailers and etc.,) . I hope now you can get a better picture! Now research itself may not give an economy its boost, its the preserving of good health that gives a major positive influence( research -> better health -> -> better productivity -> economic growth), unemployement and crime too comes in somewhere along the chain of cause and effects as I mentioned beforehand. I take cues from real life to better understand this. I rest my case. :)

IC: “You’re still making literally zero sense. Our government only selects already employed scientists and offers them an opportunity to work for the government. That would not help unemployment and this proposal would not help reduce crime in any way. Ontop of that you have given me zero evidence to back up your claims. I refuse to believe your claims unless you give me some evidence.”
OOC: RL stuff doesn’t work as evidence for proposals on NS, nor can it be used in IC debates on NS.
”Nuclear strikes do not damage the phone network. The atom respects your right to a final call.” - Dumb Ideologies

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Masurbia
Envoy
 
Posts: 228
Founded: Dec 08, 2017
Ex-Nation

Postby Masurbia » Tue Mar 13, 2018 1:56 pm

The First German Order wrote:
Nelandire wrote:I thought NS had its basis on real life( eg: WA, budgets, terrorism, etc.,) So I believe it is helpful to think of them.
I cannot offer you much towards enabling you see if you totally base your understanding on the game mechanics itself. however as a final attempt to help you with it, let me reiterate, no country that is not advanced enough to do some amount of science can benefit from the resolution however it does offer a sort of help via other scientifically established nations to equip some citizens to do research (even if its 200 scientists in a million , it is a decrease in unemployment) now for research, facilities require maintenance, there are logistical needs, scientists spent money (affects local retailers and etc.,) . I hope now you can get a better picture! Now research itself may not give an economy its boost, its the preserving of good health that gives a major positive influence( research -> better health -> -> better productivity -> economic growth), unemployement and crime too comes in somewhere along the chain of cause and effects as I mentioned beforehand. I take cues from real life to better understand this. I rest my case. :)

IC: “You’re still making literally zero sense. Our government only selects already employed scientists and offers them an opportunity to work for the government. That would not help unemployment and this proposal would not help reduce crime in any way. Ontop of that you have given me zero evidence to back up your claims. I refuse to believe your claims unless you give me some evidence.”
OOC: RL stuff doesn’t work as evidence for proposals on NS, nor can it be used in IC debates on NS.

Just wanna butt in here for a sec, but FGO, you tell Nelandire to provide evidence for his claims, and then say that RL stuff can't be used as evidence? Would you rather them make stuff up?
I see, therefore I am not blind.

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Araraukar
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 11973
Founded: May 14, 2007
Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Araraukar » Tue Mar 13, 2018 2:16 pm

The First German Order wrote:OOC: RL stuff doesn’t work as evidence for proposals on NS, nor can it be used in IC debates on NS.

OOC: Stop giving bad advice, again. RL stuff can absolutely be used as evidence OOCly.

To author: that means that you, the player of this game called NationStates, can use RL examples to back up your claims, but you can't do so in the proposal text and if you do so in IC, other people's characters can treat it as nonsense or examples that only exist in your RP reality.
"I've come to appreciate boring bureaucracy much more after my official execution..." - Johan Milkus, acting ambassador in the absence of miss Leveret
Giovenith wrote:And sorry hun, if you were looking for a forum site where nobody argued, you've come to wrong one.

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