Bullying, damaging or helpful?

[Hittanryan]

YOU THINK I WAS BULLIED SO I COULD GET SYMPATHY AND PITY?! YOU THINK I WANTED TO BE A VICTIM?!? I'm glad you don't live close to me, otherwise I'd show you how much 'pity' I'd want from the likes of you. To even suggest that many people who've posted as victims of bullying are looking for pity is an insult to them, and I, for one, won't take the insult lightly.

Whoa! Where did all the hostility come from? I am not trying to offend you or anyone but offer my take on it.

Then again my take is coming from the guy who yells at the waiter for asking too many questions when the waiter simply asked if I had wanted a drink.
That waiter was an invasive prick.

*That quote is from Holy Trek. I have not idea how to fix it besides just doing this quick edit for I am a semi-retard.

If you're posting in-character still, then you're in the wrong forum.

[The UK in Exile]

or that if your are powerful you become bad.....

Not necessarily as the president is still viewed as good but kids know that he is incredibly powerful.

not all bad guys in films are powerful.

therefore kids will see that movies are often confusing, unrealistic and contradictory, they shouldn't try and draw overarching conclusions from it.

which is valueable lesson to learn.

[The UK in Exile]

not all bad guys in films are powerful.

therefore kids will see that movies are often confusing, unrealistic and contradictory, they shouldn't try and draw overarching conclusions from it.

which is valuable lesson to learn.

You would be surprised. While not all bad guys are powerful the majority(looking at you Disney) are powerful. Those that are just average joes are the minority. Kids take the majority as an example. Though shows such as Arthur do have characters that are bullies show a softer side, Binky Barnes is such an example. If this were type of portrayal was used more often then what Disney does then bullying would most likely recede.

the most likely result is that people would stop watching disney films.

[Hittanryan]

Ok...this will likely get the mods' attention, but I have to say it.....WHAT THE F*CK?!?

It's true, look at how bullying has risen in importance in the media with the lack of school shootings. How much was bullying brought up in the early 90's? Compare that to the early 2000's. Bulling became bigger because of lack of deterrence. Simple concept.

If massacres are your idea of "deterrence," then I don't know what your major malfunction is. Furthermore, school shootings weren't nearly commonplace enough to act as a deterrent in the first place. They made the news, which milked it for a couple of weeks, then people basically casually forgot aside from those towns.

Oh yeah, and about that "pulled a Columbine" idiocy, the shooters ended up dead. Yeah, they didn't get bullied again, but for a rather unacceptable reason.

[CAPRAE]

Whoa! Where did all the hostility come from? I am not trying to offend you or anyone but offer my take on it.

Then again my take is coming from the guy who yells at the waiter for asking too many questions when the waiter simply asked if I had wanted a drink.
That waiter was an invasive prick.

*That quote is from Holy Trek. I have not idea how to fix it besides just doing this quick edit for I am a semi-retard.

If you're posting in-character still, then you're in the wrong forum.

That post was OOC. I actually did not know I was in an OOC forum. I tend to click on the latest forum topics area and post in character becuase I didn't think that people would care if I was in character or not in any forum. I know I can check to see what forum I am in but I am quite the ignorant person so I do not check and I just act in character in order to not get attacked for being OOC in an in character thread.

Now I know and knowing is half the battle.

[Northern Dominus]

Since you missed it on the last page... once more, this time with footnotes and hopefully no waffling.

This I may have missed. The fact of the matter is humans adapt to the society they are in. Animals do the same. If an animal is in an overtly hostile environment it becomes more hostile no? Humans do the same thing. As children learn from what they see around them they often notice that the "best" are looked up to while the average is not. This makes then try to set themselves apart somehow. They do so in different ways such as becoming popular or becoming a bully or simply keeping to themselves. While it is not the root problem it is one of the main problems, they wanted a fixable problem. One cannot fix human and animal nature, therefore if I had used that it would not be a valid argument.

But you simply argued against your own logic then! Capitalism isn't a cause of bullying and you just said as much. Possibly some of it is down to nature and a desire for dominance but the possibility exists that a lot of it, again, comes down to parental conditioning.

[Forsher]

We live in a culture dominated by women. A culture where being a grown man watching shows made for 8 year old little girls is acceptable in some circles. More than 70% of teachers are female. Those females are in position of power, and have become many of our role models rather than men also not forgetting that many young men are raised by single mothers. The real problem here I believe is not with bullying, but with feminization of males. Which is a symptom of our increasingly liberal for lack of a better word society.

A man needs to defend himself, and to stand up for himself against bullies. When some one disrespects his honor a man should raise to the occasion fully prepared to fight. How can he though learn these skills from a female? Most females are compassionate and caring. Rarely do females concern themselves with the testosterone driven behaviors of men.

We are told "be nice" when it is to no consequence of ourselves. Then when we're defending our honor or defending ourselves on the playground we are punished. What were these fists made for if not the defense of honor and self? These manly fists.

The biggest criminal here through all of this though is public schooling. It forces children into school regardless of their whims. It oppresses and neuters many young men. I wish for boys to some day work besides other men, and to be influenced by and develop male role models.

ITT any male brought up without a male role model in his life is doomed to fail.

So where did you get your degree in psychology?

ITT? What is this?

We live in a culture dominated by women. A culture where being a grown man watching shows made for 8 year old little girls is acceptable in some circles. More than 70% of teachers are female. Those females are in position of power, and have become many of our role models rather than men also not forgetting that many young men are raised by single mothers. The real problem here I believe is not with bullying, but with feminization of males. Which is a symptom of our increasingly liberal for lack of a better word society.

A man needs to defend himself, and to stand up for himself against bullies. When some one disrespects his honor a man should raise to the occasion fully prepared to fight. How can he though learn these skills from a female? Most females are compassionate and caring. Rarely do females concern themselves with the testosterone driven behaviors of men.

We are told "be nice" when it is to no consequence of ourselves. Then when we're defending our honor or defending ourselves on the playground we are punished. What were these fists made for if not the defense of honor and self? These manly fists.

The biggest criminal here through all of this though is public schooling. It forces children into school regardless of their whims. It oppresses and neuters many young men. I wish for boys to some day work besides other men, and to be influenced by and develop male role models.

The poor oppressed menfolk. Real men don't cry. Therefore, this post is invalid.

[Wamitoria]

We live in a culture dominated by women. A culture where being a grown man watching shows made for 8 year old little girls is acceptable in some circles. More than 70% of teachers are female. Those females are in position of power, and have become many of our role models rather than men also not forgetting that many young men are raised by single mothers. The real problem here I believe is not with bullying, but with feminization of males. Which is a symptom of our increasingly liberal for lack of a better word society.

A man needs to defend himself, and to stand up for himself against bullies. When some one disrespects his honor a man should raise to the occasion fully prepared to fight. How can he though learn these skills from a female? Most females are compassionate and caring. Rarely do females concern themselves with the testosterone driven behaviors of men.

We are told "be nice" when it is to no consequence of ourselves. Then when we're defending our honor or defending ourselves on the playground we are punished. What were these fists made for if not the defense of honor and self? These manly fists.

The biggest criminal here through all of this though is public schooling. It forces children into school regardless of their whims. It oppresses and neuters many young men. I wish for boys to some day work besides other men, and to be influenced by and develop male role models.

Wow. There's so much wrong with this post.

[Forsher]

According to you, men not in 100% control of every aspect of life = women dominating. Come back when the gender ratio in Congress has switched. 75 women in the House and 17 in the Senate is basically the opposite of "dominating."

Last time I checked young men weren't being raised in the halls of congress.

1. We have people like you on the internet whining like 5 year old boys about others liking a show. A culture like this is going to grow full of assholes who are sexist and full of bigotry. So women teach more, and? I don't see the negativity here. Being raised by a single mother of course affects you, but until you show that it makes the child more feminine, this point is useless. "Feminization of males" is one of the most sexist phrases I have ever seen.

See this is what I mean. It doesn't it matter if it's sexist or full of bigotry when your ideology is conflicting to many young growing men. Are boys suppose to choose a guy a grown male I might add as a role model who watches shows about ponies or wears skinny jeans in public?

LOL, you think fighting solves bullying effectively. Yeah, this post is a joke.

It's not about just fighting, but it's also about being prepared to stand up for yourself and fighting if you just might have to. It works I know it works just watch Gordon Ramsay in action.

Our fists were made so that we could hold stuff. You must have the education of a 2 year old.

No, those are our palms. You can't hold stuff with your fists.

Boys DO have male role models. By the way, more sexism.

Most of them are women though!

LOLA, L O L A Lola...

See this is what I mean. It doesn't it matter if it's sexist or full of bigotry when your ideology is conflicting to many young growing men. Are boys suppose to choose a guy a grown male I might add as a role model who watches shows about ponies or wears skinny jeans in public?

Yes it does matter. Please explain when sexism and bigotry doesn't matter. Who do you think boys choose as role models? Seems like you're just punching at a wall and whining over something that you fail to even explain. Watching a TV show can change your gender? Huh, didn't know that.

It's not about just fighting, but it's also about being prepared to stand up for yourself and fighting if you just might have to. It works I know it works just watch Gordon Ramsay in action.

Being prepared is fine. Your post made it seem like anyone who prefers to solve bullying through non-violent methods is less of a man than if they pulled out a knife and stabbed them in the eye.

No, those are our palms. You can't hold stuff with your fists.

The fuck? Do you have magical adhesion powers? PLEASE, try to hold something like a remote without making a fist motion, and just lift it with your palm. I'll be waiting to see how that turns out.

Most of them are women though!

Proof? And what's your definition of role model? Saying, "God damn, that chick in the movie is so hot... The things I would do to her!" doesn't make the woman a role model. By the way, what's wrong with having a woman as a role model? Please address the massive amounts of sexism in your post.

Gender in this screwed up modern world is possible to change through television, don'cha know?

[Forsher]

Last time I checked young men weren't being raised in the halls of congress.



See this is what I mean. It doesn't it matter if it's sexist or full of bigotry when your ideology is conflicting to many young growing men. Are boys suppose to choose a guy a grown male I might add as a role model who watches shows about ponies or wears skinny jeans in public?



It's not about just fighting, but it's also about being prepared to stand up for yourself and fighting if you just might have to. It works I know it works just watch Gordon Ramsay in action.



No, those are our palms. You can't hold stuff with your fists.



Most of them are women though!

Damn man, you're really insecure.

To repeat this thread's favourite phrase: where did you get your degree in psychology?

Don't make this guy into some sort of FST.

[Numer]

Bullying is neither helpful nor harmful...it's hilarious.

^Kidding, but in all seriousness, recent data suggests that most students/adolescents do not identify themselves as the bullies or victims-rather an overlap of both. An overwhelming majority said that they had said hurtful things to another peer, but had also had hurtful things said to them, both situations happening on multiple occasions. So technically it is hard to solve "bullying" as a problem when nearly everyone's doing it to each other. On a personal note, I was picked on in my school, but I made the rights friends, tried to better the flaws that people made fun of me for and...I'll admit it...deflected some of the abuse I had received on other peers. It's called growing up, and I can't believe our society makes such a big deal over these things when other children are starving to death, children who would do anything to be in the bullying "victim's" situation.

[Forsher]

In my opinion people usually get bullied through no fault other than their own.

At least you qualified it as an opinion.

You're wrong of course:
http://www.livescience.com/6032-studies ... ected.html
http://psychcentral.com/news/2010/02/03 ... 11191.html

Some do bring it on themselves, some. As an example, the psycho who always hogs the ball and is totally useless at the sport in question and when asked to pass the ball abuses his team-mates. They are asking to be bullied, but, then, they are a psycho.

[Disturbed]

Ive been bullied alot by teAchers and students. Im the kid in the back of the rokm that no one cqres about, no one deals with, who its seems like the world is against me im the psychopathic lonly kid....teahcers yell at me and i dont do it i stand up for myself ans then i have to talk to the principal and my parenst about crap like that! What do i do if i have nothing to use against them....i am nothing in life!

[The UK in Exile]

At least you qualified it as an opinion.

You're wrong of course:
http://www.livescience.com/6032-studies ... ected.html
http://psychcentral.com/news/2010/02/03 ... 11191.html

Some do bring it on themselves, some. As an example, the psycho who always hogs the ball and is totally useless at the sport in question and when asked to pass the ball abuses his team-mates. They are asking to be bullied, but, then, they are a psycho.

but their the bully....

so I guess its ok to bully bullies?

[Arbites]

Bullying is neither helpful nor harmful...it's hilarious.

^Kidding, but in all seriousness, recent data suggests that most students/adolescents do not identify themselves as the bullies or victims-rather an overlap of both. An overwhelming majority said that they had said hurtful things to another peer, but had also had hurtful things said to them, both situations happening on multiple occasions. So technically it is hard to solve "bullying" as a problem when nearly everyone's doing it to each other. On a personal note, I was picked on in my school, but I made the rights friends, tried to better the flaws that people made fun of me for and...I'll admit it...deflected some of the abuse I had received on other peers. It's called growing up, and I can't believe our society makes such a big deal over these things when other children are starving to death, children who would do anything to be in the bullying "victim's" situation.

That's not "bullying" as we're defining it here. Everyone gets teased, and everyone occasionally gets into spats with other people. That's not the issue.

The kind of bullying we're talking about is a completely one-sided campaign of psychological abuse. Two people who both hate each other and each give as well as they get are not "bullying" each other. A bully has power over the victim in some way or another that the victim cannot compensate for to fight him on equal terms.

[Numer]

Bullying is neither helpful nor harmful...it's hilarious.

^Kidding, but in all seriousness, recent data suggests that most students/adolescents do not identify themselves as the bullies or victims-rather an overlap of both. An overwhelming majority said that they had said hurtful things to another peer, but had also had hurtful things said to them, both situations happening on multiple occasions. So technically it is hard to solve "bullying" as a problem when nearly everyone's doing it to each other. On a personal note, I was picked on in my school, but I made the rights friends, tried to better the flaws that people made fun of me for and...I'll admit it...deflected some of the abuse I had received on other peers. It's called growing up, and I can't believe our society makes such a big deal over these things when other children are starving to death, children who would do anything to be in the bullying "victim's" situation.

That's not "bullying" as we're defining it here. Everyone gets teased, and everyone occasionally gets into spats with other people. That's not the issue.

The kind of bullying we're talking about is a completely one-sided campaign of psychological abuse. Two people who both hate each other and each give as well as they get are not "bullying" each other. A bully has power over the victim in some way or another that the victim cannot compensate for to fight him on equal terms.

In the situation you described, I never understand why the victim doesn't adjust themselves to make themselves less vulnerable to a psychological abuse. They can laugh at the bully's jest and then say something equally hurtful back (yeah I know it's vicious, but it works), Let's say the person is fitting the stereotype of a "nerd" or "geek" they can try to be more social and garner more friends and support in another way (joining a sports team). The victim doesn't necessarily need to fight back to the bully directly, they only need to adjust the balances of social power so that the bully can move onto "weaker prey" (also sounds really bad, but in my experience this method works best).

[Arbites]

That's not "bullying" as we're defining it here. Everyone gets teased, and everyone occasionally gets into spats with other people. That's not the issue.

The kind of bullying we're talking about is a completely one-sided campaign of psychological abuse. Two people who both hate each other and each give as well as they get are not "bullying" each other. A bully has power over the victim in some way or another that the victim cannot compensate for to fight him on equal terms.

In the situation you described, I never understand why the victim doesn't adjust themselves to make themselves less vulnerable to a psychological abuse. They can laugh at the bully's jest and then say something equally hurtful back (yeah I know it's vicious, but it works), Let's say the person is fitting the stereotype of a "nerd" or "geek" they can try to be more social and garner more friends and support in another way (joining a sports team). The victim doesn't necessarily need to fight back to the bully directly, they only need to adjust the balances of social power so that the bully can move onto "weaker prey" (also sounds really bad, but in my experience this method works best).

That doesn't work. Once a bully is locked on, it really doesn't matter what the victim does to try to change their situation. Bullies really don't need an excuse after they've picked a target, and in many cases the bully is the one who is actively preventing the victim from adjusting his position in the first place. Again, we're not talking about the harmless teasing and what have you.

Besides, I fail to see why a geek should have to change just because some prick won't lay off.

[Holy Trek]

Sexism and bigotry don't really matter when you're dealing with members of a certain group who have a disposition towards acting a certain way. I don't know exactly know who men choose as their role models, but Gordon Ramsay or some one along the lines of George Washington would be a great start. Men who are mostly successful, hardworking and influential.

Yes it does. So far you've

1. Implied that there are no successful and hardworking women. Otherwise why the hell would it matter if they choose a woman or a man as a role model?
2. Said that the feminization of boys is a problem, when it's not.
3. Implied that using violence against a bully is the best way to solve the problem.

Depends on the circumstance.

Let's see how that works out for the students who implement this.

I can already tell you how it worked out.....IT DIDN'T. I got a black eye for three weeks after standing up to a bully....he wasn't even bruised.

[Holy Trek]

It's true, look at how bullying has risen in importance in the media with the lack of school shootings. How much was bullying brought up in the early 90's? Compare that to the early 2000's. Bulling became bigger because of lack of deterrence. Simple concept.

If massacres are your idea of "deterrence," then I don't know what your major malfunction is. Furthermore, school shootings weren't nearly commonplace enough to act as a deterrent in the first place. They made the news, which milked it for a couple of weeks, then people basically casually forgot aside from those towns.

Oh yeah, and about that "pulled a Columbine" idiocy, the shooters ended up dead. Yeah, they didn't get bullied again, but for a rather unacceptable reason.

THANK YOU for setting that guy straight. I was actually gonna bring that little bit of trivia up, as he seems to have forgotten that little info.

[Holy Trek]

That's not "bullying" as we're defining it here. Everyone gets teased, and everyone occasionally gets into spats with other people. That's not the issue.

The kind of bullying we're talking about is a completely one-sided campaign of psychological abuse. Two people who both hate each other and each give as well as they get are not "bullying" each other. A bully has power over the victim in some way or another that the victim cannot compensate for to fight him on equal terms.

In the situation you described, I never understand why the victim doesn't adjust themselves to make themselves less vulnerable to a psychological abuse. They can laugh at the bully's jest and then say something equally hurtful back (yeah I know it's vicious, but it works), Let's say the person is fitting the stereotype of a "nerd" or "geek" they can try to be more social and garner more friends and support in another way (joining a sports team). The victim doesn't necessarily need to fight back to the bully directly, they only need to adjust the balances of social power so that the bully can move onto "weaker prey" (also sounds really bad, but in my experience this method works best).

I call BS....and here's why...
I only showed interest in sports ONCE.....back in junior high, I tried out for basketball. I was all set to get into sports until I learned the cost in equipment, uniforms, and travel fees my parents would have to incur just so I could play. I backed out of it right then. Now, during that 6 week period in which I tried out, nothing changed. I was STILL being bullied. So, "adjusting the balances of social power" did nothing for me. THAT is why I call BS on your statement.

[Numer]

In the situation you described, I never understand why the victim doesn't adjust themselves to make themselves less vulnerable to a psychological abuse. They can laugh at the bully's jest and then say something equally hurtful back (yeah I know it's vicious, but it works), Let's say the person is fitting the stereotype of a "nerd" or "geek" they can try to be more social and garner more friends and support in another way (joining a sports team). The victim doesn't necessarily need to fight back to the bully directly, they only need to adjust the balances of social power so that the bully can move onto "weaker prey" (also sounds really bad, but in my experience this method works best).

I call BS....and here's why...
I only showed interest in sports ONCE.....back in junior high, I tried out for basketball. I was all set to get into sports until I learned the cost in equipment, uniforms, and travel fees my parents would have to incur just so I could play. I backed out of it right then. Now, during that 6 week period in which I tried out, nothing changed. I was STILL being bullied. So, "adjusting the balances of social power" did nothing for me. THAT is why I call BS on your statement.

Well, sorry to be an asshole but...you didn't make it. At every tryout there's kids who everyone knows have no chance, while the kids themselves are oblivious to their lack of skill. I am not saying that you were one of them, but until you are on the team, proving that you are good, you're situation isn't supposed to change yet because guess what... your not on the team yet!

[Cromarty]

Whoa! Where did all the hostility come from? I am not trying to offend you or anyone but offer my take on it.

Then again my take is coming from the guy who yells at the waiter for asking too many questions when the waiter simply asked if I had wanted a drink.
That waiter was an invasive prick.

*That quote is from Holy Trek. I have not idea how to fix it besides just doing this quick edit for I am a semi-retard.

If you're posting in-character still, then you're in the wrong forum.

Not really. There's a lot of people *cough*Nazi Flower Power, that-guy-who-pretends-he's-kim-jong-un, etc*cough* that post 'in-character'.

At least this character is entertaining (as is NPW).

[Israslovakahzerbajan]

I call BS....and here's why...
I only showed interest in sports ONCE.....back in junior high, I tried out for basketball. I was all set to get into sports until I learned the cost in equipment, uniforms, and travel fees my parents would have to incur just so I could play. I backed out of it right then. Now, during that 6 week period in which I tried out, nothing changed. I was STILL being bullied. So, "adjusting the balances of social power" did nothing for me. THAT is why I call BS on your statement.

Well, sorry to be an asshole but...you didn't make it. At every tryout there's kids who everyone knows have no chance, while the kids themselves are oblivious to their lack of skill. I am not saying that you were one of them, but until you are on the team, proving that you are good, you're situation isn't supposed to change yet because guess what... your not on the team yet!

If he is not on the team then it would be useless to fit in at his own expense, he'd be wasting time and money on that.

Holy Trek, from my experience I have noted that in my breif 17 years and 8 months of life one must stick to group norms in order to have positive reactions within...eh, people. However this also brings the question if you are selling out your true self to avoid negativity. Personally speaking, though in lower educational levels in the US and in Mexico, and in an American High School; I had the bullying problem for multiple reasons.

Here in Mexico, in Preparatoria, I actually have no problems...and I'm a guy who can walk around with a Yuki Nagato t-shirt, I stick solidly to the the stereotype of a "nerd" or "geek" Numer described yet I am free of harm. This gives me multiple assumptions. One: The educational level is more professional. Two: Social groups in Mexico in this institution are more tolerant of the differences between individuals (because they're more mature or because they fear school-related sanctions more?) Three: IDK?

So my advice goes as followed: Do whatever you please as an individual, if you want to conform like Numer suggested, Ok. If you want to be yourself, OK. Do whatever makes you happier and more confortable...granted, you seem pretty normal. I don't see why people pick on you, have you considered the idea people pick on people for the hell of it?

[Yandere Schoolgirls]

Yes it does. So far you've

1. Implied that there are no successful and hardworking women. Otherwise why the hell would it matter if they choose a woman or a man as a role model?
2. Said that the feminization of boys is a problem, when it's not.
3. Implied that using violence against a bully is the best way to solve the problem.


Let's see how that works out for the students who implement this.

I can already tell you how it worked out.....IT DIDN'T. I got a black eye for three weeks after standing up to a bully....he wasn't even bruised.

YOU DID NOT TRY HARD ENOUGH

[The UK in Exile]

I can already tell you how it worked out.....IT DIDN'T. I got a black eye for three weeks after standing up to a bully....he wasn't even bruised.

YOU DID NOT TRY HARD ENOUGH

TAKE DRUGS. KILL A BEAR.