Heinleinites wrote:The South Islands wrote:US involvement was completely irrelevant.
Yeah, that's so wrong it hurts. If nothing else, you may want to read up on Lend-Lease.
Lend-lease helped, but it did was not a deciding factor of the war.
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by Buffett and Colbert » Sun Aug 16, 2009 12:22 pm
Heinleinites wrote:The South Islands wrote:US involvement was completely irrelevant.
Yeah, that's so wrong it hurts. If nothing else, you may want to read up on Lend-Lease.
You-Gi-Owe wrote:If someone were to ask me about your online persona as a standard of your "date-ability", I'd rate you as "worth investigating further & passionate about beliefs". But, enough of the idle speculation on why you didn't score with the opposite gender.
by Yootopia » Sun Aug 16, 2009 12:23 pm
The South Islands wrote:The Soviet Union won World War II. All other effort is completely irrelevant.
by Augmark » Sun Aug 16, 2009 12:23 pm
Yootopia wrote:Augmark wrote:take into account that the Germans would be able to refine the weapons to be more accurate and deadly, without the constant threat of Allied Air supremacy.
The Russians had air supremacy by 1943. They just didn't bomb all that much shit because they didn't need to. Nothing stopping them hypothetically making more bombers...Though nothing impressive initially, they could open up a door of horrors. Lob over a V-rocket filled with gas=a lot of dead people. No, the Germans didn't use gas in combat in WW2, but because this is a what if thread...
... yeah the Germans didn't use that kind of thing because they knew that the British and Russians would rub anthrax in their face.
by Lizardiar » Sun Aug 16, 2009 12:24 pm
Buffett and Colbert wrote:Heinleinites wrote:The South Islands wrote:US involvement was completely irrelevant.
Yeah, that's so wrong it hurts. If nothing else, you may want to read up on Lend-Lease.
Lend-lease helped, but it did was not a deciding factor of the war.
by Augmark » Sun Aug 16, 2009 12:25 pm
Yootopia wrote:Augmark wrote:Hitler wanted Britain to come to peace with Germany. They refused. He realized they needed to take Britain out of the war. Britain wasn't considered "A natural Enemy" like the communist and Slavs.
... sort of irrelevant since the German Airforce bombed our cities thus Dresden etc. was pretty much kosher.
by Yootopia » Sun Aug 16, 2009 12:27 pm
Augmark wrote:Yootopia wrote:Augmark wrote:Hitler wanted Britain to come to peace with Germany. They refused. He realized they needed to take Britain out of the war. Britain wasn't considered "A natural Enemy" like the communist and Slavs.
... sort of irrelevant since the German Airforce bombed our cities thus Dresden etc. was pretty much kosher.
that was after sealion began
by Bavin » Sun Aug 16, 2009 12:28 pm
Aggicificicerous wrote:I'm not quite sure which way the war would have gone, but didn't the USSR prevail due, in large part, to aid from the US? I could have sworn I heaing a quote from Zhukov that went something like "without theUSHitler's meddling in the German Army, the Soviet Union would have collapsed by the end of 1941."
by The Master M » Sun Aug 16, 2009 12:29 pm
The South Islands wrote:The Soviet Union won World War II. All other effort is completely irrelevant.
by Gleinster » Sun Aug 16, 2009 12:30 pm
by Augmark » Sun Aug 16, 2009 12:31 pm
Bavin wrote:Aggicificicerous wrote:I'm not quite sure which way the war would have gone, but didn't the USSR prevail due, in large part, to aid from the US? I could have sworn I heaing a quote from Zhukov that went something like "without theUSHitler's meddling in the German Army, the Soviet Union would have collapsed by the end of 1941."
Fixed
by Bluth Corporation » Sun Aug 16, 2009 12:31 pm
KaIashnikov wrote:I recall 2,000,000 German losses to 10,000,000 Soviets Losses?
by Yootopia » Sun Aug 16, 2009 12:32 pm
Gleinster wrote:Why do people think that the USSR would necessarily have beaten the Germans anyway?
by Chrobalta » Sun Aug 16, 2009 12:33 pm
by The German Region » Sun Aug 16, 2009 12:33 pm
The Soviet Union won World War II. All other effort is completely irrelevant.
by Morrdh » Sun Aug 16, 2009 12:36 pm
by Psychotic Mongooses » Sun Aug 16, 2009 12:37 pm
Gleinster wrote:
Most historian today would follow AJP Taylor's assessment of World War 2, that the reason Germany invaded Russia in the first place was that they suspected that the US would enter the war at some point and they wanted to knock Russia out before that happened.
by Sdaeriji » Sun Aug 16, 2009 12:38 pm
Yootopia wrote:The South Islands wrote:The Soviet Union won World War II. All other effort is completely irrelevant.
... not really... without Lend-Lease they would've had a harder fight of it in the earlier days of the Great Patriotic War, and without Britain tying down the Tallies, Germans etc. all over Africa, some of the better German generals might have ended up on the eastern front instead of just getting bored, also bombed, in North Africa.
by Yootopia » Sun Aug 16, 2009 12:41 pm
Sdaeriji wrote:Also, without Lend-Lease, Hitler might not have declared war on the US after Pearl Harbor.
by The Master M » Sun Aug 16, 2009 12:42 pm
by Gleinster » Sun Aug 16, 2009 12:44 pm
Yootopia wrote:Gleinster wrote:Why do people think that the USSR would necessarily have beaten the Germans anyway?
Larger production base, much higher population, more diverse natural resources and a command economy that provided a smooth(ish) transition to a wartime economy, esp. since in the latter half of the 1930s the Russians were already spending a vast amount on military production and R&D.
by Heinleinites » Sun Aug 16, 2009 12:44 pm
Buffett and Colbert wrote:Heinleinites wrote:The South Islands wrote:US involvement was completely irrelevant.
Yeah, that's so wrong it hurts. If nothing else, you may want to read up on Lend-Lease.
Lend-lease helped, but it did was not a deciding factor of the war.
Gleinster wrote:Why do people think that the USSR would necessarily have beaten the Germans anyway?
by Sdaeriji » Sun Aug 16, 2009 12:45 pm
by Yutugeria » Sun Aug 16, 2009 12:47 pm
by Psychotic Mongooses » Sun Aug 16, 2009 12:47 pm
Sdaeriji wrote: And, while US involvement in Europe may not have been critical in defeating Germany, it was certainly beneficial. Without US involvement, the Iron Curtain may very well have fallen through France instead of Central Europe.
by Gleinster » Sun Aug 16, 2009 12:48 pm
Yutugeria wrote:The question should be:
Without Canada, would the Allies have lost WWII?
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