Should the "LGB" & the "T" be Separate?

[Necroghastia]

It's not much of a legitimate belief when you have at best cherrypicked evidence.
This is just "the gays are grooming your children" in different packaging.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/lindseyedarvin/2024/04/25/transgender-athletes-could-be-at-a-physical-disadvantage-new-research-shows/

Explain how? Trans people have if anything been instrumental in the whole rights movement. The likes of Marsha P. Johnson, Zazu Nova, Sylvia Rivera, and Miss Major Griffin-Gracy should not be forgotten.

So, it's about a new form of conversion therapy. Telling boys that they can't be feminine and telling girls they can't be masculine.

you mean the thing anti-lgbt cis people do all the dang time

If they feel this way, they must have be transgender, as in have gender dysphoria rather than just being a feminine male or a masculine female.

Absolutely no one actually believes this.

[Slembana]

There is nothing “morally reprehensible” about being LGBTQ.

Says the guy who tried to justify communist atrocities. You’re not exactly a moral authority. Who should I listen to, some guy from the internet who justifies murder or the God who created the entire universe, is infinite in wisdom, loves the entirety of humanity, and died for our sins even though we do all sorts of deplorable things? The answer is obvious.

I didn’t “justify communist atrocities” I don’t justify murder. And God doesn’t hate LGBTQ people, in reality.

[Neu California]

And what makes them morally reprehensible?

Your answer should be good for a laugh at least.

Leviticus 18:22
Romans 1:26-28
1 Corinthians 6:9-10
And many, many, more.

So, a bunch of people who lived millennia ago and didn't have modern understanding of science.

Can you show actual, quantifiable harm from accepting LGBT people beyond "they hurt my fee fees" and "they go against my religion"? (Reminder that I live in a country that declared over 200 years ago that it's not a Christian nation

[Bnei Noah]

Obviously. One has to do with sexuality and the other is completely different. They’re the same in the way that they’re both morally reprehensible but completely different in nature.

And what makes them morally reprehensible?

Your answer should be good for a laugh at least.

Just to let you know, folks like this believe I'm going to be burning in hell even though I'm 100% celibate and never even been on a date or even had a first kiss.

[Bnei Noah]

Says the guy who tried to justify communist atrocities. You’re not exactly a moral authority. Who should I listen to, some guy from the internet who justifies murder or the God who created the entire universe, is infinite in wisdom, loves the entirety of humanity, and died for our sins even though we do all sorts of deplorable things? The answer is obvious.

I didn’t “justify communist atrocities” I don’t justify murder. And God doesn’t hate LGBTQ people, in reality.

God doesn't like what some LGB(TQ) people do and say, but he doesn't hate them for being created in his image.

[Federal Republic of Serov]

Says the guy who tried to justify communist atrocities. You’re not exactly a moral authority. Who should I listen to, some guy from the internet who justifies murder or the God who created the entire universe, is infinite in wisdom, loves the entirety of humanity, and died for our sins even though we do all sorts of deplorable things? The answer is obvious.

I didn’t “justify communist atrocities” I don’t justify murder. And God doesn’t hate LGBTQ people, in reality.

Yes, God doesn’t hate anyone. Including LGBT. That doesn’t mean that it’s not a sin LMAO

[Slembana]

I didn’t “justify communist atrocities” I don’t justify murder. And God doesn’t hate LGBTQ people, in reality.

Yes, God doesn’t hate anyone. Including LGBT. That doesn’t mean that it’s not a sin LMAO

Being gay is not a sin.

[Neu California]

I didn’t “justify communist atrocities” I don’t justify murder. And God doesn’t hate LGBTQ people, in reality.

Yes, God doesn’t hate anyone. Including LGBT. That doesn’t mean that it’s not a sin LMAO

Doesn't mean it is a sin either.

And why would an all-loving god make people gay, bi, or trans, then condemn them to hell for that? It's literally beyond their control.

[Necroghastia]

I didn’t “justify communist atrocities” I don’t justify murder. And God doesn’t hate LGBTQ people, in reality.

Yes, God doesn’t hate anyone. Including LGBT. That doesn’t mean that it’s not a sin LMAO

Threadjacking is a sin. Pretty sure. It's like, the eleventh commandment, it got accidentally left off the classic list when they remade the stones after Moses dropped 'em.

[Federal Republic of Serov]

And what makes them morally reprehensible?

Your answer should be good for a laugh at least.

Just to let you know, folks like this believe I'm going to be burning in hell even though I'm 100% celibate and never even been on a date or even had a first kiss.

1. It’s not my call to say how does or doesn’t go to Heaven. The only people we know for sure whether they went to Heaven or hell are the Saints. The rest is a mystery.

2. Mathew 5:28 Lust is a sin too. You don’t have to actually do the thing.

[Bnei Noah]

Just to let you know, folks like this believe I'm going to be burning in hell even though I'm 100% celibate and never even been on a date or even had a first kiss.

1. It’s not my call to say how does or doesn’t go to Heaven. The only people we know for sure whether they went to Heaven or hell are the Saints. The rest is a mystery.

2. Mathew 5:28 Lust is a sin too. You don’t have to actually do the thing.

The topic of the thread is not if LGBTQ is a sin under Christian theology. Please take that to the appropriate thread.

[Federal Republic of Serov]

Yes, God doesn’t hate anyone. Including LGBT. That doesn’t mean that it’s not a sin LMAO

Doesn't mean it is a sin either.

And why would an all-loving god make people gay, bi, or trans, then condemn them to hell for that? It's literally beyond their control.

He didn’t make them that way. The Demons corrupted such people. It is in their control. They choose to do such things (including just lusting after someone). Google Father Seraphim Rose, a former homosexual who repented and is now being considered for canonization.

[Federal Republic of Serov]

1. It’s not my call to say how does or doesn’t go to Heaven. The only people we know for sure whether they went to Heaven or hell are the Saints. The rest is a mystery.

2. Mathew 5:28 Lust is a sin too. You don’t have to actually do the thing.

The topic of the thread is not if LGBTQ is a sin under Christian theology. Please take that to the appropriate thread.

Ok. I’ll stop posting about this here.

[Jeffs]

Natural is a property that something has if it is not impeded. If we are not impeded, we are born as children, our bodies grow naturally, and with them our sexual characteristics.

And no, working out is not natural, in the sense that our bodies are not inclined to do it in themselves. But if we do it, it does not impede the natural development of our bodies. Chemical castration does.

So someone who does not work out at all is equally healthy compared to someone who has a regular workout schedule (all other things being equal)? Because neither of them would be impeding or helping the "natural" development of their bodies.

Is wearing clothes unhealthy?
Is wearing glasses unhealthy?
Is a procedure to fix a broken bone unhealthy?

You don't understand what I mean, so I'll try to clarify the terms.

There are natural characteristics, which are those that something possesses if it is not prevented from doing so. Then there are non-natural characteristics, which are those that something may not possess even if it is not prevented from doing so.

Among the non-natural characteristics, some are unnatural in the true sense of the word, meaning that their opposite is natural. Others are merely non-natural, meaning neither natural nor unnatural: they may have no effect on the thing that possesses them, they may be negative, or they may be positive.

Having certain hormone levels is natural for a male.
Medically preventing the achievement of these hormone levels, or suffering from a disease that alters them, is unnatural.
Playing sports, dressing up, and other such things are merely non-natural. Indeed, in the case of playing sports and dressing up, it is even beneficial, at least in principle.

Is that clearer?

[Neu California]

So someone who does not work out at all is equally healthy compared to someone who has a regular workout schedule (all other things being equal)? Because neither of them would be impeding or helping the "natural" development of their bodies.

Is wearing clothes unhealthy?
Is wearing glasses unhealthy?
Is a procedure to fix a broken bone unhealthy?

You don't understand what I mean, so I'll try to clarify the terms.

There are natural characteristics, which are those that something possesses if it is not prevented from doing so. Then there are non-natural characteristics, which are those that something may not possess even if it is not prevented from doing so.

Among the non-natural characteristics, some are unnatural in the true sense of the word, meaning that their opposite is natural. Others are merely non-natural, meaning neither natural nor unnatural: they may have no effect on the thing that possesses them, they may be negative, or they may be positive.

Having certain hormone levels is natural for a male.
Medically preventing the achievement of these hormone levels, or suffering from a disease that alters them, is unnatural.
Playing sports, dressing up, and other such things are merely non-natural. Indeed, in the case of playing sports and dressing up, it is even beneficial, at least in principle.

Is that clearer?

Considering disease is, by definition, natural, no it's still rather contradictory.

[Necroghastia]

So someone who does not work out at all is equally healthy compared to someone who has a regular workout schedule (all other things being equal)? Because neither of them would be impeding or helping the "natural" development of their bodies.

Is wearing clothes unhealthy?
Is wearing glasses unhealthy?
Is a procedure to fix a broken bone unhealthy?

You don't understand what I mean, so I'll try to clarify the terms.

There are natural characteristics, which are those that something possesses if it is not prevented from doing so. Then there are non-natural characteristics, which are those that something may not possess even if it is not prevented from doing so.

Among the non-natural characteristics, some are unnatural in the true sense of the word, meaning that their opposite is natural. Others are merely non-natural, meaning neither natural nor unnatural: they may have no effect on the thing that possesses them, they may be negative, or they may be positive.

Having certain hormone levels is natural for a male.
Medically preventing the achievement of these hormone levels, or suffering from a disease that alters them, is unnatural.
Playing sports, dressing up, and other such things are merely non-natural. Indeed, in the case of playing sports and dressing up, it is even beneficial, at least in principle.

Is that clearer?

It's certainly not clear how this ties into the thread topic.

[Chobotan]

I think not. After all, as Slembana so wisely said, trans people have and always will be a pivotal part of the LGBTQ+ pride movement.

[Nilokeras]

trans women take androgen blockers as part of their hormone therapy specifically to halt the development of higher muscle mass and other 'male' traits testosterone encourages. they have no real 'advantage' over cis women because of that.

Exactly, an unhealthy lifestyle.

Trans women, on average, are on par with cis women. They might have a slight disadvantage in terms of some metrics that elite athletes that care about, but it’s nothing any trans person has to worry about.

[Jeffs]

Considering disease is, by definition, natural, no it's still rather contradictory.

Read it again more carefully and you will understand that I didn't mean "natural" in the sense of “occurring in nature".

It's certainly not clear how this ties into the thread topic.

Fair. I will stop this argument here.

[Kriegsreich of Iron]

You know, I feel, and hear me out here, the experts should decide.

Make all this billions of wasted dollars in “Queer Studies” degrees count for once, eh?

[Nilokeras]

It alters the natural development of the human body.

Shaking hands meme between the six year olds who don’t want to get braces and transphobes

[The Xenopolis Confederation]

From my anecdotal experience, a lot of gays, bi and lesbians absolutely despise the T for doing more to set their movement and progress back than anybody else.

What are trans people doing to set anybody's progress back?

[The Xenopolis Confederation]

What part of "divide and conquer" do people not understand?

Oh please, there are legitimate disagreements within the community.

Which community are you referring to exactly?

[Nilokeras]

You know, I feel, and hear me out here, the experts should decide.

Make all this billions of wasted dollars in “Queer Studies” degrees count for once, eh?

oh man, in about 15 years when you’re finally old enough to go to uni, mention this to your profs who do queer studies

they’ll laugh and laugh

[Kriegsreich of Iron]

You know, I feel, and hear me out here, the experts should decide.

Make all this billions of wasted dollars in “Queer Studies” degrees count for once, eh?

oh man, in about 15 years when you’re finally old enough to go to uni, mention this to your profs who do queer studies

they’ll laugh and laugh

Hopefully, I won’t, because by then (I hope), QS won’t be a requirement anymore.