The Warhammer 40.000/Fantasy Discussion Thread Mk.III

[Tethys 13]

What does WAAC stand for?

Win At All Costs. They are the worst part of 40k's sanctioned competitive scene. These dudes only play competitive armies with competitive builds, will absolutely rule's lawyer you over the most minute things, and insist you play on terrain that looks a five-year-old's building blocks so that you can't score even the most basic advantage. They are also the ones who take a loss like someone killed their mother. Because they're the loudest, the people doing market research think they're the largest and bend to their whims, which leads to shit like we're seeing here.

Warmachine kinda had a problem with these cretins but Privateer Press didn't really listen to them and Battletech has been dodging that bullet for years, but I assume they get away with it because they don't really have Tournement scenes. See, a WAAC needs the validation of an observed win or all the money they spent on their points-perfect army was wasted.

E: if you want another example of a WAAC, a good one would be the dudes who build $1000 Magic: The Gathering Decks to stomp everyone at their local game stores neighborhood tournament. They're just the worst kind of people in the hobby.

I have met plenty like that. There was one at my old gaming store who was particularly difficult to talk to. I played a few games against him, and whether he won or lost, he would just complain about what a waste of time the game had been because my casual list was of no help to him in 'what actually mattered'. This was about a decade ago, mind, though from what I hear he has not mellowed out at all.
I remember he was utterly livid when I narrowly beat him for the highest score during a store event day and thus won the right to plan that season's events at the store.

On a better topic, I have finished the test model and leader for my burgeoning Dark Eldar project, the Kabal of the Horror Veil!

Their lore is that they discovered a planet occupied by a minor xenos AI race and surrounded in a psychic shroud that dampens emotions. For a human, this would dampen them to the point of the individual ceasing to function, but for the Dark Eldar it is like the most soothing palliative, taking the edge off their emotional hypersensitivity. They also discovered that this field seems to make it difficult for Slaanesh to find them, so they can stop torturing people there, and lose all desire to do so - indeed, their haemonculi all quit and entered a state of suspended-animation-meditation. However, the planet has absolutely no natural resources left, and so the Kabal has to depart it to steal food, water and also minerals that can fuel the inscrutable machines that power the field. Whenever they leave the planet, however, Slaanesh finds them again, and they have to resume their torturing, which gets harder and harder to force themselves to do each time they return to the planet.

[Shamhnan Insir]

Win At All Costs. They are the worst part of 40k's sanctioned competitive scene. These dudes only play competitive armies with competitive builds, will absolutely rule's lawyer you over the most minute things, and insist you play on terrain that looks a five-year-old's building blocks so that you can't score even the most basic advantage. They are also the ones who take a loss like someone killed their mother. Because they're the loudest, the people doing market research think they're the largest and bend to their whims, which leads to shit like we're seeing here.

Warmachine kinda had a problem with these cretins but Privateer Press didn't really listen to them and Battletech has been dodging that bullet for years, but I assume they get away with it because they don't really have Tournement scenes. See, a WAAC needs the validation of an observed win or all the money they spent on their points-perfect army was wasted.

E: if you want another example of a WAAC, a good one would be the dudes who build $1000 Magic: The Gathering Decks to stomp everyone at their local game stores neighborhood tournament. They're just the worst kind of people in the hobby.

I have met plenty like that. There was one at my old gaming store who was particularly difficult to talk to. I played a few games against him, and whether he won or lost, he would just complain about what a waste of time the game had been because my casual list was of no help to him in 'what actually mattered'. This was about a decade ago, mind, though from what I hear he has not mellowed out at all.
I remember he was utterly livid when I narrowly beat him for the highest score during a store event day and thus won the right to plan that season's events at the store.

On a better topic, I have finished the test model and leader for my burgeoning Dark Eldar project, the Kabal of the Horror Veil!

Their lore is that they discovered a planet occupied by a minor xenos AI race and surrounded in a psychic shroud that dampens emotions. For a human, this would dampen them to the point of the individual ceasing to function, but for the Dark Eldar it is like the most soothing palliative, taking the edge off their emotional hypersensitivity. They also discovered that this field seems to make it difficult for Slaanesh to find them, so they can stop torturing people there, and lose all desire to do so - indeed, their haemonculi all quit and entered a state of suspended-animation-meditation. However, the planet has absolutely no natural resources left, and so the Kabal has to depart it to steal food, water and also minerals that can fuel the inscrutable machines that power the field. Whenever they leave the planet, however, Slaanesh finds them again, and they have to resume their torturing, which gets harder and harder to force themselves to do each time they return to the planet.

Similar issues a long time ago playing a tournament in Glasgow. This was back in the good ol' days of Warhammer Fantasy. Only thing that wasn't so good about those days were armies of gunlines, particularly Skaven or High Elves. It just wasn't any fun and they allowed absolutely no room for chance wherever possible beyond the dice.
Haven't played too many tournaments since but I was really happy to see some moderations of things like this at Fantasy Basel a few years back in a 40K game where the terrain was determined beforehand by an impartial team of people who made it interesting.

[Pasong Tirad]

Femstodes confirmed btw

[Herador]

Femstodes confirmed btw

Personally don't care too much, but /tg/'s meltdown is hilarious.

[Pasong Tirad]

Femstodes confirmed btw

Personally don't care too much, but /tg/'s meltdown is hilarious.

It was honestly really nice to see most of the 40k subreddits reacting normally to the news (only slightly inappropriate levels of thirsting over the new muscle mothers) and from what I've seen it's mostly the culture war losers on YouTube who have reacted negatively to the news.

I do agree with some of the sentiments that the soft retcon could have been handled better, but nevertheless I think this is a really nice development.

[Herador]

Personally don't care too much, but /tg/'s meltdown is hilarious.

It was honestly really nice to see most of the 40k subreddits reacting normally to the news (only slightly inappropriate levels of thirsting over the new muscle mothers) and from what I've seen it's mostly the culture war losers on YouTube who have reacted negatively to the news.

I do agree with some of the sentiments that the soft retcon could have been handled better, but nevertheless I think this is a really nice development.

I don't like the decision as much as a lot of people, I'm a grog and I'm stuck in my grog ways as far as keeping to established lore goes, but I'm far enough removed from the hobby at this point that I just can't bring myself to give a real shit and it's fair enough to realize that the process for making a Custode isn't contingent on the subject being a male like the process of making a Space Marine is.

Really what I want is an OSR scene to develop in the 40k community so I can travel an hour to a big city with my old codex and have a game day using 3rd edition. But that won't happen, the 40k fanbase is like the D&D fanbase in that they need to use the newest rules and the newest rules and newest lore aren't my scene anymore. These days I'm mostly playing Flames of War for my larger-scale games and Battletech for smaller skirmish games, and it works out ok for me. I just wish Warmachine didn't die out though.

[The Huskar Social Union]

Femstodes confirmed btw

Watching people lose their fucking minds over this on twitter and reddit has been hilarious lmao

[The Huskar Social Union]

Personally don't care too much, but /tg/'s meltdown is hilarious.

It was honestly really nice to see most of the 40k subreddits reacting normally to the news (only slightly inappropriate levels of thirsting over the new muscle mothers) and from what I've seen it's mostly the culture war losers on YouTube who have reacted negatively to the news.

I do agree with some of the sentiments that the soft retcon could have been handled better, but nevertheless I think this is a really nice development.

Ive noticed that as well, most warhammer reddits seem to be taking it really well for the most part and dishing out some great jokes about it. The only warhammer subreddit ive seen thats a bit mixed on it is the grimdank one which flips from post to post based on what i saw. And other non warhammer ones like kotakuinaction though that place is always a whiny shit hole.

I steer clear of warhammer lore on youtube outside of a few channels like Bricky and Arbitor Ian and they are both fine with it. None of the painting channels im subbed to have brought it up yet i believe.

[Three Galaxies]

Women in the Custodes is a very cool revelation, but you know who's even cooler? The YouTube channel Luetin09. His excellent lore videos got me really interested in 40K last year.

[Ameriganastan]

I swear, this guy must just sit at his computer waiting for something to have a neckbeard fit about. Wish they'd quit putting him in my recs.

[Southland]

I swear, this guy must just sit at his computer waiting for something to have a neckbeard fit about. Wish they'd quit putting him in my recs.
(Image)

You can get the BlockTube extension for Chrome or Firefox (and Kiwi Browser if on Android; don't know if iOS allows extensions at this stage) and set it to filter his channel out. Not-so coincidentally, he's one of the channels that I'm blocking using it.

[Hurdergaryp]

I swear, this guy must just sit at his computer waiting for something to have a neckbeard fit about. Wish they'd quit putting him in my recs.
(Image)

You can get the BlockTube extension for Chrome or Firefox (and Kiwi Browser if on Android; don't know if iOS allows extensions at this stage) and set it to filter his channel out. Not-so coincidentally, he's one of the channels that I'm blocking using it.

Let me guess: another one of those wankers who takes offense at any fictional hero character being anything else but a pale-faced heterosexual paragon of stereotypical masculinity. Probably identifies as an alpha male, too. And, as any software developer can tell you, alpha versions are always incomplete and flawed.

[Three Galaxies]

I swear, this guy must just sit at his computer waiting for something to have a neckbeard fit about. Wish they'd quit putting him in my recs.
(Image)

I always knew he's an idiot.

[The Huskar Social Union]

I played my first game with the Cities of Sigmar yesterday, a 2 vs 1 scenario, me and stormcast (1000 points each) vs a Tzeentch demon army (2000 Points) and we ended up tied on points by the end of the game. My army consisted of a Fusil Major on Warhulk (General), an Alchemite Warforger, 20 Steel Helms, 10 Fusiliers, an Ironweld Great Cannon and a Steam tank. I split my force into two groups, the ranged force consisting of the castelite formations (Cannon, Fusil Major and Fusiliers) in the centre/right side of the board and my melee force of the 20 steelhelms and warforger on the left, with the tank as a reserve to go where needed. It ended up being sent on the left to help my steelhelms as the game went on.

The Steelhelms and Warforger were the only units i ended up losing, the Steel helms got whittled down by magic and an endless spell before finally getting close to their target objective near the Tzeentch start zone, though i was able to bring some men back via rally before they got into melee combat against some Tzaangors. At less than half strength with only eight men left they took down three of the two wound Tzaangors and contested an objective for a turn before being wiped out. The Warforger was then killed by a Cursling in melee combat afterwards. They did their job despite the horrendous casualties they took so gg my lads.

The Tank was awesome and fucked up stuff, well done there.

The Castelite formation with the Major did wonders, they killed soo much shit it was awesome, i dont know what people are saying about the Great Cannon being underwhelming, that thing did its hob brilliantly and killed some nasty stuff on the Tzeentch side including almost one shotting an entire Flamers unit on the first turn.

Yeah i like this army lol, its a lot of fun : P

[Pasong Tirad]

A second femstodes has just hit the Warhammer 40K community

This is getting out of hand. Now there are two of them!

[The Huskar Social Union]

A second femstodes has just hit the Warhammer 40K community

This is getting out of hand. Now there are two of them!

I cant believe they killed my warhammer childhood for a second time now. Madge.

[Hurdergaryp]

[Valles Marineris Mining co]

I heard the director of the new war hammer game is a piece of shit. Like ultraprogressive twitter brainrot type.

[Tethys 13]

So, a pricing update came out a few days ago. It is looking like a roughly 5% increase for most if not all miniature kits.

[Shamhnan Insir]

At least paints are immune. I have so much to paint....

Can we launch a crusade against inflation?

[Herador]

At least paints are immune. I have so much to paint....

Can we launch a crusade against inflation?

It's not inflation. Compared to games with similar quality sculpts like Infinity and Warmachine, you start to see that GW is overpricing its stuff a bit, the prices are closer but the other two tend to run cheaper by $10-20. But then you compare it to games like Battletech or Flames of War and the price discrepancy becomes downright egregious. Like, just compare box sets intended to get you started collecting an army, everything will be in USD.

I'll quote you the less expensive but less impressive (presently) $220 Space Marine spearhead box instead of the (presently) $350 Space Marine Battlefoce box. For (presently) $220 you get 20 models, the listing indicates no rulebook and no reference materials.

Battletech's Clan Invasion Box, intended to be a large force akin to the $350 Battleforce Box, is $50. 7 models, 2 double-sided maps, a punchboard of more mechs and terrain, 32 page rulebook, 24 page record sheet booklet, 24 page primer on the setting, 20 page novella, 15 double-sided reference cards (10 base game, 5 for their rules-simplified version), rule reference sheet, and two dice.

Flames of War doesn't really have an "army box" so I'll use their Hit The Beach set, a beginner box for Americans vs Germans. In that kit you get 92 models of infantry, 2 AT guns, 8 tanks, and a complete rulebook, not just a quick start guide, for $65.

Heck, just look at the cost of what constitutes a "squad" of basic infantry in each game. A Space Marine Tactical Squad retails currently at $60, a Lance of Mechs for Battletech is at its most expensive $30, a platoon of infantry in Flames of War is $27. GW knows it's the biggest and usually the only game in town so it prices accordingly, you see the same shit with MtG. I like 40k, I've liked 40k for going on two decades now, but this is just ridiculous.

[Hurdergaryp]

At least paints are immune. I have so much to paint....

Can we launch a crusade against inflation?

It's not inflation. Compared to games with similar quality sculpts like Infinity and Warmachine, you start to see that GW is overpricing its stuff a bit, the prices are closer but the other two tend to run cheaper by $10-20. But then you compare it to games like Battletech or Flames of War and the price discrepancy becomes downright egregious. Like, just compare box sets intended to get you started collecting an army, everything will be in USD.

I'll quote you the less expensive but less impressive (presently) $220 Space Marine spearhead box instead of the (presently) $350 Space Marine Battlefoce box. For (presently) $220 you get 20 models, the listing indicates no rulebook and no reference materials.

Battletech's Clan Invasion Box, intended to be a large force akin to the $350 Battleforce Box, is $50. 7 models, 2 double-sided maps, a punchboard of more mechs and terrain, 32 page rulebook, 24 page record sheet booklet, 24 page primer on the setting, 20 page novella, 15 double-sided reference cards (10 base game, 5 for their rules-simplified version), rule reference sheet, and two dice.

Flames of War doesn't really have an "army box" so I'll use their Hit The Beach set, a beginner box for Americans vs Germans. In that kit you get 92 models of infantry, 2 AT guns, 8 tanks, and a complete rulebook, not just a quick start guide, for $65.

Heck, just look at the cost of what constitutes a "squad" of basic infantry in each game. A Space Marine Tactical Squad retails currently at $60, a Lance of Mechs for Battletech is at its most expensive $30, a platoon of infantry in Flames of War is $27. GW knows it's the biggest and usually the only game in town so it prices accordingly, you see the same shit with MtG. I like 40k, I've liked 40k for going on two decades now, but this is just ridiculous.

You could always just not buy GW stuff, but somehow that does not seem to be an option in the mindset of many.

[The Huskar Social Union]

Most GW stuff i buy i tend to buy from other gaming sites as long as they are in stock as its cheaper but i like to support smaller companies too, especially local ones if i can and there is a miniature war gaming shop i buy from at times based up in Coleraine. Last thing i bought directly from GW was back in December from what i remember.

Ive been aiming to branch out into more non GW kits for some of my armies, especially for the Eldar army i started early in the year as i saw some really cool stuff on etsy for things like fire dragons and scorpions. But also lots of.... "detailed" Eldar sculpts ill just say. As a guard player im fortunate that there are a fuck ton of really well made third party kits out there, got some from etsy and some from Victoria Miniatures in the past and they have been cool and there are tonnes of stuff out there to supplement my guard army without going GW unless there is something that really catches my eye but i dont know if any New Guard stuff is coming any time soon.

Im mainly focusing on other games at the moment though, ive bought some Wasteland Warfare kits the last month or so and have had a lot of fun painting them up, planning on getting into the game properly when my starter set arrives in June and my friend group i play games with is interested in it too.

[The Huskar Social Union]

Also paints as well, ive started buying some Vallejo paints and they are sooo nice. Vallejo model colour black is the best black paint i have ever used.

[Herador]

You could always just not buy GW stuff, but somehow that does not seem to be an option in the mindset of many.

It's telling that we've reached a point where if someone comes out with something to say against GW, others just assume they'll keep collecting anyway, cause I see this sentence in a few different variations trotted out time and again. Like, people just really don't realize that there are other games to play, and those games are really good. It's the D&D-ization of Wargaming.

I don't buy GW products anymore though, I sold my couple of armies on ebay a couple of years ago and mostly play Battletech with friends and Flames of War with my Dad and occasional pickup games through the NorCal Flames of War group on facebook. I still play the old 40k Fantasy Flight RPG's though.

Im mainly focusing on other games at the moment though, ive bought some Wasteland Warfare kits the last month or so and have had a lot of fun painting them up, planning on getting into the game properly when my starter set arrives in June and my friend group i play games with is interested in it too.

Have you tried WW or gone through the rules at all? I'm interested in how it might play, I haven't heard great things but I heard that on /tg/ so I'm taking it with a grain of salt. I'm looking for a model-light skirmish wargame to try with my SO to introduce them to the hobby but Battletech is a bit too number crunchy and they aren't interested in WW2 enough to bother with Flames of War.

Also paints as well, ive started buying some Vallejo paints and they are sooo nice. Vallejo model colour black is the best black paint i have ever used.

I used Vallejo a lot when I was collecting and painting Warmachine and I still keep pots around for the odd day when I pick up some new Battletech mechs. When it comes to Flames of War or building scale models I use Reaper Color Core, it works well enough and it's cheap enough that I'm not breaking the bank for bigger projects.