Greece legalises equal marriage

[Kalaron]

What is wrong with a stable and loving gay couple being permitted to adopt children? Is a stable loving gay couple not any better than a single candidate?

In my belief nothing else than nuclear family works. Though yes even people in nuclear families fuck up too.

The nuclear family is, itself, an aberration from what society has looked like for thousands of years.

[San Lumen]

remind me whose rights are being taken or infringed upon in any way by this

The State is infringing upon the responsibility and purview of competing realms of influence, authority, and sovereignty - in this case, religion. It is taking more of a share of that for itself on behalf of an imaginary interest group.

Sorry are you calling being gay imaginary?

[Dimetrodon Empire]

I suspect that if your god were really that willing, you'd have already done it by now. Maybe turn your attention to the massive amounts of wealth inequality, climate change, war, and so on instead of worrying about gay people getting married?

Oh trust I am attentive to those issues, and I notice many of them America has a hand in.

More like you don't like people who are LGBTQ+ and you don't like the U.S., and you made a lazy decision to draw a spurious connection between the two.

You aren't being attentive to these issues at all, but cool story, Parkus.

[Asherahan]

Greek society is both more progressive than you think and more regressive than you think.

We are also incredibly racist and Islamophobic.

Guy who thinks gay people shouldn't be allowed to adopt just because he doesn't like it: "Actually it's all of Greek society that's like this"

Iam Greek I live in Greece and talk to Greeks. Could be confirmation bias but I know better than you.

[Asherahan]

Ancient Greeks were infinitely more inclusive regarding homosexuality and at the same time homophobic.

In laymans terms if your a free man and take it up the arse your a societal pariah but if you a free man who has sex with slaves or non adults it is Ok.

Children and Juveniles were not considered Free Persons of interest in Ancient Greece but their parents property.

I wouldn't call Ancient Greece "inclusive" in regards to homosexuality. They just had a different cultural understanding of how sexuality interacted with gender and gender roles. To them, it seems, "dominance" was more important. Homosexual behaviour was justified by there being an older, dominant partner - the truly "manly" part - and and a younger, submissive partner - feminine. Anything outside of this narrow exception was taboo. I don't like it when people bring up Greece as some sort of precursor to modern LGBT acceptance - even if hyperbolically - because they very much were not. They adhered to a slightly different version of the gender stereotypes we have today, with men needing to be the dominant part and all that.

Isn't that exactly what I described?

[Aggicificicerous]

I suspect that if your god were really that willing, you'd have already done it by now. Maybe turn your attention to the massive amounts of wealth inequality, climate change, war, and so on instead of worrying about gay people getting married?

Oh trust I am attentive to those issues, and I notice many of them America has a hand in.

But you also seem to think that the US has some sort of gay agenda, which is very funny, and here you are outraged over the very minor matter of gay people getting married. Which in a sense is extremely denigrating to organizers and campaigners in Greece who've been pushing for legal recognition for decades, and the fact that a majority of Greek citizens support same sex marriage. Nope, it's those pesky Americans forcing politicians to vote for this bill. If anyone is denying people agency, it's you.

[Cessarea]

I wouldn't call Ancient Greece "inclusive" in regards to homosexuality. They just had a different cultural understanding of how sexuality interacted with gender and gender roles. To them, it seems, "dominance" was more important. Homosexual behaviour was justified by there being an older, dominant partner - the truly "manly" part - and and a younger, submissive partner - feminine. Anything outside of this narrow exception was taboo. I don't like it when people bring up Greece as some sort of precursor to modern LGBT acceptance - even if hyperbolically - because they very much were not. They adhered to a slightly different version of the gender stereotypes we have today, with men needing to be the dominant part and all that.

Isn't that exactly what I described?

Not really; you were much too generous. Ancient Greece had no inclusiveness - amusingly, they only had the "topping isn't gay" excuse. One of the parts would be emulating what was essentially a feminine role. You can see why this isn't a form of inclusion.

It's a petty thing, but I always make sure to clarify that Ancient Greece is not an example of LGBT acceptance in any circumstance.

[The Xenopolis Confederation]

God willing we will crush the American influence in the world.

Who is "we?"

[Essic]

Very disappointing, but not unexpected, honestly.

Agreed, I feel like every western nation is going to go down the same path as Greece one way or another, except Poland ofc! Literally the Kingdom of Jesus Christ!

[Pasong Tirad]

Very disappointing, but not unexpected, honestly.

Agreed, I feel like every western nation is going to go down the same path as Greece one way or another, except Poland ofc! Literally the Kingdom of Jesus Christ!

God willing, Poland's next.

[The Xenopolis Confederation]

Very disappointing, but not unexpected, honestly.

Agreed, I feel like every western nation is going to go down the same path as Greece one way or another, except Poland ofc! Literally the Kingdom of Jesus Christ!

God willing, every nation in the world will go down the same path.

[Essic]

God willing, Poland's next.

Maybe, we'll see what route Poland takes in da future. God knows best.
But then again seeing the horrible state of incompetent "conservative" parties in the west, rainbow Poland is kinda likely.

[The Xenopolis Confederation]

Agreed, I feel like every western nation is going to go down the same path as Greece one way or another, except Poland ofc! Literally the Kingdom of Jesus Christ!

God willing, Poland's next.

Dammit Pasong, you ninja'd me with almost the exact same message.

[Essic]

In my belief nothing else than nuclear family works. Though yes even people in nuclear families fuck up too.

The nuclear family is, itself, an aberration from what society has looked like for thousands of years.

Quick question from an asian reactionary: Why do conservatives like the nuclear family so much? What's immoral or irreligious of having uncles and aunts and grandparents in the same house too? (Sorry if I asked too much btw)

[Kernen]

The nuclear family is, itself, an aberration from what society has looked like for thousands of years.

Quick question from an asian reactionary: Why do conservatives like the nuclear family so much? What's immoral or irreligious of having uncles and aunts and grandparents in the same house too? (Sorry if I asked too much btw)

Conservatives don't particularly care about that. They do care about single moms and gay couples.

[Essic]

Conservatives don't particularly care about that. They do care about single moms and gay couples.

wth? Single moms? What's wrong with single moms? Like conservatives disliking gay couples seems legit but I dunno what would be immoral about single mothers.

[Kernen]

Conservatives don't particularly care about that. They do care about single moms and gay couples.

wth? Single moms? What's wrong with single moms? Like conservatives disliking gay couples seems legit but I dunno what would be immoral about single mothers.

There is an assumption by many conservatives that single mothers are single mothers because either divorce is too accessible or premarital sex was involved.

I don't pretend to understand the conservative mindset on this.

[Distruzio]

The State is infringing upon the responsibility and purview of competing realms of influence, authority, and sovereignty - in this case, religion. It is taking more of a share of that for itself on behalf of an imaginary interest group.

Sorry are you calling being gay imaginary?

Yes.

It is an imaginary, arbitrary, useless "identity" used to subvert, disrupt, and eviscerate established identities/peoples.

When the electorate won't do what you want, you create a new electorate.

[Distruzio]

The nuclear family is, itself, an aberration from what society has looked like for thousands of years.

Quick question from an asian reactionary: Why do conservatives like the nuclear family so much? What's immoral or irreligious of having uncles and aunts and grandparents in the same house too? (Sorry if I asked too much btw)

"Conservatives" are liberals, in reality.

There is nothing wrong with kin and kind being in the same house. That's the way humanity existed for all eternity until the 20th century.

Conservatives are wrong.

[Distruzio]

Very disappointing, but not unexpected, honestly.

Agreed, I feel like every western nation is going to go down the same path as Greece one way or another, except Poland ofc! Literally the Kingdom of Jesus Christ!

It's nice to see someone who makes sense around here.

[Kernen]

Sorry are you calling being gay imaginary?

Yes.

It is an imaginary, arbitrary, useless "identity" used to subvert, disrupt, and eviscerate established identities/peoples.

When the electorate won't do what you want, you create a new electorate.

How does this assertion square with the millions of homosexuals in existence, exactly? If they exist, they have an interest in equal rights. Denying them equal rights is one thing, denying their existance is quite another.

[Port Carverton]

Sorry are you calling being gay imaginary?

Yes.

It is an imaginary, arbitrary, useless "identity" used to subvert, disrupt, and eviscerate established identities/peoples.

When the electorate won't do what you want, you create a new electorate.

Homosexuality has been documented in both humans and animals. It is completely natural.

[The Xenopolis Confederation]

Sorry are you calling being gay imaginary?

Yes.

It is an imaginary, arbitrary, useless "identity" used to subvert, disrupt, and eviscerate established identities/peoples.

When the electorate won't do what you want, you create a new electorate.

Isn't every group identity "arbitrary?"

What makes "homosexuals" any more arbitrary of a group than "women" or "Catholics" or "Italians?"

[Distruzio]

Yes.

It is an imaginary, arbitrary, useless "identity" used to subvert, disrupt, and eviscerate established identities/peoples.

When the electorate won't do what you want, you create a new electorate.

How does this assertion square with the millions of homosexuals in existence, exactly? If they exist, they have an interest in equal rights. Denying them equal rights is one thing, denying their existance is quite another.

They had equal Rights to begin with. They were simply convinced that new, extra special Rights also needed to apply to them as well.

I see no reason to validate the delusion.

Again: When the electorate won't do what you want, you create a new electorate.

Yes.

It is an imaginary, arbitrary, useless "identity" used to subvert, disrupt, and eviscerate established identities/peoples.

When the electorate won't do what you want, you create a new electorate.

Homosexuality has been documented in both humans and animals. It is completely natural.

I didn't say "unnatural", did I?

[Distruzio]

Yes.

It is an imaginary, arbitrary, useless "identity" used to subvert, disrupt, and eviscerate established identities/peoples.

When the electorate won't do what you want, you create a new electorate.

Isn't every group identity "arbitrary?"

No.

What makes "homosexuals" any more arbitrary of a group than "women" or "Catholics" or "Italians?"

Legitimacy.