Late 2023 Israel-Hamas Conflict, Thread 2 of ?

[Oodreria]

Who specifically cultivated what? Your conspiracy theory here is so inarticulate I can't even tell who you think the perpetrators are, let alone what you think they're doing: "they" hate Mizrahi Jews-- but also European Jews? This is a strictly Sephardic conspiracy? To do what? Attack Arabs so they can have a place where they can attack other Jews?

Well, things like October 7 ARE savage and frightening, something you seem to have difficulty acknowledging. When I was in israel, one day I was sunning on the beach, and the next day reading in the paper how Palestinians in rubber rafts tried to land on that beach to kill the sunbathers there. It was a little frightening, and what adjective would you prefer for the kind of people who do that kind of thing?

I like how you just completely misread what I said. I meant "they" by Israel, Israel specifically cultivated that purposefully. Also, I don't know how you can't understand that Israel mistreats Mizrahi Jews and Holocaust survivors at the same time.

Also, would you consider what Israel has done since October 7th savage and frightening? Killing 19,000 people, majority of them children, 88 journalists murdered, Israel also killing multiple hostages within Gaza and showing no regard.

you realize israel is majority jewish right? youre propagating anti semitic tropes.

[Vassenor]

I like how you just completely misread what I said. I meant "they" by Israel, Israel specifically cultivated that purposefully. Also, I don't know how you can't understand that Israel mistreats Mizrahi Jews and Holocaust survivors at the same time.

Also, would you consider what Israel has done since October 7th savage and frightening? Killing 19,000 people, majority of them children, 88 journalists murdered, Israel also killing multiple hostages within Gaza and showing no regard.

you realize israel is majority jewish right? youre propagating anti semitic tropes.

Where is the anti-Semitism in that post?

[Southland]

-snip-

I don't care if the discussion has moved on. This pretentious reprehensible statement is the epitome of "Everything before the word 'but' is bullshit".

We all gave you examples of songs that were found with quick Google searches that had nothing to do with war and revenge, and yet you continue to go "But that time I poorly YouTube'd!" If you don't want your mind changed, as it's becoming increasingly apparent, just come out and say so. That way we know not to waste our time trying to debate you on this.

Also, I find it it quite telling that your response to a terrorist's quote wasn't "Wow that guy's a jackass" and was instead "Wow, I hope everyone who shares the same ethnicity as him suffers".

[Oodreria]

you realize israel is majority jewish right? youre propagating anti semitic tropes.

Where is the anti-Semitism in that post?

since israel is a majority jewish country he is suggesting that jews killed people. that's textbook anti semitism.

[Vassenor]

Where is the anti-Semitism in that post?

since israel is a majority jewish country he is suggesting that jews killed people. that's textbook anti semitism.

In what way is it anti-Semitism to say that Jewish people killed people?

[Oodreria]

since israel is a majority jewish country he is suggesting that jews killed people. that's textbook anti semitism.

In what way is it anti-Semitism to say that Jewish people killed people?

anti semitic means anti jewish

[Vassenor]

In what way is it anti-Semitism to say that Jewish people killed people?

anti semitic means anti jewish

That doesn't answer my question.

[Fahran]

The Balkans would like to have a word with you.

I believe the argument that the cult of death is uniquely prominent in Palestinian society actually holds a lot of water when we examine the material facts. I also don't find it particularly surprising given what has led to similar cults of death elsewhere.

[Kvatchdom]

The Balkans would like to have a word with you.

I believe the argument that the cult of death is uniquely prominent in Palestinian society actually holds a lot of water when we examine the material facts. I also don't find it particularly surprising given what has led to similar cults of death elsewhere.

Considering that the largest zionist population on earth, Evangelical Americans, are literally a cult of Armageddon, this claim is very suspect. Especially when it's the IDF killing tens of thousands of Palestinians right now.

[Khardsland]

I get Serbian music sometimes. Serbian songs tend to be moody and weird but not about slaughtering their neighbors.

My Dad Is A War Criminal intensifies

[Fahran]

Israel wasn't even meant as a "refuge for the Jewish people". They specifically cultivated that purposefully. Israel has since its creation discriminated against Mizrahi Jews. https://www.timesofisrael.com/inequalit ... tatistics/ Even to this day, there's constant inequality. This also isn't even talking about how Israel broke apart Jewish families from Yemen, or how they sprayed Arab Jews with DDT to "cleanse" them, or how Israel even endorsed terrorist attacks to push other Jews of neighboring states out. or the constant discrimination of Ethiopian Jews https://www.trtworld.com/opinion/racism ... hers-28109

It's also very interesting, because infamously so, Holocaust survivors that traveled to Israel were also discriminated against.

https://www.tabletmag.com/sections/isra ... -survivors
https://www.pbs.org/newshour/world/one- ... ocates-say
https://www.jpost.com/opinion/article-729069

Israel saw Holocaust survivors as "weak" and to this day, many of them still live in poverty. In fact, there's many Holocaust survivors who have FAMOUSLY sympathized with the Palestinian populace. Also, it's weird you bring up Ben-Gurion and Haifa when that's long been proven false. https://www.haaretz.com/2015-05-26/ty-a ... 6f52530000

Anyways, I do quite enjoy how you were like, "I'm not conditioned to hate Palestinians, I just see them as savage and frightening." It's the exact same things the Boers and Rhodesians said to excuse their unjust crimes. "Oh, I don't hate them, we're just more civilized than them." Very interesting when you consider Israel and South Africa's interactions in the future.

This was a poor argument the first time you made it and remains a poor argument now. I'm a bit confused about why Elia-Shalev is alleging that we lack data on discrimination and inequality between various demographic groups in Israel because I've literally read studies from Tel Aviv University that cover the topic in excruciating detail, mapping out differences in wealth, educational attainment, etc. based on minhag, religion, race, etc. Beyond that, I'm a bit confused about why the term Mizrachi is being used instead of the more common Sephardi. Lastly, the Israeli state has been intelligent enough to keep ethnic groups divided? Really, Sayegh? It's a very poor analysis of Israeli demographics across the board, one that pretty much pretends that the bulk of research on the topic doesn't exist.

Beyond that, I've engaged with you on these topics before and you seem to pretty much be throwing out the same intentional misunderstandings that I sought to correct previously. What you're describing as "discrimination" against Holocaust survivors is in many cases the result of the weakening of Israel's social safety net, a process that began in the 1970s and 1980s, the general malfeasance of the Jewish Claims Conference, and limitations in the state's ability to distribute aid and reparation payments in an effective manner. And it is an issue of public consideration. A lot of Jewish people, both in Israel and in the Diaspora, have discussed it and have criticized the at-fault parties.

[East African Federation 2022RP]

snip

“Because YouTube recommended me war songs from Palestine that means EVERY FUCKING PALESTINIAN WANTS TO BE SEEN AS A CHILD-MURDERING LUNATIC! THIS MAKES TOTAL SENSE!!!”

[Fahran]

Considering that the largest zionist population on earth, Evangelical Americans, are literally a cult of Armageddon, this claim is very suspect. Especially when it's the IDF killing tens of thousands of Palestinians right now.

I don't think you quite get what I mean when I talk about a cult of death.

The evangelicals you bring up are insulated from violence and do not actually engage with death on a routine basis. They're not teaching their children about the glory of martyrdom with examples from around the time they were born, they're not watching cartoons where cute animals become martyrs for their country and religion, they're not naming streets and organizations after martyrs killed in living memory, they have not normalized suicide bombings, they do not have children excitedly calling their parents on the site of ethnic massacres, they have not paraded the corpses of raped and murdered women and girls through the streets in public view of their own women and children, etc. Hamas isn't just an eschatological cult. I mean it quite literally when I say death is elevated and lionized in most of their rhetoric, and, as has been pointed out, Hamas and PIJ actually emerged from and inherited the cult of death. Because it predates them by decades. It was around when the Abu Nidal Organization was filling this niche. This isn't a new phenomenon and I'm not the one who coined the term. Journalists have been using it since at least the late 1990s or early 2000s.

This is the result of Islamic revivalism's obsession with martyrdom - a trait no less pronounced in Hamas than in al-Qaeda, the Taliban, or the revolutionaries of Iran, the chronic violence and social instability present in Palestine, and systematic indoctrination into radical ideology and ethnic hatred. The closest parallel in Israeli history would be among the Irgun, the Lehi, and the Palmach, but, following the Israeli victory in the 1948 Independence War, this evolved into Israel's hero cult, the natural result of the security and insulation from violence that victory had brought the beleaguered Jewish nation-state.

[Fahran]

snip

“Because YouTube recommended me war songs from Palestine that means EVERY FUCKING PALESTINIAN WANTS TO BE SEEN AS A CHILD-MURDERING LUNATIC! THIS MAKES TOTAL SENSE!!!”

While I think the description of Palestinian culture is reductive, Palestine has definitely nurtured a cult of death since at least the 1970s. This does not mean that it's the sum total of Palestinian culture or that every Palestinian is necessarily an adherent, but it is an actual thing that is both present and influential in Palestinian society. Palestine is unique in this regard. In 2013, 37% of Palestinians stated that suicide bombing was often justified, 25% stated it was sometimes justified, 12% stated it was rarely justified, and 16% stated it was never justified. And this isn't just me picking on Palestine here. This is an issue of legitimate concern for Muslims across the world themselves because things like the cult of death and extremism impact their communities before any others.

[Kvatchdom]

Considering that the largest zionist population on earth, Evangelical Americans, are literally a cult of Armageddon, this claim is very suspect. Especially when it's the IDF killing tens of thousands of Palestinians right now.

I don't think you quite get what I mean when I talk about a cult of death.

The evangelicals you bring up are insulated from violence and do not actually engage with death on a routine basis. They're not teaching their children about the glory of martyrdom with examples from around the time they were born, they're not watching cartoons where cute animals become martyrs for their country and religion, they're not naming streets and organizations after martyrs killed in living memory, they have not normalized suicide bombings, they do not have children excitedly calling their parents on the site of ethnic massacres, they have not paraded the corpses of raped and murdered women and girls through the streets in public view of their own women and children, etc. Hamas isn't just an eschatological cult. I mean it quite literally when I say death is elevated and lionized in most of their rhetoric, and, as has been pointed out, Hamas and PIJ actually emerged from and inherited the cult of death. Because it predates them by decades. It was around when the Abu Nidal Organization was filling this niche. This isn't a new phenomenon and I'm not the one who coined the term.

This is the result of Islamic revivalism's obsession with martyrdom - a trait no less pronounced in Hamas than in al-Qaeda, the Taliban, or the revolutionaries of Iran, the chronic violence and social instability present in Palestine, and systematic indoctrination into radical ideology and ethnic hatred. The closest parallel in Israeli history would be among the Irgun, the Lehi, and the Palmach, but, following the Israeli victory in the 1948 Independence War, this evolved into Israel's hero cult, the natural result of the security and insulation from violence that victory had brought the beleaguered Jewish nation-state.

I read the article, and what it's describing sounds like hero worship, remembering those who sacrifice themselves for eventual liberation from an oppressive power.Israelis watch on the hills as Palestine is being bombed, they celebrate when Palestinians are killed en masse, and only protest for their own sake. Only about 10% of Israelis believe the IDF is using too much firepower. Hamas' only official charter denies ethnic nationalism and religious supremacy, while Israeli officials proudly speak of insects and animals when Palestinian deaths are mentioned.

Not even the study you sent me earlier about the theoretical rapes that happened on october 7 mentioned anything about raped women and girls being paraded through the streets, why make things up?

[Kvatchdom]

“Because YouTube recommended me war songs from Palestine that means EVERY FUCKING PALESTINIAN WANTS TO BE SEEN AS A CHILD-MURDERING LUNATIC! THIS MAKES TOTAL SENSE!!!”

While I think the description of Palestinian culture is reductive, Palestine has definitely nurtured a cult of death since at least the 1970s. This does not mean that it's the sum total of Palestinian culture or that every Palestinian is necessarily an adherent, but it is an actual thing that is both present and influential in Palestinian society. Palestine is unique in this regard. In 2013, 37% of Palestinians stated that suicide bombing was often justified, 25% stated it was sometimes justified, 12% stated it was rarely justified, and 16% stated it was never justified. And this isn't just me picking on Palestine here. This is an issue of legitimate concern for Muslims across the world themselves because things like the cult of death and extremism impact their communities before any others.

Desperation under ethnic cleansing and genocide make you angry enough to believe such things. Especially when it's lasted 75 years and your oppressor keeps gaslighting the world with the massacres it itself did to Palestinians to try and justify it.

[Fahran]

I read the article, and what it's describing sounds like hero worship, remembering those who sacrifice themselves for eventual liberation from an oppressive power.Israelis watch on the hills as Palestine is being bombed, they celebrate when Palestinians are killed en masse, and only protest for their own sake. Only about 10% of Israelis believe the IDF is using too much firepower. Hamas' only official charter denies ethnic nationalism and religious supremacy, while Israeli officials proudly speak of insects and animals when Palestinian deaths are mentioned.

It's not merely hero worship. We're talking about the commemoration of young men and women who blew themselves up in public locales and rhetoric tailored to encourage more young men and women to lionize and emulate that sort of behavior. Believing suicide bombers are heroes is symptomatic of adherence to the cult of death.

You're comparing apples and oranges again. The population of Sderot did not lionize death in the same way that Hamas, the Abu Nidal Organization, the Lehi, or the Palmach did. There was no intrinsic glory in dying young as a result of ethnic or sectarian conflict. There was certainly resentment towards Gaza, which supported the rockets that rained down on Sderot on a routine basis, but they weren't strapping bombs to their sons. And they were a good deal more insulated from the violence prior to October 7th when Hamas murdered as much as half the community's population.

The last article you brought up isn't exactly the cult of death either. Israel, on the whole, just doesn't exhibit the tell-tale signs associated with the cult of death. You'll see hints of it on occasion, but it's predominant among the extreme elements within society and has largely been suppressed since 1967 because the stressors that lead to it haven't been present.

Not even the study you sent me earlier about the theoretical rapes that happened on october 7 mentioned anything about raped women and girls being paraded through the streets, why make things up?

"Theoretical."

I didn't make it up. You can find the footage online if you have a desire to look at it for whatever reason.

[Fahran]

Desperation under ethnic cleansing and genocide make you angry enough to believe such things. Especially when it's lasted 75 years and your oppressor keeps gaslighting the world with the massacres it itself did to Palestinians to try and justify it.

I don't see much point in rationalizing the cult of death because it's not really a rational thing. It's the product of social instability, the normalization of extreme violence, the elevation of death and martyrdom as visceral and attainable virtues, and the cultivation of ideological extremism.

[Kvatchdom]

I read the article, and what it's describing sounds like hero worship, remembering those who sacrifice themselves for eventual liberation from an oppressive power.Israelis watch on the hills as Palestine is being bombed, they celebrate when Palestinians are killed en masse, and only protest for their own sake. Only about 10% of Israelis believe the IDF is using too much firepower. Hamas' only official charter denies ethnic nationalism and religious supremacy, while Israeli officials proudly speak of insects and animals when Palestinian deaths are mentioned.

It's not merely hero worship. We're talking about the commemoration of young men and women who blew themselves up in public locales and rhetoric tailored to encourage more young men and women to lionize and emulate that sort of behavior. Believing suicide bombers are heroes is symptomatic of adherence to the cult of death.

You're comparing apples and oranges again. The population of Sderot did not lionize death in the same way that the Lehi, the Abu Nidal Organization, the Lehi, or the Palmach did. There was no intrinsic glory in dying young as a result of ethnic or sectarian conflict. There was certainly resentment towards Gaza, which supported the rockets that rained down on Sderot on a routine basis, but they weren't strapping bombs to their sons. And they were a good deal more insulated from the violence prior to October 7th when Hamas murdered as much as half the community's population.

The last article you brought up isn't exactly the cult of death either. Israel, on the whole, just doesn't exhibit the tell-tale signs associated with the cult of death. You'll see hints of it on occasion, but it's predominant among the extreme elements within society and has largely been suppressed since 1967 because the stressors that lead to it haven't been present.

Not even the study you sent me earlier about the theoretical rapes that happened on october 7 mentioned anything about raped women and girls being paraded through the streets, why make things up?

"Theoretical."

I didn't make it up. You can find the footage online if you have a desire to look at it for whatever reason.

You seem obsessed with the terminology surrounding the cult of death. I believe it's incorrect because these people believe they're doing it so those close to them won't die, and those who live believe those who did it, did it to try and help their countrymen stay alive. It's adherence of sacrifice, martyrdom, not death itself.

I am not. The population of Sderot does* not did, this is not the past. And Israelis still lionize death of Palestinians, they make fun of dead Palestinians in Tik Tok, make dance videos about their Nova Park and going to Starbucks in the Gaza strip once it's been depopulated of all life. These people have the mentality of Nazi settlers moving into Poland. They have the privilege to love their bombs from afar, to see their bombs oppress, while Palestinians see their suicide bombers as martyrs towards freedom.

Israel exhibits the tell-tale signs of Manifest Destiny and Lebensraum mentality settlers, ethnic supremacists and racists. Their government is full of these people, their opposition agrees with them on murdering Palestinians en masse in the West Bank aswell.

You sent me the study, I read it, and responded. Here I am saying you absolutely made up the idea of raped women and girls being paraded on the streets, because it wasn't even present in that.

[Kvatchdom]

Desperation under ethnic cleansing and genocide make you angry enough to believe such things. Especially when it's lasted 75 years and your oppressor keeps gaslighting the world with the massacres it itself did to Palestinians to try and justify it.

I don't see much point in rationalizing the cult of death because it's not really a rational thing. It's the product of social instability, the normalization of extreme violence, the elevation of death and martyrdom as visceral and attainable virtues, and the cultivation of ideological extremism.

It's the product of oppression and a population devoid of proper abilities to defend itself from an oppressive and racist foreign nation.

[Kvatchdom]

Germany has restarted their antisemitism in censoring jewish voices for speaking against Israel

[Alcala-Cordel]

Desperation under ethnic cleansing and genocide make you angry enough to believe such things. Especially when it's lasted 75 years and your oppressor keeps gaslighting the world with the massacres it itself did to Palestinians to try and justify it.

I don't see much point in rationalizing the cult of death because it's not really a rational thing. It's the product of social instability, the normalization of extreme violence, the elevation of death and martyrdom as visceral and attainable virtues, and the cultivation of ideological extremism.

It makes sense as a coping mechanism for ethnic cleaning. Do you not see how being in constant danger with almost nothing to lose could drive people to that point?

[Fahran]

You seem obsessed with the terminology surrounding the cult of death. I believe it's incorrect because these people believe they're doing it so those close to them won't die, and those who live believe those who did it, did it to try and help their countrymen stay alive. It's adherence of sacrifice, martyrdom, not death itself.

I am not. The population of Sderot does* not did, this is not the past. And Israelis still lionize death of Palestinians, they make fun of dead Palestinians in Tik Tok, make dance videos about their Nova Park and going to Starbucks in the Gaza strip once it's been depopulated of all life. These people have the mentality of Nazi settlers moving into Poland. They have the privilege to love their bombs from afar, to see their bombs oppress, while Palestinians see their suicide bombers as martyrs towards freedom.

Israel exhibits the tell-tale signs of Manifest Destiny and Lebensraum mentality settlers, ethnic supremacists and racists. Their government is full of these people, their opposition agrees with them on murdering Palestinians en masse in the West Bank aswell.

You sent me the study, I read it, and responded. Here I am saying you absolutely made up the idea of raped women and girls being paraded on the streets, because it wasn't even present in that.

I'm not obsessed with the terminology. I'm just not particularly keen to allow you to continue obfuscating it, either deliberately or because you misunderstand what the term actually denotes. The entire point behind the cult of death or cult of martyrs in Palestine is to encourage more young men to pursue martyrdom on behalf of Palestine and Islam. How society perceives and reacts to death is the distinguishing characteristic. It's not actually about minimizing death or about sparing your family. In fact, this facet of culture has often led to younger boys pursuing martyrdom in emulation of their older brothers and cousins. And, as I mentioned before, it cannot be rationalized because it's not the result of rational thought processes from individuals. It's a sociological, political, and religious phenomenon that emerges dues to particular cultural underpinnings and material conditions.

It'd be a bit difficult for the population of Sderot to do a whole lot given 90% of them are no longer present in the community and the article you cited is from a decade ago. Beyond that, you do not "lionize" the death of your political enemies. Lionization is what you do for your own dead. It's the cult of martyrs or the romantic fatalism. It's naming streets after suicide bombers. It's being proud that your child slit the throats of a few old people before being gunned down. It's happily singing patriotic songs as you march to certain death. The privilege and insulation you're describing are directly counter to most of that. That said, I think you underestimate the extent of the violence experienced by civilians in Sderot. Most of those people probably had PTSD due to semi-regular rocket strikes from Gaza. They were insulated in that the stress was less pronounced and that the other factors that contribute to a full-blown cult of death weren't present.

I generally call that maximalism, but the Israeli opposition does not, in fact, agree with it, especially when you examine how diverse the opposition actually is. "Two states for two peoples" remains the baseline position for most of the Israeli center-left and center, with a binational/non-national state being a position among the hard left. That said, you're correct in pointing out that this is an aspect of policy for Likud and Otzma Yehudit. They have also cultivated cults of death, the Kahanists to a more pronounced and overt degree. And, of course, this is not all the share with Hamas, which is no less maximalist than Likud.

I'm not posting sources for that claim because I don't want to watch those videos and they would violate site rules regarding PG-13 content. They were widely circulated by pro-Hamas social media accounts in the days immediately following October 7th, and, while many sites took them down, you can probably still find them if you decide to do so. There were other people on NSG who saw them early on. I recall one remark was "I didn't know someone's leg could break like that." These parades were public events in Gaza.

It's the product of oppression and a population devoid of proper abilities to defend itself from an oppressive and racist foreign nation.

Cults of death do not develop without an underlying cultural foundation. For the Nazis, the romantic fatalism of artists such as Wagner and the cult of dead soldiers provided this. For the Lehi, anxieties over a Second Holocaust in Palestine and their own romantic, fanatical, and fatalistic outlooks provided this. For the Abu Nidal Organization, it was a poignant combination of fanaticism, romanticism, fatalism, and self-sacrifice. For Hamas, Islamic revivalism's obsession with the cult of heroic martyrs has largely filled that role, but the fatalism, fanaticism, and self-sacrifice are still present.

[Kvatchdom]

You seem obsessed with the terminology surrounding the cult of death. I believe it's incorrect because these people believe they're doing it so those close to them won't die, and those who live believe those who did it, did it to try and help their countrymen stay alive. It's adherence of sacrifice, martyrdom, not death itself.

I am not. The population of Sderot does* not did, this is not the past. And Israelis still lionize death of Palestinians, they make fun of dead Palestinians in Tik Tok, make dance videos about their Nova Park and going to Starbucks in the Gaza strip once it's been depopulated of all life. These people have the mentality of Nazi settlers moving into Poland. They have the privilege to love their bombs from afar, to see their bombs oppress, while Palestinians see their suicide bombers as martyrs towards freedom.

Israel exhibits the tell-tale signs of Manifest Destiny and Lebensraum mentality settlers, ethnic supremacists and racists. Their government is full of these people, their opposition agrees with them on murdering Palestinians en masse in the West Bank aswell.

You sent me the study, I read it, and responded. Here I am saying you absolutely made up the idea of raped women and girls being paraded on the streets, because it wasn't even present in that.

I'm not obsessed with the terminology. I'm just not particularly keen to allow you to continue obfuscating it, either deliberately or because you misunderstand what the term actually denotes. The entire point behind the cult of death or cult of martyrs in Palestine is to encourage more young men to pursue martyrdom on behalf of Palestine and Islam. How society perceives and reacts to death is the distinguishing characteristic. It's not actually about minimizing death or about sparing your family. In fact, this facet of culture has often led to younger boys pursuing martyrdom in emulation of their older brothers and cousins. And, as I mentioned before, it cannot be rationalized because it's not the result of rational thought processes from individuals. It's a sociological, political, and religious phenomenon that emerges dues to particular cultural underpinnings and material conditions.

It'd be a bit difficult for the population of Sderot to do a whole lot given 90% of the community is no longer present in the community and the article you cited is from a decade ago. Beyond that, you do not "lionize" the death of your political enemies. Lionization is what you do for your own dead. It's the cult of martyrs or the romantic fatalism. It's naming streets after suicide bombers. It's being proud that your child slit the throats of a few old people before being gunned down. It's happily singing patriotic songs as you march to certain death. The privilege and insulation you're describing are directly counter to most of that.

I generally call that maximalism, but the Israeli opposition does not, in fact, agree with it, especially when you examine how diverse the opposition actually is. "Two states for two peoples" remains the baseline position for most of the Israeli center-left and center, with a binational/non-national state being a position among the hard left. That said, you're correct in pointing out that this is an aspect of policy for Likud and Otzma Yehudit. They have also cultivated cults of death, the Kahanists to a more pronounced and overt degree. And, of course, this is not all the share with Hamas, which is no less maximalist than Likud.

I'm not posting sources for that claim because I don't want to watch those videos and they would violate site rules regarding PG-13 content. They were widely circulated by pro-Hamas social media accounts in the days immediately following October 7th, and, while many sites took them down, you can probably still find them if you decide to do so. There were other people on NSG who saw them early on. I recall one remark was "I didn't know someone's leg could break like that." These parades were public events in Gaza.

Anger, hatred and helplessness are rational, they happen in human brains and can be explained. There is obviously religious fervor going on aswell, but to say that Palestinians love death for it's own sake is stupidity, they wouldn't be trying to survive as hard as they are otherwise. The cultural underpinnings and material conditions are ethnic cleansing, oppression and the trauma from all of that. It did not happen in a vacuum, Israel created it.

The population of Sderot and similar racist settler enclaves are still alive and well within Israel, unless they fled abroad. Their ideology remains, in the constant, not in the past. And exactly, Israelis see it as their pride that Palestinians live in those horrible conditions, they cherish that idea because it makes them feel superior. Being proud of your people for fighting back against an oppressive force is nothing abnormal.

It does. Yair Lapid agrees with it, Avigdor Lieberman agrees with it, the only ones who don't seem to be the Arabic and far-left parties and the atomically small Labour party which itself hosted genocidal maniacs as members at Israel's birth. There is no future in Israeli politics where the Israeli leadership do not want to see Palestinians wiped into wet red stains on the feet of mallgoers in the Gaza strip.

People made all kinds of claims at the start, I looked and found nothing of the sort. Every single claim of mass baby executions, slitting open pregnant women, putting children into ovens, all were lies. They will all continue to be lies until Israel stops being a racist settler state with the incentive to lie.

[Kvatchdom]

It's the product of oppression and a population devoid of proper abilities to defend itself from an oppressive and racist foreign nation.

Cults of death do not develop without an underlying cultural foundation. For the Nazis, the romantic fatalism of artists such as Wagner and the cult of dead soldiers provided this. For the Lehi, anxieties over a Second Holocaust in Palestine and their own romantic, fanatical, and fatalistic outlooks provided this. For the Abu Nidal Organization, it was a poignant combination of fanaticism, romanticism, fatalism, and self-sacrifice. For Hamas, Islamic revivalism's obsession with the cult of heroic martyrs has largely filled that role, but the fatalism, fanaticism, and self-sacrifice are still present.

Do not make a Nazi comparison when it is the Israelis who are racist settlers committing their own lebensraum. You are trying to dehumanize extremely human emotions around survival and avoiding ethnic cleansing and the destruction of a culture.