Floridas ¨don´t say gay bill¨

[Northern Socialist Council Republics]

Let us roll things back to the contention that seems to me the crux of the debate:

What is the purpose of public education?

To prepare people to work in various jobs.

Sorry. Poor phrasing on my part. This was a normative question, not a descriptive one.

What should the objective of public education be? On what moral argument do we justify the idea of the state being involved in the upbringing of children?

[Alcala-Cordel]

To prepare people to work in various jobs.

Sorry. Poor phrasing on my part. This was a normative question, not a descriptive one.

What should the objective of public education be? On what moral argument do we justify the idea of the state being involved in the upbringing of children?

I'd say schools should exist to open people's eyes to the world and the things that make both nature and human society function.

[Vassenor]

Never underestimate how triggered certain cons get by the idea that people can just be not cishet without it being a social contagion.

[The United Penguin Commonwealth]

Sorry little Timmy, I can't explain why your parents live together, it would just be so sexualizing.

Explaining why little Timmy's parents live together really ought not be part of younger kids' schooling period.

doesn't need to be banned.

[Vassenor]

Explaining why little Timmy's parents live together really ought not be part of younger kids' schooling period.

doesn't need to be banned.

But the idea of kids even knowing that that’s OK makes some people deeply uncomfortable and so they want it banned.

[Loeje]

doesn't need to be banned.

But the idea of kids even knowing that that’s OK makes some people deeply uncomfortable and so they want it banned.

I wouldn't be surprised if they're uncomfortable with the existence of LGBT people more than they're uncomfortable about kids being taught about the existence of LGBT people. It's just the best they can do.

[American Legionaries]

Explaining why little Timmy's parents live together really ought not be part of younger kids' schooling period.

doesn't need to be banned.

I didn't say it did.

[Prima Scriptura]

But the idea of kids even knowing that that’s OK makes some people deeply uncomfortable and so they want it banned.

I wouldn't be surprised if they're uncomfortable with the existence of LGBT people more than they're uncomfortable about kids being taught about the existence of LGBT people. It's just the best they can do.

So, according to your logic, I believe I shouldn’t exist because I support this law?

[Necroghastia]

What part of "tyranny becomes law" did you not understand here

It’s not tyranny, though. If parents want to tell their young children about LGBT, then they are free to do so. What this law is that far-left and radical LGBT teachers cannot undermine the wishes of the parents.

Why do the "wishes of the parents" matter with this and not, say, evolution? Vaccines? Treating black people as equivalent to white people? All of those go against the wishes of many people; do you stand against schools being able to teach about all those as well?

when tyranny becomes law rebellion becomes duty etc

It isn’t tyranny. It was a law passed and signed through the regular legislative process.

Plenty of tyrannical laws do that.

Besides, young children belong nowhere near any type of LGBT pride parade.

Why not?

This is goes FAR beyond simply telling children “some people have to moms and two dads”.

At a K-3 level? Smashing X to Doubt.

This is encouraging a LGBT lifestyle and encouraging young children to question their sexuality and/or gender, which radical LGBT activists want.

Even if that WAS happening (source plz) why is that such a big deal?

[Prima Scriptura]

It’s not tyranny, though. If parents want to tell their young children about LGBT, then they are free to do so. What this law is that far-left and radical LGBT teachers cannot undermine the wishes of the parents.

Why do the "wishes of the parents" matter with this and not, say, evolution? Vaccines? Treating black people as equivalent to white people? All of those go against the wishes of many people; do you stand against schools being able to teach about all those as well?

It isn’t tyranny. It was a law passed and signed through the regular legislative process.

Plenty of tyrannical laws do that.

Besides, young children belong nowhere near any type of LGBT pride parade.

Why not?

This is goes FAR beyond simply telling children “some people have to moms and two dads”.

At a K-3 level? Smashing X to Doubt.

This is encouraging a LGBT lifestyle and encouraging young children to question their sexuality and/or gender, which radical LGBT activists want.

Even if that WAS happening (source plz) why is that such a big deal?

Because it’s inappropriate. I don’t know how many times you want me to answer the same question.

[Aggicificicerous]

Because it’s inappropriate. I don’t know how many times you want me to answer the same question.

You haven't explained what makes it inappropriate.

All my primary school teachers at some point mentioned their spouses. It's normal since teaching children involves talking to them, telling them stories and so on. For example, my third grade teacher would often tell us about the places she'd visited with her husband. Do you think that's a bad thing? Tell me, do you have a problem with a teacher telling her students either of the following sentences?

"Last summer, my husband and I went hiking in Alaska."

"Last summer, my wife and I went hiking in Alaska.

[Diarcesia]

Because it’s inappropriate. I don’t know how many times you want me to answer the same question.

You haven't explained what makes it inappropriate.

All my primary school teachers at some point mentioned their spouses. It's normal since teaching children involves talking to them, telling them stories and so on. For example, my third grade teacher would often tell us about the places she'd visited with her husband. Do you think that's a bad thing? Tell me, do you have a problem with a teacher telling her students either of the following sentences?

"Last summer, my husband and I went hiking in Alaska."

"Last summer, my wife and I went hiking in Alaska.

I think it's a subset of the "liberal arts bad", "STEM good" education debate when it comes to preparing students for careers.

[Kannap]

What part of "tyranny becomes law" did you not understand here

It’s not tyranny, though. If parents want to tell their young children about LGBT, then they are free to do so. What this law is that far-left and radical LGBT teachers cannot undermine the wishes of the parents.

Why have you made it a far-left or radical idea to simply tell gay kids that they're okay, they're not broken, and being gay is normal? Why have you bothered politicizing the lives of gay people, who just want to live equally as straight people live.

Besides, most kids don't start realizing they're gay until middle school or high school - so why should teachers - people they trust - not be allowed to affirm their existence?

Schools are Hell for LGBT students. I didn't know I was gay until high school but, oh boy, it seemed like the rest of the kids knew in elementary school. I was bullied as early as the third grade for "being gay" - I had no idea what they were talking about at the time but child me understood that it was different, it wasn't good, and it was something I desperately didn't want to be if it meant being bullied for it. I spent far longer in the closet and afraid of being myself - until the age of 21 - because I was afraid of being bullied.

So, yeah, if not wanting to see children go through the same shit I went through, the same shit many LGBT kids went through, makes me "radical" or "far-left" because you've - for some reason - decided to politicize the existence of LGBT people, then yeah, I'm radical as fuck. Because I think kids, no matter their age, deserve the dignity of respect and affirmation of who they are. This isn't "encouraging kids to be gay," or whatever nonsense bullshit you folks want to spew, this is literally a simple intolerance for homophobic bullying. And if you guys can't even cross a bar that's so low it's resting on the ground, then I don't know what the discussion to be had here is.

And yeah, if somebody's parents are homophobic and mistreat their LGBT children because of that, then fuck those parents and I hope those LGBT folks can get away from those parents and cut them out of their lives as soon as safely possible.

[Kannap]

Because it’s inappropriate. I don’t know how many times you want me to answer the same question.

You haven't explained what makes it inappropriate.

All my primary school teachers at some point mentioned their spouses. It's normal since teaching children involves talking to them, telling them stories and so on. For example, my third grade teacher would often tell us about the places she'd visited with her husband. Do you think that's a bad thing? Tell me, do you have a problem with a teacher telling her students either of the following sentences?

"Last summer, my husband and I went hiking in Alaska."

"Last summer, my wife and I went hiking in Alaska.

Random memory just turned up of the time when I was working in childcare still when one of the kids in our program kept trying to suggest me and a female coworker were dating. To which me and the female coworker both informed the kid we have boyfriends.

Also, one of the kids in my program had a gay uncle who was married and he was very proud of his gay uncles and talked about them all the time.

The thing is, kids are going to see LGBT people in public, in school settings, in afterschool settings, at the grocery store, at the movie theater, walking downtown, everywhere really. Because, newsflash, LGBT people are people, who exist and live normal lives like just like straight cisgender people do. It's perfectly reasonable to help kids understand that seeing two men holding hands when they're walking down the sidewalk is perfectly normal and acceptable behavior. Maybe the sooner kids know this, the less they'll bully other kids for being different.

[Aggicificicerous]

Random memory just turned up of the time when I was working in childcare still when one of the kids in our program kept trying to suggest me and a female coworker were dating. To which me and the female coworker both informed the kid we have boyfriends.

Also, one of the kids in my program had a gay uncle who was married and he was very proud of his gay uncles and talked about them all the time.

The thing is, kids are going to see LGBT people in public, in school settings, in afterschool settings, at the grocery store, at the movie theater, walking downtown, everywhere really. Because, newsflash, LGBT people are people, who exist and live normal lives like just like straight cisgender people do. It's perfectly reasonable to help kids understand that seeing two men holding hands when they're walking down the sidewalk is perfectly normal and acceptable behavior. Maybe the sooner kids know this, the less they'll bully other kids for being different.

I want to wonder what the protocol in Florida schools will be for when students bring up their LGBT relatives, but there probably won't be one. The laws are intentionally vague so parents can sue their school whenever they feel they can win. The goal is to punish people, not have a functioning education system.

[ChristIsKing-Groyper]

doesn't need to be banned.

But the idea of kids even knowing that that’s OK makes some people deeply uncomfortable and so they want it banned.

Ban it, have it up to the parents its their job.

[Prima Scriptura]

It’s not tyranny, though. If parents want to tell their young children about LGBT, then they are free to do so. What this law is that far-left and radical LGBT teachers cannot undermine the wishes of the parents.

Why have you made it a far-left or radical idea to simply tell gay kids that they're okay, they're not broken, and being gay is normal? Why have you bothered politicizing the lives of gay people, who just want to live equally as straight people live.

Besides, most kids don't start realizing they're gay until middle school or high school - so why should teachers - people they trust - not be allowed to affirm their existence?

Schools are Hell for LGBT students. I didn't know I was gay until high school but, oh boy, it seemed like the rest of the kids knew in elementary school. I was bullied as early as the third grade for "being gay" - I had no idea what they were talking about at the time but child me understood that it was different, it wasn't good, and it was something I desperately didn't want to be if it meant being bullied for it. I spent far longer in the closet and afraid of being myself - until the age of 21 - because I was afraid of being bullied.

So, yeah, if not wanting to see children go through the same shit I went through, the same shit many LGBT kids went through, makes me "radical" or "far-left" because you've - for some reason - decided to politicize the existence of LGBT people, then yeah, I'm radical as fuck. Because I think kids, no matter their age, deserve the dignity of respect and affirmation of who they are. This isn't "encouraging kids to be gay," or whatever nonsense bullshit you folks want to spew, this is literally a simple intolerance for homophobic bullying. And if you guys can't even cross a bar that's so low it's resting on the ground, then I don't know what the discussion to be had here is.

And yeah, if somebody's parents are homophobic and mistreat their LGBT children because of that, then fuck those parents and I hope those LGBT folks can get away from those parents and cut them out of their lives as soon as safely possible.

Hmm, I knew had SSA before middle school. I went a Catholic school from 3rd-8th grade, and homosexuality was brought up once in a Catholic sex-Ed lesson, that I actually missed that day. It was in 6th or 7th grade. The series was form the 80s and was called “In God’s image”
Either way, it’s not the Schools place to affirm one’s sexual feelings, attractions or actions. People go to school for an education, not to be indoctrinated into a leftist view of sexuality. The fact that the far-left and the radical LGBT activists want to expose young children to their lifestyle is deeply disturbing. I mean, the LGBT activists have tried their hardest to end the notion that LGBT adults recruit children, which I have personal experience with when I went to a church that was a MCC Church. At that time I was only 14-15 and I was sexually accosted.

The topic of homosexuality and transgenderism shouldn’t be brought up until high school.


This is the last reply I’m giving you. You blasphemous “joke” of the most Holy Trinity was unacceptable. Once again, you will be in my prayers.

[The United Penguin Commonwealth]

But the idea of kids even knowing that that’s OK makes some people deeply uncomfortable and so they want it banned.

Ban it, have it up to the parents its their job.

the point of a school is to teach children. part of what schools teach is relationships and stories, whether you like it or not. for what reason beyond your religion should stories depicting gay people be banned? what does that improve?

and what about the abusive parents?

[Austria-Bohemia-Hungary]

it’s not the Schools place to affirm one’s sexual feelings

But it is the school's duty to turn out relatively well-adjusted people and not fricken psychopaths because they could not or maliciously would not stop bullying.
You know, that duty of care in loco parentis?

[The United Penguin Commonwealth]

Why have you made it a far-left or radical idea to simply tell gay kids that they're okay, they're not broken, and being gay is normal? Why have you bothered politicizing the lives of gay people, who just want to live equally as straight people live.

Besides, most kids don't start realizing they're gay until middle school or high school - so why should teachers - people they trust - not be allowed to affirm their existence?

Schools are Hell for LGBT students. I didn't know I was gay until high school but, oh boy, it seemed like the rest of the kids knew in elementary school. I was bullied as early as the third grade for "being gay" - I had no idea what they were talking about at the time but child me understood that it was different, it wasn't good, and it was something I desperately didn't want to be if it meant being bullied for it. I spent far longer in the closet and afraid of being myself - until the age of 21 - because I was afraid of being bullied.

So, yeah, if not wanting to see children go through the same shit I went through, the same shit many LGBT kids went through, makes me "radical" or "far-left" because you've - for some reason - decided to politicize the existence of LGBT people, then yeah, I'm radical as fuck. Because I think kids, no matter their age, deserve the dignity of respect and affirmation of who they are. This isn't "encouraging kids to be gay," or whatever nonsense bullshit you folks want to spew, this is literally a simple intolerance for homophobic bullying. And if you guys can't even cross a bar that's so low it's resting on the ground, then I don't know what the discussion to be had here is.

And yeah, if somebody's parents are homophobic and mistreat their LGBT children because of that, then fuck those parents and I hope those LGBT folks can get away from those parents and cut them out of their lives as soon as safely possible.

Hmm, I knew had SSA before middle school. I went a Catholic school from 3rd-8th grade, and homosexuality was brought up once in a Catholic sex-Ed lesson, that I actually missed that day. It was in 6th or 7th grade. The series was form the 80s and was called “In God’s image”
Either way, it’s not the Schools place to affirm one’s sexual feelings, attractions or actions. People go to school for an education, not to be indoctrinated into a leftist view of sexuality. The fact that the far-left and the radical LGBT activists want to expose young children to their lifestyle is deeply disturbing. I mean, the LGBT activists have tried their hardest to end the notion that LGBT adults recruit children, which I have personal experience with when I went to a church that was a MCC Church. At that time I was only 14-15 and I was sexually accosted.

The topic of homosexuality and transgenderism shouldn’t be brought up until high school.


This is the last reply I’m giving you. You blasphemous “joke” of the most Holy Trinity was unacceptable. Once again, you will be in my prayers.

way to not respond to the main points of the post.
way to continue politicizing gay people being treated fairly.
way to continue claiming that teaching people that gay people exist is somehow disturbing and indoctrination.

until you can explain with facts (not feelings) what’s inappropriate about gay people, your argument has no weight.

[Stellar Colonies]

This is anecdotal and may not be widely applicable, but I wasn't aware that non-straight and non-cisgendered people were real until I was just entering high school.

Since I was so freshly aware of their existence and have only known two that I know of, both within a year or so of becoming aware, I still thought of them of being weird at the time.

I probably would not have done so if I'd known of them outside the limited context of "evil bisexual aliens in Star Trek".

[Necroghastia]

Why do the "wishes of the parents" matter with this and not, say, evolution? Vaccines? Treating black people as equivalent to white people? All of those go against the wishes of many people; do you stand against schools being able to teach about all those as well?

Plenty of tyrannical laws do that.

Why not?

At a K-3 level? Smashing X to Doubt.

Even if that WAS happening (source plz) why is that such a big deal?

Because it’s inappropriate. I don’t know how many times you want me to answer the same question.

I'll keep asking until you finally, finally, explain WHY it's inappropriate. Simply saying it is is a joke of an answer.
Also "because it's inappropriate" is not even a response to the first question posed in my post, nor is it a source for your claims.

[Saiwania]

Disney is lobbying against this legislation or siding against it, so I propose that Florida's state government if not the national tier Republican party in the US Senate and House move to weaken if not entirely revoke Disney's copyright protections on their trademarks/copyrights and etc. that'd otherwise have been public domain by now, when or if Republicans gain power again. Lets make it so anyone can now use Mickey Mouse in general.

That ought to really show them.

[The Reformed American Republic]

Disney is lobbying against this legislation or siding against it, so I propose that Florida's state government if not the national Republican party in the US Senate and House move to weaken if not entirely revoke Disney's copyright protections on their trademarks/copyrights and etc. that'd otherwise have been public domain by now, when or if Republicans gain power again. Lets make it so anyone can now use Mickey Mouse in general.

That ought to really show them.

Republicans exist to serve corporations. This is just to grandstand to their base.

[Cannot think of a name]

Disney is lobbying against this legislation or siding against it, so I propose that Florida's state government if not the national tier Republican party in the US Senate and House move to weaken if not entirely revoke Disney's copyright protections on their trademarks/copyrights and etc. that'd otherwise have been public domain by now, when or if Republicans gain power again. Lets make it so anyone can now use Mickey Mouse in general.

That ought to really show them.

Let's go ahead and do that and get rid of this homophobic law.