Only if it's those CAPTCHAS where you rotate small animals.
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by Luna Amore » Sun Aug 29, 2021 8:08 am
by Fauzjhia » Sun Aug 29, 2021 8:10 am
by Galiantus III » Sun Aug 29, 2021 9:52 am
Frisbeeteria wrote:For some reason I have a mental image of a dolphin, trying to organize a new pod of his fellow dolphins to change the course of a nuclear sub. It's entertaining, I'll give ya that.
Ballotonia wrote:Testing is for sissies. The actual test is to see how many people complain when any change is made ;)
by Riemstagrad » Sun Aug 29, 2021 10:19 am
Galiantus III wrote:
What if there was a short timer associated with issues answering, that could regulate the speed of card generation? Basically, if an issue is answered within 5 seconds of logging in, or of answering another issue, it would not generate a card pack. This is long enough to be extremely detrimental to card farmers, but short enough there are very few cases where this would hurt casual players. Importantly, this means whatever new method of card generation is introduced, it can have the same top speed as issue answering now, and be the preferred method for card farmers.
by Flanderlion » Sun Aug 29, 2021 10:23 am
Riemstagrad wrote:Galiantus III wrote:
What if there was a short timer associated with issues answering, that could regulate the speed of card generation? Basically, if an issue is answered within 5 seconds of logging in, or of answering another issue, it would not generate a card pack. This is long enough to be extremely detrimental to card farmers, but short enough there are very few cases where this would hurt casual players. Importantly, this means whatever new method of card generation is introduced, it can have the same top speed as issue answering now, and be the preferred method for card farmers.
scripts and containers can easily circumvent this. And if you will lower the rate at wich issues generate packs, players will just create more puppets to generate the same amount of packs as before.
The way the big farmers farm at this point gives near endless pack generation, despite the site limits give even less then a pack per nation every day. Higher pack rate reduces the need for more puppets (and gives casual players more cards too...). One pack per issue seems reasonable.
by Benevolent 1 » Sun Aug 29, 2021 12:00 pm
Flanderlion wrote:Riemstagrad wrote:
scripts and containers can easily circumvent this. And if you will lower the rate at wich issues generate packs, players will just create more puppets to generate the same amount of packs as before.
The way the big farmers farm at this point gives near endless pack generation, despite the site limits give even less then a pack per nation every day. Higher pack rate reduces the need for more puppets (and gives casual players more cards too...). One pack per issue seems reasonable.
I think that would change literally nothing. Farmers don't stop for a certain number of packs farmed, they stop when they get distracted/bored. So if they spend an hour, they could be paid 100 packs, 200 or 600, it wouldn't make a difference.
by Fauzjhia » Sun Aug 29, 2021 1:22 pm
Benevolent 1 wrote: Technical really really needs to develop a method of linking the puppets to their puppet masters. It's the key to solving the problem.
Benevolent 1 wrote:
Without that, maybe the only way is to have S3 more like the initial phase of S1. No auction.
by Benevolent 1 » Sun Aug 29, 2021 1:28 pm
Fauzjhia wrote:Benevolent 1 wrote: Technical really really needs to develop a method of linking the puppets to their puppet masters. It's the key to solving the problem.
Really ? you know there is a SCRIPT for that. and everyone I know of, has been reporting their most recent puppets.
in fact. you are one of the player who did not report his puppets. so why you don't follow my example and report all your puppets.Benevolent 1 wrote:
Without that, maybe the only way is to have S3 more like the initial phase of S1. No auction.
That's the April fool phase, and you have no idea how easy that phase was on big farmer, fact. you really have no idea what the hell you are talking about. Big farmer will be able to pass cards from their puppet to their main at only 0.01 bank. they were doing it back then and they will do it again.
by Frisbeeteria » Sun Aug 29, 2021 3:44 pm
Benevolent 1 wrote:3. Card farms are reduced in size and also in number - this for site stability and control of excessive card productions. TCALS is completely disabled, abolished. The practice of inflating cards is discouraged by a fee system at auction or some other system of discouragement. The above deck capacity conundrum is addressed. New bugs and flaws are dealt with better, in real time. To put it all into a super simple slogan - make the game fun again.
by SherpDaWerp » Sun Aug 29, 2021 4:00 pm
Fauzjhia wrote:unlimited game farming is not good. and should not be encouraged in anyway.
and I highly doubt a faster pack generation will bring the end of puppets. it could just bring MORE farming.
by Fauzjhia » Sun Aug 29, 2021 4:15 pm
SherpDaWerp wrote:Fauzjhia wrote:unlimited game farming is not good. and should not be encouraged in anyway.
and I highly doubt a faster pack generation will bring the end of puppets. it could just bring MORE farming.
The point here isn't to increase pack generation without reason, it's to increase pack generation, but for people who don't use puppets. Sure, it might bring more farming and more cards, at which point the drop rates can be tweaked. But the core of this change is to allow farmers to focus their farming in a way that isn't as harmful to the site as large-scale issue answering.
by United Calanworie » Sun Aug 29, 2021 4:33 pm
by Farnhamia » Sun Aug 29, 2021 4:45 pm
Benevolent 1 wrote:Fauzjhia wrote:Really ? you know there is a SCRIPT for that. and everyone I know of, has been reporting their most recent puppets.
in fact. you are one of the player who did not report his puppets. so why you don't follow my example and report all your puppets.
That's the April fool phase, and you have no idea how easy that phase was on big farmer, fact. you really have no idea what the hell you are talking about. Big farmer will be able to pass cards from their puppet to their main at only 0.01 bank. they were doing it back then and they will do it again.
It's just too easy to yank your chain.
by Benevolent 1 » Sun Aug 29, 2021 4:52 pm
United Calanworie wrote:I know I might be entirely off the mark here, but… what about just putting a captcha on the issue answer page if (x) requests come from that IP address in (y) time?
X could be five, so that anyone logging into their main and answering the maximum number of issues possible wouldn’t get hit with a captcha, but then progressively ramp up the number of captchas displayed at say, x*2, where you’ll start getting 1 captcha every three or so issues, and bring that captcha frequency up until say, x*4, where you’re getting one on every issue answer. It doesn’t hurt small-time farmers, and it simply makes the process irritating for large scale farmers to maintain hundreds of puppets, as they’ll start getting captchas every issue once they get through 15-20 of their puppets.
Thoughts?
by Praeceps » Sun Aug 29, 2021 7:34 pm
Frisbeeteria wrote:Praeceps wrote: I'd be curious as to what the admins/mods see as the outstanding discussion points preventing this idea from being moved forward?
What discussion points?The main thing preventing us from going forward is that we don't have any great ideas either. Come up with a great idea, and we won't "prevent it from going forward".
- Reducing card farms? We're for it.
- Tying it to one or more of the mini-games? I'm not seeing anything resembling a consensus, or really a strong argument either way
- Something else? Be specific.
by Galiantus III » Sun Aug 29, 2021 8:23 pm
Riemstagrad wrote:Galiantus III wrote:
What if there was a short timer associated with issues answering, that could regulate the speed of card generation? Basically, if an issue is answered within 5 seconds of logging in, or of answering another issue, it would not generate a card pack. This is long enough to be extremely detrimental to card farmers, but short enough there are very few cases where this would hurt casual players. Importantly, this means whatever new method of card generation is introduced, it can have the same top speed as issue answering now, and be the preferred method for card farmers.
scripts and containers can easily circumvent this.
Frisbeeteria wrote:For some reason I have a mental image of a dolphin, trying to organize a new pod of his fellow dolphins to change the course of a nuclear sub. It's entertaining, I'll give ya that.
Ballotonia wrote:Testing is for sissies. The actual test is to see how many people complain when any change is made ;)
by Fauzjhia » Sun Aug 29, 2021 8:28 pm
Galiantus III wrote:Riemstagrad wrote:
scripts and containers can easily circumvent this.
True, but I don't that will matter. If the available options are:
- Get the current rate of cards by doing [insert activity other than issues here] with one nation
- Get the current rate of cards by creating hundreds of puppets and using a script
I think the vast majority of card farmers will just go with option A.
by Frisbeeteria » Sun Aug 29, 2021 10:04 pm
Praeceps wrote:Is Flanderlion's OP still insufficient, and if so, how? I think this is a pretty great idea and should be implemented.
Praeceps wrote:I think the OP sets out pretty convincingly on how card farms are going to be drastically reduced should this proposal be implemented.
United Calanworie wrote:I know I might be entirely off the mark here, but… what about just putting a captcha on the issue answer page if (x) requests come from that IP address in (y) time?
by Flanderlion » Sun Aug 29, 2021 10:15 pm
by Fauzjhia » Sun Aug 29, 2021 10:31 pm
Flanderlion wrote:Frisbeeteria wrote:It's all over the place. It's not one proposal, it's half a dozen or more. Which one or ones are the "pretty great idea"?
The OP is one proposal. Changing from one way of generating cards packs to three ways, and removing the 10 pack maximum cap.
The three ways are issues like current - just a lower rate, BN game (chance per comparison, meant to be far faster than farming by switching nations and doing issues), and at the end of each WA resolution, every valid vote receives a pack. The WA bit was A) to increase discoverability of the game, and B) to ensure the average nation isn't disadvantaged by the change.
The idea evolved from just Best Nation game only in response to valid concerns that having the BN game as the exclusive way to generate packs might reduce the number of new players finding and participating in the game.
by Flanderlion » Sun Aug 29, 2021 11:12 pm
Fauzjhia wrote:Flanderlion wrote:The OP is one proposal. Changing from one way of generating cards packs to three ways, and removing the 10 pack maximum cap.
The three ways are issues like current - just a lower rate, BN game (chance per comparison, meant to be far faster than farming by switching nations and doing issues), and at the end of each WA resolution, every valid vote receives a pack. The WA bit was A) to increase discoverability of the game, and B) to ensure the average nation isn't disadvantaged by the change.
The idea evolved from just Best Nation game only in response to valid concerns that having the BN game as the exclusive way to generate packs might reduce the number of new players finding and participating in the game.
1 the pack limit is 9 not 10
2 I disagree about the best nation, and don't see why but should be even easier to farm cards, then it currently. if anything we NEED to restrict. the Card players must find a way to restrict themselves on many puppets they have. Also, I hate this game and do not want to see it back.
3 we already talked about its not a good idea to force players to join the WA to gain something that has nothing to do with the WA.
4 We should not make it even easier to farm cards. it should be harder. if anything, the solution is probably limiting the speed at which people answer issues, or preventing someone from opening a pack directly after answering an issues, (you might think its not much, but cards will have to work for the same gains as before.
5 we should not totally eliminate card farmers, just try prevent those nations from having a cards, which is why I favor a limited break. (28 days maybe)
And We already talked about theses points more then enough. for me, the CONS are way too big.
by The Blazeland Administration » Sun Aug 29, 2021 11:18 pm
by Fauzjhia » Mon Aug 30, 2021 8:17 am
Flanderlion wrote: because they farm the packs, then open the packs at a separate time during a pull event to increase their chances of getting good cards
The Blazeland Administration wrote:Cooldown on an issue? no thanks. This will affect non-card farmers more
Elegarth wrote:I understand perfectly where Fris is coming from, and I also remain unconvinced. I may not have 10000 puppets but I am among the top 50 and have a large number of puppets which I would retain should this pass, cuz I realize I enjoy creating thematic puppet sets.
by Elegarth » Mon Aug 30, 2021 8:20 am
Flanderlion wrote:Preventing someone from opening a pack directly after answering an issue wouldn't mean anything either, because they farm the packs, then open the packs at a separate time during a pull event to increase their chances of getting good cards.
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