[PASSED] Commend Pope Hope

[Cappedore]

Definitely a support here. The nation in question is completely deserving.

[The Python]

Ah, okay :P I'm pretty sure the ADN did back coups in TWP, so at least it isn't lowkey mentioning a coup as commendable xD

And I’m fairly certain you’re wrong - TWP was a long time member of the ADN. Take it from someone who was around then.

I'm pretty sure I read otherwise... I might be wrong though

EDIT:

He was downplaying it specifically because of how much damage it did to the region while still wanting to be seen as the "good guy" in his home base. The Dominion was 100% a coup backed by the ADN, though I'd need to repair a broken hard drive to grab my contemporary logs at the time.

[Dilber]

Ah, okay I'm pretty sure the ADN did back coups in TWP, so at least it isn't lowkey mentioning a coup as commendable xD

And I’m fairly certain you’re wrong - TWP was a long time member of the ADN. Take it from someone who was around then.

Yeah, Python is actually correct on this one. While it flopped, ADN was backing Biyah on his play there.

[Bhang Bhang Duc]

And I’m fairly certain you’re wrong - TWP was a long time member of the ADN. Take it from someone who was around then.

Yeah, Python is actually correct on this one. While it flopped, ADN was backing Biyah on his play there.

And I always thought it was an NPO ploy due to Ivan’s involvement (as Vlagh). You live and learn - apologies Python.

[Goobergunchia II]

Full support, obviously. Sorry I couldn't be more helpful due to being overwhelmed with a lot of other stuff the last couple months. I particularly love the taco bit and I think any long-time Nasicournian will appreciate it.

Does this mean they refounded it?

It doesn't. Sometime back in 2003-2004, the mods decided to appoint community-chosen nations as founders of founderless regions. It's how Grub became the founder of XKI; they didn't found/refound the region, but they were chosen by its community to serve as its new founder and appointed by the mods on request. The same happened with Nasicournia; Pope Hope was chosen by the community to serve as the region's new founder and the mods appointed her to the position.

Specifically spring/summer 2003 -- Founders were added to the game in April 2003 and then there was a limited window in which existing regions could get nations appointed as Founders. (I think the last one was EuroFounder.)

[Emodea]

Made some small changes based on the feedback we've received:

• Replaced 'Distinguishing' in the first clause with 'Identifying' and made some assorted changes to avoid - how do I put this - grammatical flare-ups.
• We unfortunately have to decline BBD's suggestion of changing 'Thinking' in the second clause with something else for reasons GK has explained here.
• We also have to reject Python's suggestion regarding the rewrite in the 'Extolling' clause for now, due to there not being a pressing need. We will definitely revisit the suggestion if such a concern were to arise in the foreseeable future.

Current character count is 4932 characters with BBCode and 4760 characters without BBCode. As usual, any and every feedback and critique is appreciated!

[Pierconium]

Yeah, Python is actually correct on this one. While it flopped, ADN was backing Biyah on his play there.

And I always thought it was an NPO ploy due to Ivan’s involvement (as Vlagh). You live and learn - apologies Python.

No, I was just being me.

I’m in support of PH getting a Commend but I do question the inclusion of multi-ing as part of the commendation.

[The Python]

do question the inclusion of multi-ing as part of the commendation.

Assuming you mean the puppetmaster attack, according to this it was completely legal:

Free4All was in constant communication with the site admins and game moderators to verify the legality of the Puppetmaster Attack.

Also might be worth noting that that player is now a site admin ...?

[Xoriet]

do question the inclusion of multi-ing as part of the commendation.

Assuming you mean the puppetmaster attack, according to this it was completely legal:

Free4All was in constant communication with the site admins and game moderators to verify the legality of the Puppetmaster Attack.

Also might be worth noting that that player is now a site admin ...?

Ruled legal at the time, but also not permitted/possible now. If it was still a completely okay tactic, sure.

Edit: Support from me regardless. Definitely a deserving nominee.

[Arpasia]

Sup-Fricking-Port!

[The Python]

Assuming you mean the puppetmaster attack, according to this it was completely legal:

Also might be worth noting that that player is now a site admin ...?

Ruled legal at the time, but also not permitted/possible now. :P

Well yes that's true but it wasn't considered multiing then :P

[Pierconium]

do question the inclusion of multi-ing as part of the commendation.

Assuming you mean the puppetmaster attack, according to this it was completely legal:

Free4All was in constant communication with the site admins and game moderators to verify the legality of the Puppetmaster Attack.

Also might be worth noting that that player is now a site admin ...?

No, I’m referring to maintaining SoS and her main in the WA/UN at the same time. Several players were accessing that nation and each of them had WA nations elsewhere simultaneously.

[Emodea]

No, I’m referring to maintaining SoS and her main in the WA/UN at the same time. Several players were accessing that nation and each of them had WA nations elsewhere simultaneously.

Extremely sorry for the late reply, I've been a bit busy IRL and couldn't pay much attention to NS during this time.

But I've found no evidence during my research that indicates to PH multi-ing as SoS. From what I understand, if PH needed to admit to the UN for something, someone who wasn't in the UN at that time took over the nation and allowed PH to safely admit to the UN. As far as I'm aware, she did not intentionally multi as either SoS or any other nations during her time in NS.

Nonetheless, thank you for your support!

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I would like to move this to LAST CALL now, seeing that there isn't any significant critique that needs addressing. The current character count is 4932 characters with BBCode, and 4780 characters without BBCode. As always, any and every feedback is appreciated!

[Pierconium]

No, I’m referring to maintaining SoS and her main in the WA/UN at the same time. Several players were accessing that nation and each of them had WA nations elsewhere simultaneously.

Extremely sorry for the late reply, I've been a bit busy IRL and couldn't pay much attention to NS during this time.

But I've found no evidence during my research that indicates to PH multi-ing as SoS. From what I understand, if PH needed to admit to the UN for something, someone who wasn't in the UN at that time took over the nation and allowed PH to safely admit to the UN. As far as I'm aware, she did not intentionally multi as either SoS or any other nations during her time in NS.

Nonetheless, thank you for your support!

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I would like to move this to LAST CALL now, seeing that there isn't any significant critique that needs addressing. The current character count is 4932 characters with BBCode, and 4780 characters without BBCode. As always, any and every feedback is appreciated!

No worries. I know what I know from being there and being told by one of the SoS participants that this is what was taking place. I admit that there is no smoking gun but it was common knowledge at the time among those that knew what was going on.

The fact that it is at the very least suspect should, in my opinion, prevent it from being included in an otherwise great proposal.

[Emodea]

No worries. I know what I know from being there and being told by one of the SoS participants that this is what was taking place. I admit that there is no smoking gun but it was common knowledge at the time among those that knew what was going on.

The fact that it is at the very least suspect should, in my opinion, prevent it from being included in an otherwise great proposal.

I will reiterate my previous statement; During the time I was researching for this draft, I've found out nothing which indicates that PH was multi-ing as SoS or any other nations during her time in NS. Several other players, including one of the core participants of SoS, have confirmed my conclusions with their own accounts, and other available resources which I've used to draw information from seems to reaffirm that.

So until me or my co-author get any proven evidence regarding this matter that demonstrates otherwise, that particular clause will remain as it is in the draft. Thank you for your concerns.

[Pierconium]

No worries. I know what I know from being there and being told by one of the SoS participants that this is what was taking place. I admit that there is no smoking gun but it was common knowledge at the time among those that knew what was going on.

The fact that it is at the very least suspect should, in my opinion, prevent it from being included in an otherwise great proposal.

I will reiterate my previous statement; During the time I was researching for this draft, I've found out nothing which indicates that PH was multi-ing as SoS or any other nations during her time in NS. Several other players, including one of the core participants of SoS, have confirmed my conclusions with their own accounts, and other available resources which I've used to draw information from seems to reaffirm that.

So until me or my co-author get any proven evidence regarding this matter that demonstrates otherwise, that particular clause will remain as it is in the draft. Thank you for your concerns.

And I will reiterate my previous statement: no worries.

That is your choice. I’m simply pointing out that alternative viewpoints on it exist and that one of the main architects has stated that multi-ing was taking place, which does cast doubt on the veracity of the proposal with regard to the actions taking place behind the scenes with SoS. But, sure, you have a source that says ‘who me?! No, obviously I wasn’t cheating!’ as verification. Okay, good for you then.

[Pierconium]

But, if you want I guess I could point out that SoS was not actually successful in ‘infiltrating the NPD’ and was never going to be in an actual position to do anything about it until after my departure: https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/thenort ... l#p9331013

[Emodea]

This has been submitted!

[Bhang Bhang Duc]

This has been submitted!

It’s a nicely written and well researched proposal - if (when) this gets to vote I will certainly recommend TWP’s support.

[Sylh Alanor]

Happy to support this if/when it goes to vote ^-^

[The Python]

Good luck ^-^

[Emodea]

This is now at vote!

[Partnership for Sovereignty]

The Partnership for Sovereignty recommends a vote FOR "Commend Pope Hope”: https://www.nationstates.net/page=dispatch/id=1583129

[Greater Cesnica]

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The Europeian Ministry of World Assembly Affairs recommends a vote FOR the Security Council Resolution, "Commend Pope Hope".
Its reasoning may be found here.

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[Giovanniland]

Nice to see this at vote, will support of course.