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by Fauxia » Fri Jun 25, 2021 8:42 pm
by Aumeltopia » Fri Jun 25, 2021 9:12 pm
Auphelia wrote:Raccoons are bandits! First they steal your food . . . and then your heart/identity!
by Tsunamy » Sat Jun 26, 2021 6:23 am
Cormactopia Prime wrote:TSP's administrative team was deeply politicized during that era, and it has only become less so because TSP has been reshaped in Glen's image and he no longer has reason to abuse his authority.
by Belschaft » Sat Jun 26, 2021 8:57 am
by Unibot III » Sat Jun 26, 2021 9:45 am
Cormactopia Prime wrote:Unibot III wrote:It's ridiculous to see Cormac continue to defend Imki and other participants of that coup and argue for reconciliation -- he would have been outraged if someone had tried to coup Osiris to rid Osiris of him, and I doubt very much he would have found their arguments in those cases justified.
In a democratic society, there's a process in place for removing people that need to be removed from office. The occupiers chose to skip that step and bring dishonour to the Coalition instead.
That's probably true, as no one likes being removed from a region, but there can be justified reasons to remove someone from a region and sometimes when your institutions fail it's necessary to take extrajudicial action. Think back, for example, to the decision in Osiris to just give those involved in the December 2012 coup amnesty through a very lenient plea agreement because it was clear Osiris' institutions could not convict them of any crimes, due to their manipulation of those institutions. Osiris would have been far better off if officials had made the decision to just extrajudicially remove them from the region, ironically something Glen himself has argued since the decision to grant them amnesty was made. Fairly sure you've argued it in the past too, though I may be mistaken.
The OFO 1.0 decided not to make the mistakes of the KRO and extralegally removed them from Osiris, though of course circumstances in that case were somewhat different than the actions Hileville later took in TSP, because Osiris' democratic government had already been dissolved by Detective Figs months earlier. OFO 1.0 was, in effect, "couping a coup" as the transitional government established by Detective Figs still had no constitutional basis.
[violet] wrote:I mean this in the best possible way,
but Unibot is not a typical NS player.
Milograd wrote:You're a caring, resolute lunatic
with the best of intentions.
by Zukchiva » Sun Jun 27, 2021 10:09 am
Some fixes I think that helps to tie the narrative together.The Security Council,
Recognizing the nation of Imkiville, also known as Imkihca, for their incredible leadership during an extremely turbulent time in Lazarene history, leadership that should be exemplified by those who wish to advance the mission of this Council,
Noting that in July of 2017, Civil War started to brew in Lazarus when long time native and then current Delegate, Funkadelia, alongside their cohorts, Killer Kitty and Lamb Stone, began abusing their authority to import voters, subvert laws, and eventually eject several high officials to overthrow the Celestial Union of Lazarus.and subvert laws,
Observing that the unstable situation came to a boiling point on the 24th of July when Funkadelia, aided by then Guardian, Killer Kitty, ejected several high-ranking government members, including three Guardians and the Vice-Delegate, on conspiracy charges, effectively ending the Celestial Union of Lazarus,
Remarking that on the 27th of August, with political opposition out of the way, the perpetrators of the overthrow established the Undead Dominion of Lazarus, a despotic regime that was a sharp regression from the democratic practices of the prior government,
Recording that when Funkadelia stepped down on the 12th of March 2018, the Undead Dominion was replaced by the Khanate of Lazarus, a perverse distortion of government that further denigrated the integrity of the region,
Further noting during the next few months, Funkadelia and their cohort went on to establish the Undead Dominion of Lazarus and later on the Khanate of Lazarus- both autocratic governments which went against Lazarus's democratic traditions.
Relieved that on the 23rd of April 2018, with Lazarus 10 months into its Civil War, Imkiville successfully overthrew the then leader of the Khanate, Killer Kitty.andFollowing this, Imki established a period of Anarchy to allow for the eventual institution of a new government, a move which was widely supported by the international community,
Applauding that during the aforementioned period, Imkiville allowed natives that were previously banished to return to Lazarus while simultaneously allowing those supportive of the previous government to remain, going as far as appointing Killer Kitty to the Council of Lazarene Security,
Admiring the intentions of the Peace Keeping Agreement, a document signed by Imkiville and the governments of Osiris, The Rejected Realms, The West Pacific, The East Pacific, The South Pacific, and The Pacific, that outlined a new Constitutional Convention for Lazarus to be run by a group of former Lazarene Delegates while the signatories assissted in protecting Imkiville's Delegacy during the turbulent time,Believing that while the Constitutional Convention had been build on good intentions, it was held back by a lack of trust, dirty politics, and a perceived power vacuum in the region, and that when Imkiville dissolved the convention and installed Mandate XII, it was the best move to start repairing burnt bridges,
Amazed that when it became clear the Convention was falling into a mire of distrust and confusion, Imkiville took initiative and dissolved the Convention. Imki then implemented Mandate XII as the new Constitution of Lazarus, which remains the basis of Lazarus's current government.
[INSERT REST OF PROPOSAL]
I still think it could be helpful to specify more here. Imki certainly had to take a lot of initiatives to build up SPSF- and based on this thread, there are a lot of people you could reach out too to get more information on that I think.Appreciating the contributions Imkiville has made to The South Pacific, most notably their work as Minister of Military Affairs, where they are credited with reviving the South Pacific Special Forces and creating the foundations that have made it a successful force to this day,
by Imkihca » Tue Jun 29, 2021 6:12 am
Sandaoguo wrote:
TSP's admin team was not "politicized." The whole basis of Hileville's coup was that an admin (Kris) should've allegedly lost citizenship because he didn't post on the forums. The issue was that Kris did post, just not in places that Imki (Vice Delegate) could see. The admins were the ones that previously did citizenship checks, and when that was shifted to the Vice Delegate, the forum permissions and the laws of which areas "counted" didn't change. It went from admins doing activity checks to the VD doing the checks and sending admins a list of inactive nations. It was admins that wanted to VD to do the checks, so that we weren't being asked to conduct a political function, since people tended to get up in arms any time a popular person went inactive and had their citizenship removed.
Sandaoguo wrote:
The admins (not just me) gave Imki the proof of the posts Kris made, explained that Kris did meet the requirements, and we would create something so that the VD could see total posts in all areas, even if they didn't have access to the forums. (In the meantime, the laws around what areas of the forum counted were never changed.) I made the custom page Roavin mentioned, that gave all that information straight from the forum database. Never heard a word from Imki on the subject again. Not until Hileville and she couped and offered that as their reason, referring to it as "admin abuse."
Sandaoguo wrote:
It was a wholly concocted story. In reality, what really happened is that Hileville wanted to be in charge of everything again. He used to own TSP's forums, until he ragequit and shut down the IP.Board install he owned, leaving us to scramble to set up our current MyBB forum. A while after that, he re-entered TSP and worked his way up to Delegate. It doesn't take a genius to understand his motives, especially when he hijacked the TSP domain to point at his own forums.
Sandaoguo wrote:
Anyways, even if you bought the propaganda they invented about "admin abuse" at the time, TSP's court sided against them. They ignored the court, declared the Charter invalid, and then proceeded to ban the justice (Farengeto). At that point, it was undeniably a coup. And that's what Imki still feels she was in the right taking part in. She was debatably given "amnesty" (though never sincerely apologized for her involvement, which was a requirement) because Tsunamy demanded it and browbeat the rest of us into it in the spirit of "unity." If Imki actually was contrite, rather than saying she was right and would do it again every time she's asked, the story would be different here. But she's not.
Sandaoguo wrote:
I don't care what she did as Minister of Military Affairs. Her net contribution to TSP was negative. Why anybody thinks her commendation should stand on anything related to TSP is mystifying. She did far more in other regions and TSP is, if anything, a stain on her career. It baffles me that anybody would bother with the headache of trying to include TSP, when the commendation can easily be passed without it. Is the only reason basically trolling those Imki banned in the coup? Makes no sense.
by A Bloodred Moon » Thu Jul 01, 2021 12:12 am
Noting that in July of 2017, Civil War started to brew in Lazarus when long time native and then current Delegate, Funkadelia, alongside their cohorts, Killer Kitty and Lamb Stone, began abusing their authority to import voters and subvert laws,
Observing that the unstable situation came to a boiling point on the 24th of July when Funkadelia, aided by then Guardian, Killer Kitty, ejected several high-ranking government members, including three Guardians and the Vice-Delegate, on conspiracy charges, effectively ending the Celestial Union of Lazarus,
Remarking that on the 27th of August, with political opposition out of the way, the perpetrators of the overthrow established the Undead Dominion of Lazarus, a despotic regime that was a sharp regression from the democratic practices of the prior government,
Recording that when Funkadelia stepped down on the 12th of March 2018, the Undead Dominion was replaced by the Khanate of Lazarus, a perverse distortion of government that further denigrated the integrity of the region,
Relieved that on the 23rd of April 2018, with Lazarus 10 months into its Civil War, Imkiville successfully overthrew the then leader of the Khanate, Killer Kitty, and established a period of Anarchy, which was widely supported by the international community,
Applauding that during the aforementioned period, Imkiville allowed natives that were previously banished to return to Lazarus while simultaneously allowing those supportive of the previous government to remain, going as far as appointing Killer Kitty to the Council of Lazarene Security,
Admiring the intentions of the Peace Keeping Agreement, a document signed by Imkiville and the governments of Osiris, The Rejected Realms, The West Pacific, The East Pacific, The South Pacific, and The Pacific, that outlined a new Constitutional Convention for Lazarus to be run by a group of former Lazarene Delegates,
Believing that while the Constitutional Convention had been built on good intentions, it was held back by a lack of trust, dirty politics, and a perceived power vacuum in the region, and that when Imkiville dissolved the convention and installed Mandate XII, it was the best move to start repairing burnt bridges,
by TESDAI » Thu Jul 01, 2021 7:01 am
Debussy wrote:Asserting that the contributions of Imkiville should not be overlooked and merit recognition from this Council, and that awesome is the best description of the nation,
by Bhang Bhang Duc » Wed Jul 07, 2021 3:13 pm
Pierconium wrote:I see Funk as an opportunistic manipulator that utilises the means available to him to reach his goals. In other words, a nation after my own heart.
RiderSyl wrote:If an enchantress made it so one raid could bring about world peace, Unibot would ask raiders to just sign a petition instead.
Sedgistan wrote:The SC has just has a spate of really shitty ones recently from Northumbria, his Watermelon fanboy…..
by The Python » Wed Jul 07, 2021 3:27 pm
by WayNeacTia » Wed Jul 07, 2021 3:50 pm
The Python wrote:While this could be better written and could probably have stayed in drafting a bit longer, this is good enough and the nominee is extremely deserving.
Full support
RiderSyl wrote:You'd really think that defenders would communicate with each other about this. I know they're not a hivemind, but at least some level of PR skill would keep Quebecshire and Quebecshire from publically contradicting eac
wait
by The Python » Wed Jul 07, 2021 4:24 pm
Wayneactia wrote:The Python wrote:While this could be better written and could probably have stayed in drafting a bit longer, this is good enough and the nominee is extremely deserving.
Full support
I'd be curious if you would show the same level of support for say Jakker City?
by Tringapore » Wed Jul 07, 2021 10:02 pm
by The Hazar Amisnery » Wed Jul 07, 2021 10:03 pm
Nationwide cyberattack devastates core government infrastructure, but we will prevail.
by WayNeacTia » Wed Jul 07, 2021 10:16 pm
The Python wrote:Wayneactia wrote:I'd be curious if you would show the same level of support for say Jakker City?
lol k.
RiderSyl wrote:You'd really think that defenders would communicate with each other about this. I know they're not a hivemind, but at least some level of PR skill would keep Quebecshire and Quebecshire from publically contradicting eac
wait
by Marxist Germany » Thu Jul 08, 2021 2:03 am
by Shallow Creek » Thu Jul 08, 2021 10:38 am
by Cormactopia Prime » Thu Jul 08, 2021 11:57 am
by The Church of Satan » Thu Jul 08, 2021 1:02 pm
by The Python » Thu Jul 08, 2021 1:10 pm
The Church of Satan wrote:I couldn't possibly vote in favor of a resolution that celebrates how Imki ended a coup and took over a region by becoming a dictator until she got bored or no longer had the time to oversee her regime. Which by the way seems to be a pattern for her.
by The Church of Satan » Thu Jul 08, 2021 1:15 pm
The Python wrote:Bruh, while Lazarus does have autocratic leanings atm, the head of government/PM is elected, and there is a citizens' legislature. So no, I don't see your point about how Imki declared herself dictator after becoming delegate.
by The Python » Thu Jul 08, 2021 1:29 pm
The Church of Satan wrote:The Python wrote:Bruh, while Lazarus does have autocratic leanings atm, the head of government/PM is elected, and there is a citizens' legislature. So no, I don't see your point about how Imki declared herself dictator after becoming delegate.
As bad as the constitutional convention was, ending it by force is not commendable. The only redeemable thing about Imki's actions is that Tubbius became delegate when she was done. Because he's so unlike her.
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