SD_Film Artists wrote:The OP didn't say anything about blackface.
So you didn't read OP's primary source (i.e. the NYT article).
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by Cultural Posadism » Mon Feb 15, 2021 9:37 pm
SD_Film Artists wrote:The OP didn't say anything about blackface.
by Cultural Posadism » Mon Feb 15, 2021 9:38 pm
UniversalCommons wrote:This is bizarre. Woke means awareness of injustice and racism. People are blowing it up into something which it is not. It is like the word neoliberalism. It is a word that is being misused out of context. It is bizarre fear mongering on the right and hyperbole on the left. You can apply things like meditation to the word woke, but I seriously doubt the way this word is being touted is correct. There is no specific action in the word, nor is action implied. It is a word focused on observation. It is going from a state of being a sheep to becoming aware.
by Borderlands of Rojava » Mon Feb 15, 2021 9:40 pm
UniversalCommons wrote:This is bizarre. Woke means awareness of injustice and racism. People are blowing it up into something which it is not. It is like the word neoliberalism. It is a word that is being misused out of context. It is bizarre fear mongering on the right and hyperbole on the left. You can apply things like meditation to the word woke, but I seriously doubt the way this word is being touted is correct. There is no specific action in the word, nor is action implied. It is a word focused on observation. It is going from a state of being a sheep to becoming aware.
by Albrenia » Mon Feb 15, 2021 9:42 pm
Repubblica Fascista Sociale Italiana wrote:Borderlands of Rojava wrote:
Considering how many people voted for a second round of Trump, I think at least half of Americans are literally ultranationalists, even if people in Portland are not.
They aren’t ultranationalist, if, say, Putin or Merkel denounces Joe Biden, Republicans and Trump supporters will most like agree with them because Biden belongs to another political party. On the contrary, when Erdogan denounced Macron, everyone in France, including Macron’s biggest opponents like Marine Le Pen rushed to his defense as the president of France. This is the kind of nationalism we need
by Cultural Posadism » Mon Feb 15, 2021 9:51 pm
Most of what antifascists do is perfectly within the law and violates nobody's "basic civil liberties".
Antifa*
If 'antifascists' was accurate then that'll solve a lot of what's wrong with them.
Also, "most of"??
Pressuring a private institution to not give a platform to fascists is no more authoritarian than boycotting Electronic Arts because you hated the lootboxes in Battlefront 2. Heckling a fascist speaker is no more authoritarian than heckling a stand up comedian when their jokes bomb. Infiltrating and exposing fascist organizations is no more authoritarian than being a whistleblower for authoritarian regimes. And violently confronting fascists on the streets isn't inherently fascist for the same reason that owning a gun doesn't automatically make you a conservative. Fascists didn't invent political violence, and historically speaking political violence hasn't been inherently incompatible with liberalism (see: almost every single liberal revolution since the 18th century).
Again, they're not just targeting fascists
so much of what you've just said is hypothetical rather than actually applying to Antifa in any way.
Violently confronting one's political opponents on the streets is illegal
and also another indication that they have no interest in free speech.
I also never claimed that fascists invented political violence.
Their lack of knowledge about true fascism
Antifa and similarly alligned groups would decide that they prefer Primark, then- regardless of any employment of child slave labor which may or may not happen- would then try to harrass GAP staff, anyone who wears GAP, starting a campaign of harrassment, defamation and sometimes violence with the intent to force the victims through intimidation by a mob rather than education through protest. And why? Not because of child labour, but because they have their interests in Primark.
There has been a consistant pattern of complaints from Liberal Democrat members during the 2019 election that harrassment and intimidation (some criminal, some less so) have consistantly came from Momentum. And if you think that's off-topic, let me remind you that the very subject of this thread is the legal combating of far-left groups which are heavily influenced by American politics...like Momentum. Let me also remind you that the Lib Dems are centre-left. They're not just going after right-wing people.
by SD_Film Artists » Tue Feb 16, 2021 2:58 am
Antifa*
If 'antifascists' was accurate then that'll solve a lot of what's wrong with them.
So you'd be ok with the stuff antifa does if they only targeted obvious fascists?
Also, "most of"??
Yeah, most of.
The word "they" is doing a lot of heavy lifting in your arguments so far... but sure, I can concede that maybe not just obvious fascists get the short end of the antifa stick. After all, many right-wingers have for decades consistently mistaken their liberal opponents for "communists" and "socialists", so it makes sense that some people involved in antifa would make a similar mistake.
so much of what you've just said is hypothetical rather than actually applying to Antifa in any way.
As opposed to what you've said, which is 100% comprised of evidence-based claims.
Violently confronting one's political opponents on the streets is illegal
Illegal is not always synonymous with wrong.
and also another indication that they have no interest in free speech.
At least not in liberal terms, no.
I also never claimed that fascists invented political violence.
The way you structure your argument makes it sounds like you believe as much.
Their lack of knowledge about true fascism
You've failed to actually prove the existence of such a generalized lack of knowledge beyond claiming it.
Antifa and similarly alligned groups would decide that they prefer Primark, then- regardless of any employment of child slave labor which may or may not happen- would then try to harrass GAP staff, anyone who wears GAP, starting a campaign of harrassment, defamation and sometimes violence with the intent to force the victims through intimidation by a mob rather than education through protest. And why? Not because of child labour, but because they have their interests in Primark.
"they have their interests in Primark"??? Within the context of this analogy, what exactly are you trying to say here?
There has been a consistant pattern of complaints from Liberal Democrat members during the 2019 election that harrassment and intimidation (some criminal, some less so) have consistantly came from Momentum. And if you think that's off-topic, let me remind you that the very subject of this thread is the legal combating of far-left groups which are heavily influenced by American politics...like Momentum. Let me also remind you that the Lib Dems are centre-left. They're not just going after right-wing people.
But harrassment and intimidation are not unique to the left, though, which highlights the problem with the cause for this thread: treating such things when coming from the left as if they were some homogenous, uniquely left-wing phenomenon supported by a left-wing consensus.
by The Alma Mater » Tue Feb 16, 2021 3:21 am
/quote]SD_Film Artists wrote:The word "they" is doing a lot of heavy lifting in your arguments so far... but sure, I can concede that maybe not just obvious fascists get the short end of the antifa stick. After all, many right-wingers have for decades consistently mistaken their liberal opponents for "communists" and "socialists", so it makes sense that some people involved in antifa would make a similar mistake.
They are plural, so I'll use a plural. Also if you're going to go after fascists then it's a good idea to know what fascism is. If they're not knowingly going after any political opponenents even left-wing ones but instead just honestly mistaking them for fascists, then that demonstrates a monumental lack of research.
by Vassenor » Tue Feb 16, 2021 3:28 am
by SD_Film Artists » Tue Feb 16, 2021 3:32 am
The Alma Mater wrote:/quote]SD_Film Artists wrote:
They are plural, so I'll use a plural. Also if you're going to go after fascists then it's a good idea to know what fascism is. If they're not knowingly going after any political opponenents even left-wing ones but instead just honestly mistaking them for fascists, then that demonstrates a monumental lack of research.
True, but their point is that that is fair in the country where a majority thinks "liberal" is "communism".
by SD_Film Artists » Tue Feb 16, 2021 3:34 am
by Democratic Exodian Territories » Tue Feb 16, 2021 6:55 am
Cultural Posadism wrote:UniversalCommons wrote:This is bizarre. Woke means awareness of injustice and racism. People are blowing it up into something which it is not. It is like the word neoliberalism. It is a word that is being misused out of context. It is bizarre fear mongering on the right and hyperbole on the left. You can apply things like meditation to the word woke, but I seriously doubt the way this word is being touted is correct. There is no specific action in the word, nor is action implied. It is a word focused on observation. It is going from a state of being a sheep to becoming aware.
It sure looks like a certain group of people are abusing the term "woke" the same way they abused "cultural marxism" and "sjw".
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by Vassenor » Tue Feb 16, 2021 7:37 am
by Glorious Hong Kong » Tue Feb 16, 2021 8:10 am
Western Fardelshufflestein wrote:Baltenstein wrote:
Now, I'm not French, so I don't claim to have a native's insight on their social and societal issues and the academics' take on them, but I can attest to a similar - and similarly nonsensical - trend in Germany.
Debates on the nature and dynamics of racism have started to use a vocabulary that has more often than not been airlifted directly from the American discourse - including the dichotomy of the exclusively and all-encompassing Whites on the one hand and the always-discriminated against BIPOC* on the other, with little adjustment into the German societal context. Something you increasingly notice these days is that activist-journalists have started to add a polit-speak glossary to their articles to give their poor readers a chance to understand what they are even talking about - not exactly a sign that it's an organically developed debate that is taking place here. It's probably also not a coincidence that less and less people are reading and are feeling represented by mainstream media.
*the irony of using the US term "indigenous" when referring to a, at best, tiny number of immigrants of Native American background as opposed to, you know, the actual indigenous population of the place, is usually lost on the author.
I find this trend both annoying and disturbing for a variety of reasons, namely:
1.) The often repeated claim that the concept of a "colorblind society" is a false narrative that only serves to mask social prejudices is one thing; however, no evidence of any kind is offered that the woke Left's counter-approach of errecting more and more tribal markers in language, behavior and who you are to socialize with/listen to etc will lead to a better and juster society instead of deepening the differences between these alleged tribal groups. The US sure as hell aren't an example.
2.) The introduction of US-style ad hominem puritanism into debate culture. I don't disagree with you by analyzing the fallacies of your argument but by marking you as someone who has been born into - alleged - privilege and are therefore inherently immoral and only worthy of being shunned.
3.) The audacity with which some people of one ethnic minority appropriate the vocabulary and self-image of another ethnic minority with a completely different history. Some Turkish German journalists - who have roots in a nation with a long and often uncritically embraced history of empire, colonialism, authoritarianism, racism and genocide - try to claim the label of "POC" to forge a - completely artificial - common "we" with African Americans and other historically wronged ethnic groups, thus very intellectually conveniently switching places from the role of historical opressor to historical victim.
4.) The ongoing (self-)destruction of traditional Social Democracy which decided that their own voter base, yesterday's exploited working-class, have become today's over-privileged white cishet males or whatever, then stares in puzzled disbelief everytime it hits new lows in voter support.
5.) Most despicably of all, the silent erasure of remembering and understanding Germany's own historically developed brand of racism. In all the articles I've read written from the perspective of this new, US-style "anti"-racism, the Holocaust usually just gets namedropped with no further elaboration on how things got that far and what to do to prevent similar developments again, while the genocides in Poland, Ukraine and Russia might just as well not have happened at all - after all these are peoples that are filed under the "white" label, which makes them privileged, no further analysis needed.
If the situation in France is any similar to the above, I can sympathize.
I put this in the Awesome NS Quotes thread; hope that's OK with you.
And thank you for mentioning the genocides in Eastern Europe; those are often overlooked, with Poles being lopped into the "privileged" category as though the Poles haven't been historically invaded or discriminated against.
I don't know much about the Turks, so I won't comment on that.
I am sick of white people always being portrayed as the bad guys. It's discriminatory and...r a c i s t , to use the proper definition of the word.
Repubblica Fascista Sociale Italiana wrote:Alcala-Cordel wrote:Americans are extremely nationalistic.
Hahahaha no
If a foreign government denounces the American president, our people and politicians will agree with the foreigners if the president happens to be from another political party. Furthermore, there is a growing number of people from the "woke left" who think America is the worst thing to ever happen to humanity, and most of these people happen to be… Americans
by Nekostan-e Gharbi » Tue Feb 16, 2021 9:43 am
by Nekostan-e Gharbi » Tue Feb 16, 2021 9:47 am
Glorious Hong Kong wrote:Western Fardelshufflestein wrote:
I put this in the Awesome NS Quotes thread; hope that's OK with you.
And thank you for mentioning the genocides in Eastern Europe; those are often overlooked, with Poles being lopped into the "privileged" category as though the Poles haven't been historically invaded or discriminated against.
I don't know much about the Turks, so I won't comment on that.
I am sick of white people always being portrayed as the bad guys. It's discriminatory and...r a c i s t , to use the proper definition of the word.
I second that. Baltenstein's excellent riposte to the American woke imperialists is second to none. Chris Hitchens would be proud.
Proof that American wokism is a form of cultural imperialism? Several woke posters on this site aren't even American, yet they espouse views typical of American wokists and seek to impose those views on everyone else at all costs, up to and including attempts to smear a moderate centrist like Emmanuel Macron as some kind of fascist because the f-word is their favorite word. American wokism should be viewed through the same lens as radical Islam or Chinese-style communism, a close relative of American woke leftism by ancestry, at times aligned, and at times opposed to one another.
Even more supremely ironic is how Jews are routinely lumped into the "privileged" category despite enduring one of the most horrific genocides in modern history. The Woke Left is systemically, undeniably antisemitic. Just recently on this very site, we have had instances of woke leftist posters (not naming names) making antisemitic remarks in a thread that has nothing to do with Jews and is simply an excuse to initiate a threadjack and vent their naked bigotry.
Another supreme irony is how someone with the kind of background that Ayaan Hirsi Ali possesses has recently come under sustained assault from wokists claiming to represent, among other institutions, the New York Times, because she had the temerity to publish a new book about Islam and mass Muslim immigration. To paraphrase a certain presidential candidate, she "ain't black". Individuals such as her scare these left-wing woke imperialists far more than Trump ever could because she's neither white nor Christian nor conservative.
Douglas Murray lays into the American Woke Left's attempts to character-assassinate Hirsi Ali and exposes these privileged, out-of-touch talking heads in their ivory towers of upper- to upper-middle-class comfort for the intellectual fraudsters that they really are, specifically Jill Filipovic of the New York Times.
Link
American woke imperialism is an existential threat to atheists, Jews, Christians, LGBTQ people, and women in Europe who need someone to stand with them in opposition to the creeping Islamization of the continent.
American wokists may back certain groups such as gay men one moment and viciously turn on them the next. A gay, white man who was a member of a knitting circle was ostracized, subjected to all kinds of gaslighting and abuse and literally driven insane by his colleagues over a harmless poem. The sustained gaslighting and abuse I experienced last year at the hands of certain woke leftist posters on this site alone pales in comparison to what this man was subjected to.
This happened in the UK a few years back and was widely covered by Quillette. Gay men are now considered expendable now that same-sex marriage has been legalized across the Anglosphere. Nowadays, gay men, especially gay white men, are "privileged, fascist scum".
Another instance of American woke imperialism that I can personally relate to is a recent attempt by certain quarters to appropriate terms such as "China virus" as something that's "racist" and "trolling" and seeking to impose that narrow American definition of the term onto foreigners, particularly Asians and anti-CCP political dissidents in HK and elsewhere in Asia who can and have used that and similar terms to lambast the CCP for whatever reason and for whom Donald Trump, his rhetoric, and his domestic policies have had nothing to do with them.
Wokists on this very site have attempted to get the term "China virus" banned altogether without due regard to the differences in meaning in different parts of the world because "some white dude attacked me in the street earlier today because I look different". Now I know how Western conservatives feel about what they consider to be the compelled use of certain pronouns even if I disagree with them on trans issues. I'm not American and I have never set foot in the United States or anywhere in the Americas. What does Donald Trump's use of a term like "China virus" have to do with me?
The fact that online circles such as NS are dominated by American users, many of them woke leftists and imperialist-enablers, and the fact that Facebook, Twitter, Google, and other online services are based in America and owned by Americans means that we must keep our guard up at all times and resist this constant assault on our sanity and our very humanity before it consumes us all in a conflagration of manufactured grievance, hatred, and division.
At least the people of France have finally had enough of this culturally degrading, imperialist BS and have decided to take a stand. I urge Brits, Canadians, Australians, New Zealanders, other Mainland Europeans, and Western expats living in HK, S'pore, and other cosmopolitan cities to do likewise. America and Europe alike must be utterly cleansed of wokeness before it destroys us all. We must learn to detect its signs and nip it in the bud at the very first opportunity.Repubblica Fascista Sociale Italiana wrote:Hahahaha no
If a foreign government denounces the American president, our people and politicians will agree with the foreigners if the president happens to be from another political party. Furthermore, there is a growing number of people from the "woke left" who think America is the worst thing to ever happen to humanity, and most of these people happen to be… Americans
Gratitude and appreciation are sorely lacking among these wokists. They get to grow up in one of the greatest democracies in the world far removed from the twin threats of radical Islam and Chinese-tier totalitarianism. Then they have the nerve to lecture to everyone else about just how "oppressed" they or their black, Muslim, or female comrades are and impose their narrow, fanciful ideas on the whole world. This is an insidious form of cultural imperialism.
They have no idea just how easy they have it and they should be thoroughly ashamed of themselves. Instead of demonizing people like Ayaan Hirsi Ali, they should be standing shoulder to shoulder with her. They are anything but liberal and anything but tolerant.
by Vassenor » Tue Feb 16, 2021 9:52 am
Glorious Hong Kong wrote:Western Fardelshufflestein wrote:
I put this in the Awesome NS Quotes thread; hope that's OK with you.
And thank you for mentioning the genocides in Eastern Europe; those are often overlooked, with Poles being lopped into the "privileged" category as though the Poles haven't been historically invaded or discriminated against.
I don't know much about the Turks, so I won't comment on that.
I am sick of white people always being portrayed as the bad guys. It's discriminatory and...r a c i s t , to use the proper definition of the word.
I second that. Baltenstein's excellent riposte to the American woke imperialists is second to none. Chris Hitchens would be proud.
Proof that American wokism is a form of cultural imperialism? Several woke posters on this site aren't even American, yet they espouse views typical of American wokists and seek to impose those views on everyone else at all costs, up to and including attempts to smear a moderate centrist like Emmanuel Macron as some kind of fascist because the f-word is their favorite word. American wokism should be viewed through the same lens as radical Islam or Chinese-style communism, a close relative of American woke leftism by ancestry, at times aligned, and at times opposed to one another.
Even more supremely ironic is how Jews are routinely lumped into the "privileged" category despite enduring one of the most horrific genocides in modern history. The Woke Left is systemically, undeniably antisemitic. Just recently on this very site, we have had instances of woke leftist posters (not naming names) making antisemitic remarks in a thread that has nothing to do with Jews and is simply an excuse to initiate a threadjack and vent their naked bigotry.
Another supreme irony is how someone with the kind of background that Ayaan Hirsi Ali possesses has recently come under sustained assault from wokists claiming to represent, among other institutions, the New York Times, because she had the temerity to publish a new book about Islam and mass Muslim immigration. To paraphrase a certain presidential candidate, she "ain't black". Individuals such as her scare these left-wing woke imperialists far more than Trump ever could because she's neither white nor Christian nor conservative.
Douglas Murray lays into the American Woke Left's attempts to character-assassinate Hirsi Ali and exposes these privileged, out-of-touch talking heads in their ivory towers of upper- to upper-middle-class comfort for the intellectual fraudsters that they really are, specifically Jill Filipovic of the New York Times.
Link
American woke imperialism is an existential threat to atheists, Jews, Christians, LGBTQ people, and women in Europe who need someone to stand with them in opposition to the creeping Islamization of the continent.
American wokists may back certain groups such as gay men one moment and viciously turn on them the next. A gay, white man who was a member of a knitting circle was ostracized, subjected to all kinds of gaslighting and abuse and literally driven insane by his colleagues over a harmless poem. The sustained gaslighting and abuse I experienced last year at the hands of certain woke leftist posters on this site alone pales in comparison to what this man was subjected to.
This happened in the UK a few years back and was widely covered by Quillette. Gay men are now considered expendable now that same-sex marriage has been legalized across the Anglosphere. Nowadays, gay men, especially gay white men, are "privileged, fascist scum".
Another instance of American woke imperialism that I can personally relate to is a recent attempt by certain quarters to appropriate terms such as "China virus" as something that's "racist" and "trolling" and seeking to impose that narrow American definition of the term onto foreigners, particularly Asians and anti-CCP political dissidents in HK and elsewhere in Asia who can and have used that and similar terms to lambast the CCP for whatever reason and for whom Donald Trump, his rhetoric, and his domestic policies have had nothing to do with them.
Wokists on this very site have attempted to get the term "China virus" banned altogether without due regard to the differences in meaning in different parts of the world because "some white dude attacked me in the street earlier today because I look different". Now I know how Western conservatives feel about what they consider to be the compelled use of certain pronouns even if I disagree with them on trans issues. I'm not American and I have never set foot in the United States or anywhere in the Americas. What does Donald Trump's use of a term like "China virus" have to do with me?
The fact that online circles such as NS are dominated by American users, many of them woke leftists and imperialist-enablers, and the fact that Facebook, Twitter, Google, and other online services are based in America and owned by Americans means that we must keep our guard up at all times and resist this constant assault on our sanity and our very humanity before it consumes us all in a conflagration of manufactured grievance, hatred, and division.
At least the people of France have finally had enough of this culturally degrading, imperialist BS and have decided to take a stand. I urge Brits, Canadians, Australians, New Zealanders, other Mainland Europeans, and Western expats living in HK, S'pore, and other cosmopolitan cities to do likewise. America and Europe alike must be utterly cleansed of wokeness before it destroys us all. We must learn to detect its signs and nip it in the bud at the very first opportunity.Repubblica Fascista Sociale Italiana wrote:Hahahaha no
If a foreign government denounces the American president, our people and politicians will agree with the foreigners if the president happens to be from another political party. Furthermore, there is a growing number of people from the "woke left" who think America is the worst thing to ever happen to humanity, and most of these people happen to be… Americans
Gratitude and appreciation are sorely lacking among these wokists. They get to grow up in one of the greatest democracies in the world far removed from the twin threats of radical Islam and Chinese-tier totalitarianism. Then they have the nerve to lecture to everyone else about just how "oppressed" they or their black, Muslim, or female comrades are and impose their narrow, fanciful ideas on the whole world. This is an insidious form of cultural imperialism.
They have no idea just how easy they have it and they should be thoroughly ashamed of themselves. Instead of demonizing people like Ayaan Hirsi Ali, they should be standing shoulder to shoulder with her. They are anything but liberal and anything but tolerant.
by Democratic Exodian Territories » Tue Feb 16, 2021 9:54 am
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by Nekostan-e Gharbi » Tue Feb 16, 2021 9:55 am
UniversalCommons wrote:This is bizarre. Woke means awareness of injustice and racism. People are blowing it up into something which it is not. It is like the word neoliberalism. It is a word that is being misused out of context. It is bizarre fear mongering on the right and hyperbole on the left. You can apply things like meditation to the word woke, but I seriously doubt the way this word is being touted is correct. There is no specific action in the word, nor is action implied. It is a word focused on observation. It is going from a state of being a sheep to becoming aware.
by Vassenor » Tue Feb 16, 2021 9:59 am
by Stellar Colonies » Tue Feb 16, 2021 10:08 am
Vassenor wrote:...
So we've gone from "uppity black people" to "muslims bad" in a manner that would please the Chinese government greatly.
Floofybit wrote:Your desired society should be one where you are submissive and controlled
Techocracy101010 wrote:If she goes on a rampage those saggy wonders are as deadly as nunchucks
Parmistan wrote:It's not ALWAYS acceptable when we do it, but it's MORE acceptable when we do it.
Theodorable wrote:Jihad will win.
Distruzio wrote:All marriage outside the Church is gay marriage.
Khardsland wrote:Terrorism in its original definition is a good thing.
San Lumen wrote:If he wins Harris should tear up his ballots on the house floor causing a constitutional crisis.
I try to be objective, but I do have some biases.
North Californian.
Stellar Colonies is a loose galactic confederacy.
The Confederacy & the WA.
Add 1200 years.
by Vassenor » Tue Feb 16, 2021 10:10 am
by Nekostan-e Gharbi » Tue Feb 16, 2021 10:13 am
Vassenor wrote:Stellar Colonies wrote:When were we at "uppity black people"?
Whenever GHK goes off on one about the evils of Black Lives Matter.
by Stellar Colonies » Tue Feb 16, 2021 10:13 am
Vassenor wrote:Stellar Colonies wrote:When were we at "uppity black people"?
Whenever GHK goes off on one about the evils of Black Lives Matter.
Floofybit wrote:Your desired society should be one where you are submissive and controlled
Techocracy101010 wrote:If she goes on a rampage those saggy wonders are as deadly as nunchucks
Parmistan wrote:It's not ALWAYS acceptable when we do it, but it's MORE acceptable when we do it.
Theodorable wrote:Jihad will win.
Distruzio wrote:All marriage outside the Church is gay marriage.
Khardsland wrote:Terrorism in its original definition is a good thing.
San Lumen wrote:If he wins Harris should tear up his ballots on the house floor causing a constitutional crisis.
I try to be objective, but I do have some biases.
North Californian.
Stellar Colonies is a loose galactic confederacy.
The Confederacy & the WA.
Add 1200 years.
by Nekostan-e Gharbi » Tue Feb 16, 2021 10:15 am
by Democratic Exodian Territories » Tue Feb 16, 2021 10:34 am
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