She's a bit busy screaming about how investigating these allegations is evidence of cult behaviour among the party.
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by Vassenor » Fri May 01, 2020 3:06 am
by Valrifell » Fri May 01, 2020 4:34 am
Liriena wrote:Outer Sparta wrote:If you're so fixated on Biden's case, why don't you look at the tons of Trump sexual assault cases?
We did. In 2016. And I haven't forgotten. But I'll be damned if I'm gonna get dragged into some pathetic game of "who raped the most?" to see which rapist is the most electorally tolerable.
by Valrifell » Fri May 01, 2020 4:37 am
by Ifreann » Fri May 01, 2020 4:43 am
Vassenor wrote:The Andromeda Island Group wrote:
Do you want Bernie Sanders to go the way of a Walter Mondale or Ted Kennedy?
Bernie has helped move the Democratic Party leftward. That legacy itself is much more valuable than the Vice Presidency or a Cabinet post.
Problem is some people have apparently decided that Bernie not being in one of the big two seats apparently kills progressive politics forever somehow.
by Valrifell » Fri May 01, 2020 4:45 am
Ifreann wrote:Vassenor wrote:
Problem is some people have apparently decided that Bernie not being in one of the big two seats apparently kills progressive politics forever somehow.
Those people specifically being the shared imagination of you and a few other posters, who just will not shut up about Sanders.
by Ifreann » Fri May 01, 2020 4:48 am
by Gormwood » Fri May 01, 2020 6:28 am
by Cisairse » Fri May 01, 2020 7:35 am
Shrillland wrote:Biden's now saying that he would keep our Israeli embassy in Jerusalem as president: https://www.yahoo.com/news/joe-biden-says-hed-leave-221537039.html
Makes sense though. Foreign policy, however disagreeable one may find it, is something that has to stay consistent regardless of party politics in the short term.
Idzequitch wrote:Interesting. In 2016, the narrative was "A vote for Gary Johnson is basically a vote for the party I don't like!"
This time it seems like both parties are convinced that Justin Amash will actually draw more support away from the opponent's side and assure their own victory.
Meanwhile I just like the fact that Amash hasn't been accused of sexual misconduct. Such a high bar I ask candidates to hop over to to earn my vote.
by Cisairse » Fri May 01, 2020 7:40 am
Vassenor wrote:And now there's claims that Reade's allegations match something in a novel her dad wrote.
Pass the salt for the moment, I suppose.
by Zurkerx » Fri May 01, 2020 7:50 am
Shrillland wrote:We also have a new poll for May.
Idzequitch wrote:Interesting. In 2016, the narrative was "A vote for Gary Johnson is basically a vote for the party I don't like!"
This time it seems like both parties are convinced that Justin Amash will actually draw more support away from the opponent's side and assure their own victory.
Meanwhile I just like the fact that Amash hasn't been accused of sexual misconduct. Such a high bar I ask candidates to hop over to to earn my vote.
by Uiiop » Fri May 01, 2020 8:48 am
by Kannap » Fri May 01, 2020 8:56 am
Uiiop wrote:https://twitter.com/NicoleEinbinder/status/1256216361941872641
So biden says to look for in a group archives then the place he says to look for them denies they would have anything from that group. Other relevant people then say they are somewhere else.
*facepalm*
Poor move.
Luna Amore wrote:Please remember to attend the ritualistic burning of Kannap for heresy
by Valrifell » Fri May 01, 2020 9:02 am
Uiiop wrote:https://twitter.com/NicoleEinbinder/status/1256216361941872641
So biden says to look for a group archives then the place he says to look for them in denies they would have anything from that group. Other relevant people then say they are somewhere else.
*facepalm*
Poor move.
by New Socialist South Africa » Fri May 01, 2020 9:06 am
Outer Sparta wrote:Pythaga wrote:
The Kavanaugh accusations were rocky as well, I think anyone that the movement would have lost due to that sort of absolutism are already gone. I think that the real danger to the movement is loosing support from politicians who would rather see Biden win over backing the movement.
Compare Ford's testimony to Reade's and you'll see a clear difference between the two.
Olthar wrote:Anyone who buys "x-ray specs" expecting them to be real deserves to lose their money.
by Uiiop » Fri May 01, 2020 9:06 am
Valrifell wrote:Uiiop wrote:https://twitter.com/NicoleEinbinder/status/1256216361941872641
So biden says to look for a group archives then the place he says to look for them in denies they would have anything from that group. Other relevant people then say they are somewhere else.
*facepalm*
Poor move.
Twitter is not a source smh. Did High School English teach you nothing
Either get a primary source or a better secondary source.
by Valrifell » Fri May 01, 2020 9:10 am
by Kannap » Fri May 01, 2020 9:12 am
Valrifell wrote:Uiiop wrote:https://twitter.com/NicoleEinbinder/status/1256216361941872641
So biden says to look for a group archives then the place he says to look for them in denies they would have anything from that group. Other relevant people then say they are somewhere else.
*facepalm*
Poor move.
Twitter is not a source smh. Did High School English teach you nothing
Either get a primary source or a better secondary source.
Luna Amore wrote:Please remember to attend the ritualistic burning of Kannap for heresy
by Uiiop » Fri May 01, 2020 9:13 am
Valrifell wrote:Uiiop wrote:I linked the article in an edit.
Everyone seems to trust BI's reporting on this case and i don't see why that changes now.
See, now you're conflating my distrust of your twitter link with distrust of BI's reporting. I trust articles more than a character limited tweet because articles can explain things better and are generally looked over by more than one person.
I've no idea why you wouldn't just start from the article.
by Valrifell » Fri May 01, 2020 9:25 am
by Trollzyn the Infinite » Fri May 01, 2020 9:30 am
New Socialist South Africa wrote:Outer Sparta wrote:Compare Ford's testimony to Reade's and you'll see a clear difference between the two.
Alright, lets have a look then:
- A man is up for a powerful position (Supreme Court Justice and President respectively).
- A woman comes forward with allegations that the man sexually assaulted her years ago (in 1982 in the case of Christine Blasey Ford, in 1993 in the case of Tara Reade).
- Multiple friends of both women report that they told them they were sexually assaulted at the time.
- There is some evidence that backs up both women's account, but the evidence isn't conclusive (therapist's notes that Ford claimed she was attacked by students "from an elitist boys' school" who went on to become "highly respected and high-ranking members of society in Washington", Tara Reade's mother calls in to Larry King in 1993, and talks about how her daughter was working as a staffer for a "prominent senator," and couldn't get through with her "problems")
- Ryan Grim of the Intercept breaks both stories.
- The media pretty rapidly starts reporting on it in the case of Ford, but is a fair deal slower in the case of Reade.
- Both men categorically deny sexually assaulting the women.
- Some people call for an independent investigation into the allegations.
- Party loyalists (Republicans and Democrats respectively) start digging up dirt on the accusers, and start claiming that the claims have no credibility. In the case of Reade, the New York Times explicitly responds by stating that the argument that they said Reade's accusation was not credible is not true, and that they did not find it as either credible or not credible https://edition.cnn.com/2020/04/29/politics/joe-biden-tara-reade-new-york-times/index.html.
- There is a desperate attempt in both cases to dismiss the allegations as not credible without any investigation, and a desperate attempt to smear both accusers, and to thus imply that they must be lying, because bad people.
Seems pretty damn similar to me. Indeed, the only real difference, other than the media being much slower with Reade's accusation, appears to be that Kavanaugh and Ford held different political ideologies, while Reade is a lifelong Democrat who hates Donald Trump, and thus has absolutely nothing to gain from bringing this story forward now, when Biden is the presumptive Democratic nominee against Trump, a man she despises.
Again, that doesn't mean Biden sexually assaulted Reade, OR that Kavanaugh sexually assaulted Ford. It just means that neither case has been proven or disproved. This many years after both alleged instances, we will probably never know for certain if they happened.
I do find it curious that so many people who were dead sure that Kavanaugh definitely assaulted Ford are now dead sure that Biden is totally innocent, as well as how many right wing media folks who were insistent that Kavanaugh is totally innocent are now totally sure that Biden is definitely guilty.
by Zurkerx » Fri May 01, 2020 9:38 am
Valrifell wrote:The article mentions that the Biden campaign didn't comment on the story and that it was some staffer for some other office that told them to check the Archive group (which didn't have the info they wanted).
So I'm confused. Nevertheless, the article notes the records do exist but won't be released in the 2040s for, I don't know, reasons I guess. There's also notes that could confirm or disprove the allegations somewhere in a musty archive of the University of Delaware but it seems only Biden can give direct permission to open them up early, and considering the archive is physical and the university is closed that's not going to happen until the pandemic blows over.
by New Socialist South Africa » Fri May 01, 2020 9:44 am
Trollzyn the Infinite wrote:New Socialist South Africa wrote:
Alright, lets have a look then:
- A man is up for a powerful position (Supreme Court Justice and President respectively).
- A woman comes forward with allegations that the man sexually assaulted her years ago (in 1982 in the case of Christine Blasey Ford, in 1993 in the case of Tara Reade).
- Multiple friends of both women report that they told them they were sexually assaulted at the time.
- There is some evidence that backs up both women's account, but the evidence isn't conclusive (therapist's notes that Ford claimed she was attacked by students "from an elitist boys' school" who went on to become "highly respected and high-ranking members of society in Washington", Tara Reade's mother calls in to Larry King in 1993, and talks about how her daughter was working as a staffer for a "prominent senator," and couldn't get through with her "problems")
- Ryan Grim of the Intercept breaks both stories.
- The media pretty rapidly starts reporting on it in the case of Ford, but is a fair deal slower in the case of Reade.
- Both men categorically deny sexually assaulting the women.
- Some people call for an independent investigation into the allegations.
- Party loyalists (Republicans and Democrats respectively) start digging up dirt on the accusers, and start claiming that the claims have no credibility. In the case of Reade, the New York Times explicitly responds by stating that the argument that they said Reade's accusation was not credible is not true, and that they did not find it as either credible or not credible https://edition.cnn.com/2020/04/29/politics/joe-biden-tara-reade-new-york-times/index.html.
- There is a desperate attempt in both cases to dismiss the allegations as not credible without any investigation, and a desperate attempt to smear both accusers, and to thus imply that they must be lying, because bad people.
Seems pretty damn similar to me. Indeed, the only real difference, other than the media being much slower with Reade's accusation, appears to be that Kavanaugh and Ford held different political ideologies, while Reade is a lifelong Democrat who hates Donald Trump, and thus has absolutely nothing to gain from bringing this story forward now, when Biden is the presumptive Democratic nominee against Trump, a man she despises.
Again, that doesn't mean Biden sexually assaulted Reade, OR that Kavanaugh sexually assaulted Ford. It just means that neither case has been proven or disproved. This many years after both alleged instances, we will probably never know for certain if they happened.
I do find it curious that so many people who were dead sure that Kavanaugh definitely assaulted Ford are now dead sure that Biden is totally innocent, as well as how many right wing media folks who were insistent that Kavanaugh is totally innocent are now totally sure that Biden is definitely guilty.
Golly gee, it's almost likeAmericanpoliticsareis a cancer.
Olthar wrote:Anyone who buys "x-ray specs" expecting them to be real deserves to lose their money.
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