What's wrong with diversity?

[Totenborg]

Says the person who refuses to cite ANY sources for his claims

You haven't even specified what you want proved.

If you think non-white migrants don't lean OVERWHELMINGLY left, you have to be living under a rock. There are charts provided by liberal websites that show 2016 was basically divided entirely by race and to a much lesser degree, sex and education level.

If they do, it's because the xenophobic nature of the right is a threat to their wellbeing. Hilariously, many immigrants would probably vote conservatively if not for this fact. Mexican, Indian, Iraqi, ect. cultures are definitely not traditionally liberal by any metric. Y'all set a fire and blame the homeowner for living in a wooden building.

[Keturi]

The main reason why there is a need for ethnostates is precisely the high amount of collectivism and tribalism in the world. Banishing tribalists to their respective Bantustans can leave us individualists some room to breathe.

Good heavens, you haven't provided any evidence for your beliefs. You have yet to provide evidence that blacks are innately more violent than non-blacks. Why not just say you don't like non-whites and leave it at that? Would be a lot more simpler... Either way, unless you provide evidence, I see no reason for the validity of any of your racist claims.

In regards to what others have been saying about immigrants liking Democrats. Yeah, that tends to happen when the other party is employing the Southern strategy and making appeals to racist WASPs. Part of Trump's appeal is routed in the failure to assist the Rust Belt, but it's also founded on a fear of immigrants. The irony is... Even when talking illegals, they are actually net contributors to the US economy:

https://www.cfr.org/report/economic-log ... mmigration:

"In this Council Special Report, Professor Gordon H. Hanson of the University of California, San Diego approaches immigration through the lens of economics. The results are surprising. By focusing on the economic costs and benefits of legal and illegal immigration, Professor Hanson concludes that stemming illegal immigration would likely lead to a net drain on the U.S. economy—a finding that calls into question many of the proposals to increase funding for border protection. Moreover, Hanson argues that guest worker programs now being considered by Congress fail to account for the economic incentives that drive illegal immigration, which benefits both the undocumented workers who desire to work and live in the United States and employers who want flexible, low-cost labor. Hanson makes the case that unless policymakers design a system of legal immigration that reflects the economic advantages of illegal labor, such programs will not significantly reduce illegal immigration. He concludes with guidelines crucial to any such redesign of U.S. laws and policy. In short, Professor Hanson has written a report that will challenge much of the wisdom (conventional and otherwise) on the economics behind a critical and controversial issue."

Americans have this wonderful opportunity of cheap and plentiful labour, and they spend billions on trying to keep it out. Lmao.

[Flaxxony]

You misread my post.

Not even a little.

Look at it this way. The black death is fairly widely credited with higher standards of living for Yeomen English farmers who survived. Shortage of labor supply, demand goes up, wages go up.

Yes. Literally everyone says this. So it's extraordinary to find you saying people say the opposite. Where are those people?

But I repeat myself.

So how does a glut of low-skilled labor possibly not increase competition with domestic workers, lowering standards of living? The Dow Jones has scarcely doubled since 1970 despite population growing by roughly 50%.

wut

Dow Jones 1970... 809.20 (start) and 838.92 (end). Now... 28,551.53 (23 December). Source.

US Population 1970: 205.1 (says Google) and Now? 327.2 million (2018) (likewise, Google)

327.2 / 205.1 = 1.595319356. That's not roughly 50%. That's roughly 60%. When you're dealing with percentages this kind of cock up with rounding is a Big Deal.

28,551.53 / 838.92 = 34.033674248 which is a 3300% increase ((34-1)*100).

Not that the Dow Jones is remotely connected to human wellbeing. Not that the phrase "Dow Jones" ever refers to some other index. Given that you'd have to be an enormous idiot to mistake a 34-fold increase for a doubling I rather suspect you're using Dow Jones incorrectly and in so misleading a fashion as to make it impossible to check your actual meaning.

Unions used to know this. Liberals used to know this.

And to repeat myself a second time... where is the evidence that they don't talk about it now?

M2 adjusted. Always look at inflation.

Who's the idiot now? Also 50% isn't egregiously off, and 60% enhances my point not dimunates it.

[Catburg]

You haven't even specified what you want proved.

If you think non-white migrants don't lean OVERWHELMINGLY left, you have to be living under a rock. There are charts provided by liberal websites that show 2016 was basically divided entirely by race and to a much lesser degree, sex and education level.

If they do, it's because the xenophobic nature of the right is a threat to their wellbeing. Hilariously, many immigrants would probably vote conservatively if not for this fact. Mexican, Indian, Iraqi, ect. cultures are definitely not traditionally liberal by any metric. Y'all set a fire and blame the homeowner for living in a wooden building.

This is evidence that tribalism is so serious that all other political issues are irrelevant when it is present. Hence multitribal democracies can not work.

[Flaxxony]

The main reason why there is a need for ethnostates is precisely the high amount of collectivism and tribalism in the world. Banishing tribalists to their respective Bantustans can leave us individualists some room to breathe.

Good heavens, you haven't provided any evidence for your beliefs. You have yet to provide evidence that blacks are innately more violent than non-blacks. Why not just say you don't like non-whites and leave it at that? Would be a lot more simpler... Either way, unless you provide evidence, I see no reason for the validity of any of your racist claims.

In regards to what others have been saying about immigrants liking Democrats. Yeah, that tends to happen when the other party is employing the Southern strategy and making appeals to racist WASPs. Part of Trump's appeal is routed in the failure to assist the Rust Belt, but it's also founded on a fear of immigrants. The irony is... Even when talking illegals, they are actually net contributors to the US economy:

https://www.cfr.org/report/economic-log ... mmigration:

"In this Council Special Report, Professor Gordon H. Hanson of the University of California, San Diego approaches immigration through the lens of economics. The results are surprising. By focusing on the economic costs and benefits of legal and illegal immigration, Professor Hanson concludes that stemming illegal immigration would likely lead to a net drain on the U.S. economy—a finding that calls into question many of the proposals to increase funding for border protection. Moreover, Hanson argues that guest worker programs now being considered by Congress fail to account for the economic incentives that drive illegal immigration, which benefits both the undocumented workers who desire to work and live in the United States and employers who want flexible, low-cost labor. Hanson makes the case that unless policymakers design a system of legal immigration that reflects the economic advantages of illegal labor, such programs will not significantly reduce illegal immigration. He concludes with guidelines crucial to any such redesign of U.S. laws and policy. In short, Professor Hanson has written a report that will challenge much of the wisdom (conventional and otherwise) on the economics behind a critical and controversial issue."

Americans have this wonderful opportunity of cheap and plentiful labour, and they spend billions on trying to keep it out. Lmao.

Wealth distribution breh.

Yeah, GDP goes up with more people. I'm talking about the median earner.

Wars, waste, etc. All factor into GDP. Bad metric. And who cares if the GDP surges if it all just goes to Amazon?

[Flaxxony]

You haven't even specified what you want proved.

If you think non-white migrants don't lean OVERWHELMINGLY left, you have to be living under a rock. There are charts provided by liberal websites that show 2016 was basically divided entirely by race and to a much lesser degree, sex and education level.

If they do, it's because the xenophobic nature of the right is a threat to their wellbeing. Hilariously, many immigrants would probably vote conservatively if not for this fact. Mexican, Indian, Iraqi, ect. cultures are definitely not traditionally liberal by any metric. Y'all set a fire and blame the homeowner for living in a wooden building.

Xenophobia = Wanting to control your own country's immigration policy.

Welcome to the current year. Xenophobia in your mind means not wanting to become an ethnic minority, so if the people you listed aren't on board with that tenet of the Republican party then it's a pretty big item on the agenda to be against...

[Catburg]

I strongly encourage ethnonats to support freedom worldwide for tyrannies are an important reason why some people aren’t in their ethnostates.

[Totenborg]

If they do, it's because the xenophobic nature of the right is a threat to their wellbeing. Hilariously, many immigrants would probably vote conservatively if not for this fact. Mexican, Indian, Iraqi, ect. cultures are definitely not traditionally liberal by any metric. Y'all set a fire and blame the homeowner for living in a wooden building.

Xenophobia = Wanting to control your own country's immigration policy.

Welcome to the current year.

Hey, you're the one coming with all that 1890s anti-immigration rhetoric. The funny thing is that you anti-immigrant types always like to act like you speak for everyone. You don't. In fact, many, including myself, want a far less restrictive immigration policy. See, I ain't scared of the brown people taking my job. If someone with no roots in the country and little ability to speak the majority language is a threat to your general wellbeing, you plain suck. Anti-immigrant rhetoric is nothing more than a feeble attempt to cope with one's own shortcomings.

[Flaxxony]

I strongly encourage ethnonats to support freedom worldwide for tyrannies are an important reason why some people aren’t in their ethnostates.

I just see the whole thing as a way to justify manipulating the demographic to gain political power. A trick as old as time that's only logical conclusion is to proceed until the US is no longer a desirable place to immigrate to.

[Nobel Hobos 2]

If immigration helps Democrats it's probably because immigrants start out poor, and Democrat policies are more sympathetic to the poor. And immigration policy, sure, but why not? The answer to the partisan bias isn't to ban or strictly limit immigration, it's for the Republicans to stop being wrong!

Nah, it's because Democrats favor non-whites. If that wasn't the case, why wouldn't a larger proportion of whites without a college degree support them, and even the most educated and well-paid racial minorities vote Democrat? High school educated whites vote more conservatively than college-educated ones.

Same deal and it cuts both ways. If Democrats want the votes of prosperous but not professional people, they'll have to change their policies.

Having anti-immigrant policies loses the Republicans votes in the areas immigrants settle. It's the price to pay for having such policies.

But don't miss the first part of my post. I believe the main reason immigrants vote Democrat is because they want better public healthcare and education for their kids (possibly themselves) and look forward to social security later in life. It's not the immigrants who are wrong, it's the Republicans.

[Keturi]

Good heavens, you haven't provided any evidence for your beliefs. You have yet to provide evidence that blacks are innately more violent than non-blacks. Why not just say you don't like non-whites and leave it at that? Would be a lot more simpler... Either way, unless you provide evidence, I see no reason for the validity of any of your racist claims.

In regards to what others have been saying about immigrants liking Democrats. Yeah, that tends to happen when the other party is employing the Southern strategy and making appeals to racist WASPs. Part of Trump's appeal is routed in the failure to assist the Rust Belt, but it's also founded on a fear of immigrants. The irony is... Even when talking illegals, they are actually net contributors to the US economy:

https://www.cfr.org/report/economic-log ... mmigration:

"In this Council Special Report, Professor Gordon H. Hanson of the University of California, San Diego approaches immigration through the lens of economics. The results are surprising. By focusing on the economic costs and benefits of legal and illegal immigration, Professor Hanson concludes that stemming illegal immigration would likely lead to a net drain on the U.S. economy—a finding that calls into question many of the proposals to increase funding for border protection. Moreover, Hanson argues that guest worker programs now being considered by Congress fail to account for the economic incentives that drive illegal immigration, which benefits both the undocumented workers who desire to work and live in the United States and employers who want flexible, low-cost labor. Hanson makes the case that unless policymakers design a system of legal immigration that reflects the economic advantages of illegal labor, such programs will not significantly reduce illegal immigration. He concludes with guidelines crucial to any such redesign of U.S. laws and policy. In short, Professor Hanson has written a report that will challenge much of the wisdom (conventional and otherwise) on the economics behind a critical and controversial issue."

Americans have this wonderful opportunity of cheap and plentiful labour, and they spend billions on trying to keep it out. Lmao.

Wealth distribution breh.

Yeah, GDP goes up with more people. I'm talking about the median earner.

Wars, waste, etc. All factor into GDP. Bad metric. And who cares if the GDP surges if it all just goes to Amazon?

Nothing in that report mentions anything about Amazon. Illegal immigrants benefit the US economy as a whole, which in turn means more revenue for the government. You have to look at the jobs those illegals are taking up. They are a competitive advantage (not a threat) and should be utilized as such by the US.

The report indicated that the American economy is actually hurt by the present immigration system. It should be redesigned, so that it uses this competitive resource to its fullest.

[Totenborg]

I strongly encourage ethnonats to support freedom worldwide for tyrannies are an important reason why some people aren’t in their ethnostates.

I just see the whole thing as a way to justify manipulating the demographic to gain political power. A trick as old as time that's only logical conclusion is to proceed until the US is no longer a desirable place to immigrate to.

Yeah, nobody could possibly have ethics or empathy that would cause them to favor the concept of immigration.

[Flaxxony]

Xenophobia = Wanting to control your own country's immigration policy.

Welcome to the current year.

Hey, you're the one coming with all that 1890s anti-immigration rhetoric. The funny thing is that you anti-immigrant types always like to act like you speak for everyone. You don't. In fact, many, including myself, want a far less restrictive immigration policy. See, I ain't scared of the brown people taking my job. If someone with no roots in the country and little ability to speak the majority language is a threat to your general wellbeing, you plain suck. Anti-immigrant rhetoric is nothing more than a feeble attempt to cope with one's own shortcomings.

Classic demoralization tactic with no substance. Also, I am a high income professional class worker.

And if you'd look at my previous posts, you're in the minority. Your caricature of people who oppose immigration is telling. I quite simply don't want the US to have 750 million people in it. I want land prices down. I want consumption down. And I don't want tribal politics to be our political paradigm.

As such, I will vote accordingly. I invite you to vote as you please as well.

[Neu California]

Prove that the increase is likely because of non-whites then. Your links don't break it down by race. Also, I haven't seen too many politicians pushing for more immigration or looser borders, mainly just stuff about DACA, which I see as a great humanitarian policy. Would you want to be deported to a country you've never known, where you don't speak the language, and your parents fled and brought you here because you just happened not to be born here?

And it seems large majorities of people back DACA (which does not increase immigration), including supermqjorities of all races, which can't really be attributed to an increase in non-white people in the U.S. (source). I mention it because it's inevitably brought up when talk of illegals in the U.S. Is brought up.



Which leads to the other question. Why are college educated whites more liberal than non-college educated whites?

Edit: autocorrect mangling

I did prove that. Look at the map again. White men still overwhelmingly vote republican which opposes more immigration (at least in theory). So clearly the increase in favorable attitudes isn't coming from white men. Maybe white women but not white men. Which leaves everyone else.

College educated whites don't compete directly with low skilled immigrants. Proof is based on the relatively unassailable truth that college educated individuals generally results in higher-skilled employment. If this wasn't true, why go to college?

Correlation does not equal causation.

And I cannot find any evidence either way about your claim, so it's safe to say It's neither proven not disproven, just asserted.

Also, where do the majority of non-college educated whites live? All Google is giving me is the suggestion that major rust belt cities (where immigrants would be few and far between as I understand it, especially those seeking low pay work) are full of them.

[Keturi]

Hey, you're the one coming with all that 1890s anti-immigration rhetoric. The funny thing is that you anti-immigrant types always like to act like you speak for everyone. You don't. In fact, many, including myself, want a far less restrictive immigration policy. See, I ain't scared of the brown people taking my job. If someone with no roots in the country and little ability to speak the majority language is a threat to your general wellbeing, you plain suck. Anti-immigrant rhetoric is nothing more than a feeble attempt to cope with one's own shortcomings.

Classic demoralization tactic with no substance. Also, I am a high income professional class worker.

And if you'd look at my previous posts, you're in the minority. Your caricature of people who oppose immigration is telling. I quite simply don't want the US to have 750 million people in it. I want land prices down. I want consumption down. And I don't want tribal politics to be our political paradigm.

As such, I will vote accordingly. I invite you to vote as you please as well.

In other words, you don't like brown-skinned people, we get it.

[Flaxxony]

I just see the whole thing as a way to justify manipulating the demographic to gain political power. A trick as old as time that's only logical conclusion is to proceed until the US is no longer a desirable place to immigrate to.

Yeah, nobody could possibly have ethics or empathy that would cause them to favor the concept of immigration.

The empathy argument is so played out. It starts based on the assumption that Americans have a moral duty to absorb the consequences of bad policy in foreign nations.

The US is not a refugee camp, at least from my understanding of what a nation is and general geopolitics. It is gracious enough for Americans to allow any immigration at all.

[Nobel Hobos 2]

I strongly encourage ethnonats to support freedom worldwide for tyrannies are an important reason why some people aren’t in their ethnostates.

I just see the whole thing as a way to justify manipulating the demographic to gain political power. A trick as old as time that's only logical conclusion is to proceed until the US is no longer a desirable place to immigrate to.

A trick as old as time ... well I obviously can't ask you for the first example then. How about an example of a government importing voters for its own partisan advantage ..?

[Flaxxony]

Classic demoralization tactic with no substance. Also, I am a high income professional class worker.

And if you'd look at my previous posts, you're in the minority. Your caricature of people who oppose immigration is telling. I quite simply don't want the US to have 750 million people in it. I want land prices down. I want consumption down. And I don't want tribal politics to be our political paradigm.

As such, I will vote accordingly. I invite you to vote as you please as well.

In other words, you don't like brown-skinned people, we get it.

Whatever let's you sleep at night bud. Lose an argument, call the opponent a racist, Rules for Radicals, etc. Nice chat.

[Totenborg]

Hey, you're the one coming with all that 1890s anti-immigration rhetoric. The funny thing is that you anti-immigrant types always like to act like you speak for everyone. You don't. In fact, many, including myself, want a far less restrictive immigration policy. See, I ain't scared of the brown people taking my job. If someone with no roots in the country and little ability to speak the majority language is a threat to your general wellbeing, you plain suck. Anti-immigrant rhetoric is nothing more than a feeble attempt to cope with one's own shortcomings.

Classic demoralization tactic with no substance. Also, I am a high income professional class worker.

And if you'd look at my previous posts, you're in the minority. Your caricature of people who oppose immigration is telling. I quite simply don't want the US to have 750 million people in it. I want land prices down. I want consumption down. And I don't want tribal politics to be our political paradigm.

As such, I will vote accordingly. I invite you to vote as you please as well.

So, for you it's just a simple case of "fuck you; I got mine" mentality. Nice. You're really improving the state of the nation.

[Keturi]

Yeah, nobody could possibly have ethics or empathy that would cause them to favor the concept of immigration.

The empathy argument is so played out. It starts based on the assumption that Americans have a moral duty to absorb the consequences of bad policy in foreign nations.

The US is not a refugee camp, at least from my understanding of what a nation is and general geopolitics. It is gracious enough for Americans to allow any immigration at all.

The US literally was founded by immigrants. The economy benefits immensely from immigrants, including illegals. I already linked a report to you.

In other words, you don't like brown-skinned people, we get it.

Whatever let's you sleep at night bud. Lose an argument, call the opponent a racist, Rules for Radicals, etc. Nice chat.

I don't use the word "racist" lightly, but you've clearly demonstrated a desire to keep foreigners out of the United States. What would you call that?

[Flaxxony]

I just see the whole thing as a way to justify manipulating the demographic to gain political power. A trick as old as time that's only logical conclusion is to proceed until the US is no longer a desirable place to immigrate to.

A trick as old as time ... well I obviously can't ask you for the first example then. How about an example of a government importing voters for its own partisan advantage ..?

See:

Soviet Union imports Russians into Khazakstan to change voter base
Colonial Powers draw deliberately bad borders to encourage ethnic conflict
... Etc.

Are you arguing that demographic manipulation isn't a valid way to consolidate power?

[Keturi]

A trick as old as time ... well I obviously can't ask you for the first example then. How about an example of a government importing voters for its own partisan advantage ..?

See:

Soviet Union imports Russians into Khazakstan to change voter base
Colonial Powers draw deliberately bad borders to encourage ethnic conflict
... Etc.

Are you arguing that demographic manipulation isn't a valid way to consolidate power?

Nobody's forcing anyone into the United States. People are coming there willingly, in hope of finding better economic opportunities. You're making a false equivalence.

[Flaxxony]

Classic demoralization tactic with no substance. Also, I am a high income professional class worker.

And if you'd look at my previous posts, you're in the minority. Your caricature of people who oppose immigration is telling. I quite simply don't want the US to have 750 million people in it. I want land prices down. I want consumption down. And I don't want tribal politics to be our political paradigm.

As such, I will vote accordingly. I invite you to vote as you please as well.

So, for you it's just a simple case of "fuck you; I got mine" mentality. Nice. You're really improving the state of the nation.

It's the norm for most countries. If you're such a bleeding heart, tell me: How much money have you contributed to UNICEF, Gates Foundation, etc. This year?

[Flaxxony]

See:

Soviet Union imports Russians into Khazakstan to change voter base
Colonial Powers draw deliberately bad borders to encourage ethnic conflict
... Etc.

Are you arguing that demographic manipulation isn't a valid way to consolidate power?

Nobody's forcing anyone into the United States. People are coming there willingly, in hope of finding better economic opportunities. You're making a false equivalence.

Because they don't need to force them. Didn't need to force Gauls into Rome.

[Flaxxony]

The empathy argument is so played out. It starts based on the assumption that Americans have a moral duty to absorb the consequences of bad policy in foreign nations.

The US is not a refugee camp, at least from my understanding of what a nation is and general geopolitics. It is gracious enough for Americans to allow any immigration at all.

The US literally was founded by immigrants. The economy benefits immensely from immigrants, including illegals. I already linked a report to you.

Whatever let's you sleep at night bud. Lose an argument, call the opponent a racist, Rules for Radicals, etc. Nice chat.

I don't use the word "racist" lightly, but you've clearly demonstrated a desire to keep foreigners out of the United States. What would you call that?

I'd call it an American who thinks America has enough people.