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by Marxist Germany » Thu Aug 22, 2019 5:19 pm
by Bormiar » Thu Aug 22, 2019 5:25 pm
Marxist Germany wrote:OOC: Did you send a campaign already? Because if not, it should be easy to just remove it from queue.
by Refuge Isle » Thu Aug 22, 2019 5:54 pm
by Bormiar » Thu Aug 22, 2019 8:40 pm
Refuge Isle wrote:Going through this on my phone's tiny, tiny screen, it seems like the general idea of cards, especially when put into the metaphor of artwork would be just as viable as proposals that talk about a nation that "brings many issues to the world's attention" and then directly cites issue titles.
What I'm less sure about is very technical information like :
"(a value calculated by the average of all sale prices), a tactic used in order to prevent “dropping”"
These explainers might pick up some votes from folks who have no idea what you're talking about, but I'm wondering if they add that much value to the proposal at all when you can simply say market value and leave it at that. I'm equally on the fence about pennybidding as a condemnation supporter. It can be annoying but it's still controversial in terms of a valid strategy or not.
Your "Concluding" clause still mentions cards directly if you were looking to avoid that.
by Ransium » Fri Aug 23, 2019 7:46 pm
The Security Council,
ACKNOWLEDGING the existence of government-owned art collections within nations and the exchange of individual pieces and currency ("bank") that makes up the international art trade,
UNDERSTANDING that art reveals important information on the culture, ideology, and importance of the nation from which it originated,
AWARE that art is not bought and sold based on the artist, or the quality of the piece, but rather the culture that it expresses, so as to expand collections centered around specific nations.
DISTURBED that Koem Kab’s museums have collections so large and high-valued that masterpieces are not recognized for their beauty, instead glanced at due to the sheer amount of them. This disregard for art has been caused by the following:
1. Koem Kab’s museums’ abundance of art from the world’s legendary nations, a description determined by a nation’s longevity, census rankings, and contributions to the world, among other factors. Koem Kab’s museums have an obsession with collecting legendary nations, a trait shared by many, but fulfilled by few.
2. Koem Kab’s active attempts at monopolizing art from NERVUN, of which Koem Kab has a staggering 52 pieces in its collection.
3. Koem Kab’s decision to hoard the artificially high-valued art from Queen Yuno, of which Koem Kab has 10.
4. Koem Kab’s complete unwillingness to sell art unless the buyer is willing to meet unreasonably high prices,
AWARE of the effects of hoarding, which not only prevents nations from gaining intelligence on many prominent nations, but also, as stated above, devalues the art in the eyes of a tourist,
NOTING the importance of the distribution of art over a large number of nations, as it means that even if a government ceases to exist and its museums are abandoned, the knowledge and beauty they contained will continue to exist in the world.
DISGUSTED at the methods Koem Kab has used to develop such an abnormally large and high-valued collection, including:
1. Intentionally avoiding the maintenance fees required to increase art collection capacity, which, if not paid, bars nations from receiving gifts from its colonies. Koem Kab circumvents these limits by seizing control of another nation, Greatest Chernobyl, and receiving gifts from Koem Kab’s colonies on said nation. Koem Kab often sells the gifts in Greatest Chernobyl, thus fooling the system.
2. Blatantly increasing the value of useless art from nations such as International Organization, Ortsync, Griet, Divine Will VII, Vacuole, and many more by selling the art to a nation controlled by Koem Kab for a high price, raising the value and thus the value of the collection. This causes Koem Kab’s art collections to appear to be worth thousands more than than they actually should be, thus deceiving a tourist and increasing Koem Kab’s international ranking.
3. Koem Kab’s abuse of its massive amount of bank in order to buy low-selling art by placing two bids for the art at a price slightly above the market value (a value calculated by the average of all sale prices), a tactic used in order to prevent “dropping”, in which another owner of the art sells for the price bid by Koem Kab, then buys for the originally low price, in order to profit. This dropping-prevention tactic is one that few nations can afford, and often ends the bidding war, which prevents the naïve seller from getting a fair amount of bank for the art,
4. Colonizing thousands of nations for the sole purpose of art production,
AWARE of the methods Koem Kab uses that are widely considered petty for nations with large collections, which includes bank transfer stealing and "pennybidding", which is bidding 0.01 bank above the next highest bid,
FURTHER AWARE that Koem Kab has contributed to the art value inflation. This has been done because the demand for popular art has not been met by the supply, so nations with lots of art from a single nation can demand much higher than its actual worth. This cost increase has made it more difficult for poor nations to own popular art, and ensured that most popular art will go to Koem Kab and other rich collectors.
CONCLUDING that Koem Kab has prevented growth of small museums, inflated art prices, stolen transferred bank, pennybidded, artificially raised card value, nearly monopolized ownership of some art, and hoarded,
Hereby condemns Koem Kab
by Bormiar » Sat Aug 24, 2019 8:49 pm
by Refuge Isle » Wed Aug 28, 2019 10:54 am
Ransium wrote:I'm not a huge fan of directly referring to bank. I think most people halfway familiar with cards are going to get what you're trying to do and those not will not be helped much by on the nose terms. The specific implication that I struggle with with is that there is essentially one perhaps special currency used to buy and sell cards. This doesn't make sense IRL and nobody would call all currencies used to buy and sell cards 'bank'.
by Bormiar » Thu Aug 29, 2019 4:09 pm
The Security Council,
ACKNOWLEDGING the existence of government-owned art collections within nations and the buying and selling of individual artworks,
DISTURBED that Koem Kab’s museums have collections so large and high-valued that masterpieces are not recognized for their beauty, instead glanced at due to the sheer amount of them. This disregard for art has been caused by the following:
1. Koem Kab’s museums’ abundance of art from the world’s greatest nations, who have contributed internationally and been ranked highest in international censuses for a long time. Koem Kab’s museums have an obsession with collecting art from these nations, a trait shared by many, but fulfilled by few.
2. Koem Kab’s active attempts at monopolizing art from NERVUN, of which Koem Kab has a staggeringly large number of pieces, which easily places Koem Kab with the largest NERVUNian collection, and more than could be adequately displayed.
3. Koem Kab’s decision to hoard the artificially high-valued art from Queen Yuno, of which Koem Kab easily has the most in the world.
4. Koem Kab’s complete unwillingness to sell art unless the buyer is willing to meet unreasonably high prices,
AWARE of the effects of hoarding, which not only prevents widespread learning about many prominent nations, but also, as stated above, discredits the art,
NOTING the importance of the distribution of art over a large number of nations, as it means that even if a government ceases to exist and its museums are abandoned, the knowledge and beauty they contained will continue to exist in the world.
DISGUSTED at the methods Koem Kab has used to develop such an abnormally large and high-valued collection, including:
1. Intentionally avoiding the expenses necessary to expand a nation’s museums, which include construction, security, transportation, and time spent during construction with the museums unable to profit. Instead of renovating museums, Koem Kab usually chooses to disrespectfully keep art in the warehouses of its largest colony, Greatest Chernobyl. These masterpieces sit here until they can be sold to a grateful owner.
2. Blatantly increasing the value of useless art from nations such as International Organization, Ortsync, Griet, Divine Will VII, Vacuole, and many more by selling the art to a nation controlled by Koem Kab for a high price, which raises the value and thus the value of the collection. This causes Koem Kab’s art collections to appear to be worth thousands more than than they actually should be, thus misrepresenting the museum.
3. Koem Kab’s abuse of its fortune in order to buy cheap art. This can most-likely only be achieved if the nation has a large amount of wealth to prevent dropping. Stopping this “dropping” tactic from occurring prevents the naïve seller from getting a fair amount for the art, and discourages competition, as it often ends the bidding war,
4. Colonizing thousands of nations for the sole purpose of art production,
AWARE of the methods Koem Kab uses that are widely considered petty for nations with large collections, which includes transfer stealing and "pennybidding". “Pennybidding” is when a representative of a nation bids a negligibly small amount above the previous bid, intentionally causing frustration and extending bidding wars,
FURTHER AWARE that Koem Kab has contributed to the art value inflation. This has been done because the demand for popular art has not been met by the supply, so nations with lots of art from a single nation can demand much higher than its actual worth. This cost increase has made it more difficult for poor nations to own popular art, and ensured that most popular art will go to Koem Kab and other rich collectors.
CONCLUDING that Koem Kab has prevented growth of small museums, inflated art prices, stolen transferred bank, pennybidded, artificially raised art value, nearly monopolized ownership of some art, and hoarded,
Hereby condemns Koem Kab
by Refuge Isle » Thu Aug 29, 2019 4:33 pm
Bormiar wrote:AWARE of the effects of hoarding, which not only prevents widespread learning about many prominent nations, but also, as stated above, discredits the art,
Bormiar wrote:AWARE of the methods Koem Kab uses that are widely considered petty for nations with large collections, which includes transfer stealing and "pennybidding". “Pennybidding” is when a representative of a nation bids a negligibly small amount above the previous bid, intentionally causing frustration and extending bidding wars,
by Bormiar » Thu Aug 29, 2019 4:55 pm
Refuge Isle wrote:The acrobatics on this rewrite are rather fantastic, and I'm glad to see that you addressed a lot of the original concerns with creative interpretations. Over-inflating transfer cards so that the leaderboard is fundamentally damaged and the IC moral implications of who knows how many farms are two things I'm glad are here.
Refuge Isle wrote:Bormiar wrote:AWARE of the effects of hoarding, which not only prevents widespread learning about many prominent nations, but also, as stated above, discredits the art,
I'm not sure how I feel about the phrase "prevents widespread learning." Is it possible to make that less awkward or contagious sounding?
Refuge Isle wrote:Bormiar wrote:AWARE of the methods Koem Kab uses that are widely considered petty for nations with large collections, which includes transfer stealing and "pennybidding". “Pennybidding” is when a representative of a nation bids a negligibly small amount above the previous bid, intentionally causing frustration and extending bidding wars,
I'm still unsure about this clause, and I think partially because I don't believe pennybidding being "petty" is a condemnable action or that this resolution should imply that someone who does it is going down the road to their own condemnation. But moreso, it's hard to translate the idea of pennybidding into the interpretation of "bank" and transfers that you've provided in this draft.
by Aclion » Thu Aug 29, 2019 9:56 pm
I think it would work better if you sold it as an and unfair trading practice that impedes legitimate trade in art.Bormiar wrote:The key thing is mentioned, that Koem Kab has thousands of bank, and this is petty, which is why I believe this is fitting in the draft. If the majority decide that that is not fitting for a condemnation, so be it, but I believe it adds to it. I think the translation issues would be addressed when the mods decide its legality.
by Bormiar » Fri Aug 30, 2019 5:46 pm
Aclion wrote:I think it would work better if you sold it as an and unfair trading practice that impedes legitimate trade in art.Bormiar wrote:The key thing is mentioned, that Koem Kab has thousands of bank, and this is petty, which is why I believe this is fitting in the draft. If the majority decide that that is not fitting for a condemnation, so be it, but I believe it adds to it. I think the translation issues would be addressed when the mods decide its legality.
by Refuge Isle » Fri Aug 30, 2019 6:28 pm
Bormiar wrote:Aclion wrote:I think it would work better if you sold it as an and unfair trading practice that impedes legitimate trade in art.
I talked to some other card players and they said for a variety of reasons that it’s best to remove it (e.g. the SC’s stance on pennybidding should be impartial as it’s one of the only good methods poor nations can use), so eventually I decided to just remove it.
Anyways it’s submitted right now.
by Bormiar » Fri Aug 30, 2019 9:19 pm
Refuge Isle wrote:Bormiar wrote:I talked to some other card players and they said for a variety of reasons that it’s best to remove it (e.g. the SC’s stance on pennybidding should be impartial as it’s one of the only good methods poor nations can use), so eventually I decided to just remove it.
Anyways it’s submitted right now.
Technically, it's still in the conclusion clause, but I've approved it anyway.
by Bhang Bhang Duc » Sat Aug 31, 2019 12:31 am
Pierconium wrote:I see Funk as an opportunistic manipulator that utilises the means available to him to reach his goals. In other words, a nation after my own heart.
RiderSyl wrote:If an enchantress made it so one raid could bring about world peace, Unibot would ask raiders to just sign a petition instead.
Sedgistan wrote:The SC has just has a spate of really shitty ones recently from Northumbria, his Watermelon fanboy…..
by Marxist Germany » Sat Aug 31, 2019 6:53 am
by Eumaeus » Sat Aug 31, 2019 8:21 am
Raiding History | Security Council | Dear Natives | TWP Raid |
by Destructive Government Economic System » Sat Aug 31, 2019 1:10 pm
Keshiland literally wrote:I would give it a no. A country that lies about how free, or how great, or how humanitarian it is can never be developed. Example, NK lies and says they are democratic and are not, the US lies and says we are free yet we incarcerate millions for a medical plant. See we are basically a larger more populated North Korea.
by Marxist Germany » Sat Aug 31, 2019 1:44 pm
by Bormiar » Sat Aug 31, 2019 8:57 pm
Bhang Bhang Duc wrote:The submitted version looks good, best of luck with getting it to vote. Full support from me.
Marxist Germany wrote:OOC:Good luck!
Eumaeus wrote:Good luck, Bormiar, you're breaking new ground.
Destructive Government Economic System wrote:Man, this draft looks awesome.
It's the first of its kind, and I'm betting absolutely nobody will be happier to see this pass than us in the Card server
Marxist Germany wrote:OOC:Good luck and support!
by Wallenburg » Sun Sep 01, 2019 6:41 am
by Eumaeus » Sun Sep 01, 2019 8:05 am
Wallenburg wrote:Referencing "bank" as a currency can't be legal, can it?
Raiding History | Security Council | Dear Natives | TWP Raid |
by Ransium » Sun Sep 01, 2019 9:05 am
by Llwn Bud » Sun Sep 01, 2019 11:27 am
by VW53Aland » Sun Sep 01, 2019 11:34 am
This also goes back to my first point against this resolution. What you see here happening is, however unfortunate, normal capitalism at work. From a capitalistic point of view, the nominee is not abusing its fortune, but merely using it. Again, we are not a fan of capitalism, but we don't believe in its prohibition.Koem Kab’s abuse of its fortune in order to buy cheap art. This can most-likely only be achieved if the nation has a large amount of wealth to prevent dropping. Stopping this “dropping” tactic from occurring prevents the naïve seller from getting a fair amount for the art, and discourages competition, as it often ends the bidding war
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