Much of the Hadith are horrible trash, sure, but most of Islam obsesses over the Hadith.
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by Novus America » Thu Mar 28, 2019 5:52 pm
by Mystic Warriors » Thu Mar 28, 2019 5:52 pm
by New haven america » Thu Mar 28, 2019 5:52 pm
Badb Catha wrote:New haven america wrote:Let's just forget that for a large part of history Islam was actually more liberal and advanced than the West.
Or that they actually ruled a large portion of the West...
1. There is nothing good about being more liberal.
2. I do not consider Iberia and Sicily to be a "large portion of the West", either.
by El-Amin Caliphate » Thu Mar 28, 2019 5:52 pm
Duhon wrote:Badb Catha wrote:
Islam is incompatible with Western culture, for one thing. Our values have their roots in Christianity; an entirely different religion with entirely different beliefs.
Nonsense: for one thing, "our values" were formulated recently, especially those against LGBT discrimination: even two decades ago, you'd still see significant challenge against accepting women and LGBTs in the military, for instance. We're not that far removed in time from where most Muslim jurisprudence is now, and we still wouldn't be if not for increasing secularism and emphasis on universaling principles like human rights.
It "our values" are capable of reform, then so can Islam.
https://americanvision.org/948/theonomy-vs-theocracy/ wrote:God’s law cannot govern a nation where God’s law does not rule in the hearts of the people
Plaetopia wrote:Partly Free / Hybrid regime (score 4-6) El-Amin Caliphate (5.33)
by Mystic Warriors » Thu Mar 28, 2019 5:53 pm
by El-Amin Caliphate » Thu Mar 28, 2019 5:54 pm
https://americanvision.org/948/theonomy-vs-theocracy/ wrote:God’s law cannot govern a nation where God’s law does not rule in the hearts of the people
Plaetopia wrote:Partly Free / Hybrid regime (score 4-6) El-Amin Caliphate (5.33)
by El-Amin Caliphate » Thu Mar 28, 2019 5:54 pm
https://americanvision.org/948/theonomy-vs-theocracy/ wrote:God’s law cannot govern a nation where God’s law does not rule in the hearts of the people
Plaetopia wrote:Partly Free / Hybrid regime (score 4-6) El-Amin Caliphate (5.33)
by Duhon » Thu Mar 28, 2019 5:54 pm
El-Amin Caliphate wrote:Duhon wrote:
Nonsense: for one thing, "our values" were formulated recently, especially those against LGBT discrimination: even two decades ago, you'd still see significant challenge against accepting women and LGBTs in the military, for instance. We're not that far removed in time from where most Muslim jurisprudence is now, and we still wouldn't be if not for increasing secularism and emphasis on universaling principles like human rights.
It "our values" are capable of reform, then so can Islam.
Please keep your kufr to yourselves.
by Badb Catha » Thu Mar 28, 2019 5:54 pm
Duhon wrote:Badb Catha wrote:
Islam is incompatible with Western culture, for one thing. Our values have their roots in Christianity; an entirely different religion with entirely different beliefs.
Nonsense: for one thing, "our values" were formulated recently, especially those against LGBT discrimination: even two decades ago, you'd still see significant challenge against accepting women and LGBTs in the military, for instance. We're not that far removed in time from where most Muslim jurisprudence is now, and we still wouldn't be if not for increasing secularism and emphasis on universaling principles like human rights.
It "our values" are capable of reform, then so can Islam.
by The South Falls » Thu Mar 28, 2019 5:55 pm
by Cedoria » Thu Mar 28, 2019 5:55 pm
by Mystic Warriors » Thu Mar 28, 2019 5:55 pm
Badb Catha wrote:New haven america wrote:Let's just forget that for a large part of history Islam was actually more liberal and advanced than the West.
Or that they actually ruled a large portion of the West...
There is nothing good about being more liberal.
I do not consider Iberia and Sicily to be a "large portion of the West", either.
by San Montalbano » Thu Mar 28, 2019 5:55 pm
by The South Falls » Thu Mar 28, 2019 5:56 pm
by New haven america » Thu Mar 28, 2019 5:56 pm
Badb Catha wrote:Duhon wrote:
Nonsense: for one thing, "our values" were formulated recently, especially those against LGBT discrimination: even two decades ago, you'd still see significant challenge against accepting women and LGBTs in the military, for instance. We're not that far removed in time from where most Muslim jurisprudence is now, and we still wouldn't be if not for increasing secularism and emphasis on universaling principles like human rights.
It "our values" are capable of reform, then so can Islam.
You are mistaken in assuming I was referring to liberalism and egalitarianism; these are not part of Western values, merely new concepts developed during the Enlightenment.
by Gormwood » Thu Mar 28, 2019 5:57 pm
The South Falls wrote:Why are there so many "liberal bad, authoritarian christian good" people?
by New haven america » Thu Mar 28, 2019 5:57 pm
by San Montalbano » Thu Mar 28, 2019 5:57 pm
by The South Falls » Thu Mar 28, 2019 5:57 pm
by Mystic Warriors » Thu Mar 28, 2019 5:57 pm
by Badb Catha » Thu Mar 28, 2019 5:58 pm
New haven america wrote:Badb Catha wrote:
1. There is nothing good about being more liberal.
2. I do not consider Iberia and Sicily to be a "large portion of the West", either.
1. Objectively false, especially if you're trying to discuss the differences between the West and elsewhere
2. Turkey, the Levant, Mesopotamia, Egypt, Libya, Tunisia, Algeria, and Morocco were all considered to be part of the West before Islamic takeover (They were even majority Christian nations, with remnants of their beliefs being found mostly in Lebanon).
by San Montalbano » Thu Mar 28, 2019 5:58 pm
by Mystic Warriors » Thu Mar 28, 2019 5:58 pm
by Duhon » Thu Mar 28, 2019 5:59 pm
Badb Catha wrote:Duhon wrote:
Nonsense: for one thing, "our values" were formulated recently, especially those against LGBT discrimination: even two decades ago, you'd still see significant challenge against accepting women and LGBTs in the military, for instance. We're not that far removed in time from where most Muslim jurisprudence is now, and we still wouldn't be if not for increasing secularism and emphasis on universaling principles like human rights.
It "our values" are capable of reform, then so can Islam.
You are mistaken in assuming I was referring to liberalism and egalitarianism; these are not part of Western values, merely new concepts developed during the Enlightenment.
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