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by Bedetopia » Mon Feb 04, 2019 3:01 am
by Heraswed » Mon Feb 04, 2019 4:20 am
Bedetopia wrote:I'm quite surprised by the wide variety of ideologies mentioned. Isn't it paradoxical to have communists cohabitate with fascists? I thought they hated each other.
Aside from that, the other parts seem good.
by Honeydewistania » Mon Feb 04, 2019 5:14 am
Alger wrote:if you have egoquotes in your signature, touch grass
by Greater vakolicci haven » Mon Feb 04, 2019 5:18 am
by Honeydewistania » Mon Feb 04, 2019 5:34 am
Alger wrote:if you have egoquotes in your signature, touch grass
by Bedetopia » Mon Feb 04, 2019 6:38 am
Heraswed wrote:Bedetopia wrote:I'm quite surprised by the wide variety of ideologies mentioned. Isn't it paradoxical to have communists cohabitate with fascists? I thought they hated each other.
Aside from that, the other parts seem good.
Previously, the laws governing the Confederation restricted rulers from aligning with leftist ideology. However, more recently Imperial Law was relaxed and only encourages right-wing ideologies. It's really just a pro-authoritarian haven now.
As for communist/fascist cohabitation, they don't need to hate each other, and often nationalist movements have evolved into communist groups so the two are closer than you'd think. Economic policy is also similar, however Mussolini stated that Fascist economic policy should be flexible and not plagued by ideological commitments which opposes Communist policy.
by Honeydewistania » Mon Feb 04, 2019 7:47 am
Alger wrote:if you have egoquotes in your signature, touch grass
by Greater vakolicci haven » Mon Feb 04, 2019 8:57 am
Honeydewistania wrote:'To the Community of CAIN United,
Our apologies for radio silence. The Imperial Empire has only just returned to NationStates after a foreseen leave of absence.
The Confederation respects your region's goals and commends you for your continuing mission.
Nonetheless, the Confederation does not share in your dislike of Nazis. We are strong supporters of fascism and find that Nazi ideologies are of benefit to both our government and the wider world.
The Confederation will not be bullied into believing otherwise and politely invites you to cease your hollow threats.
Sincerely,
Viceroy's Office
on behalf of
WALTER MEMMON
VICEROY OF THE CONFEDERATION'
I don't think that is In-Character
by Jocospor » Mon Feb 04, 2019 9:07 am
Caracasus wrote:Very recently Jocospur opened a thread in moderation regarding their region being called nazis and fascistd. They were given some advice as to how to avoid that. Cheifly to close embassies with fascist regions and provide better disclaimers regarding their actual stance on fascism. As far as I am aware they haven't. While Jocospur seemed willing to work with others, unfortunately Shrewlama vetoed the idea. Apart from an insight into who actually runs CoCD, the discussion was fruitless.
viewtopic.php?f=16&t=458438
As far as I am concerned I am very much against this. If anything the very venement rejection of perfectly reasonable solutions made in good faith kind of leads me to believe that there is a pretty strong fascist contingent in CoCD.
by Greater vakolicci haven » Mon Feb 04, 2019 9:09 am
Jocospor wrote:Caracasus wrote:Very recently Jocospur opened a thread in moderation regarding their region being called nazis and fascistd. They were given some advice as to how to avoid that. Cheifly to close embassies with fascist regions and provide better disclaimers regarding their actual stance on fascism. As far as I am aware they haven't. While Jocospur seemed willing to work with others, unfortunately Shrewlama vetoed the idea. Apart from an insight into who actually runs CoCD, the discussion was fruitless.
viewtopic.php?f=16&t=458438
As far as I am concerned I am very much against this. If anything the very venement rejection of perfectly reasonable solutions made in good faith kind of leads me to believe that there is a pretty strong fascist contingent in CoCD.
OOC: I just saw this thread now and I feel like your comment is the only one worth responding to as of now. My government and I are still discussing the advice that was offered. Rome wasn't built in a day, and this decision isn't an easy one for us to make, though it might be for you. We are still conducting our own investigations into the accusations aforementioned concerning select regions and are yet unable to ascertain legitimacy on a variety of circumstances. As far as I am aware, Shrewllamaland, though a valued, integral part of our operation, is not actually the leader of the Confederation, as been suggested several times. If he wishes to challenge me for the position he's more than welcome to but, since it would be a futile act, I'm sure he won't (much to your disappointment, I can see).
by ShrewLlamaLand » Mon Feb 04, 2019 9:14 am
Jocospor wrote:As far as I am aware, Shrewllamaland, though a valued, integral part of our operation, is not actually the leader of the Confederation, as been suggested several times. If he wishes to challenge me for the position he's more than welcome to but, since it would be a futile act, I'm sure he won't (much to your disappointment, I can see).
Greater vakolicci haven wrote:I'm willing to provide proof of the accusations against NE.
by Heraswed » Mon Feb 04, 2019 9:18 am
Honeydewistania wrote:'To the Community of CAIN United,
Our apologies for radio silence. The Imperial Empire has only just returned to NationStates after a foreseen leave of absence.
The Confederation respects your region's goals and commends you for your continuing mission.
Nonetheless, the Confederation does not share in your dislike of Nazis. We are strong supporters of fascism and find that Nazi ideologies are of benefit to both our government and the wider world.
The Confederation will not be bullied into believing otherwise and politely invites you to cease your hollow threats.
Sincerely,
Viceroy's Office
on behalf of
WALTER MEMMON
VICEROY OF THE CONFEDERATION'
I don't think that is In-Character
by Jocospor » Mon Feb 04, 2019 9:18 am
ShrewLlamaLand wrote:Jocospor wrote:As far as I am aware, Shrewllamaland, though a valued, integral part of our operation, is not actually the leader of the Confederation, as been suggested several times. If he wishes to challenge me for the position he's more than welcome to but, since it would be a futile act, I'm sure he won't (much to your disappointment, I can see).
Well, actually, I may just do that. When are our next elections scheduled?
by Lord Dominator » Mon Feb 04, 2019 9:23 am
Lord Dominator wrote:
Sure it is, and we've done it before.
But, I've here a piece of SC legislation which explicitly states that the SC believes it is not their place to dictate what ideologies are acceptable, unless you can produce such a piece of legislation which states the opposite, I'm sticking with SC#38.
Lord Dominator wrote:
Liberations merely require a clause and justification, writing it like a Condemnation was intentional
Condemnation has no mechanical effect
Well firstly, the issue I take is that the only justification you've used is your claim that the CCD is fascist. And I'd remind you that your liberation has likewise had no mechanical effect and wouldn't even serve the purpose you intended for it, since a person would have to read the resolution in order to understand why the badge exists on the CCD page. This renders the purpose of the resolution 'to warn both Confederation of Corrupt Dictators and future regions from promoting fascism, other such ideologies, and blatant use of this Assembly as recruitment and ego-boosting; unknown to most people. Whereas a Condemnation may have given nations an inkling of what was going on without having to have read the resolution.
This is not a complaint that it's not a normal liberation, the complaint is that it doesn't meet the definition of a liberation resolution. And furthermore, there is a no mechanical effect to the liberation.
Lord Dominator wrote:
I assume that saying this draft is a silly idea that won't pass doesn't count?
Why is it a 'silly idea'? My definition of a silly idea is proposing an ineffectual liberation which doesn't even meet the definition of a liberation before attempting to keep down a proposal to repeal it through complaints which are as asinine as they are inane.
by Greater vakolicci haven » Mon Feb 04, 2019 9:55 am
ShrewLlamaLand wrote:Blood Wine wrote:
You cannot hide behind that idiotic excuse of "IC" when supporting nazism
Yes, just like you can't hide behind "IC" when role-playing an anarchist, or a communist, or an evil wizard, right?Jocospor wrote:As far as I am aware, Shrewllamaland, though a valued, integral part of our operation, is not actually the leader of the Confederation, as been suggested several times. If he wishes to challenge me for the position he's more than welcome to but, since it would be a futile act, I'm sure he won't (much to your disappointment, I can see).
Well, actually, I may just do that. When are our next elections scheduled?Greater vakolicci haven wrote:I'm willing to provide proof of the accusations against NE.
Please do pass it on.
by Kuriko » Mon Feb 04, 2019 10:03 am
Honeydewistania wrote:Kuriko deleting her post
:thonk:
by Blood Wine » Mon Feb 04, 2019 10:17 am
Elke and Elba wrote:Well Mall, you want Haven? I'd want your Joint Systems Alliance badge, then.
Discoveria wrote:Port blood is a raider through and through. Honest.
Tim-Opolis wrote:The Salt Mines will be fueled for months by the tears of silly fascists.
[4:27 PM] Antigone: Port Blood = Gameplay JesusSedgistan wrote:Attempted threadjack on sandwiches and satanism removed.
by Heraswed » Mon Feb 04, 2019 10:24 am
by Lord Dominator » Mon Feb 04, 2019 10:28 am
by Greater vakolicci haven » Mon Feb 04, 2019 10:32 am
by Heraswed » Mon Feb 04, 2019 11:50 am
Lord Dominator wrote:
Sure it is, and we've done it before.
But, I've here a piece of SC legislation which explicitly states that the SC believes it is not their place to dictate what ideologies are acceptable, unless you can produce such a piece of legislation which states the opposite, I'm sticking with SC#38.
Lord Dominator wrote:At least one of Nazi Europe's condemns, all three of the present offensive liberations (KR, NE, and CCD), probably some others, we have a couple commends that cite promotion of a gameplay ideology (and one condemn for promoting a different one), and literally every R/D C&C is a Gameplay ideology related.
Lord Dominator wrote:
Liberations merely require a clause and justification, writing it like a Condemnation was intentional
Condemnation has no mechanical effect
Well firstly, the issue I take is that the only justification you've used is your claim that the CCD is fascist. And I'd remind you that your liberation has likewise had no mechanical effect and wouldn't even serve the purpose you intended for it, since a person would have to read the resolution in order to understand why the badge exists on the CCD page. This renders the purpose of the resolution 'to warn both Confederation of Corrupt Dictators and future regions from promoting fascism, other such ideologies, and blatant use of this Assembly as recruitment and ego-boosting; unknown to most people. Whereas a Condemnation may have given nations an inkling of what was going on without having to have read the resolution.
Lord Dominator wrote:Aside from the fact that I don't expect people ever read any of the badges after they're passed, a Liberations present non-effect is still more than the effect than a Condemnation can ever have.
Lord Dominator wrote:
This is not a normal liberation, complaints that it isn't are rather moot
This is not a complaint that it's not a normal liberation, the complaint is that it doesn't meet the definition of a liberation resolution. And furthermore, there is a no mechanical effect to the liberation.
Lord Dominator wrote:It meets the definition of a Liberation resolution, that is it prohibits the regional delegate from imposing a regional password (which, while presently a useless effect is still an effect).
Lord Dominator wrote:How about a repeal that won't ever pass? I'd certainly call that a silly idea.
by Heraswed » Mon Feb 04, 2019 12:01 pm
by Lord Dominator » Mon Feb 04, 2019 12:07 pm
by Lord Dominator » Mon Feb 04, 2019 12:15 pm
But, I've here a piece of SC legislation which explicitly states that the SC believes it is not their place to dictate what ideologies are acceptable, unless you can produce such a piece of legislation which states the opposite, I'm sticking with SC#38.Lord Dominator wrote:At least one of Nazi Europe's condemns, all three of the present offensive liberations (KR, NE, and CCD), probably some others, we have a couple commends that cite promotion of a gameplay ideology (and one condemn for promoting a different one), and literally every R/D C&C is a Gameplay ideology related.
That's all well and good, but the only thing that will change the fact that the SC has legislated that it can't use ideology as the sole reasoning for a resolution is it legislating the opposite.
Well firstly, the issue I take is that the only justification you've used is your claim that the CCD is fascist. And I'd remind you that your liberation has likewise had no mechanical effect and wouldn't even serve the purpose you intended for it, since a person would have to read the resolution in order to understand why the badge exists on the CCD page. This renders the purpose of the resolution 'to warn both Confederation of Corrupt Dictators and future regions from promoting fascism, other such ideologies, and blatant use of this Assembly as recruitment and ego-boosting; unknown to most people. Whereas a Condemnation may have given nations an inkling of what was going on without having to have read the resolution.Lord Dominator wrote:Aside from the fact that I don't expect people ever read any of the badges after they're passed, a Liberations present non-effect is still more than the effect than a Condemnation can ever have.
That makes no sense whatsoever, presently, neither would have any mechanical effect. And in order for the liberation to be at all useful, Jocospor would have to leave the site, whilst passing to delegacy to another nation and the Confederation would have to greatly shrink. These alone are unlikely to take place. So, you can either have a noticeable, clear and obvious sign that the region in question is disapproved of by the World at large, or you can have a badge which might as well read 'non-threatening' with a mechanical effect that has an extremely low probability of ever being useful.
This is not a complaint that it's not a normal liberation, the complaint is that it doesn't meet the definition of a liberation resolution. And furthermore, there is a no mechanical effect to the liberation.Lord Dominator wrote:It meets the definition of a Liberation resolution, that is it prohibits the regional delegate from imposing a regional password (which, while presently a useless effect is still an effect).
Let me rephrase that, it meets the definition of a liberation resolution but has no purpose, as long as the liberation in not affecting the confederation it is purposeless and therefore, should not exist, or even have been passed.
Lord Dominator wrote:
And why won't it pass?
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