MAGAThread XIV: All persons born or naturalized ...

[Trumptonium1]

He wasn't a US journalist.

Yeah he was, he worked with the Washington Post.

I suppose that made Dwight Eisenhower a Belgian General. Anyone knows why he was allowed to stand for election?

[Vassenor]

Obama in Iraq, April 2009

Obama at Bagram Air Base, Afghanistan. December 2010

Obama in Afghanistan, May 2012

A combat zone is not an entire country, just the areas designated as combat zones by the military.

Whereas Trump cannot even be bothered to leave the safety of his for-profit golf course that no-one required him to divest. I'm looking at his list of international visits and not one of them involves deployed US forces.

And keep in mind the Taliban attacked Bagram not long after Obama was there in 2010.

[Mardla]

A combat zone is not an entire country, just the areas designated as combat zones by the military.

Exactly. Obama going to US bases in Iraq and Afghanistan and Trump not doing that are both the same, because those bases might technically not have been combat zones.

We are no longer in Iraq. We do have a presence in Afghanistan, which we need to end.

[Ifreann]

A combat zone is not an entire country, just the areas designated as combat zones by the military.

Whereas Trump cannot even be bothered to leave the safety of his for-profit golf course that no-one required him to divest.

And keep in mind the Taliban attacked Bagram not long after Obama was there in 2010.

Silly Vass, it doesn't matter that Obama went to visit the troops and Trump hasn't done so. All that matters is technicalities around what is and is not a combat zone. That way Trump supporters don't have to actually defend Trump and his behaviour, they just have to cast aspersions on Obama. And we fall for it, every time, because we just can't leave bad arguments alone.

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Exactly. Obama going to US bases in Iraq and Afghanistan and Trump not doing that are both the same, because those bases might technically not have been combat zones.

We are no longer in Iraq. We do have a presence in Afghanistan, which we need to end.

See? This is perfect. What does it say about Trump that he hasn't visited troops deployed overseas? Never mind that, instead let's talk about the War in Afghanistan in general.

[Vassenor]

Exactly. Obama going to US bases in Iraq and Afghanistan and Trump not doing that are both the same, because those bases might technically not have been combat zones.

We are no longer in Iraq. We do have a presence in Afghanistan, which we need to end.

Didn't Obama try to do exactly that but Congress would have none of it?

Also I see you're still trying to distract from the issue. If Afghanistan is as safe as you say it is what's stopping Trump from going out there like Obama and Bush did?

[Mardla]

A combat zone is not an entire country, just the areas designated as combat zones by the military.

Whereas Trump cannot even be bothered to leave the safety of his for-profit golf course that no-one required him to divest. I'm looking at his list of international visits and not one of them involves deployed US forces.

And keep in mind the Taliban attacked Bagram not long after Obama was there in 2010.

I doubt safety has much to do with it. He just isn't interested.

[Mardla]

We are no longer in Iraq. We do have a presence in Afghanistan, which we need to end.

Didn't Obama try to do exactly that but Congress would have none of it?

Also I see you're still trying to distract from the issue. If Afghanistan is as safe as you say it is what's stopping Trump from going out there like Obama and Bush did?

I never said Afghanistan is safe, I say we can't win.

[Vassenor]

Whereas Trump cannot even be bothered to leave the safety of his for-profit golf course that no-one required him to divest. I'm looking at his list of international visits and not one of them involves deployed US forces.

And keep in mind the Taliban attacked Bagram not long after Obama was there in 2010.

I doubt safety has much to do with it. He just isn't interested.

So he doesn't actually care about the military beyond using them as sticks to pander to his base and beat down people who protest.

[Mardla]

I doubt safety has much to do with it. He just isn't interested.

So he doesn't actually care about the military beyond using them as sticks to pander to his base and beat down people who protest.

Do you thank servicemen?

[Ifreann]

So he doesn't actually care about the military beyond using them as sticks to pander to his base and beat down people who protest.

Do you thank servicemen?

Is Vassenor the Commander in Chief of the Armed Forces of the United States?

[Vassenor]

And I was wrong, there is exactly one visit to deployed troops. To a base in the suburbs of a South Korean city.

Unlike Clinton, Bush and Obama, who all went out to the actual DMZ.

[Mardla]

Do you thank servicemen?

Is Vassenor the Commander in Chief of the Armed Forces of the United States?

I said thank, not travel to Afghanistan.

[Ifreann]

Is Vassenor the Commander in Chief of the Armed Forces of the United States?

I said thank, not travel to Afghanistan.

Yes, you did. And what Vassenor does is irrelevant, because she is a rando on the interbutt.

If you're deeply curious about Vass' personal habits maybe send her a telegram.

[Mardla]

I said thank, not travel to Afghanistan.

Yes, you did. And what Vassenor does is irrelevant, because she is a rando on the interbutt.

If you're deeply curious about Vass' personal habits maybe send her a telegram.

It is quite relevant as to whether the level of indignation is warranted.

[Galloism]

Obama in Iraq, April 2009

Obama at Bagram Air Base, Afghanistan. December 2010

Obama in Afghanistan, May 2012

A combat zone is not an entire country, just the areas designated as combat zones by the military.

Um, it's true a combat zone may not be an entire country, but it was in the case of Iraq and Afghanistan.

In fact, Afghanistan still is to this day:

https://www.irs.gov/newsroom/combat-zones

Afghanistan Area
By Executive Order No. 13239, Afghanistan (and the airspace above) was designated as a combat zone beginning September 19, 2001.

Afghanistan

[Freezic Vast]

Exactly. Obama going to US bases in Iraq and Afghanistan and Trump not doing that are both the same, because those bases might technically not have been combat zones.

We are no longer in Iraq. We do have a presence in Afghanistan, which we need to end.

No we're never going to leave, otherwise a similar situation in Iraq and Syria will happen in Afghanistan.

[Mardla]

A combat zone is not an entire country, just the areas designated as combat zones by the military.

Um, it's true a combat zone may not be an entire country, but it was in the case of Iraq and Afghanistan.

In fact, Afghanistan still is to this day:

https://www.irs.gov/newsroom/combat-zones

Afghanistan Area
By Executive Order No. 13239, Afghanistan (and the airspace above) was designated as a combat zone beginning September 19, 2001.

Afghanistan

Ah, my mistake.

[Mardla]

We are no longer in Iraq. We do have a presence in Afghanistan, which we need to end.

No we're never going to leave, otherwise a similar situation in Iraq and Syria will happen in Afghanistan.

Nah, the Taliban will rapidly consolidate power.

[Vassenor]

Yes, you did. And what Vassenor does is irrelevant, because she is a rando on the interbutt.

If you're deeply curious about Vass' personal habits maybe send her a telegram.

It is quite relevant as to whether the level of indignation is warranted.

Oh, are we trying to appeal to perceived hypocrisy in lieu of an actual argument again?

[Mardla]

It is quite relevant as to whether the level of indignation is warranted.

Oh, are we trying to appeal to perceived hypocrisy in lieu of an actual argument again?

That's applicable here as this isn't a dialectical search for truth, just a contextual question over if indignation is warranted.

[Vassenor]

Oh, are we trying to appeal to perceived hypocrisy in lieu of an actual argument again?

That's applicable here as this isn't a dialectical search for truth, just a contextual question over if indignation is warranted.

Whether you think I am allowed to think a thing has no bearing on whether I will actually think a thing.

Now back to the topic.

[Juristonia]

After a long day of carrying goalposts around, I suppose it's nice to relax with a straw man for a while instead.

[Mardla]

That's applicable here as this isn't a dialectical search for truth, just a contextual question over if indignation is warranted.

Whether you think I am allowed to think a thing has no bearing on whether I will actually think a thing.

Now back to the topic.

I don't think you do.

[Vassenor]

In actually relevant news, Trump is still hurling barbs at Roberts.

It's like he wants the Judicial branch to hate him or something.

[Mardla]

After a long day of carrying goalposts around, I suppose it's nice to relax with a straw man for a while instead.

The argument was Trump doesn't care about the troops because he doesn't visit Afghanistan.

I implicitly asked whether failing to thank them (a lot less) means you don't care. I didn't get much more than evasion on this, so let it simply be said that the argument I was rebutting hinges on a non sequitur