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US Midterm Elections Megathread III: Hitting The Wall

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)

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Petrasylvania
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Posts: 10647
Founded: Oct 20, 2017
Ex-Nation

Postby Petrasylvania » Tue Nov 13, 2018 9:31 am

Bienenhalde wrote:
Page wrote:
American politics is a battle in which Cersei Lannister types excel, liberals aren't going to win until they stop being Ned Stark.

It's time for the Dems to be abrasive and land low blows.


Well, if you do that, don't expect to get the votes of moderates and conservatives who are fed up with Trump and want a return to civility!

Because civility always triumphs over trash talk in American politics.
Crimes committed by Muslims will be proof of a pan-Islamic plot and Islam's inherent evil. On the other hand, crimes committed by non-Muslims will merely be the acts of mentally ill lone wolves who do not represent their professed belief system at all.
The probability of someone secretly participating in homosexual acts is directly proportional to the frequency and loudness of their publicly professed disapproval and/or disgust for homosexuality.
If Donald Trump accuses an individual of malfeasance without evidence, it is almost a certainty either he or someone associated with him has in fact committed that very same malfeasance to a greater degree.

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Page
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Left-Leaning College State

Postby Page » Tue Nov 13, 2018 9:32 am

Arouran wrote:Let's see the undercover videos around this country like Texas show proof of the dumbass liberal saying they let all daca illegals vote,any state that allows Sanctuary protection for the peasants who drain the taxpayers with welfare like California,New York.Don t deny that it's not true. Stupid snowflake liberals who easily get offended by facts,well they make people in this country sick.


You don't need a hidden video. I'm for giving all DACA people citizenship and thus the right to vote, I'll grab a megaphone and shout it from the rooftops. Sanctuary cities too.
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Post War America
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Founded: Sep 05, 2010
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Post War America » Tue Nov 13, 2018 9:38 am

NS Miami Shores wrote:
Page wrote:
American politics is a battle in which Cersei Lannister types excel, liberals aren't going to win until they stop being Ned Stark.

It's time for the Dems to be abrasive and land low blows.

I would call them hard blows, oh Please like both sides have not done so in the past, and I think I don't have to prove that, and what according to me and many others they did to Brett Kavanaugh.


An appointee to a permanent governmental position as influential as SCOTUS justice should be beyond reproach. Kavanaugh clearly was not. I get the value of innocent until proven guilty, but he wasn't being tried in a criminal court, he was being questioned as to his qualifications for being given a high level permanent government position. Even if he didn't sexually assault anyone, there is also the matter of him perjuring himself in front of a senatorial commission, something that Republicans deemed sufficiently criminal to try and impeach a president of. But of course Kavanaugh's a conservative so he obviously did nothing wrong.
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Page
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Postby Page » Tue Nov 13, 2018 9:46 am

The Senate Dems might have stopped Kavanaugh if they were smart enough to play the perjury angle. The rape accusations couldn't be 100% proven or disproved, but he lied under oath. He was asked if he ever got totally shitfaced, he said no, and his drinking buddies confirmed - yeah he got sloshed as you can get.
Antifa Astartes | Ave Luigi | Trans Rights or I Bites | Abolish ICE | Certified 100% Hasbara-proof

In a world ruled by Epsteins and Eichmanns, anarchism is a moral imperative.

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Seangoli
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Posts: 6001
Founded: Sep 24, 2006
Ex-Nation

Postby Seangoli » Tue Nov 13, 2018 9:48 am

Post War America wrote:
NS Miami Shores wrote:I would call them hard blows, oh Please like both sides have not done so in the past, and I think I don't have to prove that, and what according to me and many others they did to Brett Kavanaugh.


An appointee to a permanent governmental position as influential as SCOTUS justice should be beyond reproach. Kavanaugh clearly was not. I get the value of innocent until proven guilty, but he wasn't being tried in a criminal court, he was being questioned as to his qualifications for being given a high level permanent government position. Even if he didn't sexually assault anyone, there is also the matter of him perjuring himself in front of a senatorial commission, something that Republicans deemed sufficiently criminal to try and impeach a president of. But of course Kavanaugh's a conservative so he obviously did nothing wrong.


He also went completely off the rails into a partisan rant. While some.may argue it was justified given the situation assuming innocence, that really doesnt matter. He took the bait and proved he is a partisan hack, which raises huge concerns about his imparriality in future cases. His little rant by itself should have disqualified him, regardless of whether it was justified or not.

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Washington Resistance Army
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Posts: 59216
Founded: Aug 08, 2011
Father Knows Best State

Postby Washington Resistance Army » Tue Nov 13, 2018 9:54 am

Seangoli wrote:
Post War America wrote:
An appointee to a permanent governmental position as influential as SCOTUS justice should be beyond reproach. Kavanaugh clearly was not. I get the value of innocent until proven guilty, but he wasn't being tried in a criminal court, he was being questioned as to his qualifications for being given a high level permanent government position. Even if he didn't sexually assault anyone, there is also the matter of him perjuring himself in front of a senatorial commission, something that Republicans deemed sufficiently criminal to try and impeach a president of. But of course Kavanaugh's a conservative so he obviously did nothing wrong.


He also went completely off the rails into a partisan rant. While some.may argue it was justified given the situation assuming innocence, that really doesnt matter. He took the bait and proved he is a partisan hack, which raises huge concerns about his imparriality in future cases. His little rant by itself should have disqualified him, regardless of whether it was justified or not.


C'mon after Kennedy left there's no impartial justices left on the court. If that was a disqualifying thing we'd have to impeach the entire bench.
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Petrasylvania
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Founded: Oct 20, 2017
Ex-Nation

Postby Petrasylvania » Tue Nov 13, 2018 9:54 am

Page wrote:The Senate Dems might have stopped Kavanaugh if they were smart enough to play the perjury angle. The rape accusations couldn't be 100% proven or disproved, but he lied under oath. He was asked if he ever got totally shitfaced, he said no, and his drinking buddies confirmed - yeah he got sloshed as you can get.

If the Republicans were willing to overlook sexual assault, perjury would be nothing to them as long as they got to own the Dems.
Crimes committed by Muslims will be proof of a pan-Islamic plot and Islam's inherent evil. On the other hand, crimes committed by non-Muslims will merely be the acts of mentally ill lone wolves who do not represent their professed belief system at all.
The probability of someone secretly participating in homosexual acts is directly proportional to the frequency and loudness of their publicly professed disapproval and/or disgust for homosexuality.
If Donald Trump accuses an individual of malfeasance without evidence, it is almost a certainty either he or someone associated with him has in fact committed that very same malfeasance to a greater degree.

New Flag Courtesy of The Realist Polities

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Valgora
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Posts: 6621
Founded: Mar 23, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Valgora » Tue Nov 13, 2018 9:59 am

Washington Resistance Army wrote:
Seangoli wrote:
He also went completely off the rails into a partisan rant. While some.may argue it was justified given the situation assuming innocence, that really doesnt matter. He took the bait and proved he is a partisan hack, which raises huge concerns about his imparriality in future cases. His little rant by itself should have disqualified him, regardless of whether it was justified or not.


C'mon after Kennedy left there's no impartial justices left on the court. If that was a disqualifying thing we'd have to impeach the entire bench.


You know what.... if that's the price of a SCOTUS with impartial justices, then so be it.
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Valgora
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Posts: 6621
Founded: Mar 23, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Valgora » Tue Nov 13, 2018 10:02 am

Post War America wrote:
NS Miami Shores wrote:I would call them hard blows, oh Please like both sides have not done so in the past, and I think I don't have to prove that, and what according to me and many others they did to Brett Kavanaugh.


An appointee to a permanent governmental position as influential as SCOTUS justice should be beyond reproach. Kavanaugh clearly was not. I get the value of innocent until proven guilty, but he wasn't being tried in a criminal court, he was being questioned as to his qualifications for being given a high level permanent government position. Even if he didn't sexually assault anyone, there is also the matter of him perjuring himself in front of a senatorial commission, something that Republicans deemed sufficiently criminal to try and impeach a president of. But of course Kavanaugh's a conservative so he obviously did nothing wrong.


That hearing (or whatever it's called) is kinda part of his job interview if you think about it.
I personally believe that too much time has past to correctly determine whether or not Kavanaugh did commit sexual assault.
However, his conduct during the hearing was not the conduct that we should want from our Supreme Court justices.
Libertarian Syndicalist
Not state capitalist

MT+FanT+some PMT
Multi-species.
Current gov't:
Founded 2023
Currently 2027

DISREGARD NS STATS
Link to factbooks-Forum Factbook-Q&A-Embassy
The Reverend Tim
Ordained Dudeist Priest
IRL Me
Luxemburgist/Syndicalist, brony, metalhead
Valgora =+/-IRL views
8 Values

Pro - Socialism/communism, Palestine, space exploration, left libertarianism, BLM, Gun Rights, LGBTQ, Industrial Hemp
Anti - Trump, Hillary, capitalism, authoritarianism, Gun Control, Police, UN, electric cars, Automation of the workforce
Sometimes, I like to think of myself as the Commie version of Dale Gribble.

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Washington Resistance Army
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 59216
Founded: Aug 08, 2011
Father Knows Best State

Postby Washington Resistance Army » Tue Nov 13, 2018 10:08 am

Valgora wrote:
Washington Resistance Army wrote:
C'mon after Kennedy left there's no impartial justices left on the court. If that was a disqualifying thing we'd have to impeach the entire bench.


You know what.... if that's the price of a SCOTUS with impartial justices, then so be it.


You're never going to get impartial justices though. Both sides pick judges that lean in their favor for a reason.
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Telconi
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Posts: 34903
Founded: Oct 08, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Telconi » Tue Nov 13, 2018 10:08 am

Valgora wrote:
Washington Resistance Army wrote:
C'mon after Kennedy left there's no impartial justices left on the court. If that was a disqualifying thing we'd have to impeach the entire bench.


You know what.... if that's the price of a SCOTUS with impartial justices, then so be it.


There is no price, you can't buy the impossible.
-2.25 LEFT
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PRO:
-Weapons Rights
-Gender Equality
-LGBTQ Rights
-Racial Equality
-Religious Freedom
-Freedom of Speech
-Freedom of Association
-Life
-Limited Government
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ANTI:
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-Sexism
-Bigotry In All Forms
-Government Overreach
-Government Surveillance
-Freedom For Security Social Transactions
-Unnecessary Taxes
-Excessively Specific Government Programs
-Foreign Entanglements
-Religious Extremism
-Fascists Masquerading as "Social Justice Warriors"

"The Constitution is NOT an instrument for the government to restrain the people,it is an instrument for the people to restrain the government-- lest it come to dominate our lives and interests." ~ Patrick Henry

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Post War America
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 8193
Founded: Sep 05, 2010
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Post War America » Tue Nov 13, 2018 10:10 am

Washington Resistance Army wrote:
Valgora wrote:
You know what.... if that's the price of a SCOTUS with impartial justices, then so be it.


You're never going to get impartial justices though. Both sides pick judges that lean in their favor for a reason.


It's almost like appointing justices to a lifetime position via politicians is dumb, or much more importantly, lifetime positions in a democracy (or a Republic if you really want to be a pedantic ass about it) is a terrible idea when the average person will likely be alive for 30+ years after their appointment.
Ceterum autem censeo Carthaginem delendam esse
Proudly Banned from the 10000 Islands
For those who care
A PMT Social Democratic Genepunk/Post Cyberpunk Nation the practices big (atomic) stick diplomacy
Not Post-Apocalyptic
Economic Left: -9.62
Social Libertarian: -6.00
Unrepentant New England Yankee
Gravlen wrote:The famous Bowling Green Massacre is yesterday's news. Today it's all about the Cricket Blue Carnage. Tomorrow it'll be about the Curling Yellow Annihilation.

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San Lumen
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Posts: 98795
Founded: Jul 02, 2009
New York Times Democracy

Postby San Lumen » Tue Nov 13, 2018 10:12 am

Telconi wrote:
San Lumen wrote:
I hope its all of them and the First Order is defeated once and for all.


Really helping your "I care about wveryone, even Republicans" ther Mr. literal fantasy villain references.


Now that one party doesnt control everything believe it or not I do. We had a free and fair election in most states and the people chose.

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Petrasylvania
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Posts: 10647
Founded: Oct 20, 2017
Ex-Nation

Postby Petrasylvania » Tue Nov 13, 2018 10:15 am

Crimes committed by Muslims will be proof of a pan-Islamic plot and Islam's inherent evil. On the other hand, crimes committed by non-Muslims will merely be the acts of mentally ill lone wolves who do not represent their professed belief system at all.
The probability of someone secretly participating in homosexual acts is directly proportional to the frequency and loudness of their publicly professed disapproval and/or disgust for homosexuality.
If Donald Trump accuses an individual of malfeasance without evidence, it is almost a certainty either he or someone associated with him has in fact committed that very same malfeasance to a greater degree.

New Flag Courtesy of The Realist Polities

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Washington Resistance Army
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 59216
Founded: Aug 08, 2011
Father Knows Best State

Postby Washington Resistance Army » Tue Nov 13, 2018 10:16 am

San Lumen wrote:
Telconi wrote:
Really helping your "I care about wveryone, even Republicans" ther Mr. literal fantasy villain references.


Now that one party doesnt control everything believe it or not I do. We had a free and fair election in most states and the people chose.


Man you can just admit you don't care about the other side lol. Your rhetoric already shows that's the case so it's not like anyone is going to think any differently about you.
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Tarsonis
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Posts: 39890
Founded: Sep 20, 2017
Democratic Socialists

Postby Tarsonis » Tue Nov 13, 2018 10:16 am

Valgora wrote:
Post War America wrote:
An appointee to a permanent governmental position as influential as SCOTUS justice should be beyond reproach. Kavanaugh clearly was not. I get the value of innocent until proven guilty, but he wasn't being tried in a criminal court, he was being questioned as to his qualifications for being given a high level permanent government position. Even if he didn't sexually assault anyone, there is also the matter of him perjuring himself in front of a senatorial commission, something that Republicans deemed sufficiently criminal to try and impeach a president of. But of course Kavanaugh's a conservative so he obviously did nothing wrong.


That hearing (or whatever it's called) is kinda part of his job interview if you think about it.
I personally believe that too much time has past to correctly determine whether or not Kavanaugh did commit sexual assault.
However, his conduct during the hearing was not the conduct that we should want from our Supreme Court justices.


You really think anybody would be “calm collected and dignified” in his position?
“Never believe that [fascists] are completely unaware of the absurdity of their replies. They know that their remarks are frivolous, open to challenge. But they are amusing themselves, for it is their adversary who is obliged to use words responsibly, since he believes in words. The [fascists] have the right to play. They even like to play with discourse for, by giving ridiculous reasons, they discredit the seriousness of their interlocutors. They delight in acting in bad faith, since they seek not to persuade by sound argument but to intimidate and disconcert. If you press them too closely, they will abruptly fall silent, loftily indicating by some phrase that the time for argument is past.”
― Jean-Paul Sartre

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San Lumen
Post Kaiser
 
Posts: 98795
Founded: Jul 02, 2009
New York Times Democracy

Postby San Lumen » Tue Nov 13, 2018 10:20 am

Washington Resistance Army wrote:
San Lumen wrote:
Now that one party doesnt control everything believe it or not I do. We had a free and fair election in most states and the people chose.


Man you can just admit you don't care about the other side lol. Your rhetoric already shows that's the case so it's not like anyone is going to think any differently about you.

There are some reasonable Republicans such as Congressman elect Dan Crenshaw of Texas.

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Tarsonis
Post Czar
 
Posts: 39890
Founded: Sep 20, 2017
Democratic Socialists

Postby Tarsonis » Tue Nov 13, 2018 10:21 am

San Lumen wrote:
Washington Resistance Army wrote:
Man you can just admit you don't care about the other side lol. Your rhetoric already shows that's the case so it's not like anyone is going to think any differently about you.

There are some reasonable Republicans such as Congressman elect Dan Crenshaw of Texas.


Define reasonable
“Never believe that [fascists] are completely unaware of the absurdity of their replies. They know that their remarks are frivolous, open to challenge. But they are amusing themselves, for it is their adversary who is obliged to use words responsibly, since he believes in words. The [fascists] have the right to play. They even like to play with discourse for, by giving ridiculous reasons, they discredit the seriousness of their interlocutors. They delight in acting in bad faith, since they seek not to persuade by sound argument but to intimidate and disconcert. If you press them too closely, they will abruptly fall silent, loftily indicating by some phrase that the time for argument is past.”
― Jean-Paul Sartre

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San Lumen
Post Kaiser
 
Posts: 98795
Founded: Jul 02, 2009
New York Times Democracy

Postby San Lumen » Tue Nov 13, 2018 10:24 am

Tarsonis wrote:
San Lumen wrote:There are some reasonable Republicans such as Congressman elect Dan Crenshaw of Texas.


Define reasonable

People who are willing to reach out to the other side and openly want a return to civility and bipartisanship which is what Commander Crenshaw alluded to on SNL.

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Tarsonis
Post Czar
 
Posts: 39890
Founded: Sep 20, 2017
Democratic Socialists

Postby Tarsonis » Tue Nov 13, 2018 10:27 am

San Lumen wrote:
Tarsonis wrote:
Define reasonable

People who are willing to reach out to the other side and openly want a return to civility and bipartisanship which is what Commander Crenshaw alluded to on SNL.


So that would make him 1 of....1
“Never believe that [fascists] are completely unaware of the absurdity of their replies. They know that their remarks are frivolous, open to challenge. But they are amusing themselves, for it is their adversary who is obliged to use words responsibly, since he believes in words. The [fascists] have the right to play. They even like to play with discourse for, by giving ridiculous reasons, they discredit the seriousness of their interlocutors. They delight in acting in bad faith, since they seek not to persuade by sound argument but to intimidate and disconcert. If you press them too closely, they will abruptly fall silent, loftily indicating by some phrase that the time for argument is past.”
― Jean-Paul Sartre

User avatar
Telconi
Post Czar
 
Posts: 34903
Founded: Oct 08, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Telconi » Tue Nov 13, 2018 10:27 am

San Lumen wrote:
Telconi wrote:
Really helping your "I care about wveryone, even Republicans" ther Mr. literal fantasy villain references.


Now that one party doesnt control everything believe it or not I do. We had a free and fair election in most states and the people chose.


Liar.
-2.25 LEFT
-3.23 LIBERTARIAN

PRO:
-Weapons Rights
-Gender Equality
-LGBTQ Rights
-Racial Equality
-Religious Freedom
-Freedom of Speech
-Freedom of Association
-Life
-Limited Government
-Non Interventionism
-Labor Unions
-Environmental Protections
ANTI:
-Racism
-Sexism
-Bigotry In All Forms
-Government Overreach
-Government Surveillance
-Freedom For Security Social Transactions
-Unnecessary Taxes
-Excessively Specific Government Programs
-Foreign Entanglements
-Religious Extremism
-Fascists Masquerading as "Social Justice Warriors"

"The Constitution is NOT an instrument for the government to restrain the people,it is an instrument for the people to restrain the government-- lest it come to dominate our lives and interests." ~ Patrick Henry

User avatar
San Lumen
Post Kaiser
 
Posts: 98795
Founded: Jul 02, 2009
New York Times Democracy

Postby San Lumen » Tue Nov 13, 2018 10:29 am

Telconi wrote:
San Lumen wrote:
Now that one party doesnt control everything believe it or not I do. We had a free and fair election in most states and the people chose.


Liar.

And what makes me a liar?

User avatar
San Lumen
Post Kaiser
 
Posts: 98795
Founded: Jul 02, 2009
New York Times Democracy

Postby San Lumen » Tue Nov 13, 2018 10:29 am

Tarsonis wrote:
San Lumen wrote:People who are willing to reach out to the other side and openly want a return to civility and bipartisanship which is what Commander Crenshaw alluded to on SNL.


So that would make him 1 of....1

Its a start

User avatar
Telconi
Post Czar
 
Posts: 34903
Founded: Oct 08, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Telconi » Tue Nov 13, 2018 10:32 am

San Lumen wrote:
Telconi wrote:
Liar.

And what makes me a liar?


The telling of lies. You have a consistent mindset that people who are supporters of the other party are bad people, you compare them to literal fantasy villains when describing them. What evidence, other than your preposterous insistence, indicates that you care about them one bit?
-2.25 LEFT
-3.23 LIBERTARIAN

PRO:
-Weapons Rights
-Gender Equality
-LGBTQ Rights
-Racial Equality
-Religious Freedom
-Freedom of Speech
-Freedom of Association
-Life
-Limited Government
-Non Interventionism
-Labor Unions
-Environmental Protections
ANTI:
-Racism
-Sexism
-Bigotry In All Forms
-Government Overreach
-Government Surveillance
-Freedom For Security Social Transactions
-Unnecessary Taxes
-Excessively Specific Government Programs
-Foreign Entanglements
-Religious Extremism
-Fascists Masquerading as "Social Justice Warriors"

"The Constitution is NOT an instrument for the government to restrain the people,it is an instrument for the people to restrain the government-- lest it come to dominate our lives and interests." ~ Patrick Henry

Cannot think of a name
Post Czar
 
Posts: 48123
Founded: Antiquity
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Cannot think of a name » Tue Nov 13, 2018 10:32 am

Washington Resistance Army wrote:
San Lumen wrote:
Now that one party doesnt control everything believe it or not I do. We had a free and fair election in most states and the people chose.


Man you can just admit you don't care about the other side lol. Your rhetoric already shows that's the case so it's not like anyone is going to think any differently about you.

Man do I love spending half of these threads reading people tell San Lumen what he believes...
"...I have been gravely disappointed with the white moderate. I have almost reached the regrettable conclusion that the Negro's great stumbling block in the stride toward freedom is not the White Citizen's Council-er or the Ku Klux Klanner, but the white moderate who is more devoted to "order" than to justice; who prefers a negative peace which is the absence of tension to a positive peace which is the presence of justice; who constantly says "I agree with you in the goal you seek, but I can't agree with your methods of direct action;" who paternalistically feels he can set the timetable for another man's freedom; who lives by the myth of time and who constantly advises the Negro to wait until a "more convenient season." -MLK Jr.

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