US Midterm Election Megathread II: The Stretch Run Begins

[Cannot think of a name]

So what we basically have here is another case of "when you're used to privilege, equality feels like oppression."

In all fairness, even Brown doesn't appear to feel like this will actually stand up and didn't appear ready to do it before the Kavanaugh hearings, he just felt that shit was so bad that women needed a win.

Also, in the Great Oppression Olympics having to hire one whole woman to a board is going to effect so few people we could theoretically know all of their names. I'm more or less on the side of 'this isn't probably the best way to solve this problem but for a wrong way to go about it, its pretty meh.'

[Galloism]

So what we basically have here is another case of "when you're used to privilege, equality feels like oppression."

In all fairness, even Brown doesn't appear to feel like this will actually stand up and didn't appear ready to do it before the Kavanaugh hearings, he just felt that shit was so bad that women needed a win.

Also, in the Great Oppression Olympics having to hire one whole woman to a board is going to effect so few people we could theoretically know all of their names. I'm more or less on the side of 'this isn't probably the best way to solve this problem but for a wrong way to go about it, its pretty meh.'

The immediate fallout will be lawsuits. If a woman gets hired for the board, men who applied will sue under the Civil Rights Act. California supplied motive to violate the Civil Rights Act for every company in California.

However, if they fail to hire enough women however, they will face fines from CA.

It’s also fairly likely that women on the board will be viewed as less meritorious as a result of the law.

[Page]

So what we basically have here is another case of "when you're used to privilege, equality feels like oppression."

You wouldnt know what equality is if it slapped you across the face if you offended it.

I can tell you what equality is not. If you have a race where some people are given head starts and others are wearing heavy backpacks that weigh them down, and then in the middle of the race you decide "from now on everything is going to be equal, there will be no more head starts and everyone with a heavy backpack will no longer have to carry it", but then the race merely continues and those who had head starts still benefit from those head starts, that's not equality.

The effects of a history in which disparity was codified into law, tradition, societal norms, and indeed our collective psyche are not so easily done away with. If at exactly 12:00AM Tuesday, we all would abolish those laws, traditions, norms, even our own subconscious biases and decide that everything is equal going forward, you do not have equality at 12:01AM. You do not have equality the next day, week, year, or decade, and you will never have it without addressing the lingering effects of the disparity which shaped us for so long.

[Loben]

You wouldnt know what equality is if it slapped you across the face if you offended it.

I can tell you what equality is not. If you have a race where some people are given head starts and others are wearing heavy backpacks that weigh them down, and then in the middle of the race you decide "from now on everything is going to be equal, there will be no more head starts and everyone with a heavy backpack will no longer have to carry it", but then the race merely continues and those who had head starts still benefit from those head starts, that's not equality.

The effects of a history in which disparity was codified into law, tradition, societal norms, and indeed our collective psyche are not so easily done away with. If at exactly 12:00AM Tuesday, we all would abolish those laws, traditions, norms, even our own subconscious biases and decide that everything is equal going forward, you do not have equality at 12:01AM. You do not have equality the next day, week, year, or decade, and you will never have it without addressing the lingering effects of the disparity which shaped us for so long.

You were never a slave.

I never owned one.

get the fuck over it.

[Cannot think of a name]

I can tell you what equality is not. If you have a race where some people are given head starts and others are wearing heavy backpacks that weigh them down, and then in the middle of the race you decide "from now on everything is going to be equal, there will be no more head starts and everyone with a heavy backpack will no longer have to carry it", but then the race merely continues and those who had head starts still benefit from those head starts, that's not equality.

The effects of a history in which disparity was codified into law, tradition, societal norms, and indeed our collective psyche are not so easily done away with. If at exactly 12:00AM Tuesday, we all would abolish those laws, traditions, norms, even our own subconscious biases and decide that everything is equal going forward, you do not have equality at 12:01AM. You do not have equality the next day, week, year, or decade, and you will never have it without addressing the lingering effects of the disparity which shaped us for so long.

You were never a slave.

I never owned one.

get the fuck over it.

Meanwhile, the south loses their shit when we take down a statue. Only black people need to get over it, the South never needs to get over the Confederacy.

[Galloism]

You wouldnt know what equality is if it slapped you across the face if you offended it.

I can tell you what equality is not. If you have a race where some people are given head starts and others are wearing heavy backpacks that weigh them down, and then in the middle of the race you decide "from now on everything is going to be equal, there will be no more head starts and everyone with a heavy backpack will no longer have to carry it", but then the race merely continues and those who had head starts still benefit from those head starts, that's not equality.

The effects of a history in which disparity was codified into law, tradition, societal norms, and indeed our collective psyche are not so easily done away with. If at exactly 12:00AM Tuesday, we all would abolish those laws, traditions, norms, even our own subconscious biases and decide that everything is equal going forward, you do not have equality at 12:01AM. You do not have equality the next day, week, year, or decade, and you will never have it without addressing the lingering effects of the disparity which shaped us for so long.

And you think forcing inequality at the individual level is the way to get there?

When are you going to propose quotas for female garbage collectors? Power line workers? Fishermen? Other extremely hazardous professions? That’s the only way we’re going to equalize the workplace death gap. And that affects a lot more people than corporate boards.

You in favor of making sure more women die at work to overtake their head start?

[Loben]

You were never a slave.

I never owned one.

get the fuck over it.

Meanwhile, the south loses their shit when we take down a statue. Only black people need to get over it, the South never needs to get over the Confederacy.

why the hell are statues important? just fucking put them on private sites.

[Loben]

I can tell you what equality is not. If you have a race where some people are given head starts and others are wearing heavy backpacks that weigh them down, and then in the middle of the race you decide "from now on everything is going to be equal, there will be no more head starts and everyone with a heavy backpack will no longer have to carry it", but then the race merely continues and those who had head starts still benefit from those head starts, that's not equality.

The effects of a history in which disparity was codified into law, tradition, societal norms, and indeed our collective psyche are not so easily done away with. If at exactly 12:00AM Tuesday, we all would abolish those laws, traditions, norms, even our own subconscious biases and decide that everything is equal going forward, you do not have equality at 12:01AM. You do not have equality the next day, week, year, or decade, and you will never have it without addressing the lingering effects of the disparity which shaped us for so long.

And you think forcing inequality at the individual level is the way to get there?

When are you going to propose quotas for female garbage collectors? Power line workers? Fishermen? Other extremely hazardous professions? That’s the only way we’re going to equalize the workplace death gap. And that affects a lot more people than corporate boards.

You in favor of making sure more women die at work to overtake their head start?

For every man who breaks his back at work, a woman shall be brought in to have her back broken.

Equality.

[Cannot think of a name]

In all fairness, even Brown doesn't appear to feel like this will actually stand up and didn't appear ready to do it before the Kavanaugh hearings, he just felt that shit was so bad that women needed a win.

Also, in the Great Oppression Olympics having to hire one whole woman to a board is going to effect so few people we could theoretically know all of their names. I'm more or less on the side of 'this isn't probably the best way to solve this problem but for a wrong way to go about it, its pretty meh.'

The immediate fallout will be lawsuits. If a woman gets hired for the board, men who applied will sue under the Civil Rights Act.

The balls required to do that I'm going to guess will happen in Silicon Valley. Though it seems more likely that it will be a company challenging penalties from non compliance that will strike down the law more than anything.

California supplied motive to violate the Civil Rights Act for every company in California.

eeeeehhhhh

However, if they fail to hire enough women however, they will face fines from CA.

Which they'll challenge and that will be how they go after the law, you know, instead of finding the guy who wants to be the face of 'women ain't as good as me'.

It’s also fairly likely that women on the board will be viewed as less meritorious as a result of the law.

As a result of the law or just, you know, the regular lingering feelings about women in the workplace that were already in place...who can tell the difference.

[Cannot think of a name]

Meanwhile, the south loses their shit when we take down a statue. Only black people need to get over it, the South never needs to get over the Confederacy.

why the hell are statues important? just fucking put them on private sites.

Don't ask me, I'm not the one driving Challengers into crowds of people over it...

[Page]

I can tell you what equality is not. If you have a race where some people are given head starts and others are wearing heavy backpacks that weigh them down, and then in the middle of the race you decide "from now on everything is going to be equal, there will be no more head starts and everyone with a heavy backpack will no longer have to carry it", but then the race merely continues and those who had head starts still benefit from those head starts, that's not equality.

The effects of a history in which disparity was codified into law, tradition, societal norms, and indeed our collective psyche are not so easily done away with. If at exactly 12:00AM Tuesday, we all would abolish those laws, traditions, norms, even our own subconscious biases and decide that everything is equal going forward, you do not have equality at 12:01AM. You do not have equality the next day, week, year, or decade, and you will never have it without addressing the lingering effects of the disparity which shaped us for so long.

And you think forcing inequality at the individual level is the way to get there?

When are you going to propose quotas for female garbage collectors? Power line workers? Fishermen? Other extremely hazardous professions? That’s the only way we’re going to equalize the workplace death gap. And that affects a lot more people than corporate boards.

You in favor of making sure more women die at work to overtake their head start?

I wasn't making a case for quotas, I was making a case for social justice in general. That doesn't necessarily have to involve job quotas. And I was not only speaking about women's issues but all disparity in our society. And I am of the opinion that gender equality is intertwined with the class war. I am not worrying if a female hedge fund manager is getting as rich as her male counterpart; I am not concerned with quotas for our capitalist system but rather confronting the entire system.

[Loben]

why the hell are statues important? just fucking put them on private sites.

Don't ask me, I'm not the one driving Challengers into crowds of people over it...

Yes that was me.

[Loben]

And you think forcing inequality at the individual level is the way to get there?

When are you going to propose quotas for female garbage collectors? Power line workers? Fishermen? Other extremely hazardous professions? That’s the only way we’re going to equalize the workplace death gap. And that affects a lot more people than corporate boards.

You in favor of making sure more women die at work to overtake their head start?

I wasn't making a case for quotas, I was making a case for social justice in general. That doesn't necessarily have to involve job quotas. And I was not only speaking about women's issues but all disparity in our society. And I am of the opinion that gender equality is intertwined with the class war. I am not worrying if a female hedge fund manager is getting as rich as her male counterpart; I am not concerned with quotas for our capitalist system but rather confronting the entire system.

Oh dear god, one of these people.

[Spoiled Lunch]

I can tell you what equality is not. If you have a race where some people are given head starts and others are wearing heavy backpacks that weigh them down, and then in the middle of the race you decide "from now on everything is going to be equal, there will be no more head starts and everyone with a heavy backpack will no longer have to carry it", but then the race merely continues and those who had head starts still benefit from those head starts, that's not equality.

The effects of a history in which disparity was codified into law, tradition, societal norms, and indeed our collective psyche are not so easily done away with. If at exactly 12:00AM Tuesday, we all would abolish those laws, traditions, norms, even our own subconscious biases and decide that everything is equal going forward, you do not have equality at 12:01AM. You do not have equality the next day, week, year, or decade, and you will never have it without addressing the lingering effects of the disparity which shaped us for so long.

You were never a slave.

I never owned one.

get the fuck over it.

Slavery was abolished only 5-6 generations ago. That's not a long time in the grand scheme of things.

It's also important to keep in mind that the abolishment of slavery was only the first of many steps that the US has taken towards greater racial equality.

[Cannot think of a name]

Don't ask me, I'm not the one driving Challengers into crowds of people over it...

Yes that was me.

That was an odd stretch to make.

[Loben]

Yes that was me.

That was an odd stretch to make.

i know.

[Galloism]

The immediate fallout will be lawsuits. If a woman gets hired for the board, men who applied will sue under the Civil Rights Act.

The balls required to do that I'm going to guess will happen in Silicon Valley. Though it seems more likely that it will be a company challenging penalties from non compliance that will strike down the law more than anything.

Legal trolls are a thing. They’re also quite effective.

California supplied motive to violate the Civil Rights Act for every company in California.

eeeeehhhhh

Avoiding fines isn’t a motive?

However, if they fail to hire enough women however, they will face fines from CA.

Which they'll challenge and that will be how they go after the law, you know, instead of finding the guy who wants to be the face of 'women ain't as good as me'.

A lawsuit is also likely on this front.

It’s also fairly likely that women on the board will be viewed as less meritorious as a result of the law.

As a result of the law or just, you know, the regular lingering feelings about women in the workplace that were already in place...who can tell the difference.

Actually we can tell. We studied it. It was in the context of race not sex, but we found that affirmative action actually increases the effects of racism. We had some colleges that used race based admissions vs those that didn’t, and racism and racial isolation on campus increased in the wake of affirmative action policies.

The theory is that people observed the beneficiaries of the affirmative action (in the extant case, black students) were on average less qualified than the white and Asian students. Because human thinking is more guesswork and statistics than it should be, this led to “black students are less helpful study partners” without the “average” qualification. This led to more racial segregation and racism on campus.

It’s done with the best of intent, but it actually results in blowback on the people it’s trying to help.

[Loben]

You were never a slave.

I never owned one.

get the fuck over it.

Slavery was abolished only 5-6 generations ago. That's not a long time in the grand scheme of things.

It's also important to keep in mind that the abolishment of slavery was only the first of many steps that the US has taken towards greater racial equality.

then came jim Crow.

which was bullshit.

Even bigger bullshit.

[Galloism]

And you think forcing inequality at the individual level is the way to get there?

When are you going to propose quotas for female garbage collectors? Power line workers? Fishermen? Other extremely hazardous professions? That’s the only way we’re going to equalize the workplace death gap. And that affects a lot more people than corporate boards.

You in favor of making sure more women die at work to overtake their head start?

I wasn't making a case for quotas, I was making a case for social justice in general. That doesn't necessarily have to involve job quotas. And I was not only speaking about women's issues but all disparity in our society. And I am of the opinion that gender equality is intertwined with the class war. I am not worrying if a female hedge fund manager is getting as rich as her male counterpart; I am not concerned with quotas for our capitalist system but rather confronting the entire system.

Class lines are a lot more relevant than gender lines. Men make up both the majority of CEOs and the homeless. Women tend to be clustered toward the middle.

It’s not correct to say men are privileged in everything, or even economics. It is also not correct to say women are privileged in the same.

California is mandating a sexist quota to try and force companies to violate the civil rights act. That’s what we were talking about.

[Cannot think of a name]

The balls required to do that I'm going to guess will happen in Silicon Valley. Though it seems more likely that it will be a company challenging penalties from non compliance that will strike down the law more than anything.

Legal trolls are a thing. They’re also quite effective.

Great. Not a lot of stakes in how it gets challenged first, I don't really care that much. It doesn't actually matter.

eeeeehhhhh

Avoiding fines isn’t a motive?

Oh, that's what you were going for...even more eeeeeehhhhhhhhhhh

Which they'll challenge and that will be how they go after the law, you know, instead of finding the guy who wants to be the face of 'women ain't as good as me'.

A lawsuit is also likely on this front.

The more likely one, I would say. But again...it doesn't matter. It's like picking which rubber ducky will make it down the stream faster...

As a result of the law or just, you know, the regular lingering feelings about women in the workplace that were already in place...who can tell the difference.

Actually we can tell. We studied it. It was in the context of race not sex, but we found that affirmative action actually increases the effects of racism. We had some colleges that used race based admissions vs those that didn’t, and racism and racial isolation on campus increased in the wake of affirmative action policies.

The theory is that people observed the beneficiaries of the affirmative action (in the extant case, black students) were on average less qualified than the white and Asian students. Because human thinking is more guesswork and statistics than it should be, this led to “black students are less helpful study partners” without the “average” qualification. This led to more racial segregation and racism on campus.

It’s done with the best of intent, but it actually results in blowback on the people it’s trying to help.

I'd ask for a source but then we'll just toilet bowl the thread since it's not about California, Brown (who is not up for reelection), sexism, affirmative action, or the glass ceiling. It's all a tangential that was supposed to prove that electing Democrats to control a state made it into a hellscape. And this was the best that anyone came up with...California getting a dozen women hired somewhere as the worst thing ever. Let's just grant it's a 'bad thing'...still not the most compelling support for the premise.

[Galloism]

Legal trolls are a thing. They’re also quite effective.

Great. Not a lot of stakes in how it gets challenged first, I don't really care that much. It doesn't actually matter.

Avoiding fines isn’t a motive?

Oh, that's what you were going for...even more eeeeeehhhhhhhhhhh

A lawsuit is also likely on this front.

The more likely one, I would say. But again...it doesn't matter. It's like picking which rubber ducky will make it down the stream faster...

Actually we can tell. We studied it. It was in the context of race not sex, but we found that affirmative action actually increases the effects of racism. We had some colleges that used race based admissions vs those that didn’t, and racism and racial isolation on campus increased in the wake of affirmative action policies.

The theory is that people observed the beneficiaries of the affirmative action (in the extant case, black students) were on average less qualified than the white and Asian students. Because human thinking is more guesswork and statistics than it should be, this led to “black students are less helpful study partners” without the “average” qualification. This led to more racial segregation and racism on campus.

It’s done with the best of intent, but it actually results in blowback on the people it’s trying to help.

I'd ask for a source but then we'll just toilet bowl the thread since it's not about California, Brown (who is not up for reelection), sexism, affirmative action, or the glass ceiling. It's all a tangential that was supposed to prove that electing Democrats to control a state made it into a hellscape. And this was the best that anyone came up with...California getting a dozen women hired somewhere as the worst thing ever. Let's just grant it's a 'bad thing'...still not the most compelling support for the premise.

Oh it’s not a hellscape, but full democrat control isn’t a paradise. Bad shit happens in government a lot

And it’s not “a dozen women hired somewhere”, but hundreds of men being discriminated against on the basis of gender under penalty of law, and hundreds of women viewed as lesser because quotas blow back on the people they’re intended to help.

[Spoiled Lunch]

If the Democrats take the House, what are the chances of Trump declaring the election rigged or illegitimate? Also, will the House investigation into Russian election influence be reopened?

[Ifreann]

If the Democrats take the House, what are the chances of Trump declaring the election rigged or illegitimate?

I fully expect Trump to call the election rigged before the final result is in, and then either double down or pretend he never said it depending on how the Republicans do.

[Galloism]

If the Democrats take the House, what are the chances of Trump declaring the election rigged or illegitimate?

I fully expect Trump to call the election rigged before the final result is in, and then either double down or pretend he never said it depending on how the Republicans do.

This here. Gotta hedge his bets.

[Vassenor]

If the Democrats take the House, what are the chances of Trump declaring the election rigged or illegitimate? Also, will the House investigation into Russian election influence be reopened?

He's already going on about how China is rigging the election in the Dems' favour.