Gun Control III - the Gunnening

[Constitutional Technocracy of Minecraft]

No, I'm saying the average totally-not-going-to-shoot-up-a-school American should not have access to machineguns. Are you OK with a Navy SEAL having a machinegun? Are you OK with a hardened criminal having a machinegun?

Yes, and yes.

Think what each person would use their gun for

[Greater Cesnica]

Are you sure about that? China and India both have greater numbers of enlisted personnel. China and Russia are working on technological advancements to rival the U.S, and Russia currently has the fastest missile on Earth. It's 360 million+ v.s about 1.5 million.

1. The size and technological capability of the Chinese, Russian and Indian militaries does not make the US military any smaller or less technologically advanced.
2. Manpower doesn't really give an advantage anymore in modern wars. Nowadays, long-range weaponry and cyberwarfare capability are becoming increasingly important in warfare. Plus, average American citizens do not have access to military vehicles.
3. The US military has a larger budget than the next 10 strongest militaries on Earth combined

Machineguns encompass a vast array of weaponry, my good sir. From SMGs to Gatling Guns on Navy ships and helicopters.

Doesn't invalidate my point

1. Russia has greater long-range strike capability, and China has a greater cyber-warfare capability.
2. Do you expect criminals to abide by gun laws that prohibit machine guns?
3. I mean, they do, it's just they don't usually go out to buy them.

[Licana]

Do you believe American citizens should be in possession of weapons like M4A1 Carbines, or M134 rotary miniguns?

No. Quite frankly, machineguns are not designed to defend you against a killer/rapist/burglar. Machineguns are designed to kill as many people as possible in combat in as short a space of time as possible.

That hasn't been the role of "machine guns" since about the 1920s.

And no, the people will not be able to rise up against the government even if they had all the guns they wanted, as the US military is the largest and most technologically advanced military in the world.

It also has a fairly mediocre record against partisan-style opposition.

[Greater Cesnica]

Yes, and yes.

Think what each person would use their gun for

You're not getting the point here. The hardened criminal doesn't give a flying fuck about gun regulations. He/she probably already has full-auto rifles from the black market.

[Northeast American Federation]

It also has a fairly mediocre record against partisan-style opposition.

Ironic, considering the origins of the US.

[Washington Resistance Army]

Plenty of citizens have working military vehicles.

ffs there's working main battle tanks on the civilian market

Doesn't mean many people have them. And quite frankly, who would win? 10,000 gun-toting Americans or an F-35?

The former pretty much every time because F-35's and such things are ass at COIN and asymmetrical warfare. You can't shock and awe your way through an insurgency.

[Grinning Dragon]

Yes, and yes.

Think what each person would use their gun for

Both would use the tool for the same reason, to shoot offensively or defensively. It still doesn't change my mind.

[Corantia]

Plenty of citizens have working military vehicles.

ffs there's working main battle tanks on the civilian market

Doesn't mean many people have them. And quite frankly, who would win? 10,000 gun-toting Americans or an F-35?

10,000 gun toting Americans bum-rushing the airbase.

[Greater Cesnica]

Plenty of citizens have working military vehicles.

ffs there's working main battle tanks on the civilian market

Doesn't mean many people have them. And quite frankly, who would win? 10,000 gun-toting Americans or an F-35?

The F-35 is a fucking turkey that has the maneuvering agility of an obese motorized-scooter bound redneck.

10000 gun-toting Americans could shoot it down probably.

[Constitutional Technocracy of Minecraft]

Doesn't mean many people have them. And quite frankly, who would win? 10,000 gun-toting Americans or an F-35?

10,000 gun toting Americans bum-rushing the airbase.

Let's say the F-35 is in the air, fully armed, when the fight begins

[Constitutional Technocracy of Minecraft]

Doesn't mean many people have them. And quite frankly, who would win? 10,000 gun-toting Americans or an F-35?

The F-35 is a fucking turkey that has the maneuvering agility of an obese motorized-scooter bound redneck.

It still has the ability to #rek any gun-toting American on the ground. Sorry, but fighter jets are far, far superior to individual humans.

[Greater Cesnica]

10,000 gun toting Americans bum-rushing the airbase.

Let's say the F-35 is in the air, fully armed, when the fight begins

10000 gun-toting Americans are going to be smart enough to not bunch up. The F-35 only has so much ammunition and payload.

[Corantia]

10,000 gun toting Americans bum-rushing the airbase.

Let's say the F-35 is in the air, fully armed, when the fight begins

Then the 10,000 hide in the trees, in buildings, ect

[Washington Resistance Army]

The F-35 is a fucking turkey that has the maneuvering agility of an obese motorized-scooter bound redneck.

It still has the ability to #rek any gun-toting American on the ground. Sorry, but fighter jets are far, far superior to individual humans.

It also has the ability to #rek all of main street with tons of collateral damage and sway tons of people to the insurgent side.

[Greater Cesnica]

The F-35 is a fucking turkey that has the maneuvering agility of an obese motorized-scooter bound redneck.

It still has the ability to #rek any gun-toting American on the ground. Sorry, but fighter jets are far, far superior to individual humans.

But does it? It has flawed targeting systems.

[Greater Cesnica]

The F-35 is a fucking turkey that has the maneuvering agility of an obese motorized-scooter bound redneck.

It still has the ability to #rek any gun-toting American on the ground. Sorry, but fighter jets are far, far superior to individual humans.

Dude the F-35 can be shot down with a Javelin Stinger launcher.


A JAVELIN Stinger FREAKING LAUNCHER.

[Constitutional Technocracy of Minecraft]

1. The size and technological capability of the Chinese, Russian and Indian militaries does not make the US military any smaller or less technologically advanced.
2. Manpower doesn't really give an advantage anymore in modern wars. Nowadays, long-range weaponry and cyberwarfare capability are becoming increasingly important in warfare. Plus, average American citizens do not have access to military vehicles.
3. The US military has a larger budget than the next 10 strongest militaries on Earth combined

Doesn't invalidate my point

1. Russia has greater long-range strike capability, and China has a greater cyber-warfare capability.
2. Do you expect criminals to abide by gun laws that prohibit machine guns?
3. I mean, they do, it's just they don't usually go out to buy them.

OTHER NATIONS HAVING GREATER MILITARY CAPABILITIES THAN THE UNITED STATES DOES NOT MAKE THE US MILITARY ANY LESS CAPABLE. Let's say person A, who is holding a knife, is trying to fight person B, who has a machine gun. Does person C, who has a rocket launcher but has nothing to do with the fight, make it any more likely for person A to win? No.

[The Empire of Pretantia]

Do you believe American citizens should be in possession of weapons like M4A1 Carbines, or M134 rotary miniguns?

No. Quite frankly, machineguns are not designed to defend you against a killer/rapist/burglar.

PDWs are :\

Machineguns are designed to kill as many people as possible in combat in as short a space of time as possible.

Not entirely correct, even within the scope of military weaponry. Excluding submachine guns, many modern machine guns are designed with suppressing fire in mind. It's one reason why we use the SAW despite it using a "piddly" 5.56.

Other machine guns, like MA FUCKING DEUCE, are designed to defeat lightly armored and soft-skinned materiel.

And no, the people will not be able to rise up against the government even if they had all the guns they wanted, as the US military is the largest and most technologically advanced military in the world.

And we've been getting our asses kicked by some troglodytes in all those Bumfuckistans.

No age, everyone has a right to defend themselves with the most efficient weapon possible

Do you believe American citizens should be in possession of weapons like M4A1 Carbines, or M134 rotary miniguns?

I mean, the Swiss already do that.

Think what each person would use their gun for

You're not getting the point here. The hardened criminal doesn't give a flying fuck about gun regulations. He/she probably already has full-auto rifles from the black market.

I think WRA has a source about that somewhere. Or maybe someone else.

Plenty of citizens have working military vehicles.

ffs there's working main battle tanks on the civilian market

Doesn't mean many people have them. And quite frankly, who would win? 10,000 gun-toting Americans or an F-35?

10,000 gun-toting Americans. The F-35 simply does not have the ammunition or the fuel to kill them all. With a number like that they could even potentially overrun an airbase.

>shouldn't own machine guns because lots o kill rate
>US military has lots o people in it
Umm, ok? Do you not see an issue here?
Yes machine guns are quite capable for defense as well as offense, any weapon that is available for defense is better than no weapon.
Yes machine guns should be as easy to buy as any semi-auto/single shot firearm. No there shouldn't be any age restrictions on buying firearms. Are there age restrictions on other enumerated negative rights?

No, I'm saying the average totally-not-going-to-shoot-up-a-school American should not have access to machineguns.

Why not?

Are you OK with a Navy SEAL having a machinegun?

Why wouldn't I be?

Are you OK with a hardened criminal having a machinegun?

We have the right idea about criminals and guns already.

Are you sure about that? China and India both have greater numbers of enlisted personnel. China and Russia are working on technological advancements to rival the U.S, and Russia currently has the fastest missile on Earth. It's 360 million+ v.s about 1.5 million.

1. The size and technological capability of the Chinese, Russian and Indian militaries does not make the US military any smaller or less technologically advanced.
2. Manpower doesn't really give an advantage anymore in modern wars.

Factually incorrect. The ability to be everywhere is a massive advantage.

Plus, average American citizens do not have access to military vehicles.

Yes they do.

Doesn't invalidate my point

Uh, yeah it does.

20% of US Army officers resigned in 1861.

Boy, was the North in for a long five years!

[Constitutional Technocracy of Minecraft]

It still has the ability to #rek any gun-toting American on the ground. Sorry, but fighter jets are far, far superior to individual humans.

Dude the F-35 can be shot down with a Javelin launcher.


A JAVELIN FREAKING LAUNCHER.

Ok, let's say an F-16 then.

[Greater Cesnica]

Dude the F-35 can be shot down with a Javelin launcher.


A JAVELIN FREAKING LAUNCHER.

Ok, let's say an F-16 then.

F-16 jets have limited ammunition and payload capacity.

[Washington Resistance Army]

I think WRA has a source about that somewhere. Or maybe someone else.

Less a source and more anecdotes I've heard from ATF agents. Most of the breakdowns of the types of guns used in crime I've seen are too simplistic to break things down into any real categories beyond "pistol", "shotgun" and "rifle".

[Licana]

Doesn't mean many people have them. And quite frankly, who would win? 10,000 gun-toting Americans or an F-35?

>Senator Asshat McClown gets sniped stepping out of his limo
>deploy the F-35!
>sniper packed his rifle and left minutes after the shooting, is gone hours before the F-35 arrives

>4 guys with converted ARs and masks firebomb a federal building
>deploy the F-35
>4 guys ditch their weapons and take off their masks, looks like everyone else in the city

>Fuel convoy sets out to refuel F-35s
>ambushed by IEDs and waiting partisans
>deploy the F-35
>partisans cache their weapons, look like everyone else
>fuel never makes it to base
>have to ground half of the F-35s to continue operations

I'll take 10,000 dudes over your facebook-tier meme anytime.

[The Empire of Pretantia]

Dude the F-35 can be shot down with a Javelin launcher.


A JAVELIN FREAKING LAUNCHER.

Ok, let's say an F-16 then.

What the fuck does that change? Do you even know what the difference between them is?

[Greater Cesnica]

Ok, let's say an F-16 then.

What the fuck does that change? Do you even know what the difference between them is?

I don't think he does.

[The Empire of Pretantia]

The F-35 is a fucking turkey that has the maneuvering agility of an obese motorized-scooter bound redneck.

It still has the ability to #rek any gun-toting American on the ground. Sorry, but fighter jets are far, far superior to individual humans.

But you just said it wasn't individual humans. You said it was 10,000.