Karultural Merkel's downfall was forgetting about hoomint nature!
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by Torrocca » Mon Feb 05, 2018 4:44 pm
by Orostan » Mon Feb 05, 2018 5:01 pm
Aramtal Urla Credets wrote:Best Ism is Minarchism.
Communists just ignore human nature so do primtivists
Socialism is a sham
“It is difficult for me to imagine what “personal liberty” is enjoyed by an unemployed hungry person. True freedom can only be where there is no exploitation and oppression of one person by another; where there is not unemployment, and where a person is not living in fear of losing his job, his home and his bread. Only in such a society personal and any other freedom can exist for real and not on paper.” -J. V. STALIN
Ernest Hemingway wrote:Anyone who loves freedom owes such a debt to the Red Army that it can never be repaid.
Napoleon Bonaparte wrote:“To understand the man you have to know what was happening in the world when he was twenty.”
Cicero wrote:"In times of war, the laws fall silent"
by Grenartia » Mon Feb 05, 2018 5:24 pm
by Kubra » Mon Feb 05, 2018 5:42 pm
>primitivism ignores human natureAramtal Urla Credets wrote:Best Ism is Minarchism.
Communists just ignore human nature so do primtivists
Socialism is a sham
by Grenartia » Mon Feb 05, 2018 5:50 pm
by 36 Camera Perspective » Mon Feb 05, 2018 6:47 pm
by UniversalCommons » Mon Feb 05, 2018 7:43 pm
Chestaan wrote:UniversalCommons wrote:Tell me, if 47% of jobs are replaceable in the next decade with automation and this number will increase in the coming years, why is that not discussed as a major economic issue. It can't be solved with the standard models. Socialism does not have answer for when capital replaces labor which is happening right now. In the socialist system and communist system labor is supposed to replace capital, but it is not what is happening in the world. The opposite is happening. The way things are going, there will be far fewer workers, just like there are far fewer farmers. Only a small amount of workers will be needed to produce all the goods and services, just like only a few farmers grow food in the industrialized countries. There will not be enough workers to have a workers state... What emerges will be different.
Isn't that exactly what Marx predicted? An ever-growing pool of unemployed labour leading to the inevitable proletarian revolt?
by Kubra » Mon Feb 05, 2018 8:44 pm
>Marx did not predict that when there stopped being many farms and most of the farmers moved to the city and became laborersUniversalCommons wrote:Chestaan wrote:
Isn't that exactly what Marx predicted? An ever-growing pool of unemployed labour leading to the inevitable proletarian revolt?
Marx did not predict that when there stopped being many farms and most of the farmers moved to the city and became laborers. Now we have laborers who no longer identify with labor and instead come up with things like creatives and service workers. The essential ideal is that the laborers do not identify as labor, but something else which ultimately will lead to something else entirely in a situation where you can produce far more than people can consume. Cross out the word and proletarian------ and put something else in its place. and you end up with revolt--- but what kind-- the first test case was the Occupy Wall Street and that was something else, not quite a revolt. You get a revolution. Assuming the revolution is by the people, you are more likely to get the Ukranian exampe-- eg we want non-corrupt officials that will do what we ask and follow our votes-- than a proletarian revolution. Maybe they will demand a Universal Basic Income or some kind of access to technologies that will be able to make most common goods up to the size of a refrigerator cheaply in a local shop. It will probably be a demand for government that is completely responsive to the people.
A political party will not be able to control the next revolution, many of the common people will be more educated than the leadership of the country in question or the leadership of political parties. To run the machinery of every day life require more and more complex technologies which requires greater and greater education.
by Torrocca » Wed Feb 07, 2018 3:22 am
Kubra wrote:>Marx did not predict that when there stopped being many farms and most of the farmers moved to the city and became laborersUniversalCommons wrote:
Marx did not predict that when there stopped being many farms and most of the farmers moved to the city and became laborers. Now we have laborers who no longer identify with labor and instead come up with things like creatives and service workers. The essential ideal is that the laborers do not identify as labor, but something else which ultimately will lead to something else entirely in a situation where you can produce far more than people can consume. Cross out the word and proletarian------ and put something else in its place. and you end up with revolt--- but what kind-- the first test case was the Occupy Wall Street and that was something else, not quite a revolt. You get a revolution. Assuming the revolution is by the people, you are more likely to get the Ukranian exampe-- eg we want non-corrupt officials that will do what we ask and follow our votes-- than a proletarian revolution. Maybe they will demand a Universal Basic Income or some kind of access to technologies that will be able to make most common goods up to the size of a refrigerator cheaply in a local shop. It will probably be a demand for government that is completely responsive to the people.
A political party will not be able to control the next revolution, many of the common people will be more educated than the leadership of the country in question or the leadership of political parties. To run the machinery of every day life require more and more complex technologies which requires greater and greater education.
oh you mean like every process of industrialisation to date
I mean, he didn't predict it, given that it was a process more or less completed in Great Britain by the time he began writing Capital.
by Hyperborja » Wed Feb 07, 2018 5:59 am
Valentine Z wrote:
But... seeing Rich Kids of Instagram/Snapchat is a totally different thing, I will say that much.
by Jute » Wed Feb 07, 2018 6:31 am
Italios wrote:Tritos Ellinikos Politismos wrote:What about far right like National Socialism and Fascism? And it's not only these two, there more than a dozen of Far right ideologies that despise Communism, where are they?
Nazism is not anti-capitalist, and though a few strains of fascism might be anti-capitalist (third positionism), being against communism is usually good indicator that something is not anti-capitalist
Carl Sagan, astrophysicist and atheist wrote:"Science is not only compatible with spirituality; it is a profound source of spirituality.
When we recognize our place in an immensity of light-years and in the passage of ages,
when we grasp the intricacy, beauty, and subtlety of life, then that soaring feeling,
that sense of elation and humility combined, is surely spiritual...
The notion that science and spirituality are somehow mutually exclusive does a disservice to both."
Italios wrote:Jute's probably some sort of Robin Hood-type outlaw
"Boys and girls so happy, young and gay / Don't let false worldly joy carry your hearts away."
by Great Minarchistan » Wed Feb 07, 2018 10:45 am
by The Glorious Third Reign of Templedom » Thu Feb 08, 2018 2:00 am
by Kubra » Thu Feb 08, 2018 2:11 am
Given that the the nazi party pretty much solidified the domestic economic and political clout of the large congolmerates, and by extension capital, I'd say they were pretty capitalisticJute wrote:Italios wrote:Nazism is not anti-capitalist, and though a few strains of fascism might be anti-capitalist (third positionism), being against communism is usually good indicator that something is not anti-capitalist
Is this really the common conception here? Being against communism means you can't possibly be anti-capitalist as well? Nazis were known to hate capitalism more than even Bolshevism, just see here or here. In other words, stop with the bull and quit lumping fascism, an explicitly anti-capitalist ideology that arouse from nationalist socialist tendencies, together with Capitalism.
And aside from the far-right, you can also be e.g. an anti-communist and and anti-capitalist (and anti-fascist) socialist.
by Orostan » Thu Feb 08, 2018 4:41 pm
“It is difficult for me to imagine what “personal liberty” is enjoyed by an unemployed hungry person. True freedom can only be where there is no exploitation and oppression of one person by another; where there is not unemployment, and where a person is not living in fear of losing his job, his home and his bread. Only in such a society personal and any other freedom can exist for real and not on paper.” -J. V. STALIN
Ernest Hemingway wrote:Anyone who loves freedom owes such a debt to the Red Army that it can never be repaid.
Napoleon Bonaparte wrote:“To understand the man you have to know what was happening in the world when he was twenty.”
Cicero wrote:"In times of war, the laws fall silent"
by 36 Camera Perspective » Fri Feb 09, 2018 4:19 pm
by Great Minarchistan » Fri Feb 09, 2018 4:33 pm
by Great Minarchistan » Fri Feb 09, 2018 4:49 pm
The Glorious Third Reign of Templedom wrote:Hi again, I remember coming across comments previously on this thread about the dangers of late-stage capitalism, namely, wealth concentration, corporatism, the likes.
The Glorious Third Reign of Templedom wrote:An article about euthanasia smells like -- globalist illuminati freemasonry one-world government new world order depopulation of pesky low-income unskilled uncompetitive westerners
The Glorious Third Reign of Templedom wrote:with heady demands such as rights and/or entitlements bogging down sluggish 1st world societies unable to cope with latw-stage capitalism's ills like rising property prices, rising costs of living, overcrowded cities, low replacement rates, deteriorating climates, droughts, storms, apocalypse
The Glorious Third Reign of Templedom wrote:Now suddenly assisted suicide, abortion, gay marriage, pornography, legalised pot, all make sense.
The Glorious Third Reign of Templedom wrote:>> Let capitalism run its full course and give the poor and destitute a free ticket 'out' (of depression, family obligation, ultimately, out of life itself).
The Glorious Third Reign of Templedom wrote:Perhaps we really should accelerate studies into making a workable model for communism.
by Oil exporting People » Fri Feb 09, 2018 7:58 pm
by Aillyria » Fri Feb 09, 2018 8:07 pm
Conserative Morality wrote:If RWDT were Romans, who would they be?
......
Aillyria would be Claudius. Temper + unwillingness to suffer fools + supporter of the P E O P L E + traditional legalist
West Oros wrote:GOD DAMMIT! I thought you wouldn't be here.
Well you aren't a real socialist. Just a sociopath disguised as one.
Not to mention that this thread split off from LWDT, so I assumed you would think this thread was a "revisionist hellhole".
by Oil exporting People » Fri Feb 09, 2018 8:18 pm
by Kubra » Fri Feb 09, 2018 10:43 pm
lol I mean that's a good question
by Aillyria » Fri Feb 09, 2018 11:40 pm
Oil exporting People wrote:Aillyria wrote:Agreed, I'm not keen on the idea of the whole proletariat becoming a wards of the state. Fuck that.
Not even that, it's just bad policy; there's 320 Million people in America. Now multiple that by 12,000 (1,000 a month), and then compare it to current tax revenue.
Conserative Morality wrote:If RWDT were Romans, who would they be?
......
Aillyria would be Claudius. Temper + unwillingness to suffer fools + supporter of the P E O P L E + traditional legalist
West Oros wrote:GOD DAMMIT! I thought you wouldn't be here.
Well you aren't a real socialist. Just a sociopath disguised as one.
Not to mention that this thread split off from LWDT, so I assumed you would think this thread was a "revisionist hellhole".
by The Glorious Third Reign of Templedom » Sat Feb 10, 2018 12:31 am
Great Minarchistan wrote:How much is too much? (1) We had prolonged periods of massive wealth concentration before (Gilded Age being the main of them) yet no apocalypse whatsoever. Even if it's a true thesis, there is no reason to become scared since global GINI has been decreasing.
You are honestly the first person I have ever seen in my life that somehow links the right of a person to kill itself due to intense medical pain to a NWO illuminati scheme of depopulation. Not that it's working anyway since global population is projected to grow for several more decades. (2)
Deaths due to natural disasters have been decreasing throughout the world for decades. Natural disasters haven't gotten any or much worse than before, although prevention, evacuation and care for the affected improved significantly. (3) On regards to rising property prices, (data for the US) adjusted housing prices increased a mere 45% since 1975 while adjusted GDPpc increased 114% during the same period. (4)
So a more liberal society is a secret plot from illuminatis to kill the bottom 99%. Wew. (5)
Let capitalism run its full course so poverty rates can be dropped dramatically within 30 years while the society gets wealthier as a whole. (6)
I seriously wonder if you have any suitable model that's better than capitalism. (7)
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