Embassy of the South Pacific

[Solorni]

http://w11.zetaboards.com/ns_lazarus/topic/9634735/1/

TSP supported the PRL as far as I can remember.

I consider it an amusing irony that the UIAF was more consistent in its defence of democracy in GCRs than the self proclaimed oldest democracy in NationStates.

The PRL forum is unbrowsable without an account, and giving Milograd my IP isn't really high up on my priority list. You're going to have to copy-paste if you want to convey whatever was in that link.

Oh, it was the TSP non-aggression pact with the PRL but the version on the PRL forums.

[Escade]

Also, if someone could refresh my knowledge... TSP also supported the PRL coup right? If so, does that mean they have always supported the defender coups?

The South Pacific fought against the PRL coup. Our very own General Resentine was there every update for every week they occupied Lazarus, you may contact him to learn more about just who's side we were on ^^

Regarding your first sentence; most people don't sacrifice military gameplay time to fight coups. The SPSF doing what it's obligated to do... well, we have had reliable Generals like Resetine since that long ago, it looks like. Thanks for the historical questions ^_^
I don't often get chances to answer about NShistory since I'm not that old myself <. <

~MoMA

What she said ^

snip

I feel really saddened by your hostility and lack of friendship and cooperation. I can also teach the latter two, since they seem to be novel concepts for some of you

Offer still open! Always willing to share good vibes

My entire FA campaign in TSP has been that FA should be subservient to the needs and interests of the region first and foremost instead of being held hostage to spheres of players who really have stagnated and need some sort of refresh or a new role to play. It is also unfortunate when former allies once again support the same stance that led to the breakdown of relations. What worth is an ally that supports whoever can wrest away a bit of power for whatever transitory period of time?

If any ally of TSP has any questions about our relationship, they should contact me. I'm always willing to dialogue and have enjoyed talking to, planning with, and working with allies.

For those interested in TSP, we hope our recent actions show that as a region we hold our alliances to be more than paper. A treaty is our word and our honor and a commitment that, no matter how difficult it may be, we do not blow any which way when the wind turns but steer a true and clear course.

(Official post re: DM rocking that endo count and info on the party upcoming <3)

[Ever-Wandering Souls]

You keep quoting that same block without really explaining how it's a reply to the questions being asked.

>>"The South Pacific fought against the PRL coup."

Looks like a fact, at least at the start, based on official posts here.

>>TSP had a treaty with the PRL

Also looks like a fact, later on, based on sourced posts here.

>>"A treaty is our word and our honor and a commitment that, no matter how difficult it may be, we do not blow any which way when the wind turns but steer a true and clear course."
>>"What worth is an ally that supports whoever can wrest away a bit of power for whatever transitory period of time? "

Now see, that's the bit that looks a bit fuzzy, given the prior statements, and quoting it ad infinitum when asked about the lack of consistency there...is not explaining the lack of consistency there.

[Solorni]

Perhaps Sean Spicer really did get a new job quickly? This is an amusing albeit hallow routine.

[Escade]

Souls, that's an interesting point - let me look into it further and get a rundown of the entire timeline. I'm more aware of the initial response from when I was here and need to follow up with the period of time I wasn't here. I do believe that any explanation would be reasonable and sensible.

Solorni, I don't think you should attempt to equate members of this thread with Sean Spicer. Possibly a comedian doing a great impression of Spicer, but that level of nonsense only comes about with hypocritical regimes that lack democracy and have stagnated into the same old same old.


If it wasn't clear, this is my MoFA statement as current MoFa in TSP. It's really represents my views as to the purpose and goals of my term. Think of it as a signature for this thread

My entire FA campaign in TSP has been that FA should be subservient to the needs and interests of the region first and foremost instead of being held hostage to spheres of players who really have stagnated and need some sort of refresh or a new role to play. It is also unfortunate when former allies once again support the same stance that led to the breakdown of relations. What worth is an ally that supports whoever can wrest away a bit of power for whatever transitory period of time?

If any ally of TSP has any questions about our relationship, they should contact me. I'm always willing to dialogue and have enjoyed talking to, planning with, and working with allies.

For those interested in TSP, we hope our recent actions show that as a region we hold our alliances to be more than paper. A treaty is our word and our honor and a commitment that, no matter how difficult it may be, we do not blow any which way when the wind turns but steer a true and clear course.

[Ever-Wandering Souls]

I think reposting that with every single post you make as a "signature" regardless of relevance seems a lot like spam

[Solorni]

You were wrong and lied about the PRL Escade. If you do not wish to be compared to Sean Spicer, give earnest and truthful responses in good faith. Instead you've posted very bizarre things and seem to have accidentally (at least I hope accidentally) posted the same thing again and again. Will acknowledge being wrong about TSPs support of the PRL or will you continue to ignore that (which comes across as very Sean Spicer like)?

I'd like to know if TSP plans to use the 'historical friendship' argument (it was used when GR was FA Minister to support the PRL dictatorship) to support this new Lazarus regime?

[Escade]

Souls, it's my statement so its always relevant because its my heartfelt like FA statement. It has my love and heart and soul in it

Solorni, you also haven't answered any of my questions. Please oblige, thank you.

What is Balder's stance on the current coup in Lazarus? Which faction, if any, does Balder support? Did Balder recognize the PRL at any point? Why or why not? Is your concern from TSP coming from a place of wanting to show solidarity? Or maybe Balder hasn't picked a course and needs a nudge? (P.S. I think I pointed out to Souls that I remember the initial response and anything afterwards another TSPer will be clearer on).

Finally, since there are so many questions about Lazarus - as stated earlier, this is our current stance on Lazarus. Before that we offered to mediate between parties (an offer that is technically still open).

(Image)

The Ministry of Foreign Affairs

Statement on Lazarus and Pledge of Support for the Government-in-Exile

Yesterday, the Coalition of the South Pacific offered to mediate between the opposing factions in Lazarus, an offer readily accepted by the faction calling itself "La Resistance", while Delegate Funkadelia requested 24 hours to reply. Unfortunately, in this time, Funkadelia and his supporters have decided to overthrow the Lazarene government and purge significant members of the opposition. With assent of the Cabinet and the General Corps of the South Pacific Special Forces, General Resentine entered the Discord server of the resistance to investigate, and was able to confirm that the accusatory screenshots posted by Killer Kitty are maliciously taken out of context and that the resistance did not attempt a coup of the Lazarene government. It is now unambiguously clear that the aggressors in this conflict are Funkadelia, Killer Kitty (Evil Wolf), and Scum (Lamb Stone).

The actions of Delegate Funkadelia and his faction, namely the extra-judicial and illegal removal as well as defamation of their political opponents, is as unambiguous an example of an illegal coup as it is possible to imagine. Claims to the contrary are nothing but the most transparent attempts at propaganda to disguise this, and no informed and objective individual could conclude otherwise. The "Treaty of Friendship and Cooperation between The South Pacific and Lazarus" is an alliance between the legitimate governments of the South Pacific and Lazarus; the term legitimate can no longer be applied to the regime of Funkadelia for the reasons stated above. The South Pacific does not recognize the government of Funkadelia instated at this last minor update, and pledge our support for the government-in-exile as per Article IV Section 3 of our mutual treaty.

Signed,

Roavin, Prime Minister
Escade, Minister of Foreign Affairs
Yun, Minister of Military Affairs
Drugged Monkeys, Delegate-Elect

[The Sygian]

Thanks for quoting your FA update, with out properly answering questions, but I'll just move along since clearly you don't know how to do your job.

[Escade]

snip

Offer to teach you friendship and cooperation still open

And this is my job and my mandate:

My entire FA campaign in TSP has been that FA should be subservient to the needs and interests of the region first and foremost instead of being held hostage to spheres of players who really have stagnated and need some sort of refresh or a new role to play. It is also unfortunate when former allies once again support the same stance that led to the breakdown of relations. What worth is an ally that supports whoever can wrest away a bit of power for whatever transitory period of time?

If any ally of TSP has any questions about our relationship, they should contact me. I'm always willing to dialogue and have enjoyed talking to, planning with, and working with allies.

For those interested in TSP, we hope our recent actions show that as a region we hold our alliances to be more than paper. A treaty is our word and our honor and a commitment that, no matter how difficult it may be, we do not blow any which way when the wind turns but steer a true and clear course.

[Consular]

http://w11.zetaboards.com/ns_lazarus/topic/9634735/1/

TSP supported the PRL as far as I can remember.

I consider it an amusing irony that the UIAF was more consistent in its defence of democracy in GCRs than the self proclaimed oldest democracy in NationStates.

The PRL forum is unbrowsable without an account, and giving Milograd my IP isn't really high up on my priority list. You're going to have to copy-paste if you want to convey whatever was in that link.

That's odd. When I posted that I could view the treaty just fine as a guest. But now it won't let me.

[Escade]

The PRL forum is unbrowsable without an account, and giving Milograd my IP isn't really high up on my priority list. You're going to have to copy-paste if you want to convey whatever was in that link.

That's odd. When I posted that I could view the treaty just fine as a guest. But now it won't let me.

Yeah, I also don't have access to the TSP forums from that era due to the forum changing twice situation so I can't check until someone with more technical stuff can get me more info. Will get better informed about the historical past once I get access or get a timeline

Still always interested in talking current events and good vibes

[The Sygian]

And this is my job and my mandate:

My entire FA campaign in TSP has been that FA should be subservient to the needs and interests of the region first and foremost instead of being held hostage to spheres of players who really have stagnated and need some sort of refresh or a new role to play. It is also unfortunate when former allies once again support the same stance that led to the breakdown of relations. What worth is an ally that supports whoever can wrest away a bit of power for whatever transitory period of time?

If any ally of TSP has any questions about our relationship, they should contact me. I'm always willing to dialogue and have enjoyed talking to, planning with, and working with allies.

For those interested in TSP, we hope our recent actions show that as a region we hold our alliances to be more than paper. A treaty is our word and our honor and a commitment that, no matter how difficult it may be, we do not blow any which way when the wind turns but steer a true and clear course.

Oh trust me, your job description is burned into my memory for eternity.

I think I, and the rest of the people reading this thread, have seen it enough. I honestly thought it was in your signature until I just realized you were posting it because you don't know how else to answer people when they're asking TSP questions. As MoFA aren't you supposed to answer those questions thoroughly instead of with some cookie-cutter response?

[Escade]

snip

Do you have any real questions (not covered above) or are you just trying to make fun of me for not being as smart as you again? I feel like that judginess is what I mean about "friendship and cooperation." I mean I don't know everything but I always trust people around me to fill in the gaps.

I do admit that sometimes I feel intimidated by all the smart people on NS who are like well-versed in philosophy and political theory and sophisticated lingual gymnastics. But I'm also inspired because I learn so much from people in this game and strive to get better and like soak in the knowledge but also like do my own thing

It's a game, we have different ways to play - not everyone can be the same! (Random feelings like "I had a feeling that I belonged, I had a feeling that ...) - >

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6z8ULyW9HHs

Sleep well angels and demons and assorted malcontents <3

[Foreign Policy Idealists]

I for one am disappointed that the PRL's name is being dragged through the mud. The regime that gave Lazarus its most active period in Lazarene (the fact that that demonym is only from the PRL and the purge of the Imperialists is indeed a testament to the immense legacy of the PRL) history defined and shaped the Lazarene identity long after the regime itself died (Lazarus was, after all, a Defender region until very recently) should not be criticised and insulted as if it was some sort of curse and travesty wrought upon Lazarus. Indeed, it was the very opposite; it was a gift and a blessing, at least in its early days. The domination of the PRL by the NPO is certainly regrettable, but the institutions and ideas that natives like Harmoneia forged should be celebrated, not despised. Did the purge of the Imperialists that enabled the formation of the PRL violate Mandate 7? It did, but was it not a decision that was unanimously supported amongst the loyal natives of Lazarus at the time? Was it not a decision that protected and preserved Lazarene sovereignty from the Imperialists and enabled the most active period Lazarus has ever seen?

Recent events and the fact that insidious forces hailing from the LWU have subverted and infiltrated Lazarus show, now more than ever, the justness and goodness of the actions of Milograd and Feux in regards to the Imperialists; that sometimes certain insidious elements must occasionally be removed and purged if they have been planted in the region in order to assure the continued sovereignty of the region. That was the great lesson of August 2013, and it is regrettable that it has not yet been learned by a great majority of Gameplayers.

In regards to TSP, I do not dispute that TSP, at the time, regrettably opposed the purge of the Imperialists, but the shift in TSP's foreign policy was nothing but an excellent decision to stand for the forces of good in NationStates. It is sad that TSP's current Foreign Minister, whilst no doubt pure of heart and noble in her actions and beliefs, must emphasise TSP's initial opposition to the Imperialist purge and establishment of the PRL rather than the diplomatic rapprochement under Glen-Rhodes.

[The Sygian]

Escade - you fail to understand my point and instead of actually responded to them, you cover it up by accusing me of making fun of you. This is when legislators of TSP should start to question whether or not they elected the right person as Minister of Foreign Affairs.

Though I do appreciate the compliment.

[Warwick Z Codger]

I for one am disappointed that the PRL's name is being dragged through the mud. The regime that gave Lazarus its most active period in Lazarene (the fact that that demonym is only from the PRL and the purge of the Imperialists is indeed a testament to the immense legacy of the PRL) history defined and shaped the Lazarene identity long after the regime itself died (Lazarus was, after all, a Defender region until very recently) should not be criticised and insulted as if it was some sort of curse and travesty wrought upon Lazarus. Indeed, it was the very opposite; it was a gift and a blessing, at least in its early days. The domination of the PRL by the NPO is certainly regrettable, but the institutions and ideas that natives like Harmoneia forged should be celebrated, not despised. Did the purge of the Imperialists that enabled the formation of the PRL violate Mandate 7? It did, but was it not a decision that was unanimously supported amongst the loyal natives of Lazarus at the time? Was it not a decision that protected and preserved Lazarene sovereignty from the Imperialists and enabled the most active period Lazarus has ever seen?

Recent events and the fact that insidious forces hailing from the LWU have subverted and infiltrated Lazarus show, now more than ever, the justness and goodness of the actions of Milograd and Feux in regards to the Imperialists; that sometimes certain insidious elements must occasionally be removed and purged if they have been planted in the region in order to assure the continued sovereignty of the region. That was the great lesson of August 2013, and it is regrettable that it has not yet been learned by a great majority of Gameplayers.

In regards to TSP, I do not dispute that TSP, at the time, regrettably opposed the purge of the Imperialists, but the shift in TSP's foreign policy was nothing but an excellent decision to stand for the forces of good in NationStates. It is sad that TSP's current Foreign Minister, whilst no doubt pure of heart and noble in her actions and beliefs, must emphasise TSP's initial opposition to the Imperialist purge and establishment of the PRL rather than the diplomatic rapprochement under Glen-Rhodes.

For better or worse, the PRL did drag Lazarus to modern gameplay, just as the post Sedge coup in TSP and Nail did to TRR after Kandy.

In all three cases it from sleeply places where people just hung out (which if officially there is a government on paper) to places with dynamic governments, interactions and politics.

Edit: For TEP I blame AMOM, Hobbes, Rameus and Xoriet.

TNP is always the centre of attention as is Osiris.

TWP and The Pacific always seems kinda seperate and Balder....???

Edit edit: Maybe I can conflating 'modern gameplay' with isolatism...or francoist vs cosmopolitan

[The Resentine Kingdom]

My apologies to everyone for all this confusion, because it's mostly my fault.

Last night when I read Queen Sorolini's initial question back on page five, I was already rather tired and frustrated from the day's events and read "PRL" as "NLO".
I felt that I was not in a too diplomatic state, so I sent my frustrations to Escade to vent, believing that we were discussing the NLO, not the PRL.
Hence, I created confusing statements on both the part of the MoFA and the SPSF, indicating we fought against the PRL, when I wouldn't have even been around at the time the PRL was founded.
So, any confusion on TSP's part here is mostly my fault because I was venting my frustration through them and expected some sort of result, all because my head wasn't quite clicking with the right abbreviations.

So, to answer Sorolini's original question: I don't know about TSP's military or political activities when the PRL coup happened, because I wasn't there. However, by the time I joined NS, approximately 1 month before the NLO coup, we did have a Non-aggression treaty of some sort with them, which played a role in our decision to support them against the NLO. If there are any more questions, feel free to ask.

And again, my apologies for the confusion. I wasn't thinking or reading clearly when I talked to Escade and convinced her to do this for me.

-Resentine

[Killer Kitty]

Before that we offered to mediate between parties (an offer that is technically still open).

I don't think The South Pacific can be allowed to pretend to play peacemaker while, at the same time, pledging your support for the coup and sending your military in to attack Lazarus.

Mediation doesn't typically work that way.

[The Glorious Hypetrain]

Before that we offered to mediate between parties (an offer that is technically still open).

I don't think The South Pacific can be allowed to pretend to play peacemaker while, at the same time, pledging your support for the coup and sending your military in to attack Lazarus.

Mediation doesn't typically work that way.

Well it was going to be mediator until y'all pulled the trigger on the banjections

[Killer Kitty]

Well it was going to be mediator until y'all pulled the trigger on the banjections

You mean until we put down the coup that The South Pacific then immediately supported, in direct violation of the treaty we have with them?

Forgive me if I remain skeptical to the sincerity of that offer.

[Dirty Yellow Pickles]

I think reposting that with every single post you make as a "signature" regardless of relevance seems a lot like spam

Then report it to Moderation instead of using it as a jab.

[Roavin]

Before that we offered to mediate between parties (an offer that is technically still open).

I don't think The South Pacific can be allowed to pretend to play peacemaker while, at the same time, pledging your support for the coup and sending your military in to attack Lazarus.

Mediation doesn't typically work that way.

Claiming you didn't coup is at this point as believe as the Trumps saying they didn't collude with Russia - except that the evidence that you did coup is even stronger

So yes, mediation could have worked that way. We offered mediation (cuz, you know, we like Laz), one side accepted, Funk said "gimme 24 hours", then before those were up y'all decided to construe false evidence.

You know, you never did respond to Amerion demonstrating the most blatant out of context quote. I wonder why?

[Old Tyrannia]

If it wasn't clear, this is my MoFA statement as current MoFa in TSP. It's really represents my views as to the purpose and goals of my term. Think of it as a signature for this thread

My entire FA campaign in TSP has been that FA should be subservient to the needs and interests of the region first and foremost instead of being held hostage to spheres of players who really have stagnated and need some sort of refresh or a new role to play. It is also unfortunate when former allies once again support the same stance that led to the breakdown of relations. What worth is an ally that supports whoever can wrest away a bit of power for whatever transitory period of time?

If any ally of TSP has any questions about our relationship, they should contact me. I'm always willing to dialogue and have enjoyed talking to, planning with, and working with allies.

For those interested in TSP, we hope our recent actions show that as a region we hold our alliances to be more than paper. A treaty is our word and our honor and a commitment that, no matter how difficult it may be, we do not blow any which way when the wind turns but steer a true and clear course.

Escade: There is absolutely no need to repeatedly repost the same block of text over and over again. Cut it out or you will be facing an official warning for spam in the future.

It's also been brought to my attention that you have made a habit of including large unspoilered images in your posts (not necessarily in this thread). In future, I suggest that you avoid this as well.

[Glen-Rhodes]

History lesson:

When the PRL was formed, then-Delegate Belschaft unilaterally told Lazarus that TSP has no intention of honoring it. The Assembly never voted to repeal it, however Lazarus dissolve the treaty on their end due to the Delegate's comments. The MoFA (Kris at the time) negotiated a non-aggression pact, which was passed in the Assembly in order to repair the relationship.

TSP didn't, to my knowledge (I was Chair in the Cabinet) conduct any military (offensive or support) missions around the PRL.