[US Election 2016] Democratic Primary Megathread III

[Conserative Morality]

This is mostly how I feel. Hillary may be a typical politician, but so was Obama, and he's done alright. She's not perfect, but sometimes you have to be satisfied with someone that's just adequate. At least she has a clue what she's doing.

Obama is better on many levels, but I agree. At least she's not going to send the country into a race to the bottom.

[Guy]

Fuck no. We failed to make our case. We have to live with that.

We didn't fail to make our case, the lamestream media blocked him out plus Hillary and the DNC conspired against him and then she cheated in some key states. She stole the election from Bernie. But then, what do you expect from a crook like her?

You're such a cliche, I'm beginning to worry that I wasted my time on a troll.

[Key East]

We didn't fail to make our case, the lamestream media blocked him out plus Hillary and the DNC conspired against him and then she cheated in some key states. She stole the election from Bernie. But then, what do you expect from a crook like her?

You're such a cliche, I'm beginning to worry that I wasted my time on a troll.

Now you're shutting down arguments because you don't like a healthy dose of the truth.

Proof:

http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2016/05 ... llary-win/
http://www.thepoliticalinsider.com/clin ... ter-fraud/
http://dailycaller.com/2016/05/17/sande ... of-nevada/

[Socialist Nordia]

This is mostly how I feel. Hillary may be a typical politician, but so was Obama, and he's done alright. She's not perfect, but sometimes you have to be satisfied with someone that's just adequate. At least she has a clue what she's doing.

She's a criminal who stole the election from Bernie. So yes, she knew exactly what she was doing.

Are you a troll? Hillary never got convicted of anything and, hence, is not a criminal. Hillary won millions of more votes. I liked Bernie, but he lost. Get over it. Hillary is the better option. She is not terrible, not like the fool on the other side.

[Key East]

She's a criminal who stole the election from Bernie. So yes, she knew exactly what she was doing.

Are you a troll? Hillary never got convicted of anything and, hence, is not a criminal. Hillary won millions of more votes. I liked Bernie, but he lost. Get over it. Hillary is the better option. She is not terrible, not like the fool on the other side.

We don't just have a choice between Hillary or Trump, Bernie can run as a Green or Independent and win. He only lost because the DNC conspired for Hillary and she cheated.

[Washington Resistance Army]

Are you a troll? Hillary never got convicted of anything and, hence, is not a criminal. Hillary won millions of more votes. I liked Bernie, but he lost. Get over it. Hillary is the better option. She is not terrible, not like the fool on the other side.

We don't just have a choice between Hillary or Trump, Bernie can run as a Green or Independent and win. He only lost because the DNC conspired for Hillary and she cheated.

He wouldn't win, more than 5% sure but he wouldn't win.

[Socialist Nordia]

Are you a troll? Hillary never got convicted of anything and, hence, is not a criminal. Hillary won millions of more votes. I liked Bernie, but he lost. Get over it. Hillary is the better option. She is not terrible, not like the fool on the other side.

We don't just have a choice between Hillary or Trump, Bernie can run as a Green or Independent and win. He only lost because the DNC conspired for Hillary and she cheated.

He could win? You think he could win with democrats divided between him and Clinton? That's crazy. You are in denial. Bernie couldn't even win a majority of the Democratic Party primary. He would get crushed in a general with him, Clinton, and trump.

[Socialist Nordia]

You're such a cliche, I'm beginning to worry that I wasted my time on a troll.

Now you're shutting down arguments because you don't like a healthy dose of the truth.

Proof:

http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2016/05 ... llary-win/
http://www.thepoliticalinsider.com/clin ... ter-fraud/
http://dailycaller.com/2016/05/17/sande ... of-nevada/

Would you mind using more reputable sources? Ones that are widely respected please. I've never even heard of the gateway pundit. And, even if these allegations are true, Hillary didn't need to do it because she won by millions.

[Key East]

We don't just have a choice between Hillary or Trump, Bernie can run as a Green or Independent and win. He only lost because the DNC conspired for Hillary and she cheated.

He could win? You think he could win with democrats divided between him and Clinton? That's crazy. You are in denial. Bernie couldn't even win a majority of the Democratic Party primary. He would get crushed in a general with him, Clinton, and trump.

People who are voting Johnson because they hate Clinton and Trump, and many Trump fans would come over as well. Not saying it's easy, but it's possible. The FEC isn't like the DNC, he would be on level terms.

[Washington Resistance Army]

He could win? You think he could win with democrats divided between him and Clinton? That's crazy. You are in denial. Bernie couldn't even win a majority of the Democratic Party primary. He would get crushed in a general with him, Clinton, and trump.

People who are voting Johnson because they hate Clinton and Trump, and many Trump fans would come over as well. Not saying it's easy, but it's possible. The FEC isn't like the DNC, he would be on level terms.

Uh, no. He couldn't even be on the ballot in all 50 states.

[Ngelmish]

This is mostly how I feel. Hillary may be a typical politician, but so was Obama, and he's done alright. She's not perfect, but sometimes you have to be satisfied with someone that's just adequate. At least she has a clue what she's doing.

She's a criminal who stole the election from Bernie. So yes, she knew exactly what she was doing.

Sanders lost the election on his own. Seriously, he had his shot (a better shot than he ever should have had, considering the fundamentals) and he (or his campaign handlers more probably) bungled it.

[Key East]

People who are voting Johnson because they hate Clinton and Trump, and many Trump fans would come over as well. Not saying it's easy, but it's possible. The FEC isn't like the DNC, he would be on level terms.

Uh, no. He couldn't even be on the ballot in all 50 states.

You don't need 50 states to get 270 electoral votes.

[Guy]

You're such a cliche, I'm beginning to worry that I wasted my time on a troll.

Now you're shutting down arguments because you don't like a healthy dose of the truth.

Proof:

http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2016/05 ... llary-win/
http://www.thepoliticalinsider.com/clin ... ter-fraud/
http://dailycaller.com/2016/05/17/sande ... of-nevada/

Link 1: Unsubstantiated allegations that votes were changed/deleted. These types of issues are usually caused by entry errors, which are then corrected. Assuming though that Bernie was robbed of 4000 votes in Kentucky (not really sure how), it would net the Sanders campaign a total of 0 delegates. Given the statewide delegates are even, "who won" doesn't matter to the allocation.

Link 2: One Iowa precinct allegedly not doing a complete count following exclusion of unviable candidates. I don't see what Clinton has to do with the actions down to the precinct level. Assuming that Sanders would have won that precinct but for the alleged misconduct (again, unlikely there was any), it would have netted him a total of zero national convention delegates.

Link 3: Nevada! We'd literally discussed this for pages here. The bottom line is that of the 58 delegates whom both Sanders and Clinton representatives agreed cannot be credentialed, only 8 turned up. 8 additional State Convention delegates would have netted the Sanders campaign a total of zero national convention delegates. It's important to note that Politifact determined that the Convention proceeded according to the rules, and everyone acted properly.

So we have a grand total of 0 national convention delegates that Sanders lost due to the misconduct alleged in the three links. More importantly, it is unlikely that any misconduct had actually occurred.

[Washington Resistance Army]

Uh, no. He couldn't even be on the ballot in all 50 states.

You don't need 50 states to get 270 electoral votes.

Good luck getting 270 when you aren't even on the ballot everywhere.

[The United Territories of Providence]

He could win? You think he could win with democrats divided between him and Clinton? That's crazy. You are in denial. Bernie couldn't even win a majority of the Democratic Party primary. He would get crushed in a general with him, Clinton, and trump.

People who are voting Johnson because they hate Clinton and Trump, and many Trump fans would come over as well. Not saying it's easy, but it's possible. The FEC isn't like the DNC, he would be on level terms.

Jim Gilmore could win and his Vice President could be George Pataki. Not saying it's easy, but it's possible...that's not a real argument. For fucks sake, Michelle Obama could run with Laura Bush as her Veep. It wouldn't be easy, but it's possible. That's ridiculous. One of two people will be the 45th President of the United States; Hillary Rodham Clinton or Donald J. Trump. Those are not our only options, but those are the only people who will almost certainly win at least 270 electoral votes. That's the world we live in Mr. or Mrs. 3 year old account with a dozen posts.

[Socialist Nordia]

He could win? You think he could win with democrats divided between him and Clinton? That's crazy. You are in denial. Bernie couldn't even win a majority of the Democratic Party primary. He would get crushed in a general with him, Clinton, and trump.

People who are voting Johnson because they hate Clinton and Trump, and many Trump fans would come over as well. Not saying it's easy, but it's possible. The FEC isn't like the DNC, he would be on level terms.

A democrat could never win in a 2 against 1 race. Most of Bernie's supporters wouldn't even go to him and they would vote with the party. Reality is harsh. Oh well. She may be a politician with ties to Wall Street, but so was Obama and so is nearly every other politician. The system will only be reformed if democrats win the Supreme Court. Hillary at least might overturn cotizens United if she doesn't need any more donations. Also, she has similar views on most issues with Bernie.

[Guy]

What's the point in winning if you don't stand up for the 99%

Hillary, Trump, they're all the same to me.

Hillary: $12 minimum wage, encouraging unionism and collective bargaining, paid parental and sick leave, real action on climate change, immigration reform, protecting reproductive rights, campaign finance reform, sane majority on SCOTUS

Trump: None of the above

I really should sig that latter part.

[Key East]

People who are voting Johnson because they hate Clinton and Trump, and many Trump fans would come over as well. Not saying it's easy, but it's possible. The FEC isn't like the DNC, he would be on level terms.

A democrat could never win in a 2 against 1 race. Most of Bernie's supporters wouldn't even go to him and they would vote with the party. Reality is harsh. Oh well. She may be a politician with ties to Wall Street, but so was Obama and so is nearly every other politician. The system will only be reformed if democrats win the Supreme Court. Hillary at least might overturn cotizens United if she doesn't need any more donations. Also, she has similar views on most issues with Bernie.

The system won't be reformed if we keep on voting for people of the system. Maybe losing an election will teach us to stop voting for the banker's candidates.

[The United Territories of Providence]

People who are voting Johnson because they hate Clinton and Trump, and many Trump fans would come over as well. Not saying it's easy, but it's possible. The FEC isn't like the DNC, he would be on level terms.

A democrat could never win in a 2 against 1 race. Most of Bernie's supporters wouldn't even go to him and they would vote with the party. Reality is harsh. Oh well. She may be a politician with ties to Wall Street, but so was Obama and so is nearly every other politician. The system will only be reformed if democrats win the Supreme Court. Hillary at least might overturn cotizens United if she doesn't need any more donations. Also, she has similar views on most issues with Bernie.

Well...One Clinton did it, twice. But seeing the failure of Al Gore via Nader, I see your point. Maybe not never...but not usually, unless we have a strong candidate.

[Socialist Nordia]

A democrat could never win in a 2 against 1 race. Most of Bernie's supporters wouldn't even go to him and they would vote with the party. Reality is harsh. Oh well. She may be a politician with ties to Wall Street, but so was Obama and so is nearly every other politician. The system will only be reformed if democrats win the Supreme Court. Hillary at least might overturn cotizens United if she doesn't need any more donations. Also, she has similar views on most issues with Bernie.

The system won't be reformed if we keep on voting for people of the system. Maybe losing an election will teach us to stop voting for the banker's candidates.

This is a troll. I knew it. If you want to support Trump, make yourself active on either the GOP Primary or general election thread. I think you're a trump supporter wanting to sway real Bernie people to go against Hillary. I'm not listening to you anymore. Even Bernie himself has realised that he must do anything he can to defeat trump. It's time that you do the same. I'm convinced you have no respect for what Bernie would want and never truly felt the bern.

[Neutraligon]

A democrat could never win in a 2 against 1 race. Most of Bernie's supporters wouldn't even go to him and they would vote with the party. Reality is harsh. Oh well. She may be a politician with ties to Wall Street, but so was Obama and so is nearly every other politician. The system will only be reformed if democrats win the Supreme Court. Hillary at least might overturn cotizens United if she doesn't need any more donations. Also, she has similar views on most issues with Bernie.

The system won't be reformed if we keep on voting for people of the system. Maybe losing an election will teach us to stop voting for the banker's candidates.

By letting Trump win.... I have voted for third party candidates, even knowing they will lose as a protest vote. I very rarely like the better of two evils. In this case though I find the worse of the two evils so completely despicable that I would never willing support a person who would actually split the vote so that the worse evil wins.

[Key East]

The system won't be reformed if we keep on voting for people of the system. Maybe losing an election will teach us to stop voting for the banker's candidates.

This is a troll. I knew it. If you want to support Trump, make yourself active on either the GOP Primary or general election thread. I think you're a trump supporter wanting to sway real Bernie people to go against Hillary. I'm not listening to you anymore. Even Bernie himself has realised that he must do anything he can to defeat trump. It's time that you do the same. I'm convinced you have no respect for what Bernie would want and never truly felt the bern.

Bernie has had pressure on him from the DNC, and he still hasn't pulled out for a reason - he still has a chance of flipping Superdelegates because Hillary still has a chance of being charged by the FBI. If you felt the Bern, you would understand. #BernieOrBust

[Corrian]

Well, I remember Stein saying she'd let Sanders in and go to the VP position if he wanted the president position, but that point is moot because Sanders isn't stupid enough to do that, since he specifically said the whole point now is to beat Trump. That would most likely effectively make him win.

[USS Monitor]

Hillary is close to Bernie on most issues, so if you loved Bernie, you should at least be ok with Hillary.

Unless you happen to actually care about the issues where they're different...

Let's say you have two candidates that agree about everything except one issue. But this isn't Bernie and Hillary. It's two guys in 1850. The one you love is an abolitionist, and the other is pro-slavery. Are you OK with the pro-slavery guy?

It's not just a question of how many issues they agree on; it's a question of how much you care about the issues where they don't agree.

Obviously, the stuff they disagree on is not slavery. I just used that as an example because I wanted something that we'd all be on the same page about how important it is, and which side was right. If I start talking about illegal immigration or terrorism, and you have a different view of it than I do, then the point I wanted to make wouldn't get through.

[Geilinor]

Uh, no. He couldn't even be on the ballot in all 50 states.

You don't need 50 states to get 270 electoral votes.

You have to be on the ballot and Sanders couldn't win as a third party candidate.