[TWI ONLY] The Senate of the Western Isles

[Vancouvia]

(4) Posts that are made in violation of the court's policy of speech may be edited to put the offending content into a spoiler

RMB post can't be edited, so I'd suggest a rewrite to: "Posts that are made in violation of the court's policy of speech may be suppressed by the Justices or deleted by the poster"

and combine it with (1) instead of making it it's own line so the final would be:

(1) All posts made in the Supreme Court of The Western Isles by a member nation of the region must not be deleted, with the exception of posts that are made in violation of the court's policy of speech, which may be suppressed by the Justices or deleted by the poster"

(2) Posts made in the Supreme Court by a member nation of the region must not be altered in a way that significantly changes their intended meaning unless no other post has been made since

(3) All proceedings of the Supreme Court must be made as visible as possible to all members of the region

[Hodgsonistan]

]

Governmental Discussion (2015)

---

An act to ensure the transparent and fair operation of legislative and judicial proceedings

---

The Senate

(1) All posts made in the Senate of The Western Isles by a member nation of the region must not be deleted

(2) Posts made in the Senate by a member nation of the region must not be altered in a way that significantly changes their intended meaning unless no other post has been made since

(3) All proceedings of the Senate must be made as visible as possible to all members of the region

The Supreme Court

(1) All posts made in the Supreme Court of The Western Isles by a member nation of the region must not be deleted, with the exception of posts that are made in violation of the court's policy of speech, which may be suppressed by the Justices."


(2) Posts made in the Supreme Court by a member nation of the region must not be altered in a way that significantly changes their intended meaning unless no other post has been made since

(3) All proceedings of the Supreme Court must be made as visible as possible to all members of the region


Enforcement and Punishment

(1)The responsibility to enforce this act lies in all members of the region. Any member of the region noticing a violation of this act must report it.

(2) A violation of this act that is not immediately corrected by the perpetrator shall be prosecuted by the government with the felony of "Deceiving the Public," as outlined under the 2015 Criminal Code.

[Hodgsonistan]

The reason I exclude the delete option is that the words may be interesting and I think all voices should be heard, definitely repressed so you don't have to read them, but still there so that it can be read if one really wants to. I think all court records have to be kept no matter what. Remember that this is where we decide whether to permanently banject nations or not.

[Vancouvia]

I motion to vote then

[Dashgrinaar]

Seconded. Are we disregarding Lithuania as a Senator? If we are, the motion passes. If we are not, we need one more second.

[Vancouvia]

Seconded. Are we disregarding Lithuania as a Senator? If we are, the motion passes. If we are not, we need one more second.

Lithuania's been removed from the map and lost his senator spot as a result.

I cast my first vote FOR.

[Dashgrinaar]

I cast my vote FOR

The bill passes, 2 - 0 - 0. Verdon may cast his vote later, but the bill passes. The Senate's next order of business is an Act on Wildelyn's Bill.

[Vancouvia]

I await my colleague's feelings on that bill; I have already made mine quite clear

[Dashgrinaar]

Technically, according to Presidential Order 4, we are granted communication powers, as we are officers.

I will wait for Verdon to post, but this seems unnecessary.

[Vancouvia]

Technically, according to Presidential Order 4, we are granted communication powers, as we are officers.

I will wait for Verdon to post, but this seems unnecessary.

"all officers MAY be granted the communication power"

I would have, but the WFE looks nice with 9 and there was too much turnover in the Senate

[Dashgrinaar]

Ok, but just saying, the Senators would more likely communicate more with the region than Justices, though I do see your point.

[Vancouvia]

Ok, but just saying, the Senators would more likely communicate more with the region than Justices, though I do see your point.

I mean, communication does two things: lets you suppress RMB posts and send out regional telegrams. The first is already covered by 5+ people and the second is the Sec. of Info's job as a liaison.

[Dashgrinaar]

Sec of Info is the Executive Liaison, Chief Justice is Judicial Liaison, etc.

[Libra Project]

The main target of this amendment is to keep the Founders or Executive Delegate away from the possible political consequences of a constitutional suspension. The appointment of a temporary Commission is considered needed, because, as the suspension could ultimately have a non-democratic profile, the Founder/Executive Delegate must maintain the democratic character of this position. Also, in case of unlawful acts, the Founder should not be brought to the Supreme Court, as this would mark a destabilization of the region. Instead the Commission is a group of nations with almost-total powers, but also total responsibilities of their actions. I present the amendment to the Senate.

Article XI
Section 1: In case of a major internal or external crisis the Constitution may be temporarily suspended. The Founder or Executive Delegate appoints a Regional Crisis Commander by Executive Order, who must dismiss the government and appoint 2 more Lieutenants, in order to form a Crisis Monitoring Commission. The Commission has then the right to suspend the Constitution for a duration of no more than 48 hours.

Section 2: The Commission is overseen by the Founder or Executive Delegate. The members of the Commission are expected to act in order to end the crisis, and under no circumstance to have gains from their position. The Commission cannot repeal, replace or amend the Constitution.

Section 3: The Commission acts by Emergency Executive Orders. All actions of the Commission must be recorded. After the Constitution is restored, members of the Commission who acted unlawfully can be brought to the Supreme Court.

Section 4: A suspension cannot occur more than once within a 30 day period, unless both the Supreme Court and Senate in agreement permit an increased suspension duration of an amount of their determination, of which the Founder or Executive Delegate may choose to enact in part or in full.

Section 4: Members of the Commission cannot be dismissed before the end of the suspension. The Commission must resign or be dismissed 168 hours after the end of the suspension.

Section 5: A new government is formed after the restoration of the Constitution.

Section 6: This article shall remain active during a suspension period.

[The Pacific Peace Union]

Why not have the current government solve the crisis problem? Instead of throwing them out and replacing them.

[Wildelyn]

I have to agree with PPU on the manner. It seems like just a way to have another body of people in power, the Executive and Judicial Branches are doing just fine and seems to really grant the Founder more power again - The Founder is not an Executive position nor is the Delegate and so should not have Executive positions of power.

[Dashgrinaar]

There is also no reason to "throw out" the current government, and then go through the long process of bringing new people back into office.

[Verdon]

Vote FOR Hodgsonistan's bill.

You guys are gonna have to help me out a bit, I'm getting caught up in which legislation we're currently discussing.

[Dashgrinaar]

Vote FOR Hodgsonistan's bill.

You guys are gonna have to help me out a bit, I'm getting caught up in which legislation we're currently discussing.

Technically we are on Wildelyn's bill but we're discussing Libra's.

[Verdon]

On Wildelyn's bill:

Firstly, I think this would be a law, rather than an amendment, as it outlines specific limitations of the officer positions, rather than altering their actual purposes. More like a federal regulations code. I think the language "shall and be the only one to have" is redundant and confusing, as none of the other positions are granted the power.

President: I'm almost wary of giving the President executive power, as it makes the "executive order" thing that much more dangerous. To be honest, I've always thought that those were complete bullsh*t.

VP: would be fine with granting border control to VP, not sure they need polls but that's not really that important.

SoI: Doesn't need those powers. That's not what their job is about.
SoE: same thing.

Definitely in favor of giving Sec. of Info polling powers. I think that the region would benefit if they could gather information in that method.

All in all, I'm not a big fan of this one. There are some changes in here that I like, but considering the main purpose here is to extend the Border Control feature to all positions, I don't really see the necessity - especially considering so many people have the comms function.

[Wildelyn]

On Wildelyn's bill:

Firstly, I think this would be a law, rather than an amendment, as it outlines specific limitations of the officer positions, rather than altering their actual purposes. More like a federal regulations code. I think the language "shall and be the only one to have" is redundant and confusing, as none of the other positions are granted the power.

President: I'm almost wary of giving the President executive power, as it makes the "executive order" thing that much more dangerous. To be honest, I've always thought that those were complete bullsh*t.

VP: would be fine with granting border control to VP, not sure they need polls but that's not really that important.

SoI: Doesn't need those powers. That's not what their job is about.
SoE: same thing.

Definitely in favor of giving Sec. of Info polling powers. I think that the region would benefit if they could gather information in that method.

All in all, I'm not a big fan of this one. There are some changes in here that I like, but considering the main purpose here is to extend the Border Control feature to all positions, I don't really see the necessity - especially considering so many people have the comms function.

To defend the SoI and SoE position -

Secretary of Interior job is to manage the Interior affairs of the Region, same goes with Exterior but with Exterior affairs of the Region - I completely agree that it might be 'dangeorus' but the President is the President and so he should be able to have Executive presiding over the Region, following the constitituion of course.

To add furthermore on the Border Control for SoE and SoI, its very vital, at least in my opinion as there is lots of times were we don't have Miklania on or Vancouvia and then certain trolls run around - the SoE; the guy who gets people in the Region should also be able to get these people out incase they are Raiders, Trolls and so on.. the SoI, same.. he Manages the Interior affairs of our region and should be able to also have border control powers as per his duties.

I am extremely delighted to see that you are interested in this though if you'd like to change anything, I can agree on polls for VP and maybe Border Control for SoE but my reason for adding and extending border control is in case of security.

Thanks.

[Verdon]

Secretary of Interior job is to manage the Interior affairs of the Region, same goes with Exterior but with Exterior affairs of the Region - I completely agree that it might be 'dangeorus' but the President is the President and so he should be able to have Executive presiding over the Region, following the constitituion of course.

To add furthermore on the Border Control for SoE and SoI, its very vital, at least in my opinion as there is lots of times were we don't have Miklania on or Vancouvia and then certain trolls run around - the SoE; the guy who gets people in the Region should also be able to get these people out incase they are Raiders, Trolls and so on.. the SoI, same.. he Manages the Interior affairs of our region and should be able to also have border control powers as per his duties.

I am extremely delighted to see that you are interested in this though if you'd like to change anything, I can agree on polls for VP and maybe Border Control for SoE but my reason for adding and extending border control is in case of security.

Thanks.

I think you're using 'Exterior' and 'Interior' as absolute terms, when their definitions in the constitution outline it differently. Perhaps I could see the reason for granting the SoI border control as a REALLY loose extension of "ensuring that rules and standards are followed," but not SoE under its current constitutional definition (no hard feelings).

I understand the main point is to increase regional security, but having so many people with ejection powers also seems kind of dangerous. When EPA was ejected, there was split opinion on whether or not it was justified, which means there is a definite possibility of the same controversy arising again. Our regional government works best when it is cohesive, rather than fighting itself (hey, I can dream, right?).

I would support this with significant cuts and reclassification to law.

[Wildelyn]

Secretary of Interior job is to manage the Interior affairs of the Region, same goes with Exterior but with Exterior affairs of the Region - I completely agree that it might be 'dangeorus' but the President is the President and so he should be able to have Executive presiding over the Region, following the constitituion of course.

To add furthermore on the Border Control for SoE and SoI, its very vital, at least in my opinion as there is lots of times were we don't have Miklania on or Vancouvia and then certain trolls run around - the SoE; the guy who gets people in the Region should also be able to get these people out incase they are Raiders, Trolls and so on.. the SoI, same.. he Manages the Interior affairs of our region and should be able to also have border control powers as per his duties.

I am extremely delighted to see that you are interested in this though if you'd like to change anything, I can agree on polls for VP and maybe Border Control for SoE but my reason for adding and extending border control is in case of security.

Thanks.

I think you're using 'Exterior' and 'Interior' as absolute terms, when their definitions in the constitution outline it differently. Perhaps I could see the reason for granting the SoI border control as a REALLY loose extension of "ensuring that rules and standards are followed," but not SoE under its current constitutional definition (no hard feelings).

I understand the main point is to increase regional security, but having so many people with ejection powers also seems kind of dangerous. When EPA was ejected, there was split opinion on whether or not it was justified, which means there is a definite possibility of the same controversy arising again. Our regional government works best when it is cohesive, rather than fighting itself (hey, I can dream, right?).

I would support this with significant cuts and reclassification to law.

Ah, well I am not using them as absolute term - I am just referring to their actual roles as the term they are placed with; Exterior, Interior.

I agree, when EPA was ejected hell broke loose and I wouldn't want that, maybe limiting the Border Control to the VP and President..
Yeah the government is best when its cohesive and so we try to do that, still.. all regional officers should be entitled to Communications (first step) then depending on the classification, should be identified with appropriate power.

I.e; what we have right now but remove certain powers from certain things though I will still argue that President is deserving of Executive, no matter how 'dangerous' it can be classified, a man voted by the people is for the people. I would say.

[Vancouvia]

I can't give the President "Executive Power". Only the WA delegate or Founder can have that be default.

On giving the VP border control: that goes against Article VI section 1. I have given the Chief Justice that control before and would be happy to return it

Communications: no one really needs this power at all except the President to conduct elections. Any sort of regional telegram that people want to send out can just be sent out through the President. He's supposed to check it over first anyway to limit the spammyness that could result in everyone sending out their own telegrams.

[Wildelyn]

I can't give the President "Executive Power". Only the WA delegate or Founder can have that be default.

On giving the VP border control: that goes against Article VI section 1. I have given the Chief Justice that control before and would be happy to return it

Communications: no one really needs this power at all except the President to conduct elections. Any sort of regional telegram that people want to send out can just be sent out through the President. He's supposed to check it over first anyway to limit the spammyness that could result in everyone sending out their own telegrams.

I can confirm that, after doing experiment its limited to WA Delegate and Founder - so remove executive power from the list, keep the other authorities.