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Serah
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Postby Serah » Mon Oct 12, 2015 3:21 pm

Guys, I am wondering something.

Do I lose faith in logic yet?
Someone just told me: You don't get it she's a proffesionnal gardener, she can grow fishes.

I... don't know what to think of this.

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Harbertia
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Postby Harbertia » Mon Oct 12, 2015 3:35 pm

Serah wrote:Guys, I am wondering something.

Do I lose faith in logic yet?
Someone just told me: You don't get it she's a proffesionnal gardener, she can grow fishes.

I... don't know what to think of this.

Image

Perhaps that's what the person meant. Otherwise the person realizes that gardener is a term at times used for a farmer and has heard of Fish farming.
A light in casing is still a light.
Tomorrow is made today.
You can't stop progress, but you can direct it's course.

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Mortelatuzia
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Postby Mortelatuzia » Mon Oct 12, 2015 5:53 pm

Saleon wrote:
Mortelatuzia wrote:Indeed. I'll go back to making Combat Forms.
sorry, its been a busy week. ive been working on a post, so don't feel bad

It's alright, I just complain a lot. :P

EDIT: Though I'm not sure if I should write a post now or wait for Ken so that we aren't cutting him out of the conversation.
Last edited by Mortelatuzia on Mon Oct 12, 2015 5:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.
I should really stop with this whole dying thing.

You deserve to be
Zarkenis Ultima wrote:spaghettified by a black hole.

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Elysian Kentarchy
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Postby Elysian Kentarchy » Mon Oct 12, 2015 6:16 pm

(my usual going through the backlog)

Pyrade wrote:Things have been really quiet here lately.


My brother was hospitalized plus my birthday was this weekend so I have been largely indisposed.

Atlannia wrote:You could just have them worship their old god up to acertain point on history and then convert over to worship of Aradain, that's what I did with my people.


Mine were loyalists to an enemy of Aradain (Mael) but converted fairly early on under orders. Nowadays they toe the line between lawful and lawless due to being extremely utilitarian and isolated, to give an example.

Pyrade wrote:Can always add to it as we go along. Inspiration strikes at strange times :P


Still adding to mine even this far in, mostly with details I want to be revealed being revealed after they happen IC. That or I just write up info dumps and post them OCC to elaborate on some detail or another.

Mortelatuzia wrote:I'm complaining that Sal and Ken haven't been on in the past week while trying not to sound rude.


Reference above, that and I posted on Wednesday (page 179) so not a full week for me.

Mortelatuzia wrote:
EDIT: Though I'm not sure if I should write a post now or wait for Ken so that we aren't cutting him out of the conversation.


Not sure what to post. Initially I had an idea of Rache handing a handkerchief to Elysia with the whole almost crying thing but then I thought it would not be correct for him, and also quite rude, to be handing her one when she was trying to cover up her crying. So I am not sure what to do besides nodding along to what she says.
Last edited by Elysian Kentarchy on Mon Oct 12, 2015 6:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.


Celivaia wrote:"Today is a great day. Recently, we completed a project that will greatly help the Salarian Union in it's fight, and while I cannot divulge information about this project, I am pleased to announce that this project was no small feat, and for his dedication, work, and pure, brilliant genius, we have a special award for this Salarian. We cannot divulge the name of this operative, but we have given him a special award, the "Star of the Union," and as an added bonus, we have decided to rename this, our home planet, after him. As of this moment, you are now standing on Solus'Kesh."

Philosophy and Religion Major

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Mortelatuzia
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Postby Mortelatuzia » Mon Oct 12, 2015 6:25 pm

Elysian Kentarchy wrote:(my usual going through the backlog)

Pyrade wrote:Things have been really quiet here lately.


My brother was hospitalized plus my birthday was this weekend so I have been largely indisposed.

Oh my, I'm sorry and Happy Belated! My fault for being so callous.

Elysian Kentarchy wrote:
Mortelatuzia wrote:
EDIT: Though I'm not sure if I should write a post now or wait for Ken so that we aren't cutting him out of the conversation.


Not sure what to post. Initially I had an idea of Rache handing a handkerchief to Elysia with the whole almost crying thing but then I thought it would not be correct for him, and also quite rude, to be handing her one when she was trying to cover up her crying. So I am not sure what to do besides nodding along to what she says.

Well I didn't know if you wanted to have Rache or Kristina interject out of curiosity or concern. Perhaps seeing that Elysia has a problem that has clearly not been solved, and wishing to assist her. But if you'd rather have them be nonconfrontational than I'll just continue on.
I should really stop with this whole dying thing.

You deserve to be
Zarkenis Ultima wrote:spaghettified by a black hole.

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Elysian Kentarchy
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Postby Elysian Kentarchy » Mon Oct 12, 2015 6:56 pm

Mortelatuzia wrote:
Elysian Kentarchy wrote:(my usual going through the backlog)



My brother was hospitalized plus my birthday was this weekend so I have been largely indisposed.

Oh my, I'm sorry and Happy Belated! My fault for being so callous.

Elysian Kentarchy wrote:
Not sure what to post. Initially I had an idea of Rache handing a handkerchief to Elysia with the whole almost crying thing but then I thought it would not be correct for him, and also quite rude, to be handing her one when she was trying to cover up her crying. So I am not sure what to do besides nodding along to what she says.

Well I didn't know if you wanted to have Rache or Kristina interject out of curiosity or concern. Perhaps seeing that Elysia has a problem that has clearly not been solved, and wishing to assist her. But if you'd rather have them be nonconfrontational than I'll just continue on.


Kristina doesn't have a voice at the moment remember? Even if she did I don't think she would say anything, this is the girl whose entire immediate family mysteriously died, has a hard time qualifying as a person with how bad her PTSD is, and is quiet in general after all. As for Rache it isn't in his nature to inquire into personal circumstances unless it is someone he knows well, a member of his Order, or it seems like it is needed for him to say something or he feels the need to take action. He is more the quietly observe and offer quiet comforts when he can while respecting other's privacy and non-desire to say something.

And no problem.
Last edited by Elysian Kentarchy on Mon Oct 12, 2015 6:59 pm, edited 2 times in total.


Celivaia wrote:"Today is a great day. Recently, we completed a project that will greatly help the Salarian Union in it's fight, and while I cannot divulge information about this project, I am pleased to announce that this project was no small feat, and for his dedication, work, and pure, brilliant genius, we have a special award for this Salarian. We cannot divulge the name of this operative, but we have given him a special award, the "Star of the Union," and as an added bonus, we have decided to rename this, our home planet, after him. As of this moment, you are now standing on Solus'Kesh."

Philosophy and Religion Major

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Mortelatuzia
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Postby Mortelatuzia » Mon Oct 12, 2015 7:41 pm

Elysian Kentarchy wrote:
Mortelatuzia wrote:Oh my, I'm sorry and Happy Belated! My fault for being so callous.


Well I didn't know if you wanted to have Rache or Kristina interject out of curiosity or concern. Perhaps seeing that Elysia has a problem that has clearly not been solved, and wishing to assist her. But if you'd rather have them be nonconfrontational than I'll just continue on.


Kristina doesn't have a voice at the moment remember? Even if she did I don't think she would say anything, this is the girl whose entire immediate family mysteriously died, has a hard time qualifying as a person with how bad her PTSD is, and is quiet in general after all. As for Rache it isn't in his nature to inquire into personal circumstances unless it is someone he knows well, a member of his Order, or it seems like it is needed for him to say something or he feels the need to take action. He is more the quietly observe and offer quiet comforts when he can while respecting other's privacy and non-desire to say something.

And no problem.

Fair enough.

Side note: Anyone need interaction that wants to talk to Gawiëhr? I'm not going to have him run into Elysia yet so if anyone wants to bump him, let me know.
Last edited by Mortelatuzia on Mon Oct 12, 2015 7:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.
I should really stop with this whole dying thing.

You deserve to be
Zarkenis Ultima wrote:spaghettified by a black hole.

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Serah
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Postby Serah » Mon Oct 12, 2015 9:45 pm

Character Application

Name: Gwyn Mirtovel
Appearance: Green eyes, white/beige skin, shoulder length brown hair, white and very light red vest, long dark blue skirt (casual, when she needs to fight, she changes to white and blue sport pants.)
Gender: Female
Age: 21
Likes/Dislikes:

Likes:
-To play pranks on people. (Last one ended with two people sleeping in a dry fountain, a giant inflatable swimming pool filled with cake batter, a goat, a lama and lots of ice cream everywhere.)
-To use her weapon to trap people for fun.
-Being happy.
-Pineapples.
-Hot coco

Dislikes:
-People trying to kill her because of her planet's beliefs.
-Mosquitoes.
-Shanky business.
-Cheese

Bio:
Gwyn was born on Teos, a planet extremely powerful and civilized due to the two great wizards/gods protecting the planet since they created it in the outer realms.
Teos was actually never meant to be found, the culture was originally too different from the one made by the Redemit and the magic signatures were way too different at first, so much that even a touch could have made a man sick.
However, lately, the magic signatures have tamed down and relationships between the two worlds have begun.

For now, the only one sent to represent the planet will be Serah's representative, Gwyn Mirtovel, a young and happy girl that only wishes to get stronger by witnessing battles outside of her planet.
However, as much as she may be an outsider, she is no joke in a fight and is already considered to be one of the future heroes of the new generation.

Additional Information:

-Despite her rather weird outside personality, she can be very motherly at times, even towards people older than her.
-Her weapon is rather unique, it was forged by the Lareylis, a bloodline equally as important as hers that is responsible for various act of heroism through the ages, it is a hilt that contains, due to a rather obscure way, several kilometers of thread that is extremely resistant, it can withstand extreme amounts of punishment through a heat up to 3000 degrees, three hundred psi and is seemingly tougher than steel, and topped by a small steel claw, yet despite all this, it is highly flexible, now however, for more practical purposes, she needs to summon it as it turned into energy.
When she uses it, she calls it her spider-web, making her get the nickname of Spider.
-If she puts her mind to it, she can do things extremely fast.

RP Sample:

I was sitting on the grass, a rather high fall awaited me if I did so much as to slip.
Of course, it wouldn't really happen, I'm not too stupid as to do such a thing, I'm too careful for that.
I liked the wind in my hair, here, it was Autumn, possibly my favorite season.

I was about to leave, however, I did so by my own accord, several other people, including some part of the Lareylis advised me not to go to the inner realms, as we didn't know enough about it.
However, as my position mentioned itself, I had to represent the country.

Oh but by the way, you must not know me.
My name is Gwyn Mirtovel, but you may know me better by the name Serah.
I am the current heir to the post of leader to my country and henceforth, like my ancestors were before me, I am called Serah by the people of my country and coincidentally it is also my title in diplomatic relationships.

Yet to be fully honest with you, I don't frankly care about all this, the country is doing so well that even taking up the position of Leader won't change anything to my plans.
The Lareylis, a neighboring family and also in possession of several Duchies in the country rules the place just like my parents are doing right now.
However for now, I am about to leave to the Silver Hand in Arcadia, an academy for Mages and knights of the inner realms, they've only made contact with us recently however, but they seem nice enough, so as my position of country representative, I need to make some appearances.
Namely in the school, into which I'll spend a year.

Now, my father just arrived.

"Gwyn dear, we need to go now." He seemed nervous.
Then again, it was normal, I was their only child, which meant only heir to the family.
And the people of the country certainly did not want anyone else representing the country but me.
Except Naunet, but that's another story.

"I felt you coming. You're not really discreet are you?
For a former assassin, you'd think it'd be the contrary." Truth is, I sort of cheated, I was feeling everything with my threader.

"Well, you're taking after me too, just like you're taking after your mother in swordsmanship.
I'm not too worried about your well-being, even if someone was to attack you, I'm sure you would manage it fairly well.
After all, you've been training with the Lareylis for quite a while now.
Even your magic is quite strong, even by Seran standards.
Certainly not up to the Hero however, you know this.
Although I guess it is why you're going to that academy." My father spoke, those words filled me with pride in a way, my ultimate goal was to be as powerful as the Hero.

The Hero was Alrick Lareylis, descendant of the Blue Duelist, Liosarius Lareylis, both of them had saved this world, leaving their souls in the process, it is rumored that the Hero's children continued the various bloodlines that made the current countries what they were.

The Demeter, a family of inventor and hunters that settled in Geldran pledged eternal loyalty to the Lareylis after the death of the Fallen, Theriam Lareylis, saving the first great inventor of the bloodline, Leonard Demeter.

The Mirtovel, my family, that kept on holding the executive power ever since the Bloodlad's adulthood, some say that he wished it this way to Stone himself.

The Tellier, also known for having heroines mostly, that fought by the Lareylis's side at all times ever since the Wave sorceress, Meria Tellier.

And last, the Caerwyn, not much is known about them, simply that the first documented member of the family was named Erica, The plasma sniper, they seemed to serve the Lareylis as well as hunters and assassins.

Currently, this generation's heroes are Naunet Lareylis and her, unfortunately now crippled, brother Wayther, Màen Caerwyn, Syltoma, Vehlto and me.
The Spider, Gwyn Mirtovel.

"You know, I do want to be as powerful as he was, but I sure as hell can't equal the fact that he basically became a god to fight another one.
I can never even hope to get to that point.
Although I can hope to get to his skill with weapons, or his raw magic power.
...
Well Father, time for me to break out of the dome." I stepped up and holstered my threader, making the whole thread fix back in as usual and flashed my biggest smile to my father as I turned around.

Gwyn Mirtovel's Powergrid

GENERAL ATTRIBUTES

Focus: 3
Energy:3
Endurance:2
Readiness:4
Awareness:3

ABILITY ATTRIBUTES

Weapon Proficiency:4
[Energy Threader]: 4
[Mineral blades (Made by the crystal)]: 4

Magic Proficiency:2
[Illusion summoning(Can summon weapons made out of her mind's power.]: 4
Last edited by Serah on Mon Oct 12, 2015 10:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Mortelatuzia
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Postby Mortelatuzia » Mon Oct 12, 2015 9:49 pm

Serah wrote:-snip-
Magic Proficiency:2
[Illusion summoning(Can summon weapons made out of her mind's power.]: 3

That 3 should either become a 4 or you have another magic type that has 1.
Having a 2 in Magic Proficiency means that you have 4 points to spend on the individual magicks.
I should really stop with this whole dying thing.

You deserve to be
Zarkenis Ultima wrote:spaghettified by a black hole.

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Serah
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Postby Serah » Mon Oct 12, 2015 10:02 pm

Mortelatuzia wrote:
Serah wrote:-snip-
Magic Proficiency:2
[Illusion summoning(Can summon weapons made out of her mind's power.]: 3

That 3 should either become a 4 or you have another magic type that has 1.
Having a 2 in Magic Proficiency means that you have 4 points to spend on the individual magicks.


Ah alright.
I wasn't sure.

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Mortelatuzia
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Postby Mortelatuzia » Mon Oct 12, 2015 10:24 pm

Note to Zark: Elysia's Status is Player Character not Player Characters
I should really stop with this whole dying thing.

You deserve to be
Zarkenis Ultima wrote:spaghettified by a black hole.

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Zarkenis Ultima
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Postby Zarkenis Ultima » Mon Oct 12, 2015 11:46 pm

Mortelatuzia wrote:Note to Zark: Elysia's Status is Player Character not Player Characters


Fuck.

I'll fix that before heading to bed. Serah, I'll review your app tomororw.
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Esternial
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Postby Esternial » Tue Oct 13, 2015 8:35 am

Zarkenis Ultima wrote:
Mortelatuzia wrote:Note to Zark: Elysia's Status is Player Character not Player Characters


Fuck.

I'll fix that before heading to bed. Serah, I'll review your app tomororw.

"Tomororw"

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Zarkenis Ultima
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Postby Zarkenis Ultima » Tue Oct 13, 2015 2:01 pm

Esternial wrote:
Zarkenis Ultima wrote:
Fuck.

I'll fix that before heading to bed. Serah, I'll review your app tomororw.

"Tomororw"


Fuck off mate. >.>
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Zarkenis Ultima
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Postby Zarkenis Ultima » Tue Oct 13, 2015 9:54 pm

Serah wrote:-snippy-


Alright, took me long enough, but I read it. Just a few things. Firstly, I'm not too fond of the 'magic signatures' thing, as magic is a very specific thing and signatures aren't a part of it, but as those words could mean any number of things not actually connected to magic as it is properly understood in the CoI-verse, I don't think it's that big a deal, I just wanted to point this out. Secondly, do you regularly type in first person? This is mostly out of curiosity; I don't really mind myself, and though some others do, I'm the OP here so. :P. Oh, and lastly, what's an energy threader, again?
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Serah
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Postby Serah » Wed Oct 14, 2015 4:56 am

Zarkenis Ultima wrote:
Serah wrote:-snippy-


Alright, took me long enough, but I read it. Just a few things. Firstly, I'm not too fond of the 'magic signatures' thing, as magic is a very specific thing and signatures aren't a part of it, but as those words could mean any number of things not actually connected to magic as it is properly understood in the CoI-verse, I don't think it's that big a deal, I just wanted to point this out. Secondly, do you regularly type in first person? This is mostly out of curiosity; I don't really mind myself, and though some others do, I'm the OP here so. :P. Oh, and lastly, what's an energy threader, again?


Ah...

Well, you won't need to worry about magic signatures, I use it more as a substitute term for wavelength, for quite a while, they used magic 'normally' without the need of vocal spells, however, since I switched the worlds and Teos is never in only one universe and timeline at a time, the magic signatures change.

To be fully honest with you, I don't often type in first person, I mostly do that in third person, but I noticed that I abuse it too much at times to retcon actions, such as knowledge and various things of the sort.

Then... The energy threader.
That's... Sort of difficult to explain.

Since you've told me that energy weapons cut through basically anything besides other energy weapons themselves, I thought I should bring the threader (Which I think I explained in the app, if not, I'll put the explanation to what it is here and on it afterwards.)
As an energy weapon, since she makes traps out of it and aside from her side magic, she cannot really do anything aside from attacking with it.

The threader is a hilt that holds several kilometers of extremely resistant and resilient spider thread the thread is toppled at the end of it by some sort of dagger, as it is extremely sensitive, she can use it to 'feel' what is going on around her if she is concentrated enough.
It is extremely resistant to heat and can withstand up to 3.000 C°and is about two hundred times tougher than steel.
(Which is an actual fact, some spider silk can be that resistant.)

However, since the energy weapons can cut through most anything, one trap that gets seen and everything just fucks off.
Which would be a problem, since I don't especially want her to have thirty of those on her.
So it has the same properties it had before regarding the lightness and resilience of it, it has the same look, it's just made out of energy.
And she'll be able to re-make it if anything.

Something that wouldn't be possible with a normal one.

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Pyrade
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Postby Pyrade » Wed Oct 14, 2015 5:19 am

The way you describe it kinda makea its sound like an extendable/severable bladed whip. But I think things need a power source to be energised.

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Serah
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Postby Serah » Wed Oct 14, 2015 5:47 am

Pyrade wrote:The way you describe it kinda makea its sound like an extendable/severable bladed whip. But I think things need a power source to be energised.


I can have her have some kind of energized gauntlet that powers it up.

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Pyrade
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Postby Pyrade » Wed Oct 14, 2015 5:50 am

Serah wrote:
Pyrade wrote:The way you describe it kinda makea its sound like an extendable/severable bladed whip. But I think things need a power source to be energised.


I can have her have some kind of energized gauntlet that powers it up.

I more meant for traps you make using the thread :P

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Serah
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Postby Serah » Wed Oct 14, 2015 6:11 am

Pyrade wrote:
Serah wrote:
I can have her have some kind of energized gauntlet that powers it up.

I more meant for traps you make using the thread :P


No, I mean the traps are made with the thread itself, in a spider fashion.
She traps people in her thread and ties them up.

She doesn't use actual traps like arrow and bear traps like you'd think.

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Pyrade
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Postby Pyrade » Wed Oct 14, 2015 6:18 am

Serah wrote:
Pyrade wrote:I more meant for traps you make using the thread :P


No, I mean the traps are made with the thread itself, in a spider fashion.
She traps people in her thread and ties them up.

She doesn't use actual traps like arrow and bear traps like you'd think.

Yeah, I figured that's what she does, I mean if the threads for said traps were energised, she would need a power source. Otherwise they would be able to summon and energise their weapon and it would likely slice through the threads with ease. But I think it's a pretty good idea though :P should take a look at the Pyre Spider in the Bestiary, maybe app for a spider that spins the web she uses.

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Serah
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Postby Serah » Wed Oct 14, 2015 6:21 am

Pyrade wrote:
Serah wrote:
No, I mean the traps are made with the thread itself, in a spider fashion.
She traps people in her thread and ties them up.

She doesn't use actual traps like arrow and bear traps like you'd think.

Yeah, I figured that's what she does, I mean if the threads for said traps were energised, she would need a power source. Otherwise they would be able to summon and energise their weapon and it would likely slice through the threads with ease. But I think it's a pretty good idea though :P should take a look at the Pyre Spider in the Bestiary, maybe app for a spider that spins the web she uses.


It's basically Arachne thread.
Almost unbreakable.
When it was still physical in her original timeline, the thread was almost impossible to cut.
In this timeline, she's been so synced with it that it turned into her soul basically.

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Pyrade
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Postby Pyrade » Wed Oct 14, 2015 6:34 am

Serah wrote:It's basically Arachne thread.
Almost unbreakable.
When it was still physical in her original timeline, the thread was almost impossible to cut.
In this timeline, she's been so synced with it that it turned into her soul basically.

Out of curiosity, what are the Arachne though?

Could work, just have to get the clear from Zark-sensei :P I'm just a very bored meddler in affairs well above my pay-grade.

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Serah
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Postby Serah » Wed Oct 14, 2015 6:40 am

Pyrade wrote:
Serah wrote:It's basically Arachne thread.
Almost unbreakable.
When it was still physical in her original timeline, the thread was almost impossible to cut.
In this timeline, she's been so synced with it that it turned into her soul basically.

Out of curiosity, what are the Arachne though?

Could work, just have to get the clear from Zark-sensei :P I'm just a very bored meddler in affairs well above my pay-grade.


That's mythology, greek to be exact.

But in Teos, those are gigantic spiders that make the toughest, lightest and most resilient fabric on the planet.
Their top half is almost always human, quite often the one of a female like the original myth.
They also have extremely sharp claws when they need to attack, ones that easily cut through titanium, when the spider dies, one of those is almost always offered to the human leader of the country it died in, they often live in caverns or dank places. (Where they can find memes.)

They aren't really aggressive but it happens that some extreme humanists want to kill them, more often than not, they get slaughtered.

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Zarkenis Ultima
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Postby Zarkenis Ultima » Wed Oct 14, 2015 9:55 am

Serah wrote:
Zarkenis Ultima wrote:
Alright, took me long enough, but I read it. Just a few things. Firstly, I'm not too fond of the 'magic signatures' thing, as magic is a very specific thing and signatures aren't a part of it, but as those words could mean any number of things not actually connected to magic as it is properly understood in the CoI-verse, I don't think it's that big a deal, I just wanted to point this out. Secondly, do you regularly type in first person? This is mostly out of curiosity; I don't really mind myself, and though some others do, I'm the OP here so. :P. Oh, and lastly, what's an energy threader, again?


Ah...

Well, you won't need to worry about magic signatures, I use it more as a substitute term for wavelength, for quite a while, they used magic 'normally' without the need of vocal spells, however, since I switched the worlds and Teos is never in only one universe and timeline at a time, the magic signatures change.

To be fully honest with you, I don't often type in first person, I mostly do that in third person, but I noticed that I abuse it too much at times to retcon actions, such as knowledge and various things of the sort.

Then... The energy threader.
That's... Sort of difficult to explain.

Since you've told me that energy weapons cut through basically anything besides other energy weapons themselves, I thought I should bring the threader (Which I think I explained in the app, if not, I'll put the explanation to what it is here and on it afterwards.)
As an energy weapon, since she makes traps out of it and aside from her side magic, she cannot really do anything aside from attacking with it.

The threader is a hilt that holds several kilometers of extremely resistant and resilient spider thread the thread is toppled at the end of it by some sort of dagger, as it is extremely sensitive, she can use it to 'feel' what is going on around her if she is concentrated enough.
It is extremely resistant to heat and can withstand up to 3.000 C°and is about two hundred times tougher than steel.
(Which is an actual fact, some spider silk can be that resistant.)

However, since the energy weapons can cut through most anything, one trap that gets seen and everything just fucks off.
Which would be a problem, since I don't especially want her to have thirty of those on her.
So it has the same properties it had before regarding the lightness and resilience of it, it has the same look, it's just made out of energy.
And she'll be able to re-make it if anything.

Something that wouldn't be possible with a normal one.


...Different universes and timelines?

Well, as long as it stays in your planet I guess.

Also, you could just say that the threader has normal thread that gets energized when activated (though otherwise, energy weapons should be able to cut through it just fine, to balance things).

In any case, all is fine as far as I can see.
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