NATION

PASSWORD

Price Of Lifesaving Drug Increases By Hundreds Per Pill

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)
User avatar
Yumyumsuppertime
Retired Moderator
 
Posts: 28799
Founded: Jun 21, 2012
Ex-Nation

Price Of Lifesaving Drug Increases By Hundreds Per Pill

Postby Yumyumsuppertime » Sun Sep 20, 2015 11:29 pm

And that's hundreds of dollars, since I didn't have space to type it all out in the title. Specifically, it's gone up to $750 per pill from $13.50.

NEW YORK — Specialists in infectious disease are protesting a gigantic overnight increase in the price of a 62-year-old drug that is the standard of care for treating a life-threatening parasitic infection.

The drug, called Daraprim, was acquired in August by Turing Pharmaceuticals, a startup run by a former hedge fund manager. Turing immediately raised the price to $750 a tablet from $13.50, bringing the annual cost of treatment for some patients to hundreds of thousands of dollars.

“What is it that they are doing differently that has led to this dramatic increase?” said Dr. Judith Aberg, chief of the division of infectious diseases at the Icahn School of Medicine at Mount Sinai in New York. She said the price increase could force hospitals to use “alternative therapies that may not have the same efficacy.”

Turing’s price increase is not an isolated example. Although most of the attention on pharmaceutical prices has been on new drugs for diseases like cancer, hepatitis C, and high cholesterol, there is also growing concern about huge price increases on older drugs, some of them generic, that have long been mainstays of treatment.

Although some price increases have been caused by shortages, others have resulted from a business strategy of buying old neglected drugs and turning them into high-priced “specialty drugs.”

View Story
Boston watchdog takes aim at drug prices
A Boston nonprofit may become a serious threat to the drug industry and the prices they charge for new medicines.
Voters want drug prices addressed
FDA, drug companies clash over off-label uses

Cycloserine, to treat dangerous multidrug-resistant tuberculosis, was just increased in price to $10,800 for 30 pills from $500 after its acquisition by Rodelis Therapeutics. Scott Spencer, general manager of Rodelis, said the company needed to invest to make sure the supply of the drug remained reliable. He said the company provided the drug free to certain needy patients.

In August, two members of Congress wrote to Valeant Pharmaceuticals after that company acquired two heart drugs, Isuprel and Nitropress, from Marathon Pharmaceuticals and promptly raised their prices by 525 percent and 212 percent, respectively. Marathon itself had acquired the drugs from another company in 2013 and had quintupled their prices, according to the lawmakers, Senator Bernie Sanders, the Vermont independent who is seeking the Democratic nomination for president, and Representative Elijah E. Cummings, Democrat of Maryland.

‘What is it that they are doing differently that has led to this dramatic increase’ in price?

Dr. Judith Aberg, chief of the division of infectious diseases at the Icahn School of Medicine, on the price of Daraprim going from $13.50 a tablet to $750
Quote Icon
Doxycycline, an antibiotic, went from $20 a bottle in October 2013 to $1,849 by April 2014, according to the two lawmakers.

The Infectious Diseases Society of America and the HIV Medicine Association sent a joint letter to Turing this month calling the price increase on Daraprim “unjustifiable for the medically vulnerable patient population” and “unsustainable for the health care system.” An organization representing the directors of state AIDS programs has also been looking into the price increase, according to doctors and patient advocates.

Daraprim, known generically as pyrimethamine, is used mainly to treat toxoplasmosis, a parasite infection that can cause serious or even life-threatening problems for babies born to women who become infected during pregnancy, and also for those with compromised immune systems, like AIDS patients and certain cancer patients.

Martin Shkreli, founder and chief executive of Turing, said the drug is so rarely used that the impact on the health system would be minuscule and that Turing would use the money it earns to develop better treatments for toxoplasmosis, with fewer side effects.

“This isn’t the greedy drug company trying to gouge patients. It is us trying to stay in business,” Shkreli said. He said many patients use the drug for far less than a year and that the price was now more in line with those of other rare disease drugs.

“It really doesn’t make sense to get any criticism for this,” he said.

Daraprim, which is also used to treat malaria, was approved by the FDA in 1953 and has long been made by GlaxoSmithKline. Glaxo sold US marketing rights in 2010 to CorePharma. Last year, Impax Laboratories agreed to buy Core and affiliated companies for $700 million. In August, Impax sold Daraprim to Turing for $55 million, a deal announced the same day Turing said it had raised $90 million from Shkreli and other investors in its first round of financing.

Daraprim cost only about $1 per tablet several years ago, but it went up sharply after CorePharma acquired it. According to IMS Health, which tracks prescriptions, sales of the drug jumped to $6.3 million in 2011 from $667,000 in 2010, even as prescriptions held steady at about 12,700. In 2014, after further price increases, sales were $9.9 million, as the number of prescriptions shrank to 8,821. The figures do not include inpatient use in hospitals.

Turing’s price increase could bring sales to tens or even hundreds of millions of dollars a year if use remains constant. Medicaid and certain hospitals will be able to get the drug inexpensively under federal rules for discounts and rebates. But private insurers, Medicare, and hospitalized patients would have to pay closer to the list price.

Some doctors questioned Turing’s claim that there is a need for better drugs, saying the side effects, while potentially serious, can be managed.

“I certainly don’t think this is one of those diseases where we have been clamoring for better therapies,” said Dr. Wendy Armstrong, professor of infectious diseases at Emory University in Atlanta.

With the price now high, other companies could conceivably make generic copies, because patents have long expired. But Daraprim’s distribution is tightly controlled, making it harder for generic companies to get the samples they need for the required testing.

The switch from drugstores to controlled distribution was made in June by Impax, not by Turing. Still, controlled distribution was a strategy Shkreli talked about at his previous company as a way to thwart generics.


I've actually argued against price controls in other areas, but this is simply insane, and provides one of the best arguments that I've seen not just for government intervention in setting prices, but also for government to take over the health care industry entirely. We have people out there who are literally holding people's lives at ransom unless these folks now are willing and able to shell out hundreds of thousands of dollars a year in order to purchase this drug that cost them fifty-five times less just last month. I totally get the idea that some of the more expensive drugs out there are priced that way due to the costs of research and development, but many of these drugs (including the ones in this story) were developed long ago, and the accompanying costs have been paid off for years. This is a basic cash grab from the sickest and most vulnerable by predatory hedge fund managers, and it sickens me.

Anyone want to step up to their defense?

User avatar
USS Monitor
Retired Moderator
 
Posts: 31078
Founded: Jul 01, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby USS Monitor » Sun Sep 20, 2015 11:42 pm

Yumyumsuppertime wrote:Anyone want to step up to their defense?


Nope.

Raising the price that much is a dick move.
Don't take life so serious... it isn't permanent... RIP Dyakovo and Ashmoria
19th century steamships may be harmful or fatal if swallowed. In case of accidental ingestion, please seek immediate medical assistance.
My president is defective. Can I exchange him for store credit?

User avatar
Idzequitch
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 17040
Founded: Apr 22, 2014
Ex-Nation

Postby Idzequitch » Sun Sep 20, 2015 11:43 pm

They produce drugs that treat against parasites, you say? When will they be producing a drug that protects people from their own parasitic nature?
Last edited by Idzequitch on Sun Sep 20, 2015 11:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Twenty Thirty-something, male, heterosexual, Protestant Christian, Happily married. Politically exhausted and fed up with any and all parties.
Meyers-Briggs INFP.
Enneagram Type 9.
Political Compass Left/Right 0.13
Libertarian/Authoritarian -5.38
9Axes Results

I once believed in causes too, I had my pointless point of view, and life went on no matter who was wrong or right. - Billy Joel

User avatar
Keyboard Warriors
Minister
 
Posts: 3305
Founded: Mar 17, 2014
Ex-Nation

Postby Keyboard Warriors » Sun Sep 20, 2015 11:43 pm

Yumyumsuppertime wrote:[
Anyone want to step up to their defense?

Me neither. This is about as sick as you can get. This isn't a new pill or anything. Absolutely inexcusable. I'm very happy to live somewhere that safeguards against this sort of exploitation.
Yes.

User avatar
Cetacea
Negotiator
 
Posts: 6538
Founded: Apr 27, 2012
Ex-Nation

Postby Cetacea » Sun Sep 20, 2015 11:52 pm

I do love Pharmac

User avatar
Saiwania
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 22269
Founded: Jun 30, 2008
Ex-Nation

Postby Saiwania » Mon Sep 21, 2015 12:30 am

Yumyumsuppertime wrote:Anyone want to step up to their defense?


It could be justified if there was an actual supply problem for this drug while there is a ton of demand for it. I doubt this is the case, so my guess is that since this company is a start up; they hope to make enough of a fortune to become a big company and their upper management has gotten greedy and is possibly overreaching.

But this won't work if there is viable competition to this particular drug or it is priced high enough to cause sales to drop to the point of it being unprofitable. They must have jacked up the price because they know there is no cheaper alternative on the market and have a monopoly over this drug. If this is the case, they'd have enough leverage to attempt to raise the profit margin as much as the market will possibly bear.
Last edited by Saiwania on Mon Sep 21, 2015 12:33 am, edited 1 time in total.
Sith Acolyte
Peace is a lie, there is only passion. Through passion, I gain strength. Through strength, I gain power. Through power, I gain victory. Through victory, my chains are broken!

User avatar
Gauthier
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 52887
Founded: Antiquity
Ex-Nation

Postby Gauthier » Mon Sep 21, 2015 12:35 am

So where's the Invisible Hand now?
Last edited by Gauthier on Mon Sep 21, 2015 12:35 am, edited 1 time in total.
Crimes committed by Muslims will be a pan-Islamic plot and proof of Islam's inherent evil. On the other hand crimes committed by non-Muslims will merely be the acts of loners who do not represent their belief system at all.
The probability of one's participation in homosexual acts is directly proportional to one's public disdain and disgust for homosexuals.
If a political figure makes an accusation of wrongdoing without evidence, odds are probable that the accuser or an associate thereof has in fact committed the very same act, possibly to a worse degree.
Where is your God-Emperor now?

User avatar
Yumyumsuppertime
Retired Moderator
 
Posts: 28799
Founded: Jun 21, 2012
Ex-Nation

Postby Yumyumsuppertime » Mon Sep 21, 2015 12:36 am

Saiwania wrote:
Yumyumsuppertime wrote:Anyone want to step up to their defense?


It could be justified if there was an actual supply problem for this drug while there is a ton of demand for it. I doubt this is the case, so my guess is that since this company is a start up, they hope to make enough of a fortune to become a big company. But this won't work if there is viable competition to this particular drug or it is priced high enough to cause sales to drop to the point of it being unprofitable. They must have jacked up the price because they know there is no cheaper alternative on the market and have a monopoly over this drug. If this is the case, they'd have enough leverage to attempt to raise the profit margin as much as the market will possibly bear.


Yep. The only way to get away with this is if they hold sole rights of manufacture, which it seems that they do. They have the leverage to force people to pay hundreds and hundreds of dollars for a pill that previously cost them the price of a meal at Denny's. This strikes me as utterly immoral. I don't have any real issue with the profit motive, or capitalism so long as certain basic services are provided for and people are taken care of when they hit bottom. What I do have an issue with gouging people for huge profits when the only other serious option for them is suffering and dying.

User avatar
Yumyumsuppertime
Retired Moderator
 
Posts: 28799
Founded: Jun 21, 2012
Ex-Nation

Postby Yumyumsuppertime » Mon Sep 21, 2015 12:36 am

Gauthier wrote:So where's the Invisible Hand now?


Showing a middle finger to the sick and the dying, it seems.

User avatar
Chestaan
Negotiator
 
Posts: 6975
Founded: Sep 30, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby Chestaan » Mon Sep 21, 2015 12:37 am

Do patents last for more than 62 years on drugs?? That's a disgracefully long period of time and needs to be lowered to at least less than ten.
Council Communist
TG me if you want to chat, especially about economics, you can never have enough discussions on economics.Especially game theory :)
Economic Left/Right: -9.88
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -6.62

Getting the Guillotine

User avatar
USS Monitor
Retired Moderator
 
Posts: 31078
Founded: Jul 01, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby USS Monitor » Mon Sep 21, 2015 12:47 am

Chestaan wrote:Do patents last for more than 62 years on drugs?? That's a disgracefully long period of time and needs to be lowered to at least less than ten.


It's not under patent.

But the article mentions it's controlled distribution (available by prescription only, I guess?) which makes it more difficult for competitors to get samples to copy off of. And other companies don't have the manufacturing facilities already set up for making this drug, so it would take them some time to set up their manufacturing if they wanted to enter the market with a generic version -- but in the meantime, until someone comes out with a competing generic version, they can charge whatever they want and people either pay it or make do without this medication.
Don't take life so serious... it isn't permanent... RIP Dyakovo and Ashmoria
19th century steamships may be harmful or fatal if swallowed. In case of accidental ingestion, please seek immediate medical assistance.
My president is defective. Can I exchange him for store credit?

User avatar
Chestaan
Negotiator
 
Posts: 6975
Founded: Sep 30, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby Chestaan » Mon Sep 21, 2015 12:50 am

USS Monitor wrote:
Chestaan wrote:Do patents last for more than 62 years on drugs?? That's a disgracefully long period of time and needs to be lowered to at least less than ten.


It's not under patent.

But the article mentions it's controlled distribution (available by prescription only, I guess?) which makes it more difficult for competitors to get samples to copy off of. And other companies don't have the manufacturing facilities already set up for making this drug, so it would take them some time to set up their manufacturing if they wanted to enter the market with a generic version -- but in the meantime, until someone comes out with a competing generic version, they can charge whatever they want and people either pay it or make do without this medication.


A perfect example of non-government barriers to entry driving up prices. At least this can be used as an example to counter those free market fairy types.
Council Communist
TG me if you want to chat, especially about economics, you can never have enough discussions on economics.Especially game theory :)
Economic Left/Right: -9.88
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -6.62

Getting the Guillotine

User avatar
USS Monitor
Retired Moderator
 
Posts: 31078
Founded: Jul 01, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby USS Monitor » Mon Sep 21, 2015 12:55 am

Chestaan wrote:
USS Monitor wrote:
It's not under patent.

But the article mentions it's controlled distribution (available by prescription only, I guess?) which makes it more difficult for competitors to get samples to copy off of. And other companies don't have the manufacturing facilities already set up for making this drug, so it would take them some time to set up their manufacturing if they wanted to enter the market with a generic version -- but in the meantime, until someone comes out with a competing generic version, they can charge whatever they want and people either pay it or make do without this medication.


A perfect example of non-government barriers to entry driving up prices. At least this can be used as an example to counter those free market fairy types.


Yeah, the free market fairy is clearly sleeping on the job.
Don't take life so serious... it isn't permanent... RIP Dyakovo and Ashmoria
19th century steamships may be harmful or fatal if swallowed. In case of accidental ingestion, please seek immediate medical assistance.
My president is defective. Can I exchange him for store credit?

User avatar
Kaztropol
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1071
Founded: Aug 30, 2011
Mother Knows Best State

Postby Kaztropol » Mon Sep 21, 2015 1:45 am

USS Monitor wrote:It's not under patent.
But the article mentions it's controlled distribution (available by prescription only, I guess?) which makes it more difficult for competitors to get samples to copy off of.


Here's an interesting article about the distribution methods.
http://www.pharmacytimes.com/contributo ... hould-know

It mentions how it makes dispensing the medications a lot more complicated, and mentions some of the difficulties encountered, especially as this particular drug is often used in combination with other drugs.

User avatar
Daburuetchi
Minister
 
Posts: 2656
Founded: Sep 14, 2014
Ex-Nation

Postby Daburuetchi » Mon Sep 21, 2015 1:49 am

Maybe just maybe if property rights did not supersede human rights and workers took control of the whole government of the country, the whole administration of the economy, the whole management of production, into their own hands. This would not be an issue

...wait that's crazy talk. These comsymps need to stop hating capitalism. If people want to afford medication they should just work harder. Thats the beauty of the free market. As the CEO of bayer said we dont make drugs for poor indians.
Last edited by Daburuetchi on Mon Sep 21, 2015 1:52 am, edited 2 times in total.

User avatar
The Lone Alliance
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 11805
Founded: May 25, 2005
Left-Leaning College State

Postby The Lone Alliance » Mon Sep 21, 2015 1:50 am

The thing I suggest should be done to them is something that's against the rules of this board, lets just leave it at that.
"Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism, and exposing the country to greater danger." -Herman Goering
--------------
War is cruelty, and you cannot refine it; -William Tecumseh Sherman

User avatar
Ethel mermania
Post Overlord
 
Posts: 138142
Founded: Aug 20, 2010
Ex-Nation

Postby Ethel mermania » Mon Sep 21, 2015 3:07 am

It's a generic, some one else can make it.
https://www.hvst.com/posts/the-clash-of ... s-wl2TQBpY

The West won the world not by the superiority of its ideas or values or religion … but rather by its superiority in applying organized violence. Westerners often forget this fact; non-Westerners never do.
--S. Huntington

The most fundamental problem of politics is not the control of wickedness but the limitation of righteousness. 

--H. Kissenger

User avatar
Alvecia
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 20487
Founded: Aug 17, 2015
Democratic Socialists

Postby Alvecia » Mon Sep 21, 2015 3:11 am

Ethel mermania wrote:It's a generic, some one else can make it.


I think the point is that the nature of the drugs and the controlled distribution methods, etc make it harder for other people to make it. So they have in essence, a kind of monopoly since they own all or most of the production.

User avatar
Ethel mermania
Post Overlord
 
Posts: 138142
Founded: Aug 20, 2010
Ex-Nation

Postby Ethel mermania » Mon Sep 21, 2015 3:14 am

Alvecia wrote:
Ethel mermania wrote:It's a generic, some one else can make it.


I think the point is that the nature of the drugs and the controlled distribution methods, etc make it harder for other people to make it. So they have in essence, a kind of monopoly since they own all or most of the production.


If someone else makes it, that distribution monopoly is gone.
https://www.hvst.com/posts/the-clash-of ... s-wl2TQBpY

The West won the world not by the superiority of its ideas or values or religion … but rather by its superiority in applying organized violence. Westerners often forget this fact; non-Westerners never do.
--S. Huntington

The most fundamental problem of politics is not the control of wickedness but the limitation of righteousness. 

--H. Kissenger

User avatar
Alvecia
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 20487
Founded: Aug 17, 2015
Democratic Socialists

Postby Alvecia » Mon Sep 21, 2015 3:24 am

Ethel mermania wrote:
Alvecia wrote:
I think the point is that the nature of the drugs and the controlled distribution methods, etc make it harder for other people to make it. So they have in essence, a kind of monopoly since they own all or most of the production.


If someone else makes it, that distribution monopoly is gone.


Obligatory disclaimer: I'm not a controlled distribution-ologist(?)
I was under the impression that if the distribution is controlled, then it doesn't matter if someone else makes it, they won't be able to distribute it anyway.

User avatar
Ethel mermania
Post Overlord
 
Posts: 138142
Founded: Aug 20, 2010
Ex-Nation

Postby Ethel mermania » Mon Sep 21, 2015 3:34 am

Alvecia wrote:
Ethel mermania wrote:
If someone else makes it, that distribution monopoly is gone.


Obligatory disclaimer: I'm not a controlled distribution-ologist(?)
I was under the impression that if the distribution is controlled, then it doesn't matter if someone else makes it, they won't be able to distribute it anyway.

The distribution agreement is for that manufacturer only. A different generic manufacturer would have a different d8stribution agreement. That piece of the article is.... crap.

5hat siad, I would guess the reason it wouldnt be picked up is the low demand. I really don't like the article, i find it heavy with bias. I have no love for the drug company either, they are full of shit as well.

Normally the big insurance companies drug providers negotiate the prices.but for such a low demand product, it's probably not worth it to them to do so.
Last edited by Ethel mermania on Mon Sep 21, 2015 3:35 am, edited 1 time in total.
https://www.hvst.com/posts/the-clash-of ... s-wl2TQBpY

The West won the world not by the superiority of its ideas or values or religion … but rather by its superiority in applying organized violence. Westerners often forget this fact; non-Westerners never do.
--S. Huntington

The most fundamental problem of politics is not the control of wickedness but the limitation of righteousness. 

--H. Kissenger

User avatar
Socialist Tera
Senator
 
Posts: 4955
Founded: Dec 23, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby Socialist Tera » Mon Sep 21, 2015 3:37 am

It shows that capitalism sees medicine as something to be sold rather than something that saves lives.
Theistic Satanist, Anarchist, Survivalist, eco-socialist. ex-tankie.

User avatar
Gigaverse
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 12696
Founded: Mar 26, 2011
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Gigaverse » Mon Sep 21, 2015 3:37 am

Whoever they are, I want what they're having.
Unknown. tired-ish.
Unknown.
MAKE CAKE NOT stupidshiticanmakefunof.
Unknown
Unknown
clowning incident | clowning incident | bottom text
unknown
and unknown
unknown
unknown | unknown | unknown

UNKNOWN
unknown | unknown | unknown

User avatar
The Serbian Empire
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 58085
Founded: Apr 18, 2012
Ex-Nation

Postby The Serbian Empire » Mon Sep 21, 2015 3:39 am

Socialist Tera wrote:It shows that capitalism sees medicine as something to be sold rather than something that saves lives.

And communism would just send people to gulag to smash rocks all day. The ingredients don't just come from magic and thus aren't free. Communism to me resembles magical thinking.
LOVEWHOYOUARE~ WOMAN
Level 12 Myrmidon, Level ⑨ Tsundere, Level ✿ Hold My Flower
Bad Idea Purveyor
8 Values: https://8values.github.io/results.html?e=56.1&d=70.2&g=86.5&s=91.9
Political Compass: Economic -10.00 Authoritarian: -9.13
TG for Facebook if you want to friend me
Marissa, Goddess of Stratospheric Reach
preferred pronouns: Female ones
Primarily lesbian, but pansexual in nature

User avatar
Alvecia
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 20487
Founded: Aug 17, 2015
Democratic Socialists

Postby Alvecia » Mon Sep 21, 2015 3:39 am

Ethel mermania wrote:
Alvecia wrote:
Obligatory disclaimer: I'm not a controlled distribution-ologist(?)
I was under the impression that if the distribution is controlled, then it doesn't matter if someone else makes it, they won't be able to distribute it anyway.

The distribution agreement is for that manufacturer only. A different generic manufacturer would have a different d8stribution agreement. That piece of the article is.... crap.

5hat siad, I would guess the reason it wouldnt be picked up is the low demand. I really don't like the article, i find it heavy with bias. I have no love for the drug company either, they are full of shit as well.

Normally the big insurance companies drug providers negotiate the prices.but for such a low demand product, it's probably not worth it to them to do so.


You seem to know what you are talking about more than I do, so I guess I'll take your word for it :)

Next

Advertisement

Remove ads

Return to General

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Alvosa, American Legionaries, Camtropia, Chan Island, Crumpetopia, Darkwoke, Dumb Ideologies, Haloginland, Hurdergaryp, Namante, Narilamb, Orlavia, The Land of Shadow, Trazkaina-, Uiiop, Unogonduria, Welskerland

Advertisement

Remove ads