1821: Raise the Tricolour (OOC/Interest/Open)

[Igoria]

I know a fair bit about Germany and the Napoleonic Wars.
No Bavaria? Maybe I could be a South German Federation of Baden, Württemberg and Bavaria under the Prussian hegemony? I guess that would require the Prussian player's consent.

jus givin you reference

Cheers, mate.

[The Eastern Antarctic State]

I wasn't spying on Austria (no idea why we would need to), just wanted a few guns, but okay then. Irish guys are banned in Austria.

[Jaslandia]

I wasn't spying on Austria (no idea why we would need to), just wanted a few guns, but okay then. Irish guys are banned in Austria.

Your guys aren't banned in Austria; you just can't buy weapons from us unless you find a black market dealer. Also, we weren't accusing you of spying, but we saw your guy in Vienna and got suspicious. All the other supposed Irish guys we saw were just really drunk Austrians, like Archduke Charles said.

[Greater Liverpool]

I wasn't spying on Austria (no idea why we would need to), just wanted a few guns, but okay then. Irish guys are banned in Austria.

Your guys aren't banned in Austria; you just can't buy weapons from us unless you find a black market dealer. Also, we weren't accusing you of spying, but we saw your guy in Vienna and got suspicious. All the other supposed Irish guys we saw were just really drunk Austrians, like Archduke Charles said.

Hmmm causal Irish Racism

[The Eastern Antarctic State]

I wasn't spying on Austria (no idea why we would need to), just wanted a few guns, but okay then. Irish guys are banned in Austria.

Your guys aren't banned in Austria; you just can't buy weapons from us unless you find a black market dealer. Also, we weren't accusing you of spying, but we saw your guy in Vienna and got suspicious. All the other supposed Irish guys we saw were just really drunk Austrians, like Archduke Charles said.

Okay...

[Greater Liverpool]

I wasn't spying on Austria (no idea why we would need to), just wanted a few guns, but okay then. Irish guys are banned in Austria.

Your guys aren't banned in Austria; you just can't buy weapons from us unless you find a black market dealer. Also, we weren't accusing you of spying, but we saw your guy in Vienna and got suspicious. All the other supposed Irish guys we saw were just really drunk Austrians, like Archduke Charles said.

can you explain why does the Austrian coat of arms have a golden goat hanging from a chain cause it looks like the dragons are about to drop the sickest mixtape of 19th century

[The Eastern Antarctic State]

Top credit if you can crack my code. TG me the results.

The prize is you won't get an annoying irish guy searching for guns in your country.

[The Eastern Antarctic State]

No one wants a go? That's sad...

[Of the Quendi]

I know a PBS game isn't exactly supposed to be a paragon of accuracy, but I remember PBS has a Waterloo simulator game, and if you win a decisive victory as the French, where both the Prussians and British are utterly crushed and mauled, then Austria and Russia would basically be scared into suing for peace. Perhaps we can use something along those lines for the backstory?

This is the game I'm talking about, by the way: http://www.pbs.org/empires/napoleon/n_war/ibs/

Well that sounds fishy. First of all because no matter the outcome of Waterloo the British wouldn't be utterly crushed. At Waterloo the British had only 25,000 British soldiers and 6,000 of the King's German Legion. Even if every single man died it wouldn't be a disaster for the British army that while the smallest of the great power armies had more troops then that (though not available in Europe). Prussia, which had already lost some twenty thousand men at Ligny, would be in dire straits if they lost their fifty thousand men at Waterloo but not Britain. And again, since Schwarzenberg's army was essentially as large as Blücher's and Wellington's combined (and that wasn't even the whole of the Austrian army, they had two armies in Italy as well) and with a huge Russian army under Barclay moving through Germany I don't see Austria and Russia becoming terrified. They where the biggest powers who had delivered most of the muscle in previous wars, they would have not just given up over the fact that Napoleon won a battle that was so much smaller than those of Wagram or Borodino and little more then a skirmish compared to Leipzig.

But the game looks fun.

So, in your proposition, when would the POB exactly be?

About Haiti: I can accept such a alternative history of the country. Haiti can be a sort of Imperial crown dominion under France, giving you more potential to reach a better agreement still with the Republican government.

Still Waterloo. Mostly anyway. I would propose having Napoleon not appoint Ney and Grouchy as his lieutenants for the Waterloo campaign but go with Davout and maybe Suchet, and then maybe have Berthier join Napoleon as chief of staff, that way we get a Bonapartist dream team that can perform better then the RL leadership of the Waterloo campaign. But essentially still have a different outcome of either the Battle of Waterloo or the Campaign of Waterloo be the POD. Then after that have Napoleon manage to exploit the division that had appeared between the Great Power's at the Vienna Conference (he is not smart enough to do that on his own so maybe have Talleyrand join Napoleon's side?) and then reach a separate peace with Austria after Waterloo, neutralizing the mega armies of Austria. This is somewhat unrealistic but looking at your map apart from the size of France and the existence of a unified Italy it seems essentially an Austrian dream.

Great about Haiti, I will work on an application then.

[Great Confederacy of Commonwealth States]

Full Nation Name: The Kingdom of Norway
Short Nation Name: Norway
National Flag:(Image)
Territory: Norway
Official Language(s): Norwegian
Form of Government: Monarchy
Head of State: King Agdar I
Head of Government: (if different)
Capital City: Bergen
Population: 984,100
Religion: (state the situation of religion or lack of it within your nation) We are officially Lutheran.
Army: (both size and a brief description of its quality, organisation & structure, etc) We have a 50,000 man Royal Army.
Navy: (same as the army) We have a 50,000 man Royal Navy
Economic Strength: (briefly describe how wealthy your nation is) We a moderately wealthy.
Infrastructure: (briefly describe the quality of your nations infrastructure) We have okay infrastructure. Our main industries are ice and timber.
Primary Goals: We want to maintain our independence.
History: (from point of deviation) We gained independence from Sweden in 1814. King Agdar was crowned as the first king. He married Queen Idun and they have a child named Elsa.
RP Example:https://forum.nationstates.net/viewtopic.php?f=31&t=333514

I suggest banning this guy from the RP. He clearly has not been getting the message. I have seen him in another RP where he has shown the same level of obession with Frozen, in a situation only slightly less out of place than here. His app shows no sign of quality, his RP-style is not fitted for this kind of RP, and he has been trying to get through the gaps in the OP's rules with a disregard that makes me somewhat pissed. I say, ban him from the RP.

[The Eastern Antarctic State]

How're you going Britain? Find the message hidden in plain sight?

[Alsheb]

I know a PBS game isn't exactly supposed to be a paragon of accuracy, but I remember PBS has a Waterloo simulator game, and if you win a decisive victory as the French, where both the Prussians and British are utterly crushed and mauled, then Austria and Russia would basically be scared into suing for peace. Perhaps we can use something along those lines for the backstory?

This is the game I'm talking about, by the way: http://www.pbs.org/empires/napoleon/n_war/ibs/

Well that sounds fishy. First of all because no matter the outcome of Waterloo the British wouldn't be utterly crushed. At Waterloo the British had only 25,000 British soldiers and 6,000 of the King's German Legion. Even if every single man died it wouldn't be a disaster for the British army that while the smallest of the great power armies had more troops then that (though not available in Europe). Prussia, which had already lost some twenty thousand men at Ligny, would be in dire straits if they lost their fifty thousand men at Waterloo but not Britain. And again, since Schwarzenberg's army was essentially as large as Blücher's and Wellington's combined (and that wasn't even the whole of the Austrian army, they had two armies in Italy as well) and with a huge Russian army under Barclay moving through Germany I don't see Austria and Russia becoming terrified. They where the biggest powers who had delivered most of the muscle in previous wars, they would have not just given up over the fact that Napoleon won a battle that was so much smaller than those of Wagram or Borodino and little more then a skirmish compared to Leipzig.

But the game looks fun.

So, in your proposition, when would the POB exactly be?

About Haiti: I can accept such a alternative history of the country. Haiti can be a sort of Imperial crown dominion under France, giving you more potential to reach a better agreement still with the Republican government.

Still Waterloo. Mostly anyway. I would propose having Napoleon not appoint Ney and Grouchy as his lieutenants for the Waterloo campaign but go with Davout and maybe Suchet, and then maybe have Berthier join Napoleon as chief of staff, that way we get a Bonapartist dream team that can perform better then the RL leadership of the Waterloo campaign. But essentially still have a different outcome of either the Battle of Waterloo or the Campaign of Waterloo be the POD. Then after that have Napoleon manage to exploit the division that had appeared between the Great Power's at the Vienna Conference (he is not smart enough to do that on his own so maybe have Talleyrand join Napoleon's side?) and then reach a separate peace with Austria after Waterloo, neutralizing the mega armies of Austria. This is somewhat unrealistic but looking at your map apart from the size of France and the existence of a unified Italy it seems essentially an Austrian dream.

Great about Haiti, I will work on an application then.

So you're saying Austria would be agreeing upong a separate peace with France even though their armies hadn't been defeated in the field?
You obviously seem to have a lot of knowledge about the timeframe, so I suggest you TG me with an official text that you suggest we put in the opening post. Thanks in advance.

[Alsheb]

You may have been anschlussed by Prussia or you could still be independent under the Confederation so I'd say wait for the OP and in the meantime read up on Württemberg and Baden so you know all the shit about your country's history at this point so it can flow seamlessly with any alternate-history

I know a fair bit about Germany and the Napoleonic Wars.
No Bavaria? Maybe I could be a South German Federation of Baden, Württemberg and Bavaria under the Prussian hegemony? I guess that would require the Prussian player's consent.

A South German state filling the gaps still left open would indeed be acceptable. You may or may not be under Prussian hegemony, that is your decision.

[Alsheb]

Full Nation Name: The Kingdom of Norway
Short Nation Name: Norway
National Flag:(Image)
Territory: Norway
Official Language(s): Norwegian
Form of Government: Monarchy
Head of State: King Agdar I
Head of Government: (if different)
Capital City: Bergen
Population: 984,100
Religion: (state the situation of religion or lack of it within your nation) We are officially Lutheran.
Army: (both size and a brief description of its quality, organisation & structure, etc) We have a 50,000 man Royal Army.
Navy: (same as the army) We have a 50,000 man Royal Navy
Economic Strength: (briefly describe how wealthy your nation is) We a moderately wealthy.
Infrastructure: (briefly describe the quality of your nations infrastructure) We have okay infrastructure. Our main industries are ice and timber.
Primary Goals: We want to maintain our independence.
History: (from point of deviation) We gained independence from Sweden in 1814. King Agdar was crowned as the first king. He married Queen Idun and they have a child named Elsa.
RP Example:https://forum.nationstates.net/viewtopic.php?f=31&t=333514

Rejected This is not a realistic portrayal of Norway, and on top of that your application is way too short.

[Of the Quendi]

Full Nation Name: The Dominion of Haiti
Short Nation Name: Haiti
National Flag: A tricolor with, from left to right, blue, red and white. Based on the french tricolor the colors represent the Black, Mulatto and White peoples of Haiti. Some variants of the flag uses black instead of blue, this design was favored by Henri Christophe.
Territory: Modern day Haiti and the Dominican Republic
Official Language(s): French
Form of Government: Gubernatorial republic
Head of State:
Head of Government: (if different)
Capital City: Port-au-Prince
Population: 700,000
Religion: Roman Catholicism is the state religion, Voudoo is prevalent
Army: 35,000 well trained and disciplined troops drawn from the ranks of the elite of the revolution and increasingly supplemented with younger men of the new generation. The army is lacking in artillery and cavalry but is otherwise quite well equipped. It is commanded by governor Boyer.
Navy: At present Haiti maintains no naval forces.
Economic Strength: The Pearl of the Antilles, once the greatest jewel in the French mercantile empire is the wealthiest colony in the western hemisphere and has been for some time. Its wealth is based on an almost industrial scale agricultural production of especially sugar and coffee. Haiti produces forty percent of the sugar consumed in Europe and a whooping seventy five percent of the coffee. This single colony easily outproduce the whole of the British West Indies. The vast wealth its agricultural production generates invaluable revenue for the Haitian government which had helped first Toussaint Louverture and later his successor governors build a strong state. Within Haiti there is however a great disparity between the wealth of the small eastern part of the island and the conquered western portion, as well as between the rich plantation owners and the lower classes.
Infrastructure: The two main cities of Haiti is the new capital of Port-au-Prince and the old capital of Le Cap.
Primary Goals: Reunite the country, prosper, remain in control of the eastern parts of the island.
History: In 1801 the Haitian Revolution seemed a great success. Three years before under the able leadership of Toussaint Louverture the revolutionaries had defeated a British expeditionary force and by the beginning of the year 1801 they had even seized control over Spanish Sant-Domingue. Louverture however realized early that General, now first consul, Bonaparte was not a man so easily handled as the Directorate and in 1801 commenced negotiations with the French ruler. In 1802 a revised Haitian constitution was accepted by Napoleon whereby Toussaint Louverture became governor-for-life of a French colony of Saint Domingue but under French rule. Louverture was also forced to make peace with rival mulatto leaders such as Pétion, Rigaud and Boyer, and to introduce an inclusive rule based on both the black, mulatto and white peoples of Haiti.

As a result in 1802 Louverture became the ruler of the whole of the island of Saint Domingue as governor-for-life. He moved immediately and effectively to restore prosperity and security to the once rich colony. Armed with the revised constitution and a large well-disciplined army he sought to create and enforce a new relationship between the three castes of the island to ensure that the white, possessing skills vital to the running of his agricultural economy, didn't choose to emigrate. This policy was however unpopular with many of the freed slaves who reacted poorly to working, though now paid and without fear of the whip, for their former masters. In 1806, shortly after the Battle of Trafalgar made a French military involvement on Haiti unlikely, a series of massacres broke out on Saint Domingue where Blacks assaulted and murdered Whites. They where eventually suppressed by an aging Louverture, and as Jean-Jacques Dessalines was implicated in the massacres Louverture moved against his former lieutenant, purging many of the more radical revolutionary voices from his government. Subsequently, in 1807, a new revision of the constitution of Saint Domingue was enacted. This was a rather drastic constitution that Louverture promulgated against the wishes of Napoleon. Among other things it renamed Saint Domingue Haiti and introduced many of the attributes and paraphernalia of a sovereign state.

In 1809 Louverture, nearing his seventieth year, stepped down as governor-for-life of Haiti. He appointed as his successor his former enemy Alexandre Pétion with whom he had fought against Dessalines. Despite appointing Pétion Louverture however kept power until his death in 1813, especially through his control of the army.

When in 1813 Pétion finally gained direct power a power struggle broke out almost immediately between the Mulatto Pétion who had his support in the Mulatto southern Haiti and the Black Henri Christophe who had much support in the north. When in 1814 Pétion ran for his second term he narrowly won election over Christophe. Christophe promptly moved to the north of Haiti establishing his own government. As Christophe had much support from the army Pétion had to accept this. The division of Haiti proved short lived however as in 1815 Napoleon Bonaparte made a stunning reappearance on the world scene defeating the seventh coalition and reaching a lasting peace with his enemies. From 1816 and onward the probability of a French intervention in the internal affairs of Haiti became progressively more likely and both Pétion and Christophe, who had proclaimed himself king, became desperate to settle their disputes rather then let the emperor settle them for them.

The compromise reached was that Henri Christophe would step down as king, in turn for the promise that Pétion would not seek re-election in 1818 but would back Christophe. Both parties grudgingly agreed to the compromise, possibly orchestrated from behind the scenes by Pétion's mistress Marie-Madeleine Lachenais. In 1818 Christophe was elected governor. Despite running unopposed Christophe overall performed unimpressively in the election. His rule would be both despotic and incompetent. Despite renouncing his royal title and accepting French overlordship Christophe was more focused on building his Sans-Soucci Palace then running the country. In 1820 it became too much for Pétion who stepped out of retirement and called for the deposition of Henri Christophe. The southern parts of Haiti immediately accepted Pétion as governor while Henri Christophe was off in the north. A dying Napoleon was in no position to intervene which prompted Pétion to move boldly against Henri Christophe. He called a recall gubernatorial election, nominating Jean-Pierre Boyer as governor, and demanded the allegiance of the army and the northern part of the country.

Allyless and increasingly powerless and hated Henri Christophe could do little and he fortified himself at the yet unfinished Citadelle Laferrière. But he could do something. Shortly before the re-call election Pétion was murdered by assassins sent by Henri Christophe. This however did not stop the inevitable. Southern Haiti overwhelmingly elected Boyer governor while the man lead his army to besiege Henri Christophe at Citadelle Laferrière
RP Example: http://forum.nationstates.net/viewtopic.php?p=18777274&sid=a0be99dc4ea4d3c393d6849ad907fb42#p18777274

So you're saying Austria would be agreeing upong a separate peace with France even though their armies hadn't been defeated in the field?
You obviously seem to have a lot of knowledge about the timeframe, so I suggest you TG me with an official text that you suggest we put in the opening post. Thanks in advance.

I am saying its possible. Austria tended to be more compromising then some of the other coalition powers and at the Vienna Conference they looked about to draw the short end of a stick with Russia absorbing Poland and Prussia absorbing Saxony, neither of which Austria could accept. With the map in the OP Austria gets a good deal so I don't think its impossible that they could have gone for neutral.

As for a text I will get to work on it.

[Alsheb]

Shame to hear of Pétion's death. But Boyer might prove just as interesting. Application for Haiti is accepted.

[Winnistan]

Well, I was hoping to add Haiti to Gran Colombia, but now it looks like I'll have a fight on my hands if I do.

[Cabana]

Well, I was hoping to add Haiti to Gran Colombia, but now it looks like I'll have a fight on my hands if I do.

Add the Dominican instead.

[Winnistan]

Well, I was hoping to add Haiti to Gran Colombia, but now it looks like I'll have a fight on my hands if I do.

Add the Dominican instead.

In actual history they owned it at the time, so I'd assume he wants it now. If that is the case, I may just "liberate" Cuba from Spanish control. The French still have power, and that is something I don't want to mess with as a fledgeling nation.

[Great Confederacy of Commonwealth States]

Qing... By expelling all western traders from China, you have just signed your own economical death warrent.

[Cabana]

Qing... By expelling all western traders from China, you have just signed your own economical death warrent.

It's what they and the Japanese really did.

[Of the Quendi]

In actual history they owned it at the time, so I'd assume he wants it now. If that is the case, I may just "liberate" Cuba from Spanish control. The French still have power, and that is something I don't want to mess with as a fledgeling nation.

The Spanish will crush you. Despite the fact that they are loosing against their colonies when those rebel they still have more then enough power to suppress invasions. Especially an amphibious one. Does New Grenada even have a navy?

It's what they and the Japanese really did.

It didn't work very well though.

[Altito Asmoro]

Qing... By expelling all western traders from China, you have just signed your own economical death warrent.

What the...?Qing should instead tighten their control instead of expelling them.

Moroccan into alliance with UK?

gib moniez.

[Old Tyrannia]

Qing... By expelling all western traders from China, you have just signed your own economical death warrent.

Why? We don't actually need anything from western traders, which is why western traders tried to get the Chinese population addicted to opium in the first place. And "Special Dispensations" are being granted to foreigners helping with the "Great Restructuring of the Empire," i.e. those that the Imperial Government have been buying armaments and modern machinery from. It will have a negligible effect on my economy, but Europe has just lost an enormous market for trade; plus, the first European nation that complies with the Qing's demands and cracks down on the opium trade will benefit from exclusive access to the Chinese market.

[Altito Asmoro]

Qing... By expelling all western traders from China, you have just signed your own economical death warrent.

Why? We don't actually need anything from western traders, which is why western traders tried to get the Chinese population addicted to opium in the first place. And "Special Dispensations" are being granted to foreigners helping with the "Great Restructuring of the Empire," i.e. those that the Imperial Government have been buying armaments and modern machinery from. It will have a negligible effect on my economy, but Europe has just lost an enormous market for trade; plus, the first European nation that complies with the Qing's demands and cracks down on the opium trade will benefit from exclusive access to the Chinese market.

You don't actually need one? Even if you're not need one, by extend you have make the tension between Qing and European powers higher than ever. Sure the nations still recovering from Napoleonic War, but they still can act. The reason why they want opium trade grows so that they can control China without the need to obliges to Qing.