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by Imperium Anglorum » Thu Mar 05, 2015 12:38 am
by Ainocra » Thu Mar 05, 2015 12:39 am
by Bubba Reb » Thu Mar 05, 2015 1:31 am
Your Excellencies, I hope that I have shown that this delegation's objection to this bill is not politically motivated nor based on a dislike of the country which proposed it, it is based on definitions and scientific realities, as we find the grounds for this repeal as quite lacking. I yield the floor back to the ambassador from Bubba Reb.'
by St Nevis And Kitts » Thu Mar 05, 2015 2:48 am
by Socialist Republic of Stoa » Thu Mar 05, 2015 7:18 am
by Socialist Republic of Stoa » Thu Mar 05, 2015 7:23 am
Jean Pierre Trudeau wrote:Imperium Anglorum wrote:OOC: Link to the replacement would always be helpful.
viewtopic.php?f=9&t=332294
by Almonaster Nuevo » Thu Mar 05, 2015 8:29 am
by Iblania » Thu Mar 05, 2015 9:25 am
by The New Fandom Republic » Thu Mar 05, 2015 9:59 am
by Imperium Anglorum » Thu Mar 05, 2015 11:37 am
The new fandom republic wrote:Clause #2 made me uneasy about civilian spacecraft in my region's airspace which don't have the usual protections the radiation belts we would've made. So I support this.
by Defwa » Thu Mar 05, 2015 11:42 am
Imperium Anglorum wrote:The new fandom republic wrote:Clause #2 made me uneasy about civilian spacecraft in my region's airspace which don't have the usual protections the radiation belts we would've made. So I support this.
Your excellency, do your spacecraft have metal hulls? If so, they have the shielding necessary to protect it from a radiation belt.
by Imperium Anglorum » Thu Mar 05, 2015 11:50 am
Defwa wrote:Imperium Anglorum wrote:Your excellency, do your spacecraft have metal hulls? If so, they have the shielding necessary to protect it from a radiation belt.
If you think a metal hull is enough to protect you from radiation, I have a ship to sell you.
Disregard the various partially removed vegetable labels.
by Frustrated Franciscans » Thu Mar 05, 2015 12:24 pm
Concerned clause #1 defines nuclear testing as " usage of a nuclear weapon for research purposes, that is not targeted to destroy or affect a civilian, military, or prisoner populace", thus allowing nations to circumvent this by testing nuclear weapons connected to an actual delivery system,
Confused that clause 2 states "BANS nuclear testing within the area between the edge of a populated celestial body's atmosphere and twice the distance of geosychronous orbit - measured at the equator of said celestial body", while failing to take into account the magnetosphere of a celestial body, which can trap highly dangerous high energy particles, creating dangerous radiation belts,
BANS nuclear testing within the area between the edge of a populated celestial body's atmosphere and twice the distance of geosychronous orbit - measured at the equator of said celestial body;
Disappointed in the lack of clear language and typos that make this resolution a travesty to international law,
by Defwa » Thu Mar 05, 2015 12:47 pm
Imperium Anglorum wrote:Defwa wrote:If you think a metal hull is enough to protect you from radiation, I have a ship to sell you.
Disregard the various partially removed vegetable labels.
Ah, you're descriping the Apollo capsule then?
Your excellency, there are three types of radiation. Alpha, beta, and gamma. Alpha radiation is stopped by a sheet of paper. Beta radiation is stopped by a sheet of metal. Gamma radiation is light, and hence, not bent or affected by a celestial body's magnetosphere.
Our real life Apollo missions transversed the Van Allen radiation belts. According to radiation detectors on the ship, the astronauts received no undue amount of radiation (actually, less than if a person were in a reactor control room the entire trip).
Your excellency, the main danger to spacecraft is gamma radiation, which cannot be trapped by a magnetosphere after a nuclear blast, and is therefore irrelevant to the context of radiation belts.
However it is, 'the major radiation hazard is from solar flare particle events', namely, the Sun — which means that it cannot be affected by whether we limit nuclear testing or not (Source)
by Imperium Anglorum » Thu Mar 05, 2015 1:11 pm
Defwa wrote:Imperium Anglorum wrote:
Ah, you're descriping the Apollo capsule then?
Your excellency, there are three types of radiation. Alpha, beta, and gamma. Alpha radiation is stopped by a sheet of paper. Beta radiation is stopped by a sheet of metal. Gamma radiation is light, and hence, not bent or affected by a celestial body's magnetosphere.
Our real life Apollo missions transversed the Van Allen radiation belts. According to radiation detectors on the ship, the astronauts received no undue amount of radiation (actually, less than if a person were in a reactor control room the entire trip).
Your excellency, the main danger to spacecraft is gamma radiation, which cannot be trapped by a magnetosphere after a nuclear blast, and is therefore irrelevant to the context of radiation belts.
However it is, 'the major radiation hazard is from solar flare particle events', namely, the Sun — which means that it cannot be affected by whether we limit nuclear testing or not (Source)
Alpha radiation, sure. Beta radiation in high densities can (and did, in the case of Apollo) penetrate a basic metal sheet and in an environment that accumulates such things naturally, enduring nuclear testing can cause a severe problem for humans. Gamma radiation, while mostly getting out the way quickly can inspire radioactivity in other objects so while a radiation belt isn't a concern, gamma radiation in traversed areas is.
Apollo had the fortune of just passing through and out of the belts in a short time. Anything that might stay in the area longer such as objects in a stable orbit are going to be sensitive to artificial increases in alpha and beta radioactivity. Not just the people, electrical equipment is also in danger.
Then there's the risk of an artificial geomagnetic storm created by a detonation close enough to the magnetosphere or radiation belts which would endanger pretty much everything from the surface of the planet to the moon.
by Flibbleites » Thu Mar 05, 2015 3:25 pm
And what exactly is being circumvented again? Even if it is on a delivery system you still can't target people if it's a test.Jean Pierre Trudeau wrote:The World Assembly,
Applauding the efforts of General Assembly Resolution #119 to protect the environment from harmful radioactive byproducts associated with nuclear testing,
Concerned clause #1 defines nuclear testing as " usage of a nuclear weapon for research purposes, that is not targeted to destroy or affect a civilian, military, or prisoner populace", thus allowing nations to circumvent this by testing nuclear weapons connected to an actual delivery system,
Now I'm confused, you say you're talking about clause 2 yet your argument seems to be directed at clause 3. The actual clause 2 which reads,Jean Pierre Trudeau wrote:Confused that clause 2 states "BANS nuclear testing within the area between the edge of a populated celestial body's atmosphere and twice the distance of geosychronous orbit - measured at the equator of said celestial body", while failing to take into account the magnetosphere of a celestial body, which can trap highly dangerous high energy particles, creating dangerous radiation belts,
actually serves to prove that your arguments against clause 1 are complete and utter bullshit.GAR #119 Nuclear Testing Safety wrote:RESTRICTS nuclear testing to areas where the testing and its aftereffects will not directly affect surrounding populaces;
Really, you are going to complain about typos considering you made one. Methinks the pot is about to meet the kettle.Jean Pierre Trudeau wrote:Disappointed in the lack of clear language and typos that make this resolution a travesty to international law,
We already did Nuclear Testing Safety says several times in several different ways, "don't test them near people," it's hard to get more clear and concise than that, and now you're trying to get rid of that.Jean Pierre Trudeau wrote:Hoping the World Assembly passes clear and concise guidelines that actually prevent unaffiliated persons from being affected by nuclear testing in the future,
Hereby repeals "GENERAL ASSEMBLY RESOLUTION # 119 Nuclear Testing Safety".
Jean Pierre Trudeau wrote:Posting here as a courtesy.
by Pharthan » Fri Mar 06, 2015 5:58 pm
Imperium Anglorum wrote:
Ah, you're descriping the Apollo capsule then?
Your excellency, there are three types of radiation. Alpha, beta, and gamma. Alpha radiation is stopped by a sheet of paper. Beta radiation is stopped by a sheet of metal. Gamma radiation is light, and hence, not bent or affected by a celestial body's magnetosphere.
Our real life Apollo missions transversed the Van Allen radiation belts. According to radiation detectors on the ship, the astronauts received no undue amount of radiation (actually, less than if a person were in a reactor control room the entire trip).
Your excellency, the main danger to spacecraft is gamma radiation, which cannot be trapped by a magnetosphere after a nuclear blast, and is therefore irrelevant to the context of radiation belts.
However it is, 'the major radiation hazard is from solar flare particle events', namely, the Sun — which means that it cannot be affected by whether we limit nuclear testing or not (Source)
HALCYON ARMS STOREFRONT
by Jean Pierre Trudeau » Fri Mar 06, 2015 6:30 pm
Pharthan wrote:I begin and wonder why you presented this or any resolutions to us at all if you did not mean to take our knowledgeable and readily plentiful advice. It rather seems a slap in the face to the World Assembly to refuse to take such advice after presenting it.
by Pharthan » Fri Mar 06, 2015 6:39 pm
Jean Pierre Trudeau wrote:
Erm. I did not place it here for advice. I placed it here as a courtesy. This was already submitted, and a campaign was damn near complete before I ever bothered to post it. The only reason I posted it, is because someone else would have if I had not. At vote resolutions need a thread, and I would rather I be the OP of it. I had no intentions of having it pulled after I submitted it, as it does address the points of the resolution in question, and repeals do not need to be factually correct. They simply need to address the original resolution, to be legal, which this one does. This is politics my good man, plain and simple. Since when has politics ever gotten to the truth of anything?
Food for though....
HALCYON ARMS STOREFRONT
by Jean Pierre Trudeau » Fri Mar 06, 2015 6:43 pm
Pharthan wrote:Jean Pierre Trudeau wrote:
Erm. I did not place it here for advice. I placed it here as a courtesy. This was already submitted, and a campaign was damn near complete before I ever bothered to post it. The only reason I posted it, is because someone else would have if I had not. At vote resolutions need a thread, and I would rather I be the OP of it. I had no intentions of having it pulled after I submitted it, as it does address the points of the resolution in question, and repeals do not need to be factually correct. They simply need to address the original resolution, to be legal, which this one does. This is politics my good man, plain and simple. Since when has politics ever gotten to the truth of anything?
Food for though....
"I would caution you against arguments appealing to tradition and history as a reason to continue a pattern of behavior and action. A wise man once told me, ''This is the way we've always done it,' is an awfully long time to be doing something the wrong way."
by Pharthan » Fri Mar 06, 2015 7:10 pm
Jean Pierre Trudeau wrote:Pharthan wrote:"I would caution you against arguments appealing to tradition and history as a reason to continue a pattern of behavior and action. A wise man once told me, ''This is the way we've always done it,' is an awfully long time to be doing something the wrong way."
What you call the wrong way, I call the effective way. Six of one, half a dozen of the other.
HALCYON ARMS STOREFRONT
by Frustrated Franciscans » Sat Mar 07, 2015 1:37 pm
by Imperium Anglorum » Sat Mar 07, 2015 3:06 pm
Frustrated Franciscans wrote:It appears that this resolution is going to pass. I have passed this information to our national leader Friar Cadfail who seemed oddly enough excited. There would, naturally, be a window before any possible replacement would be passed, but that is plenty of time to get all our nuclear testing done. Apparently, they have been preparing for the this the moment it hit quorum, but no one ever tells me these things. He mentioned something about a "nuclear crusade." Personally I'm more than a bit worried about all of this, but I'll just sit back and chant "It's all your fault" while the world is reduced to nuclear rubble because of the actions of a psychotic dictator.
(Is this portable thumb working? The last time I used it I had to listen to mind numbing poetry for about 23 hours.)
by Defwa » Sat Mar 07, 2015 3:51 pm
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